If Shannan Gilbert was Drugged, this would be the perfect choice

I believe if Shannan Gilbert was drugged this is the drug that was used for the many reasons listed below. It is fast acting & short term which could be the reason why Shannan made the 23 min 911 call.
IMO Joesph Brewer made ANOTHER big mistake..... make sense that they went some were upon Shannans arrival. The drug is white & powdery. The Doctor has access to this drug. Wonder who keeps track of it & actually I would want to know exactly how many times on record he supposibly administered it.

This would also make sense about the girl found drugged, & picked up by patrol. I saw this on the News. I followed it. So take it as Imaginery if you chose I really do not care, thats your jig. The link is Me. So I heard her interview & she discribed being drugged & this drug would fit the mold IMO.
So no libel threats please lol.....just some peace & positive energy Thanx...we are human & we Feel different thoughts. I am here because this site is here to HELP VICTIMS & FAMILIES & people donate time to help & I respect their plight. Thank You Web Slueths You Rock!

Now I know there will be many people discrediting that is fine, you shine ), like to keep it in the positive & throw in New thoughts & New Theories

I think the clock is running out for these 2 killers IMO, Joesph Brewer & The Doc my POI. Nothing lasts forever my friends.......Just saying, it is my libel thought )


Succinylcholine: Is It the Perfect Murder Weapon? Not Exactly.

http://writersforensicsblog.wordpre...cinylcholine-is-it-the-perfect-murder-weapon/


There have been many famous cases in which Succinylcholine was employed or at least suspected to have been used. Just Google

This is a kind of anesthesia. About 1 in 10,000 people (including myself, which is how I know about this) lack the enzyme that makes the body wake up from this particular drug. So in rare cases, the drug can be fatal on its own, probably especially if given outside of a medical setting.

Chances that the above information applies to Shannan's case: probably miniscule.

We keep assuming that, being a doctor, CPH would have access to all kinds of drugs that he could pass out at all hours of the day and night. I doubt this is really so easy, even for a doctor. I would think that an anesthesia drug would be particularly difficult to obtain; it's not as if pharmaceutical reps would be handing out samples.

MOO

Aleph said:

This is a kind of anesthesia. About 1 in 10,000 people (including myself, which is how I know about this) lack the enzyme that makes the body wake up from this particular drug. So in rare cases, the drug can be fatal on its own, probably especially if given outside of a medical setting.

Chances that the above information applies to Shannan's case: probably miniscule.

We keep assuming that, being a doctor, CPH would have access to all kinds of drugs that he could pass out at all hours of the day and night. I doubt this is really so easy, even for a doctor. I would think that an anesthesia drug would be particularly difficult to obtain; it's not as if pharmaceutical reps would be handing out samples.

MOO

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Plus doesn't this drug cause immediate and profound paralysis? It's not the kind of med someone could be injected with and then run around the neighborhood on.

Aleph said:

This is a kind of anesthesia. About 1 in 10,000 people (including myself, which is how I know about this) lack the enzyme that makes the body wake up from this particular drug. So in rare cases, the drug can be fatal on its own, probably especially if given outside of a medical setting.

Chances that the above information applies to Shannan's case: probably miniscule.

We keep assuming that, being a doctor, CPH would have access to all kinds of drugs that he could pass out at all hours of the day and night. I doubt this is really so easy, even for a doctor. I would think that an anesthesia drug would be particularly difficult to obtain; it's not as if pharmaceutical reps would be handing out samples.

MOO

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Thanx for the thoughts, but truth is most people who obtained this drug to kill were not even doctors,they were nurses or lay health professionals. Oh and I am sure Dr. Hackett climbing that ladder to his professional status had access. See Truth Spiders links, real telling.

I believe that being the drug of choice is MONUMENTAL.....since it does not leave a trace......if Hackett was a killer that would be drug of choice.

I never put this out for over a year due to timing ....I felt it from the beginning thats how Joesph Brewer & his pal the Doc & Shifty Gus covering it up ....hence tapes from gus @ the front gate...

IMO LE was on that from the get go....
MY OPINION FOLKS thanx:blushing:

If something was adminsitered via IV; I do not thing SG would have gottten off of the the docs patios steps. IV drugs hit you hard and quick. Once that needle hits the vein, you are not getting across the street let alone tercking through a marsh. She must have been given something in pill form. Not a pill you eat, but a pill under the tongue. It was must have been an anestetic. Not a valium, klonopin, xanax type of medication because that would have been too weak to drop her in her tracks. Something administered under the tongue? This is where you Medical people jump in....

dc20015 said:

Plus doesn't this drug cause immediate and profound paralysis? It's not the kind of med someone could be injected with and then run around the neighborhood on.

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This is fast acting ...read article....Shannan gilbert was behind the couch & called 911....which leaves me to believe Dopey (joesph Brewer was focused on something else & messed up again cause Shannan woke up had her cell phone to boot....another slap to the idiots face brewer IMO. Thats why brewer just grabbed her from behind.....

