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  1. #751
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    What's behind Call #1, a goat or a mink coat?

    Quote Originally Posted by AbbeyR View Post
    And, why wouldn't he call HT not DR to see if she made it home?
    Maybe he did. We don't know who the other call was too, nor which call was made first. Maybe he did call HT and no answer so then tried DR. I think you make a good point here. If the call was to HT and DR. Then this would give some weight to that theory that JR was checking to see if she made it.

    On the other hand, if this other call was to someone who is more on the shady side... then it leans more towards JR's direct involvement.


  2. #752
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    Twin Peaks

    Quote Originally Posted by imkeylime View Post
    IDK. From the recent articles, CR was interested in LS, though I don't see anything that suggests she was interested in him. OTOH, CR and MB donated DNA, so if he/they acted on that interest, why do that? Except that CR can't remember, but if that's the case, why would he give DNA in the first place? That's another mystery, IMO.

    If LS' story was fiction, a twist might be that someone was watching from behind the scenes and manipulated them all. Alas, I believe I've watched too much of David Lynch's "Twin Peaks" ...
    Anywhere you get an idea from, it's great... because ultimately it's a theory and it can either be torn down, or it stands. The "idea" that there is something that links CR/MB to JR and to LS and it's not being torn down.
    One of those things is the likelyhood of drugs. But there are also people linking the 3, previous events including previous partying, including Person X. Seems more than likely that Soap Opera-ish elements driven by opportunistic circumstances ranging to a devious manaipulative mastermind are also possible.

    The bottom line is that this smells an awful lot more like an inside job than anything else. We just arent' sure, which insider(s) made which play.
    By deduction we arrive at less and less possibilities which create new questions to further be ruled out. I want very much to have most of my questions and ideas ruled out, because that begins to reveal the truth.


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  4. #753
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    DNA or DENY

    Quote Originally Posted by imkeylime View Post
    IDK. From the recent articles, CR was interested in LS, though I don't see anything that suggests she was interested in him. OTOH, CR and MB donated DNA, so if he/they acted on that interest, why do that? Except that CR can't remember, but if that's the case, why would he give DNA in the first place? That's another mystery, IMO.

    If LS' story was fiction, a twist might be that someone was watching from behind the scenes and manipulated them all. Alas, I believe I've watched too much of David Lynch's "Twin Peaks" ...
    One would think it rather pointless to resist DNA requests by LE. It would not take much to get a Judge to order that. So, resisting would only serve to make someone seem obstructionist. But I think it's really interesting that LE asked for it of certain people.

    Then as far as CR wanting to get into LS's pants, that probably would not be surprising to LS. I would be very surprised if she were not hit on every day and especially in these types of social situations. It would seem human nature that she would enjoy the attention - to a point, and that he would keep her entertained and hoping for a moment when she might let her guard down. And isn't this how it is from puberty, through college, in bar scenes and even in a lot of religious environments when you are young and single.
    Young women are both enjoying the attention, avoiding the creeps, looking for a partner or better partner or pretty much as often as men, or at times just going with the moment. What runs through my mind is that she had to be somewhat used to this sort of thing, and perhaps had strategies to deal with it. I would want to know from her friends, how did LS normally handle these situations? Everyone has habits(that's how humans function) and patterns and we should know hers, as well as all of the POI's. Then you get a clearer picture of what situations were most likely to occur and what the response would be. For example, let's say CR just flat out told LS to come to his place but she was trying to figure out a way out of it but for whatever reason was wasted and had a hard time doing so. Then very plausible another salivating hyena is there at smallwood before she can get to her apt. How rational she be at this point? She operates on instinct... let's go to XX's place... but she's in and out of consciousness. And XX's are not responding. CR, keeps coaxing her to come home with him. She stuck... can't go home, no one answers the door, don't want to wind up with CR... but then blam! face down lights out, purse and keys gone (except her keycard and fake ID which JR later says she had) Then minutes later she's on CR's back. Then inside of his apt. Yeah, I think it's her who vomits on the rug. And then she helps MB put CR to bed? nah... more like CR puts her into his bed. Got stains in that bed, stains on the floor, maybe some dna samples for that stuff? But so many people in and out... lots of dna there. Maybe something if you could prove LS's vomit and LS's blood. Or that she was in that bed (but wait LS said she helped CR to bed so of course her DNA is there... hmmm) So, is he a loser and rapes her as she's passed out? This is not unheard of... and it comes more under that gray area of date rape than rape because with all of the drinking and such, it's hard to prove whether or not it's consentual. So, like most of the other scenarios what happens next is she dies. Now what? Would JR help in this situation? Let's say he would because, JR supplied the coke or other drug that got her so messed up such that she died. The fact that CR may have taken advantage of that situation may not have been known to JR. For example... CR ejaculates by 3:15 and realizes that shes not breathing. He tries some CPR and it's not doing anything... He puts her clothes on, which may have mostly still been on and yells for MB. MB may not have realized what CR did and is now simply freaked out that she's dead. So JR & X come over and take her to JR's etc... Most of this plays out the same except she could have been raped by CR and no one else would know (and of course CR cant remember if he raped her or not)

