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  1. #1
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    11-year-old Girl Handcuffed for Rudeness

    Yes, the child was rude. But does the punishment fit the crime? What kind of lesson does this teach the children?

    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/03/06...6pLid%3D140899

  2. #2
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    Here's a more serious, but similar case asking the same questions:

    Is a lifetime driving ban an appropriate sentence?

    Rhode Islanders are asking this question in light of a sentence handed down to 17-year-old Lyle Topa last week. The teen was racing in October and slammed into a tree, injuring himself and three others. He was driving on a suspended license at the time and had just left a party where he and his friends had been drinking.

    When asked about the lifetime ban, Judge William Guglietta explained that it was time to get serious about teen drivers who have become a real danger on the road.

    A number of Rhode Island lawmakers think the lifetime driving ban goes too far, reports the Boston Herald. Lifetime bans are for repeat drunken drivers, not teens who may mature into responsible adults.

    This may be true, and is an argument likely to be made if Lyle Topa chooses to appeal his sentence. Sentences are supposed to be proportionate to the crime and, when they involve minors, appropriate for the age.
    http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...74294620120306
    The world is full of monsters with friendly faces and angels full of scars. ~ Unknown

    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. ~ Aristotle

    The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by doublestop View Post
    Yes, the child was rude. But does the punishment fit the crime? What kind of lesson does this teach the children?

    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/03/06...6pLid%3D140899
    If this was done at home they would call it child abuse. Even if it was done for something worse.

    Even a sheriff's dept couldn't handcuff someone for being "rude", but only if restrainsts were necessary to restrain someone for their safety or others safety, to prevent them from interfering in an investigation or other potentially criminal situations.
    Just when I think that I have seen the most depraved things a human can do to another human, somebody posts a new story...........

    Why is it that when a custodial parent fails to provide for a child it is called neglect and is a criminal matter. But when a non custodial parent fails to provide it is called failure to support and is a civil matter?


    "Just when the caterpillar thought its world was over, it became a butterfly" ~ Michelle Knight

  4. #4
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    He might have done her a favor, imo. She cannot go through life disrespecting authority like that. Much worse things may happen to her if she continues. I am guessing she was very rude to the counselor, the principal and the sheriff BEFORE the cuffs were brought out.

    I worked in a middle school. You cannot believe how downright rude and crude and horrid some 11 yr olds can be. I wish I had some cuffs at the time.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn

  5. #5
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    I don't think it's right. If she's disrespectful, call the parents, give her saturday class, suspend her for a few days. I just don't think handcuffing an 11 year old is going to help - it's only going to make her angrier. What lesson is learned here?

    JMHO - thanks.

    While the Adams County Sheriff's Office claims handcuffing students in such a manner is standard procedure, the girl's mother blasted officials for treating her daughter like a "criminal."

    Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/03/06...#ixzz1oMxDZ6uT

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Melanie View Post
    I don't think it's right. If she's disrespectful, call the parents, give her saturday class, suspend her for a few days. I just don't think handcuffing an 11 year old is going to help - it's only going to make her angrier. What lesson is learned here?

    JMHO - thanks.

    While the Adams County Sheriff's Office claims handcuffing students in such a manner is standard procedure, the girl's mother blasted officials for treating her daughter like a "criminal."

    Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/03/06...#ixzz1oMxDZ6uT
    YUP> Sounds about right. The mother is blasting the the cops and not her child/ This sounds just like the parents I dealt with at the middle school. It was always the teachers and administrators' fault--never the kids.

    If a kid didn't turn in their term paper, then the teacher must have lost it. If the kid flunked the test, then the teacher didn't explain it well enough. Many parents NEVER hold their kids responsible for the behavior or actions.

    So Mel, when you say 'call her parents or give her a saturday class,' it sounds correct. But when you call the parents they often take their child's side. And if they are rude to the principal and talk back to the sheriff, enough to be cuffed, how do you think they are going to be during Saturday class?

    This girl needs some help, and sometimes if they are shocked into seeing that they are not the rulers of the world, and they cannot do or say whatever rude thing that comes to mind, then they will be better for it. imo

    Handcuffs are not 'abuse' imo. I think they were just trying to show her some tough love, some boundaries. But her mom will probably sue, and this girl will get even more of a bloated view of her own self worth, and things will only get worse with her behavior, imo.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by katydid23 View Post
    YUP> Sounds about right. The mother is blasting the the cops and not her child/ This sounds just like the parents I dealt with at the middle school. It was always the teachers and administrators' fault--never the kids.

    If a kid didn't turn in their term paper, then the teacher must have lost it. If the kid flunked the test, then the teacher didn't explain it well enough. Many parents NEVER hold their kids responsible for the behavior or actions.
    I heartily agree with making the kids responsible for their own actions. And she should receive punishment for being rude and disrespectful. But that kinda gets lost in the school actions.

    Let's see, she was mouthy...... the school escalated the problem by making it physical. What does the kid learn? They are going to get physical anyway, so might as well make it a physical fight from the first. After all the biggest and strongest win, so the only chance she has of getting in any shots at all is in the beginning.

    To me that is the biggest problem. The school escalated it. If she had been physical then handcuff her. But she wasn't, she was mouthy and rude so they made it physical and handcuffed her. What will they do she does get physical, shoot her?

    The school had so many other options in this case. They could isolate her, suspend her, put her in detention. But no they want to up the ante.

