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Thread: CANADA - Dungeon discovered in Pickering (Ontario) farmhouse

  1. #76
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    The thing I keep wondering about though is the fact that they actually spent the time, labor and expense of building a room.

    Why not just board up one of the empty rooms, put a lock on a closet or just attach restraints on the wall? That room is important to someone for some reason.

    And nt I hadn't caught that about the homicide cop. Why do they have a homicide cop on this case? Unless they are suspecting something more than a filmmaker.

    Could they have found some evidence that it had been occupied at one point? Maybe some blood, but not enough to say someone died there?
    Just when I think that I have seen the most depraved things a human can do to another human, somebody posts a new story...........

    Why is it that when a custodial parent fails to provide for a child it is called neglect and is a criminal matter. But when a non custodial parent fails to provide it is called failure to support and is a civil matter?


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  3. #77
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    Lightbulb

    My first thought was Paul Teale/Bernardo's house where he'd placed black-out paper over all of the windows, including the windows to the basement. At that time, neighbours were wondering WHY the windows were all blackened out.

    We later learned the truth.

    Back on topic - could this dungeon thing be used for the same types of crimes Bernardo was committing?

    Just a thought.......
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  5. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by sherbetjello View Post
    Random fires in/of homes in this area, and a chamber built in this abanonded home just this year?......

    Sounds related.

    If I was LE I would be checking many other abanonded homes.

    First thing I though about when skimming through articles was human trafficking.

    If there is no evidence of a crime in this chamber there at least has to be some DNA somewhere. Has to be.
    -----------

    Yes, we were discussing transit of human beings and this possibly being a temporary holding area until the next transport to take them even further away...

    Just one example, (that I think was operative, even in the past, with missing children cases):

    Let's say someone in power has the agenda of abducting a child from the U.S. to another country. This person dispatches someone to abduct the child, or was the abductor? They would find in necessary to travel as far as possible from the 1st crime scene (abduction site), probably cross the border, and have a "rest station" until the next leg of the journey begins. They would need a holding area for multiple reasons.

    And, I agree. I was saying earlier that there probably were fingerprints, DNA etc. at least of the builder(s), if it hadn't yet been put to use.

    Maybe some cold cases can be solved by figuring out who built this. This may have not been a first project.

    My guess is that LE is soft-pedaling their request for someone to come forward and admit they built it, by saying perhaps it could have been intended for some other "innocent" purpose, like a movie set.

    If it was intended to be a "movie set," then it would have had to be planned by amateurs, who did not understand the need for permits, as other sleuths here have pointed out.

    And, if it was amateur indie filmmakers, where the heck would they get the money for building materials, etc.?
    Last edited by concentric; 12-25-2011 at 11:26 AM.

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  7. #79
    <modsnip>

    Somebody upthread mentioned the drugs possibility- I used to live in that general area and drug trafficking was a huge problem along the Quebec-Windsor corridor at the time (unsure if it still is), so I cannot see LE calling it a confinement room without other evidence such as restraints.
    Last edited by Salem; 12-26-2011 at 01:50 PM. Reason: removed quoted post with link to adult site

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  9. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dewey2Me1MoThyme View Post
    I haven't lived in Ont since the early to mid 70s, but at that time there were several motorcycle gangs in and around Toronto, Oshawa, and I've been told near the Sault. Do any of you locals know if those gangs, Devil's Deciple's, Satan's Choice etc are still active. Depending on who you talked to back then, the gangs were "clubs" or "Notorious". Seems there was no happy medium on their activities. I also believe there was a Hell's Angels chapter or two in southern Ontario as well.
    This is EXACTLY what my first thought was.
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  11. #81
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    Probably not connected but close enough to make me go hmmmmmmm...

    http://www.680news.com/news/local/ar...orth-of-bolton

    http://g.co/maps/9qejt
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  13. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by LadyL View Post
    the property doesn't appear to be easily accessible (ie) overgrown/blocked driveway so does the person park on the road, therefore drawing attention or does the person move the cement blocks in order to drive in or does the person have another access route through the woods?
    If you look at the aerial view a number of posts back, even a good sized truck could pull in next the field just down the road from that house and into a little open area not visible from the road. Look below the house where there is what appears to be a concrete pad from a building no longer there.