    Ultimately this probably does come down to the gritty underside of human nature. Some guys just wanted to have sex with her, most wanted to get high/wasted/totally messed up, someone wanted to profit. Follow the money, follow the dope, follow the testosterone. All 3 trails were involved, which leads to her demise? Or rather which can be ruled out? So far, none of them.


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  6. #754
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    Misinformation

    Quote Originally Posted by Jacobite View Post
    Thank you! Now it gets much more interesting because it says her fake ID was found at 12th and Walnut. That's a couple blocks north-east of Rosenbaum's. Walnut is also Hwy 37 North to Indianapolis. Just what I suspected all along. It doesn't make sense to use lightly traveled back roads to leave town in the wee hours of the morning. Police are looking at anything that moves at those hours and there's safety in numbers using the main highway. One would not want to get pulled over and asked to open the trunk. So, I'd really like to look at video and try to spy a certain little blue car, white truck, or any other vehicle associated with POI that was not searched.
    And, now we know that Lauren had her room key but had lost her building key. Now it also makes sense why she would call David to let her in the front door when she has the key to her apartment.
    Wait a minute.

    Someone posts a link here which is to an HT Blog, where someone posts a rumor and then you comment on it like it's a proven fact?

    That would probably qualify as MISINFORMATION. <modsnip>

    JR is quoted as saying that LS had her SW keycard AND her Fake ID at his place before she was supposedly last seen by him. There has been no substantiated or official statement about her SW Keycard or Fake ID being found. If so, let's see it. If her ID had been found at 12th street that would be huge news. The what happened to LS compass is pointing to a square block bordered by 10th, College, 11th, Morton, and so far there is nothing to disprove that. And for me personally, it's pointing to 10th and College.

    I think Jupiter182 asked about entrances to 10th and college. I'm sure that CR knew them all, he just seems like that sort of guy. I'm particularly curious of any entrances that avoid the alley cam, but come from north or east or go directly into a parking garage (still hoping someone can confirm where the parking garage is and where the entrance / exits are.


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  8. #755
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    Quote Originally Posted by VeryVeritas View Post
    One would think it rather pointless to resist DNA requests by LE. It would not take much to get a Judge to order that. So, resisting would only serve to make someone seem obstructionist. But I think it's really interesting that LE asked for it of certain people.