    I'm sorry but I do have a problem with allowing the school more leeway than is allowed a parent. A parent who did this would be prosecuted. How is handcuffing a child any different than duct taping a child? Or tying them up in restraints?
    Just when I think that I have seen the most depraved things a human can do to another human, somebody posts a new story...........

    Why is it that when a custodial parent fails to provide for a child it is called neglect and is a criminal matter. But when a non custodial parent fails to provide it is called failure to support and is a civil matter?


    "Just when the caterpillar thought its world was over, it became a butterfly" ~ Michelle Knight

  8. #8
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    i got a paddling from mr. britton the gym teacher when i was her age. she's lucky

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by mysteriew View Post
    I heartily agree with making the kids responsible for their own actions. And she should receive punishment for being rude and disrespectful. But that kinda gets lost in the school actions.

    Let's see, she was mouthy...... the school escalated the problem by making it physical. What does the kid learn? They are going to get physical anyway, so might as well make it a physical fight from the first. After all the biggest and strongest win, so the only chance she has of getting in any shots at all is in the beginning.

    To me that is the biggest problem. The school escalated it. If she had been physical then handcuff her. But she wasn't, she was mouthy and rude so they made it physical and handcuffed her. What will they do she does get physical, shoot her?

    The school had so many other options in this case. They could isolate her, suspend her, put her in detention. But no they want to up the ante.

    I'm sorry but I do have a problem with allowing the school more leeway than is allowed a parent. A parent who did this would be prosecuted. How is handcuffing a child any different than duct taping a child? Or tying them up in restraints?
    They didn't Allow the 'school' more leeway than a parent,they allowed a sheriff more leeway. He has the legal right to use cuffs, even if no one is actually arrested. They use them when investigating or sorting things out.

    I wouldn't call putting hand cuffs on a person the same thing as 'getting physical.' They didn't beat her. Imo, it is more like showing the person the balance of power that exists. She, at 11, was showing extreme disrespect for the authority figures in her life. I think they were trying to show her that she has less power in relation to the authority figures in her life, than she thinks she has.

    Hand cuffing is very different than duct taping. LE handcuffs people all day long. Even if they are not being arrested, they might be cuffed while things are being checked out. It is not 'torture'--it is routine procedure.

    I think Mom is blowing things out of proportion.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn

  10. #10
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    The schools are in a no win situation. If they have a student who refuses to obey the rules , what can they do?? Some children are so out of control and use to having their way that they just will not obey. Sure they can call the parents, give extra homework but many times the student will just keep doing whatever he wants to do. Some children have no respect for authority. If they let the student do what ever, it will snowball to more and more students.

    Of course I would not want my children handcuffed but they knew they had to follow the rules at school.


  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by LadyLuck View Post
    The schools are in a no win situation. If they have a student who refuses to obey the rules , what can they do?? Some children are so out of control and use to having their way that they just will not obey. Sure they can call the parents, give extra homework but many times the student will just keep doing whatever he wants to do. Some children have no respect for authority. If they let the student do what ever, it will snowball to more and more students.

    Of course I would not want my children handcuffed but they knew they had to follow the rules at school.
    And if the principal allows one student like this to mouth off to him and turn her back and walk away like that, the odds are good that he will lose control of the student population. He is in charge of keeping order in the school and of keeping them all safe. So he has to show the other kids that he will not stand for that type of behavior, otherwise the other kids will follow her lead.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn

  12. #12
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    Hmmm I don't know.When I visited my brother two years ago my niece should have been lipcuffed for she smacked them at least 30 times a day.Spoiled whiney brat.

  13. #13
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    I don't understand why handcuffs are an appropriate response to any form of speech, except actual threats of physical violence. I realize they are used with adult suspects when the officer has no way of knowing whether the suspect will pose a physical threat or try to escape. But on a lippy 11-year-old girl?

    Sounds more like bullying to me and aren't we all supposed to be against that?

  14. #14
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    Last year my then 7 yr old DD was actually praised for talking back to her teacher.
    The teacher thought it was good to see her having some attitude instead of always crying or being too afraid to speak up, while I thought she should have at least gotten some punishment for it, because it broke one of the core school rules of being respectful.


    An 11 year old being handcuffed for being rude or disrespectful is way OTT, IMO.

    I wonder how many teachers at that school have used those very same words "I don't have time for this"?

    I believe in mutual respect. And I often wonder why it's okay for teachers to have bad days and take it out their students, but kids are expected to be perfect little angels every day. Do they forget that most 11 yr old girls have 'off' days including a bit of attitude with hormones kicking in?

    I know my philosophy is different from many others. Personally I think that the PBIS initiative is a much healthier way of dealing with, and preventing behaviour issues.
    I guess it's a good thing that differents school use different methods, so we can have our children enrolled in a school that suits our personal philosophies.

    She says she's learned her lesson. I just happen to think there were better alternatives to teaching her that lesson.

    'She told me that I need to quit giving her my attitude. Why would they handcuff me? I'm not the type of girl to get arrested,' Ms Quezada said.

    Ms Quezada's mother, Mireya Gaytan, questioned the school's actions and bruise marks on left on her daughter's wrist by the handcuffs.

    Ms Gaytan has moved both her daughters to a new school following the incident.

    In any case, Ms Quezada seems to have learned a valuable lesson when it comes to communicating with teachers.

    'Not to give them attitude,' she said. 'I am blaming myself.'
    More @ link: Note that in the video it states that the mother does not condone her daughters behaviour, just that she questions the severity of the punishment. Also that the report states that she was never violent, just disobedient and disrespectful.

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz1oSWlSut1

    JMO



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