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Thread: Lisa Irwin Disappearance - Thoughts and Theories ONLY!

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    Lisa Irwin Disappearance - Thoughts and Theories ONLY!

    This thread is for general, non specific discussion of the case and a place to post your theories regarding what happened to baby Lisa.

    It is always confusing when a case gets its own forum and things are parceled out to more specific threads for discussion.

    here is thread to discuss the case in more general terms and your thoughts about it.

    As always, there should be no name-calling, no snark and no baiting, please govern yourselves accordingly and keep your posts within TOS.

    Thanks,

    tl

    ETA for your convenience, a link to Shelby1's excellent timeline [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150977"]Lisa Irwin-Timeline - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]
    Last edited by tlcya; 10-11-2011 at 07:01 PM.
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    My theory is that DB snapped. This was the first night JI was working and now she had her hands full with three children. Was JI involved in the night time ritual of putting the kids to bed, etc.?

    If she was sleep deprived and Baby Lisa kept waking her up, she may have snapped. I know all three of my kids woke up frequently as babies/toddlers in the night when they coughed or had a hard time breathing through their nose.

    One other thing I wonder is if DB has PND.

    IMO

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    Thankx tl - we needed something like this.

    I'm very much wondering about vehicles. I have seen nothing mentioned in MSM about the family's vehicles. How many - did mom have a car and dad have a car? Or was there only one vehicle for the family? If only one - then did dad take the car to work? Or did dad manage to arrange a ride to and from work so mom would have the car?

    And also - what are the boys saying? They are certainly old enough to be able to talk about that night and what went on.

    Still very early in this investigation and so many questions.


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    I think it was a accident. medicine maybe!

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    I too am curious about vehicles, how many, what style, if they've been searched, etc.

    I am curious as to what vehicle was used for the Festival Foods trip earlier in the evening and where the children where and whose care they were in at that time as well.
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    Thanks tl!!! I don't have a theory just yet but would like a brief rundown of (what we know) are the facts. A rough *time line* perhaps...

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    I think if something happened to Lisa in the home, it was an accident, not anger-related or shaken, etc...JMO. But perhaps she had been drinking and her judgement was skewed as far as what would happen if she called 911.

    I have trouble with a random intruder due to all of the much-discussed "firsts" that nights. And if someone known to the family had taken Lisa, I feel that she would have been found by now.

    JMO
    Just my opinion, of course.

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    Thanks so much for starting this thread, TL!

    WIseOldOwl, do you know what the general procedure is when dealing with children who may have info about a crime? Just out of curiosity.
    Kindness is magic. (Derek)

    @JaneDoe25 (Twitter)

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    What are these parents doing to locate Lisa? Anything?

    Also, I'm curious, is there a place where people are leaving flowers, notes, teddy bears..?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Paige SC View Post
    Thanks tl!!! I don't have a theory just yet but would like a brief rundown of (what we know) are the facts. A rough *time line* perhaps...
    I am so not good at the timelines, but for all our benefit I have edited my opening post to include a link to Shelby1's timeline.
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    PlainJaneDoe - you can bet those boy have been questioned. Whether nor not we ever hear anything is a "hit or miss". They are minors and protected under the law - so we may never hear anything.

    Paige - there is a "time line" thread in the forum index.

    I would also like to hear some type of confirmation about dad's work hours that night. (shades of ron cummings and the "I was at WERK" statement - and we have never found out his work hours)


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    Quote Originally Posted by captivagrl View Post
    What are these parents doing to locate Lisa? Anything?

    Also, I'm curious, is there a place where people are leaving flowers, notes, teddy bears..?
    as to your first, I honestly don't know.

    As to your second, there is a pole located in front (or near) the Irwin home with posters expressing hope, stuffed animals, etc beginning to gather.
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    I dont know for certain that I can say what I think happened the night Lisa disappeared other than to say, at this point in time, if it were accidental, it no longer is. After all the crap that went on with the CA trial you think that this mom would have known that. You call the police. An accident is an accident. If you did everything you could do then how can you get in trouble. This is just absurd now. Now if it were an accident you just lead the police on all these chases, the detectives, the FBI, CSI, Firefighters, etc. I just cannot by that someone can walk into a house in the middle of the night and steal an infant, when you have 2 other children there in a house and you have a baby monitor, then they put all the lights on, come in and leave through the front door and you have a dog that didnt bark and the neighbor has a dog that was kept outside. Makes no sense, all of this on the one and only night dad ever worked at night and the cell phones are gone too. Well being a call was made at 2:30 in the morning from one of the phones, I would say that means that Lisa was missing either before that or after that time. Obviously mom was awake to make a call. That rules out a kidnapping to me. Oh unless the kidnapper made a phone call.