    Then as far as CR wanting to get into LS's pants, that probably would not be surprising to LS. I would be very surprised if she were not hit on every day and especially in these types of social situations. It would seem human nature that she would enjoy the attention - to a point, and that he would keep her entertained and hoping for a moment when she might let her guard down. And isn't this how it is from puberty, through college, in bar scenes and even in a lot of religious environments when you are young and single.
    Young women are both enjoying the attention, avoiding the creeps, looking for a partner or better partner or pretty much as often as men, or at times just going with the moment. What runs through my mind is that she had to be somewhat used to this sort of thing, and perhaps had strategies to deal with it. I would want to know from her friends, how did LS normally handle these situations? Everyone has habits(that's how humans function) and patterns and we should know hers, as well as all of the POI's. Then you get a clearer picture of what situations were most likely to occur and what the response would be. For example, let's say CR just flat out told LS to come to his place but she was trying to figure out a way out of it but for whatever reason was wasted and had a hard time doing so. Then very plausible another salivating hyena is there at smallwood before she can get to her apt. How rational she be at this point? She operates on instinct... let's go to XX's place... but she's in and out of consciousness. And XX's are not responding. CR, keeps coaxing her to come home with him. She stuck... can't go home, no one answers the door, don't want to wind up with CR... but then blam! face down lights out, purse and keys gone (except her keycard and fake ID which JR later says she had) Then minutes later she's on CR's back. Then inside of his apt. Yeah, I think it's her who vomits on the rug. And then she helps MB put CR to bed? nah... more like CR puts her into his bed. Got stains in that bed, stains on the floor, maybe some dna samples for that stuff? But so many people in and out... lots of dna there. Maybe something if you could prove LS's vomit and LS's blood. Or that she was in that bed (but wait LS said she helped CR to bed so of course her DNA is there... hmmm) So, is he a loser and rapes her as she's passed out? This is not unheard of... and it comes more under that gray area of date rape than rape because with all of the drinking and such, it's hard to prove whether or not it's consentual. So, like most of the other scenarios what happens next is she dies. Now what? Would JR help in this situation? Let's say he would because, JR supplied the coke or other drug that got her so messed up such that she died. The fact that CR may have taken advantage of that situation may not have been known to JR. For example... CR ejaculates by 3:15 and realizes that shes not breathing. He tries some CPR and it's not doing anything... He puts her clothes on, which may have mostly still been on and yells for MB. MB may not have realized what CR did and is now simply freaked out that she's dead. So JR & X come over and take her to JR's etc... Most of this plays out the same except she could have been raped by CR and no one else would know (and of course CR cant remember if he raped her or not)

    Ultimately this probably does come down to the gritty underside of human nature. Some guys just wanted to have sex with her, most wanted to get high/wasted/totally messed up, someone wanted to profit. Follow the money, follow the dope, follow the testosterone. All 3 trails were involved, which leads to her demise? Or rather which can be ruled out? So far, none of them.
    Under Indiana law, an intoxicated person cannot give consent. If Corey had done this, he would have been charged with rape and they would be putting the screws to him now. The police would certainly like to file any charges they could find in order to get more answers. So, this simply did not happen.


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  10. #756
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    Quote Originally Posted by VeryVeritas View Post
    Wait a minute.

    Someone posts a link here which is to an HT Blog, where someone posts a rumor and then you comment on it like it's a proven fact?

    That would probably qualify as MISINFORMATION. <modsnip>

    JR is quoted as saying that LS had her SW keycard AND her Fake ID at his place before she was supposedly last seen by him. There has been no substantiated or official statement about her SW Keycard or Fake ID being found. If so, let's see it. If her ID had been found at 12th street that would be huge news. The what happened to LS compass is pointing to a square block bordered by 10th, College, 11th, Morton, and so far there is nothing to disprove that. And for me personally, it's pointing to 10th and College.

    I think Jupiter182 asked about entrances to 10th and college. I'm sure that CR knew them all, he just seems like that sort of guy. I'm particularly curious of any entrances that avoid the alley cam, but come from north or east or go directly into a parking garage (still hoping someone can confirm where the parking garage is and where the entrance / exits are.
    There are conflicting accounts about just about everything including Lauren's condition. I really don't know who to believe. Try to solve this puzzle by adding links to a chain won't work. Try to build theory upon theory, huh.
    Build upon a bad foundation and the whole thing will collapse.

