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Thread: WA - Sky Metalwala, 2, Bellevue, 6 Nov 2011 - #11

  1. #1
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    WA - Sky Metalwala, 2, Bellevue, 6 Nov 2011 - #11

    Please continue here.




    http://media.komonews.com/images/111106_missing_boy.jpg http://www.ktvb.com/news/regional/133461168.html

    2-year-old Sky Metalwala was last seen around 9:00 am on Sunday, November 6, 2011. Sky's mother reported that her car ran out of gas in Bellevue, Washington at that time. She said she left Sky in the unlocked vehicle and walked with her daughter, who is 4, about a mile to a gas station. When she returned approximately 1 hour later, Sky was missing. An extensive search of the area turned up no sign of Sky. He was last seen wearing, a grey hooded sweatshirt, black and aqua blue sweatpants, and white socks. The FBI has been called in to assist in the investigation.

    NCMEC Poster
    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154065"]Media Links[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=153950"]Info & Support thread[/ame]


    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=153949"]Thread #1[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154079"]Thread #2[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154154"]Thread #3[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154213"]Thread #4[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154321"]Thread #5[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154486"]Thread #6[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154637"]Thread #7[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7351790#post7351790"]Thread #8[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154875"]Thread #9[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=155024"]Thread #10[/ame]



    It's very important that if there's anybody that has information about Sky to call in.

    TIPLINE: 425-452-2564


    We can link to Flickr account as long as its a public site and related to this case. No posting of pics here at Websleuths from Flickr account.
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    jimformanKING5 Jim Forman KING5News
    @2:50 PM EST or 11:50 AM PST

    Bellevue PD tells me new photos of Missing toddler and his mother leading to new tips in #SearchForSky.
    6 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patty G View Post
    jimformanKING5 Jim Forman KING5News
    @2:50 PM EST or 11:50 AM PST

    Bellevue PD tells me new photos of Missing toddler and his mother leading to new tips in #SearchForSky.
    6 minutes ago Favorite Retweet Reply

    http://twitter.com/#!/jimformanKING5
    The pressure is mounting.........
    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. ~ Aristotle

    The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense.

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  5. #4
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    Media link's:
    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154065"]WA WA - Sky Metalwala, 2, Bellevue, 6 Nov 2011 *Media Links Only* - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

    map:
    http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=...51e14a36&msa=0

    new pictures released:
    http://mynorthwest.com/?nid=129&sid=580607&pid=0
    and
    http://images.bimedia.net/documents/...lia+photos.pdf
    Last edited by Miziree; 11-19-2011 at 04:10 PM. Reason: added link

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    I was downtown today for other reasons and went right past where SB lives in Belltown. It's on 3rd Avenue between Bell and Battery. This google street view shows it still underconstruction, but you can see from the other landmarks this is indeed the location.

    [ame="http://maps.google.com/maps?q=2300+3rd+Ave,+Seattle&hl=en&ll=47.615284,-122.345778&spn=0.003775,0.010568&sll=47.614720,-122.344796&layer=c&cbp=13,126.4,,0,0&cbll=47.61514 7,-122.345547&hnear=2300+3rd+Ave,+Seattle,+Washington +98121&t=h&z=17&vpsrc=0&panoid=uoPOGtmT98iE9Y_8ipP nBQ"]2300 3rd Ave, Seattle - Google Maps[/ame]

    Link to a screen cap of the interview in front of SB's building.
    http://i1222.photobucket.com/albums/...BInterview.jpg

    The complex is called Moda.
    Last edited by GingerRed; 11-19-2011 at 04:38 PM.

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    PLEASE let there be a break in this case today....................

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  11. #7
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    I'm so glad to hear LE are getting more tips after releasing the new photo's!! I hope this leads them to where Sky is.

    http://twitter.com/#!/jimformanKING5

    Bellevue PD tells me new photos of Missing toddler and his mother leading to new tips in #SearchForSky.