    A vehicle pulled in there would be visible to people working the large field, which could explain why the room was not built until late fall.

    Edited to add: Looking at the Google map that was posted, at least when that image was taken there were vehicle tracks visible that went right to the house and maybe far enough a truck would not be seen from the field.

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  15. #83
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    Wow, luckily they found this place when they did. From the sounds of it, it seems like whoever built this room was getting prepped to grab a victim. I'd definitely look towards that golf course.. a worker there or something. They could go there and build for a few hours after work or before work without attracting much attention.

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  17. #84
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    I live very close to this location, if any updates occur Ill take a drive and get some pics for everyone....

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  19. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by greatwhitenorth View Post
    I live very close to this location, if any updates occur Ill take a drive and get some pics for everyone....
    Thanks GWN!

    What do you hear locally, what are the guesses that are going on rumor wise?
    Just when I think that I have seen the most depraved things a human can do to another human, somebody posts a new story...........

    Why is it that when a custodial parent fails to provide for a child it is called neglect and is a criminal matter. But when a non custodial parent fails to provide it is called failure to support and is a civil matter?


    "Just when the caterpillar thought its world was over, it became a butterfly" ~ Michelle Knight

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  21. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by mysteriew View Post
    Thanks GWN!

    What do you hear locally, what are the guesses that are going on rumor wise?
    There has been very little News If any... I havent heard anyone even mention it again since the initial News cast.

    Police are not saying anything....i will keep my ears open with any Local updates. If we get any...Smile

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  23. #87
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    out of concern....

    After careful consideration - IMHO - the person who constructed this "confinement room" had to be extremely comfortable in the area. Also, I tend to think it's a single person rather than a group.

    It's important to consider that in the winter months, without the golf course opened, there is literally NO ONE around to hear anything...



    IF (note: BIG if) it was a movie set - why the need for a locking mechanism nobody would be able to penetrate or breach??????



    I wish we'd hear more from authorities.

    Ultra creepy & exactly what nightmares are made of!
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  25. #88
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    Tricky...

    http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2011/12...n_1161079.html

    snipped...

    Durham police spokesman Dave Selby says the home has been abandoned for so long that the focus isn't on the original owners, but on anyone who may have been seen driving in the area or any other suspicious activity.

    "They're obviously down there because it's somewhere where no one would check," said Selby.

    _____________


    While I'm sure the original owners are not suspect - Barkey's built the place in the 1875 - I would hope there's some research going on of more / most recent tenants.

    Due to expropriation of the area the place has most likely been a rental for many many years, that is up until 2006 as it's been reported.
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  27. #89
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    I suspect LE is analyzing the hardware, finding out who makes it, where it's sold, how common it is, and who has purchased it recently.
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  29. #90
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    Making sense of it

    From that last link to huffington post....

    "Our forensic guys went down and took all kinds of samples of anything they could find to figure out if it was used and how it was used," he said.

    "But at this point it's still under investigation, and we really don't know if it was used for a criminal purpose or not."
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  31. #91
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    Sabean inspected the house in November 2010; he examines homes for their heritage value and has written reports for Transport Canada, which is in charge of the expansive swath of Crown land.

    “There was no confinement room then,” Sabean said, “but there was a lot of junk, which is normal when people leave homes they never owned.”


    The former tenants, who police say aren’t suspects, sold herbs and flowers they grew on the property. The government boarded it up after they left.

    http://www.thestar.com/news/article/...-alarm#article

    I wonder whether or not John Sabean inspected the basement. Perhaps he overlooked this room.

    Former tenants grew and sold 'herbs'. :-) Could have been a grow room or where they kept their stash. ;-)

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  33. #92
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    I've wonder too, if Sabean didn't opt to venture into the basement in November 2010...I also wouldn't blame him for not doing so if he was out there inspecting alone.

