FL - 17-yo Teen Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #5

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Salem

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Please continue here.

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Salem

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=166660"]Thread 4[/ame]
 
Hi Mr. Hornsby! :seeya: So glad you decided to stop by.

I have a legal question about all this.

What, if anything, will be done or could be done if that racial slur does turn out to be what GZ said? Is that enough to move into hate crime territory?


Thankx!
 
I was adviser to a student newspaper at a college with a large percentage of Black students. It is difficult to photograph dark skin in black and white - it does not reflect light as easily. Therefore, in many b/w photos of Blacks, the persons features were indiscernible. We routinely altered the photos in Photoshop to show the faces more clearly. That was the only reason.
 
Responding to an earlier question from roug...(can't remember how it's spelled)- There is no evidence that shows Trayvon could not have started the fight. Regardless of if he was followed, he still could have started a fight. It's quite simple and we don't know all the facts. Following someone is not starting a fight. I believe Mr. Hornsby confirmed this when he said that the evidence could show that GZ was in his rights to use deadly force...
 
I was adviser to a student newspaper at a college with a large percentage of Black students. It is difficult to photograph dark skin in black and white - it does not reflect light as easily. Therefore, in many b/w photos of Blacks, the persons features were indiscernible. We routinely altered the photos in Photoshop to show the faces more clearly. That was the only reason.

How do you know?
 
Songline, Let me clarify for you. Suspension does equate to a bad kid. And it certainly does not make one deserving of being killed.
 
Mr. Hornsby,

Thanks so much for stopping by!

There are video cameras in that complex. Do you think LE looked over the tapes to see if anything was caught on tape? Why haven't we seen any written/recorded statements by George Zimmerman the night of the shooting? Pictures of his injuries? His clothes? Where are the Sunshine Laws?
 
Glad to see you again Richard! So was Trayvon expected to know that GZ was carrying a gun and not fight back in fear of a stranger stalking him?
 
Tonight at 7:00 EST, Dateline NBC will have a segment on Trayvon's case for those who might be interested and don't know about it.
 
I was adviser to a student newspaper at a college with a large percentage of Black students. It is difficult to photograph dark skin in black and white - it does not reflect light as easily. Therefore, in many b/w photos of Blacks, the persons features were indiscernible. We routinely altered the photos in Photoshop to show the faces more clearly. That was the only reason.

I think the second picture looks more like the other pictures we have seen of him that are in color. Not sure why this is an issue unless someone would make it an issue. I think the public interest in the picture would be a clear picture that reflects what he looked like. At least it would for me. jmo
 
Songline, if he was acting as a Watch person, if in fact, as you maintain, he had a duty to do so, then did he not also have a duty to follow the rules of the Neighborhood Watch organization? I don't think you should be able to cloak yourself in the authority of an organization while flagrantly flouting it's rules.

I find it significant that Zimmerman does not identify himself as a member of the Neighborhood Watch to the dispatcher when he calls. Or at least nowhere I could find. I also find it significant that Chief Lee stresses that George was on a personal errand at the time of the incident. Moo

http://news.yahoo.com/george-zimmerman-why-did-shoot-trayvon-martin-141231964.html
 
Does being a neighborhood watchman give them any authority?
 
Does anyone really believe that Trayvon jumped out and attacked George Zimmerman as he was walking back to his truck (after checking for the name of a street sign in a neighborhood he had stalked since 2009)?
 
Songline, if he was acting as a Watch person, if in fact, as you maintain, he had a duty to do so, then did he not also have a duty to follow the rules of the Neighborhood Watch organization? I don't think you should be able to cloak yourself in the authority of an organization while flagrantly flouting it's rules.

I find it significant that Zimmerman does not identify himself as a member of the Neighborhood Watch to the dispatcher when he calls. Or at least nowhere I could find. I also find it significant that Chief Lee stresses that George was on a personal errand at the time of the incident. Moo

http://news.yahoo.com/george-zimmerman-why-did-shoot-trayvon-martin-141231964.html
What authority does a neighborhood watch member have that is different than a private citizen?
 
Does being a neighborhood watchman give them any authority?

No. They are only suppose to watch, observe and report suspicious behavior to LE. They are not to pursue. jmo
 
Does anyone really believe that Trayvon jumped out and attacked George Zimmerman as he was walking back to his truck (after checking for the name of a street sign in a neighborhood he had stalked since 2009)?

I don't.
 
What authority does a neighborhood watch member have that is different than a private citizen?

They have no authority. They have a set of guidelines to follow to report a crime or suspicious behavior same as any private citizen. Difference is a NWP knows they are only to report and not to pursue. So I guess GZ thought of himself as a private citizen and the guidelines be damned. jmo
 
Responding to an earlier question from roug...(can't remember how it's spelled)- There is no evidence that shows Trayvon could not have started the fight. Regardless of if he was followed, he still could have started a fight. It's quite simple and we don't know all the facts. Following someone is not starting a fight. I believe Mr. Hornsby confirmed this when he said that the evidence could show that GZ was in his rights to use deadly force...

Column A: Evidence that GZ started the fight
*Targeted TM for looking "suspicious", called it in to 911
*Followed TM despite Neighborhood Watch guidelines that explicitly state not to
*Continued to pursue TM despite 911 operator instructing him not to (refusing to give a concrete location where LE could meet him is evidence, IMO, that he was continuing to pursue TM)
*Eyewitness statement from TM's girlfriend that TM was trying to get away from GZ and she was encouraging him to do the same.
*No indication from any of the evidence that TM was, at any time, pursuing GZ.
*TM is screaming for help (as evidence by eyewitness statements from the 911 callers).
*TM is found dead, lying on his stomach, with GZ pressing on his back while straddling him.

Column B: Evidence that TM started the fight:
*I've got nothing, so please fill in the blank (and please source your evidence, as I did).

My links to support my argument are here:
http://abcnews.go.com/US/traynor-ma...-crucial-phone/story?id=15959017#.T29m1ngqNok

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2...-zimmerman-never-tried-to-help-trayvon-martin

http://abcnews.go.com/US/neighborho...s-questionable/story?id=15907136#.T29onXgqNom

A woman who says she and her roommate witnessed the final moments of Trayvon Martin's life told Dateline NBC that George Zimmerman had "his hands pressed on his back" and "never turned him over or tried to help him."

"He said this man was watching him, so he put his hoodie on. He said he lost the man," Martin's friend said. "I asked Trayvon to run, and he said he was going to walk fast. I told him to run, but he said he was not going to run."

Eventually, he would run, said the girl, thinking that he'd managed to escape. But suddenly the strange man was back, cornering Martin.

"Trayvon said, 'What are you following me for,' and the man said, 'What are you doing here.' Next thing I hear is somebody pushing, and somebody pushed Trayvon because the head set just fell. I called him again, and he didn't answer the phone."

Another officer corrected a witness after she told him that she heard the teen cry for help.

The officer told the witness, a long-time teacher, it was Zimmerman who cried for help, said the witness. ABC News has spoken to the teacher and she confirmed that the officer corrected her when she said she heard the teenager shout for help.
 
Does anyone really believe that Trayvon jumped out and attacked George Zimmerman as he was walking back to his truck (after checking for the name of a street sign in a neighborhood he had stalked since 2009)?

I think it's very possible he attacked GZ at some point.
 
Do we have any knowledge as to where GZ is at the present time.. I realize he has not been arrested but is he in hiding or in protective custody?
 
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