    I'm using a different method and my method works for me. It's called the big picture. Opportunity is the key for who, what, where, why, how, and etc.
    I prefer doing to talking. And, I've been known to walk out of boring meetings at my own corporations because discussions are a waste of time. I'm ready to go look for Lauren and leave the others looking for her key card. After Lauren is found everyone will be singing like a bird.
    We'll get the itty bitty details then.
    Last edited by Jacobite; 06-12-2012 at 10:13 AM.


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  12. #757
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    But where to look, where is Lauren?

    On the one hand, the way she is so well hidden makes it look like it was something planned, or a random attack.

    If done by those around her, spur-of-the-moment; they did not have much time to plan, which should be good thing, unless they were very lucky (don't like saying it that way!).

    Without much time, I lean to what's been mentioned that she was simply stashed away in a open construction pit, and by chance wasn't seen and is now beneath concrete or building structure...
    "oldsteve" - no relation to anyone outside this forum. My posts not to be used/quoted outside of Websleuths.



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  14. #758
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    There is something I feel really needs said here. i took the time to do the legwork and track down someone who knew Corey Rossman. Someone who had heard his version of the story. Here's part of it. Corey wanted to be the protector that night. He wanted to be the hero. He tried to be the good guy. But, he was punched out of action. Lauren came knocking on his door and she asked him to accompany her to the bar. At the bar, they felt they were being watched and being set up. At Smallwood they were ambushed.
    Corey was beat up. Lauren did not go to her room because she did not want to. She would not go home. She could not go home. Lauren and Corey did not call police to report the assault because the police would have arrested everybody. Lauren and Corey feared the police mistakenly more than they feared evil itself.
    So, I had this info. Maybe, I was also the person who could have made a difference. Maybe, I could have broke the ice and got Corey to speak with Lauren's parents. Sometimes, just one person can make a difference. And, maybe this is the truth. The truth is what we seek in the end.


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  16. #759
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldSteve View Post
    But where to look, where is Lauren?

    On the one hand, the way she is so well hidden makes it look like it was something planned, or a random attack.

    If done by those around her, spur-of-the-moment; they did not have much time to plan, which should be good thing, unless they were very lucky (don't like saying it that way!).

    Without much time, I lean to what's been mentioned that she was simply stashed away in a open construction pit, and by chance wasn't seen and is now beneath concrete or building structure...
    Maybe, this case was always very simple. Who has a boat and a lake to carry out the legend? I've now connected an Indiana POI to two lakes in Indy.
    Maybe it was that simple all along. Maybe, no one connected the dots and searched the right lake.


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  18. #760
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jacobite View Post
    There is something I feel really needs said here. i took the time to do the legwork and track down someone who knew Corey Rossman. Someone who had heard his version of the story. Here's part of it. Corey wanted to be the protector that night. He wanted to be the hero. He tried to be the good guy. But, he was punched out of action. Lauren came knocking on his door and she asked him to accompany her to the bar. At the bar, they felt they were being watched and being set up. At Smallwood they were ambushed.
    Corey was beat up. Lauren did not go to her room because she did not want to. She would not go home. She could not go home. Lauren and Corey did not call police to report the assault because the police would have arrested everybody. Lauren and Corey feared the police mistakenly more than they feared evil itself.
    So, I had this info. Maybe, I was also the person who could have made a difference. Maybe, I could have broke the ice and got Corey to speak with Lauren's parents. Sometimes, just one person can make a difference. And, maybe this is the truth. The truth is what we seek in the end.
    Wow! You would make a great PI!
    It seems it would be in Lauren's parents interests to reach out to Corey and somehow assure him that they will not bring him into civil court if he provides more info. Perhaps if this could be offered to others as well, one-by-one those who are not involved could be weeded out?

    Why couldn't Lauren go back to her room, what did she fear?
    "oldsteve" - no relation to anyone outside this forum. My posts not to be used/quoted outside of Websleuths.