    Bringing this link from the last thread:

    http://www.kirotv.com/news/news/sear...330-pm-/nFg8p/

    Bellevue police have called another news conference for 3:30 p.m. Saturday in the search for missing toddler Sky Metalwala

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  13. #8
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    I found a local news update but not sure if it is considered MSM . . . . if not - Mods please forgive.

    "Search for Missing Boy Sky moves to Kirkland’s Watershed Park"

    http://www.kirklandviews.com/archives/30817/
    Proud member of the AFKBPOFPOPL


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    Quote Originally Posted by wenwe4 View Post
    I found a local news update but not sure if it is considered MSM . . . . if not - Mods please forgive.

    "Search for Missing Boy Sky moves to Kirklandís Watershed Park"

    http://www.kirklandviews.com/archives/30817/
    You know, it's really easy to get to where the car "ran out of gas...ahem" and be facing the direction it did toward the hospital from there.

    It would explain what she was doing on that side of the 405.

    [ame="http://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=Watershed+Park,+Kirkland,+WA&daddr=2400 +112th+Ave+NE,+Bellevue&hl=en&sll=47.637143,-122.190628&sspn=0.015789,0.042272&geocode=FXIT1wId F4a3-CG7h09VsU_6Sw%3BFe3N1gIdx4O3-Cnh7hcU6WyQVDHBrvjjgrIxag&vpsrc=0&mra=ls&t=h&z=14"]Watershed Park to 2400 112th Ave NE, Bellevue, WA 98004 - Google Maps[/ame]

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    I am not familiar with the direction of the hospital she was supposedly heading to . . . wasn't it overlake or something like that?

    Watershed park is quite a ways from her apartment . . . so I would assume she would have driven there. I am not sure she had a car when she was seen in the survellience stills . . . maybe she didn't get her brother's car until the weekend?
    Proud member of the AFKBPOFPOPL

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  18. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by wenwe4 View Post
    I am not familiar with the direction of the hospital she was supposedly heading to . . . wasn't it overlake or something like that?

    Watershed park is quite a ways from her apartment . . . so I would assume she would have driven there. I am not sure she had a car when she was seen in the survellience stills . . . maybe she didn't get her brother's car until the weekend?
    Yes, it was Overlake she was pointing toward, but her location was questionable.

    I just calculated on google maps the drive time to where 108th crosses through Watershed. It's a three minute drive. It's a 26 minute walk.


    [ame="http://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=2400+112th+Ave+NE,+Bellevue&daddr=4352+ 108th+Ave+NE,+Kirkland,+WA+98033&hl=en&sll=47.6399 ,-122.19363&sspn=0.031576,0.084543&geocode=Fe3N1gIdx 4O3-Cnh7hcU6WyQVDHBrvjjgrIxag%3BFc8M1wId7nC3-Cmz0kzX0GyQVDGuBNb9QzdttQ&vpsrc=0&dirflg=w&mra=ltm &t=h&z=14"]2400 112th Ave NE, Bellevue, WA 98004 to 4352 108th Ave NE, Kirkland, WA 98033 - Google Maps[/ame]

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    So perhaps 908 to 405?

    Or 520 to the park?
    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. ~ Aristotle

    The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense.

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  22. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by SurfieTX View Post
    So perhaps 908 to 405?

    Or 520 to the park?
    Lots of routes and none of them are of great distance relative to the area.

    That location makes a lot of sense to me. They lived in Kirkland. 108th--which becomes 112th--borders that park and the walking distance from that point is rather interesting. The 3 minute drive from that point even moreso.

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    From a psychological point of view and from the research that BritsKate presented about filicide, I did wonder what JB considered "home." Was "home" the place where she returned with a newborn Sky or the apt. in which she lived currently?

    How far is the now-foreclosed family home from this park?
    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. ~ Aristotle

    The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense.

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  26. #15
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    I wanted to comment on the theory that Julia left the kids alone during mediation and then something happened to Sky.

    It is a logical theory. But the two weeks thing really has me feeling different. So does the statement by Solomon before Sky went missing that the mother had thoughts of strangling Sky, coupled with her apparently intense mental illness -bi polar and OCD, depression (possibly began as post-partum depression?).