    Statistically, if someone was to steal an infant, it would be a mother who lost a child or wanted a child. That is really the only person that steals infants, if this were a pedophile, one of those boys would be gone. Pedo's go for boys most of the time and not infants, boys the age of her boys. I wish they would make an arrest already and/or sit them parents down and rip into them until they get the REAL story.
    "When we were children, we used to think that when we grew up we would no longer be vulnerable. But to grow up is to accept vulnerability, to be alive is to be vulnerable." ~Madeleine L'Engle



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    I just have to get my thoughts about this new "box of wine" out of my head, because this changes or adds perspective to me. I think it is probable she did not mention this & LE may have known this before yesterday (remember it came via an store employee talking), if not why not mention it? LE I am sure went over what happened that whole day, maybe the day before etc...nothing illegal about an adult drinking wine (unless something happens to your child). I also try & go for the simplest theory. It would not surprise me if at 10:30, mom either shook baby L. because maybe she wouldn't stop crying or gave her maybe too much medication. I believe she checked on her again (maybe she had to go to the bathroom) just before 2:30, checked on her and found she had passed away. Panicking and/or under-the-influence made "the" phone call. But, what would Dad's motive be IF he helped? Fear of losing his son too? I do believe someone helped. Dad's story has not been what I would consider consistent either. If anyone cracks, I think it could be Dad, unless something happened before he went to work. I think 10:30 is an "important" time to this story, beside mom going to bed. I think an accident happened, she may have been impaired or impaired thinking & she freaked. Thanks for letting put down my thoughts.

    No doubt LE knows how much wine was drunk by the box (no pun intended) & who was there to possibly help drink it. Maybe with everything coming out in the open, it will free people to open up and confess whatever they know?

    (Moved from Wine thread, now that this is open)
    Last edited by Dee10; 10-11-2011 at 07:37 PM.


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    I think we are in the suds and LE doesn't have a clue what happened.

    Don't believe the mom did it.

    jmo

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wise Old Owl View Post
    Thankx tl - we needed something like this.

    I'm very much wondering about vehicles. I have seen nothing mentioned in MSM about the family's vehicles. How many - did mom have a car and dad have a car? Or was there only one vehicle for the family? If only one - then did dad take the car to work? Or did dad manage to arrange a ride to and from work so mom would have the car?

    And also - what are the boys saying? They are certainly old enough to be able to talk about that night and what went on.

    Still very early in this investigation and so many questions.
    ..i don't know how many vehicles they have, but they did search 2 at the home ----the van was shown in news videos with the name of an elecrical co. on it ( all current electric ), so presumably jeremy's work van.

    http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-auth...,6273053.story

    On Tuesday, authorities searched a van and car at the home.
    my opinion...........and i happen to agree with it.....

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    IIRC, we only have parents word on timeline.
    Who and when was the last time ANYONE saw baby Lisa?
    She could of been gone before this story.
    Kyron, HALEIGH, ADJI & Gabriel NEEDS PRAYERS NOW TO FIND THEM!. Zahra & Jonathan in heaven
    Justice for Hailey!!!!
    No Justice for Caylee Marie..........

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    Quote Originally Posted by captivagrl View Post
    What are these parents doing to locate Lisa? Anything?