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  20. #761
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jacobite View Post
    There is something I feel really needs said here. i took the time to do the legwork and track down someone who knew Corey Rossman. Someone who had heard his version of the story. Here's part of it. Corey wanted to be the protector that night. He wanted to be the hero. He tried to be the good guy. But, he was punched out of action. Lauren came knocking on his door and she asked him to accompany her to the bar. At the bar, they felt they were being watched and being set up. At Smallwood they were ambushed.
    Corey was beat up. Lauren did not go to her room because she did not want to. She would not go home. She could not go home. Lauren and Corey did not call police to report the assault because the police would have arrested everybody. Lauren and Corey feared the police mistakenly more than they feared evil itself.
    So, I had this info. Maybe, I was also the person who could have made a difference. Maybe, I could have broke the ice and got Corey to speak with Lauren's parents. Sometimes, just one person can make a difference. And, maybe this is the truth. The truth is what we seek in the end.
    Thank you for this. I think it is possible that CR is being misunderstood.

    If CR's amnesia was fictional, why would he claim he doesn't remember? Would it be because of what or who he fears?


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  22. #762
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    Quote Originally Posted by OldSteve View Post
    But where to look, where is Lauren?

    On the one hand, the way she is so well hidden makes it look like it was something planned, or a random attack.

    If done by those around her, spur-of-the-moment; they did not have much time to plan, which should be good thing, unless they were very lucky (don't like saying it that way!).

    Without much time, I lean to what's been mentioned that she was simply stashed away in a open construction pit, and by chance wasn't seen and is now beneath concrete or building structure...
    I think it is easy to get lucky and not being able to find the body doesn't necessarily mean she is well-hidden. On days I procrastinate from my schoolwork (currently writing dissertation ) I have scrolled through many cases here. There are tons where a body wasn't found right away despite the drunken fools who "hid it" just dumping it randomly out in the open somewhere. Like, literally not even hidden under anything and within 10 miles of the abduction site/house/whatever. There are also literally hundreds of pages of missing people who have never been found. Sure, some are well-hidden or perhaps voluntarily missing, but I am sure a good other chunk just happen to be laying out somewhere and no one has stumbled over the body yet.
    There are acres upon acres upon acres of woods, water, and random structures in the immediate area. Lauren could literally have been dumped somewhere in the woods out in the open or in an abandoned shed and for some reason God just hasn't thought it time for us to find her yet.


    I guess if you think about how tiny a body is (especially Lauren's) and how big the world is it makes sense.


    On another note, I am just no longer believing she walked away from CR/JR's complex. Not sure where exactly to go from there because accepting that premise opens up a can of worms of who knew, why, how, and where.


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  24. #763
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    Amnesia is usually the first step in an insanity defense (or temporary insanity). It shows a mental disconnect with earlier actions. So, if someone has watched enough TV they might try and play that card hoping they don't get caught, and assuming if they do that card will mitigate the punishment.

    So that is one reason why he'd claim amnesia.

    But just because there's a reason one would claim amnesia without it being true doesn't mean it's the case here. Clearly, people have blacked out from drugs and drinking, from concussions, and even from legitimate mental issues.


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  26. #764
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    Quote Originally Posted by akh View Post
    Amnesia is usually the first step in an insanity defense (or temporary insanity). It shows a mental disconnect with earlier actions. So, if someone has watched enough TV they might try and play that card hoping they don't get caught, and assuming if they do that card will mitigate the punishment.

    So that is one reason why he'd claim amnesia.

    But just because there's a reason one would claim amnesia without it being true doesn't mean it's the case here. Clearly, people have blacked out from drugs and drinking, from concussions, and even from legitimate mental issues.
    I realize that and we have pretty much discussed that ad nauseum. I was trying to get at who and what he fears...I guess the short answer is something along the lines of a drug dealer and all that that entails.


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  28. #765
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    I grew up in an area around where Lauren was from. Still have friends up there. The impression that I get from talking to them is that they really think this was an abduction. Supposedly there's been lots of them in Indiana or so I've been told. Maybe it can be as simple as that...some random sicko harmed Lauren.


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