    So, my theory is there was no accident.

    I think, that when questioning Julia, who was obviously a suspect almost immediately, they asked her to go back and trace what she had been doing, step-by-step, in the days leading up to Sky's disappearance. They probably told her they wanted to make sure no one was stalking her. And maybe they actually believed that was a possibility at first because I am sure one of the first things out of her mouth would have been the intense custody battle and Solomon's "violence".

    So, as she told them things, other LE probably checked those things out. I believe it was a marathon interview session and LE was probably interviewing people while Julia was interviewed.

    So when she discussed mediation, which occurred five days before she was interviewed, they probably asked her where Sky was during it. "Oh, my mother cared for both kids that day." Now she is sweating.

    In the meantime, they are asking all her neighbors, friends and relatives when was the last time they saw Sky (two weeks ago). So they ask grandma, or whoever she claimed was watching the kids, "Didn't you watch Sky on 11-1-11?" "No, just M. Sky was at a play date with so and so."

    Then they call so and so. "No, I never had a play date with Sky on that date." Now the red flags are being raised even higher. LE confers. They go back to mom: "Listen, your mother says she only sat for M. That you told her Sky was with so and so. But we talked to so and so and she denied that. What's going on? No one has seen Sky for two weeks besides you. Is there something you need to tell us? People state they have seen M, but not Sky. What's going on?"

    Now she really starts to freak out. Realizes she is in major trouble. "Okay, I need to admit something to you. I left Sky home alone during mediation. He wasn't feeling well so I didn't want to take him out of the house. He was sleeping. I know it was wrong but I thought he would be okay."

    As she's speaking, you have other LE quickly contacting as many people as possible that Julia states she would have encountered during the last two weeks. Someone states they again saw M with mom at some function or place, without Sky on a certain date within the last two weeks. They again confront Julia: "Where was Sky? Did you have a babysitter that day?" She is getting in deeper and states, "Well, he was sick that day. I left him home at the condo because he was sleeping. I know I shouldn't have but he was okay."

    I really feel this is a strong possibility. I am not buying the accident theory. I think there is no way that a mom with such severe OCD and mental problems would leave her kids alone in her house to mess it up, even if she drugged them or locked them in a bathroom or something. Why wouldn't she just get a babysitter? Why wouldn't she bring them to grandma's or Grandma S's house?

    Even if drugged and locked somewhere - and it had to be both because otherwise, they could cry and scream and someone would hear that - her disordered mind would likely (I imagine), keep wandering to the possibility that they woke up and made some kind of mess. I just can't imagine Julia wanting to leave her kids unattended in her precious house and possibly disrupt the order there.

    No, I really don't think there was an accident. I think LE found out very quickly that Sky hadn't been seen in a while but M had. They confronted her and she had to make up a story. They maybe won't arrest her yet for leaving the kids alone because they do not believe it is true and it undercuts their murder theory. I think they will only arrest her as a last resort, if they feel they will not be able to get enough to prove murder.
    For Travis Alexander, a human being. Justice will prevail.


    *Gitana (means "Gypsy girl"). Pronounced "hee tah nah."


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    http://61.19.1.27/support/forum/p/bl...85b3b1c1&hl=en

    "http://juliabiryukova.blogspot.com/ this is my account. I can't sign in. Don't remember password or the e-mail address. Report abuse

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    http://juliabiryukova.blogspot.com/ -- This is my blogger account. I set it up a while ago for personal reasons. Not for the public. I never knew how to make it private. I only needed this audio post for a moment to exchange. And I could not e-mail an audio file this large so a friend suggested I quickly create a blog and e-mail the link to the blog. I don't need this blog anymore. And especially I do not want it public. It was not meant for the public. I created this blog long ago with one sole purpose to be able to e-mail a large audio file. I do not remember the e-mail address I created to set up this blog. I think it asked me to create a yahoo or a google e-mail account. I don't remember. I use MSN. And I created an e-mail account with the sole purpose to quickly set up this blog. Please help me find what e-mail address I created to set up this blog.
    Thank you very much, -J "



    Interesting.