    Also, I'm curious, is there a place where people are leaving flowers, notes, teddy bears..?
    I think I am getting *****y about this whole thing, either that or my husband is pissing me off or something.. so if I sound harsh I apologize up front. That being said, I dont think the parents are doing a thing to help find their daughter and havent though they have done anything since the beginning. They lock themselves away and that is that. Nothing proactive that I can see on the news or through posts at all. And I think there were flowers and the such being left in front of their house if I am not mistaken. I dont live anywhere near there, I am in NY but I do believe on the cover of a newspaper there were flowers, stuffed animals and candles at that location.
    "When we were children, we used to think that when we grew up we would no longer be vulnerable. But to grow up is to accept vulnerability, to be alive is to be vulnerable." ~Madeleine L'Engle



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    I have been at work all day but could someone tell me if the 2:30 am phone call/text is substantiated in MSM or by LE? Last I heard it was sort of up in the air. Thanks so much to anyone who can answer and if it is substantiated, please provide a link so I can put that one to rest in my own mind?
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    The original story of what happened does not fly for me. Something is amiss. However, feeling like something is amiss does not immediately lead me to think DB did it. I feel like she may feel guilty for something else like (just throwing out ideas) perhaps having a glass or two of wine and sleeping so deeply that she didn't hear anything. I really wish we knew-
    1. Where those phones are
    2. Why LE is so determined something is around the house (I still semi-suspect phone pings for this)
    3. Why the lights were all on if DB claims she turned them all off before bed.

    Of course, the first thing I would like to know is where is Lisa.

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    Quote Originally Posted by frankie069 View Post
    I dont know for certain that I can say what I think happened the night Lisa disappeared other than to say, at this point in time, if it were accidental, it no longer is. After all the crap that went on with the CA trial you think that this mom would have known that. You call the police. An accident is an accident. If you did everything you could do then how can you get in trouble. This is just absurd now. Now if it were an accident you just lead the police on all these chases, the detectives, the FBI, CSI, Firefighters, etc. I just cannot by that someone can walk into a house in the middle of the night and steal an infant, when you have 2 other children there in a house and you have a baby monitor, then they put all the lights on, come in and leave through the front door and you have a dog that didnt bark and the neighbor has a dog that was kept outside. Makes no sense, all of this on the one and only night dad ever worked at night and the cell phones are gone too. Well being a call was made at 2:30 in the morning from one of the phones, I would say that means that Lisa was missing either before that or after that time. Obviously mom was awake to make a call. That rules out a kidnapping to me. Oh unless the kidnapper made a phone call.

    Statistically, if someone was to steal an infant, it would be a mother who lost a child or wanted a child. That is really the only person that steals infants, if this were a pedophile, one of those boys would be gone. Pedo's go for boys most of the time and not infants, boys the age of her boys. I wish they would make an arrest already and/or sit them parents down and rip into them until they get the REAL story.
    Polly Klaas was taken out a window of her home during a girls sleep-over. Right underneath everyone's noses. So, it does happen.

    I'm just not getting the feeling of stanger abudction in this at all tho.

    Thankx for the vehicle info lauriej - so dad has a work vehicle and mom has a car.

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  39. #22
    OK...I do not want to think this at all...I do not know that this happened...but...Dad's first night shift?? Mom gets a little party happy with neighborhood fellows?? Something goes down...now what?

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    Quote Originally Posted by passionflower View Post
    IIRC, we only have parents word on timeline.
    Who and when was the last time ANYONE saw baby Lisa?
    She could of been gone before this story.
    but the neighbor came over that night..she probably saw the baby, sleeping or not..don't most parents open the door to show off a little one to a guest?

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    Quote Originally Posted by lauriej View Post
    ..i don't know how many vehicles they have, but they did search 2 at the home ----the van was shown in news videos with the name of an elecrical co. on it ( all current electric ), so presumably jeremy's work van.

    http://www.fox4kc.com/news/wdaf-auth...,6273053.story

    On Tuesday, authorities searched a van and car at the home.
    I think I watch too many crime shows.. they should have taken those cars/vans in and went over them with a fine toothed comb. Dont they usually take them to a police impound and forensically go over them. God, can you tell what shows I watch on TV.
    "When we were children, we used to think that when we grew up we would no longer be vulnerable. But to grow up is to accept vulnerability, to be alive is to be vulnerable." ~Madeleine L'Engle



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    Quote Originally Posted by passionflower View Post
    IIRC, we only have parents word on timeline.
    Who and when was the last time ANYONE saw baby Lisa?
    She could of been gone before this story.
    Hi passionflower Good to see you. you are correct we only have parents timeline to go on. If it is helpful, Baby Lisa was last seen on the Sunday, 1-2 days prior to her disappearance, at a birthday party for her sibling. She was seen and photographed by the extended family.
    Last edited by tlcya; 10-11-2011 at 07:24 PM.
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