    Hopefully DRP can tell the difference between a confinement room and a grow/storage room.

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  35. #93
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    The GTA's Forgotten Frontier
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    snipped...

    Teenagers party in other abandoned homes and someone recently built a dungeon in a property that has been boarded up since 2005. No one was killed or tortured there, but the police have no one in custody.

    The land’s owner has let the properties slip into dereliction. The owner, the federal government, has had plans to build an international airport on the site for 40 years.

    ...“These are beautiful homes that the government just let rot,” Delaney said. “Some of these old brick homes are more than 150 years old.”

    http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1106759
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  37. #94
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    Maybe DPR are busy questioning all the present and more important past employees of the Security Firm that's been patrolling this area and these boarded up homes all these years.

    Now there would REALLY be someone comfortable in the area. Not to mention, locals are familiar with these vehicles and would not consider them to be suspicious.

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  39. #95
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    I'm still stuck on why the dungeon? A dungeon would be more expensive to build. And really unnecessary. It wasn't like anyone was living there and needed somewhere to hide a captive from visitors. It wasn't like anyone needed to hide screams from neighbors cause there weren't any close.
    An out of the way room could have served the purpose. Add some restraints, cover the windows and the captive is secure and hidden.

    So building the dungeon is purposeful. Necessary for some other reason than security.
    Just when I think that I have seen the most depraved things a human can do to another human, somebody posts a new story...........

    Why is it that when a custodial parent fails to provide for a child it is called neglect and is a criminal matter. But when a non custodial parent fails to provide it is called failure to support and is a civil matter?


    "Just when the caterpillar thought its world was over, it became a butterfly" ~ Michelle Knight

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  41. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by tarabull View Post
    Maybe DPR are busy questioning all the present and more important past employees of the Security Firm that's been patrolling this area and these boarded up homes all these years.

    Now there would REALLY be someone comfortable in the area. Not to mention, locals are familiar with these vehicles and would not consider them to be suspicious.

    I have driven past this area tons of times...its remote. even the houses are spread out a distance. I have never seen security, maybe a patrolling officer but never security. A Movie makes no sense to me at all. Why would they need the locks on the outside...???? The premises were search in November and this room apparently did not exist at the time.
    A Mystery SO FAR waiting to see if its anything at all....

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  43. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by greatwhitenorth View Post
    I have driven past this area tons of times...its remote. even the houses are spread out a distance. I have never seen security, maybe a patrolling officer but never security. A Movie makes no sense to me at all. Why would they need the locks on the outside...???? The premises were search in November and this room apparently did not exist at the time.

    A Mystery SO FAR waiting to see if its anything at all....
    ditto on the bbm...and yes remote and desolate.

    And I assure you there is hired security that patrols the entire expropriated area and there has been for years...

    but, no need to take my word for it:

    snipped...

    There isn’t a neighbour within screaming distance, save for Glen Cedars Golf Club and the suspicious eye of a roving government-hired security guard, who, along with four police officers, rushed to the area to deal with a curious Star reporter Tuesday morning.

    http://www.thestar.com/news/article/...ses-alarm?bn=1
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  45. #98
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    “Whoever built it,” Selby said, “we hope they’ll call us and tell us what they were doing there.”
    http://www.thestar.com/news/article/...ses-alarm?bn=1

    I don't think that's going to happen! (Well, just bumping for any news since this is really strange!)
    Speaking of mysteries - billions of people past/present, how on earth did I get be on earth and self-aware?

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  47. #99
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    house was burnt down last night. Poloice just reporting ...

    http://www.cp24.com/servlet/an/local.../?hub=CP24Home

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  49. #100
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    Guess LE and the Security Firm weren't keeping too close an eye on this place. It burned to the ground last night.

    http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/loc...TorontoNewHome

    "southern Ontario farmhouse where a bizarre basement dungeon was recently discovered went up in flames overnight, Durham Regional Police said on Friday.

    The abandoned farmhouse near Concession road 7 just in northwest Pickering burned to the ground after catching fire at around 1 a.m. on Friday..."
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