  28. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by gitana1 View Post
    I wanted to comment on the theory that Julia left the kids alone during mediation and then something happened to Sky.

    It is a logical theory. But the two weeks thing really has me feeling different. So does the statement by Solomon before Sky went missing that the mother had thoughts of strangling Sky, coupled with her apparently intense mental illness -bi polar and OCD, depression (possibly began as post-partum depression?).

    So, my theory is there was no accident.

    I think, that when questioning Julia, who was obviously a suspect almost immediately, they asked her to go back and trace what she had been doing, step-by-step, in the days leading up to Sky's disappearance. They probably told her they wanted to make sure no one was stalking her. And maybe they actually believed that was a possibility at first because I am sure one of the first things out of her mouth would have been the intense custody battle and Solomon's "violence".

    So, as she told them things, other LE probably checked those things out. I believe it was a marathon interview session and LE was probably interviewing people while Julia was interviewed.

    So when she discussed mediation, which occurred five days before she was interviewed, they probably asked her where Sky was during it. "Oh, my mother cared for both kids that day." Now she is sweating.

    In the meantime, they are asking all her neighbors, friends and relatives when was the last time they saw Sky (two weeks ago). So they ask grandma, or whoever she claimed was watching the kids, "Didn't you watch Sky on 11-1-11?" "No, just M. Sky was at a play date with so and so."

    Then they call so and so. "No, I never had a play date with Sky on that date." Now the red flags are being raised even higher. LE confers. They go back to mom: "Listen, your mother says she only sat for M. That you told her Sky was with so and so. But we talked to so and so and she denied that. What's going on? No one has seen Sky for two weeks besides you. Is there something you need to tell us? People state they have seen M, but not Sky. What's going on?"

    Now she really starts to freak out. Realizes she is in major trouble. "Okay, I need to admit something to you. I left Sky home alone during mediation. He wasn't feeling well so I didn't want to take him out of the house. He was sleeping. I know it was wrong but I thought he would be okay."

    As she's speaking, you have other LE quickly contacting as many people as possible that Julia states she would have encountered during the last two weeks. Someone states they again saw M with mom at some function or place, without Sky on a certain date within the last two weeks. They again confront Julia: "Where was Sky? Did you have a babysitter that day?" She is getting in deeper and states, "Well, he was sick that day. I left him home at the condo because he was sleeping. I know I shouldn't have but he was okay."

    I really feel this is a strong possibility. I am not buying the accident theory. I think there is no way that a mom with such severe OCD and mental problems would leave her kids alone in her house to mess it up, even if she drugged them or locked them in a bathroom or something. Why wouldn't she just get a babysitter? Why wouldn't she bring them to grandma's or Grandma S's house?

    Even if drugged and locked somewhere - and it had to be both because otherwise, they could cry and scream and someone would hear that - her disordered mind would likely (I imagine), keep wandering to the possibility that they woke up and made some kind of mess. I just can't imagine Julia wanting to leave her kids unattended in her precious house and possibly disrupt the order there.

    No, I really don't think there was an accident. I think LE found out very quickly that Sky hadn't been seen in a while but M had. They confronted her and she had to make up a story. They maybe won't arrest her yet for leaving the kids alone because they do not believe it is true and it undercuts their murder theory. I think they will only arrest her as a last resort, if they feel they will not be able to get enough to prove murder.
    I think it's a good theory. It makes a lot of sense!

    The only thing I'd alter, and it's just my gut, is that I don't think the grandmothers, in her mind, were a viable babysitting option. For living so close, neither grandma is in a lot of pictures. Her mom, I think, appears to be a divorcee/full time professional and wouldn't likely take a weekday off to babysit. That's just my gut. Heck, maybe she did, IDK. But as far as paternal grandparents, if she didn't want Solomon having contact with the kids, I can't see her asking his folks to watch them. Or were the kids still seeing the paternal grandparents?

    Which reminds me. Didn't someone sleuth that at one point, they used a daycare/preschool? And they hadn't been there in months? Was it both children that went to the daycare? And if so, why was it necessary for Sky to go if she's a stay-at-home mom, especially considering their finances.

    All I know is if the leaving a 2 and 4 year old in the apartment alone for extended amounts of time is actually a lie, the truth must be a doozy, because who lies to make themselves look worse?

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  30. #18
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    Some interesting things I noticed when looking at her ChristianMingle profile:

    Under "Info About Me"
    ~ About children - I have kids and I would like more.
    Under "Fun Facts"
    ~ Indoor Activity- Charity/Volunteering, Cooking/Culinary Arts, Movies/TV, Music, Politics, Reading, Shopping, Sports
    ~ Outdoor Activity- Biking, Gardening, Photography, Running, Sunbathing, Traveling/Sightseeing

    Now, IF this is JB's profile I see some things that are in conflict with her OCD and the recluse claim. The charity thing would mean being around alot of people. Cooking/Culinary Arts would imply that she cooks in her own home, unless she means in someone else's kitchen. Biking and Running would mean that she doesn't mind getting dirty and/or sweaty. Gardening would mean that she has no problem with digging in the dirt. We can see from the vast number of photos on her flickr that she does indeed like photography but her obviously preferred subject to photograph is little Miss M.

    It sounds to me that she was willing to lie in order to find a new man to "take care" of her. That is if this is in fact her profile.

    MOO

    Link to the profile for ChristianMingle:
    http://www.christianmingle.com/view-...lia0381&link=3

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  32. #19
    I agree, Gitana. A car is one thing, but for hours at her home that she is obsessive about? When my kids were that age I wouldn't even go in another room for an hour for fear of how my house would look upon returning. I agree that it wasn't a random accident. IMO is was calculated, and like you said, previous to that day. I just don't know how previous.

    Super curious, though I know we'll never know, what M says as she gets more comfortable and safe away from JB.

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  34. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by SurfieTX View Post
    From a psychological point of view and from the research that BritsKate presented about filicide, I did wonder what JB considered "home." Was "home" the place where she returned with a newborn Sky or the apt. in which she lived currently?

    How far is the now-foreclosed family home from this park?
    Yeah do we have the addresses on the two foreclosed properties? The house and the condo? Wondering if watershed is close to "home" for her.

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  36. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by RabidBadger View Post
    http://61.19.1.27/support/forum/p/bl...85b3b1c1&hl=en

    "http://juliabiryukova.blogspot.com/ this is my account. I can't sign in. Don't remember password or the e-mail address. Report abuse

    juliavalerie
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    http://juliabiryukova.blogspot.com/ -- This is my blogger account. I set it up a while ago for personal reasons. Not for the public. I never knew how to make it private. I only needed this audio post for a moment to exchange. And I could not e-mail an audio file this large so a friend suggested I quickly create a blog and e-mail the link to the blog. I don't need this blog anymore. And especially I do not want it public. It was not meant for the public. I created this blog long ago with one sole purpose to be able to e-mail a large audio file. I do not remember the e-mail address I created to set up this blog. I think it asked me to create a yahoo or a google e-mail account. I don't remember. I use MSN. And I created an e-mail account with the sole purpose to quickly set up this blog. Please help me find what e-mail address I created to set up this blog.
    Thank you very much, -J "



    Interesting.
    gosh is that a hard post. a hard post to read. she reminds me of, she reminds me of. gertrude stein. like gertrude stein. she writes like gertrude stein. if gertrude stein posted blogs she might post like this. she might post blogs like this. this is a hard post to read because it reminds me of gertrude stein. gertrude stein is a hard post to read. it hardly seems fair to have to read a post like that. a hard post like that.



    I am sorry yall I dont know how I can even laugh in this thread, the truth is I hoped so hard that after a night off to read the new stephen king that I would come here to see FOUND ALIVE by sky's name.

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  38. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by TorisMom003 View Post
    Some interesting things I noticed when looking at her ChristianMingle profile:

    Under "Info About Me"
    ~ About children - I have kids and I would like more.
    Under "Fun Facts"
    ~ Indoor Activity- Charity/Volunteering, Cooking/Culinary Arts, Movies/TV, Music, Politics, Reading, Shopping, Sports
    ~ Outdoor Activity- Biking, Gardening, Photography, Running, Sunbathing, Traveling/Sightseeing

    Now, IF this is JB's profile I see some things that are in conflict with her OCD and the recluse claim. The charity thing would mean being around alot of people. Cooking/Culinary Arts would imply that she cooks in her own home, unless she means in someone else's kitchen. Biking and Running would mean that she doesn't mind getting dirty and/or sweaty. Gardening would mean that she has no problem with digging in the dirt. We can see from the vast number of photos on her flickr that she does indeed like photography but her obviously preferred subject to photograph is little Miss M.

    It sounds to me that she was willing to lie in order to find a new man to "take care" of her. That is if this is in fact her profile.

    MOO

    Link to the profile for ChristianMingle:
    http://www.christianmingle.com/view-...lia0381&link=3
    I like your assessment. I dunno....I think she makes stuff up all the time. I think JB is ALL about image (clothing, hair, posing, posing, posing children, staging, happy family, pricey house, pricey condo, living outside her means, the front porch, look at the beautiful new front porch!).

    So, IF this is JB's profile, I wouldn't be surprised if she just clicked on a lot of buttons saying, "Yes, I like this! Oh, a man will want to hear that I cook and garden and do charity work! That's what a good, Christian wife does!" I think it's all a farce.
    Websleuths Verified Licensed Mental Health Counselor/Trauma Specialist

    Proud and dedicated member of Sky Crew until Sky Metalwala is brought home where he belongs.


  39. #23
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    I like how my post was copied to another forum with no credit given, lol. Oh well, the more the info is out there, the more sleuths on the case!

    I hope this is the day they find Sky and JB goes down!

  40. The Following 11 Users Say Thank You to RabidBadger For This Useful Post:


  41. #24
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    10,329
    Quote Originally Posted by RabidBadger View Post
    http://61.19.1.27/support/forum/p/bl...85b3b1c1&hl=en

    "http://juliabiryukova.blogspot.com/ this is my account. I can't sign in. Don't remember password or the e-mail address. Report abuse

    juliavalerie
    Level 1
    11/13/11
    Short description of problem:

    http://juliabiryukova.blogspot.com/ -- This is my blogger account. I set it up a while ago for personal reasons. Not for the public. I never knew how to make it private. I only needed this audio post for a moment to exchange. And I could not e-mail an audio file this large so a friend suggested I quickly create a blog and e-mail the link to the blog. I don't need this blog anymore. And especially I do not want it public. It was not meant for the public. I created this blog long ago with one sole purpose to be able to e-mail a large audio file. I do not remember the e-mail address I created to set up this blog. I think it asked me to create a yahoo or a google e-mail account. I don't remember. I use MSN. And I created an e-mail account with the sole purpose to quickly set up this blog. Please help me find what e-mail address I created to set up this blog.
    Thank you very much, -J "



    Interesting.
    A few tidbits: She routinely uses a MSN related email.

    The ChristianMingle moniker was Julia 0381.

    The moniker for this question is Juliavalerie.
    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. ~ Aristotle

    The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense.

  42. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to SurfieTX For This Useful Post:


  43. #25
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    823
    Quote Originally Posted by RabidBadger View Post
    Yeah do we have the addresses on the two foreclosed properties? The house and the condo? Wondering if watershed is close to "home" for her.
    The foreclosed condo is located at 10047 Main Street in Bellevue (approx 4.5 miles to Watershed park).
    Their former house is at 12522 NE 80th Place in Kirkland (approx 3 miles from Watershed).

    http://seattle.blockshopper.com/prop...reet_unit_319/
    http://seattle.blockshopper.com/prop...ne_80th_place/

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