Yes it does within a minute......so maybe brewer picked it up can be in powder form ....Because maybe docy did not want to release it to the "ODDBALL' becaUSE HE IS A BAFFOON AT TIMES IMO...that makes so much sense.....

Did you read any other cases I read them ALL

My happy thought is if they did it that is what could happen to them via lethal injection my friend if convicted & I tend to see the enormous circumstantial evidence sending them on there Merry little way......to hell )
If they get convicted.......& found guilty of COURSE
Nice question, sometimes referring back to article answers it...Just saying

Knew there was going to be a group rebutting....

LINative13 said:

If something was adminsitered via IV; I do not thing SG would have gottten off of the the docs patios steps. IV drugs hit you hard and quick. Once that needle hits the vein, you are not getting across the street let alone tercking through a marsh. She must have been given something in pill form. Not a pill you eat, but a pill under the tongue. It was must have been an anestetic. Not a valium, klonopin, xanax type of medication because that would have been too weak to drop her in her tracks. Something administered under the tongue? This is where you Medical people jump in....

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First of all who said IV?
AGAIN referring & reading the article STATES
Fast acting within a minute
Fast Metabilizing very short term breaks down fast......
That is why they can not detect it...

Please read article it answers all these questions
Oh and it never said IV is the way administered...kinda misinforming

The plethora of articles state husbands wives patients victims are jabbed with needle & works in less than 1 minute.....

When was shannan on the docs patio steps Please link me to that one, TY
Secondly I believe Joesph Brewer did it back at his house & the drug works within seconds....but you wake up fast.....like why shannan hide behind couch calling 911...brewer did not think she would be up that fast & have phone IMOOOOOOO
JMO
Try to say it because It is MY thoughts
Link in my brain for NOW

I believe He would strangle victims before awaking...see this drug allows ones mind to be very aware of all going on you hear, you understand every single thing happening to you...you are just not able to have control of muscles....temporary state....you can not talk, can't move paralized you have full faculties. Ever Dream you were stuck & something was going to happen & you couldn't move.....soI Think shannan regains control of bodybecause her mind was always there....thats how I THINK IT HAPPENED. I would Place a HEFTY WAGER LIKE MY HOME ON IT....if the truth comes out........see drug is undetected & I think shannan was purposely placed to be found which collberates GC theory she fell off jetty in water & drown. Gus the Tapes Buddy....that is why he put himself in it because I BELIEVE & THINK it was all on the tape Gussy

I stated this from the beginning but never put the drug info out there ...due to people that visit the site....I Believe/Think that the end for them is right around the corner because they are my POI's

Tapes distroyed due to GC at the gate & everybody on tape GUILTY IMO....

If a car was broken into those tapes would have been handed over.

GC calls 911....Barbra calls 911...nieghbors call each other & person who watches OB security....All this BIG RUKUS & they did not want to view the tapes......
I say sleep sleep you are not in Kansas anymore......Be Real...those tapes could not be looped over without several sets of eyes viewing this reassurring nieghbors that night was nothing to fear etc....IMO

I can not wait for the trials I see it all Now....Barbra.....more like hanna-bar barra...cartoons...These our my theories...link it to Me folks )
a little humor goes a long way on here....

I want another Web Sleuths Radio Show....this place is gonna get real hot & the show Rocked...
I think Truth was the real Hero...You REock

Weigh in My Friend.....

I Think they wanted shannan found they wanted her decomposed due to the fact forensics may be able to detect in the brain if that drug was used & what if they found the injection site my friends Jimmy the boob...I mean Joey the boob would have fried...so I think it was methodical & they wanted Mari Gilbert the heck out of Hell's Town IMO....they could not take it anymore & took a chance...I think....well I know the FBI was on the case due to all the links of news video on here as well as my link from Joesph Brewer POI Thread....

I think they were all over the area via satelite.....& got more evidence & more evidence & more evidence....

Doctor Hacketts access & use of this specific drug on ER patients....because I Think he didn't really use it on the ER Patients thats how I think he may have gotten his sticky little grimmy hands on it...I am sure they have been through hospital drug logs over the years IMO
Link In My Head.
I hear that song...
In My Heaaad Heaaad Heaaad Zombie zombie zombie......
Thats where the Link is.....in my head/thoughts theory

First thread friend......only posts.....

What on Earth would be the motive to administer this drug to her?

Unlike any of the actual victims, JB called SG and hired her to come to his house to have sex. He did not make any attempt to conceal his identity. She arrived with a driver (witness). When she was on the phone with 911 he could be heard in the background trying to calm her down. When she did go missing he attempted to file a missing persons report. When the police asked to search his house he let them do it without a warrant. When the police asked him to take a polygraph test he agreed and let them administer it (even though it was his legal right to refuse).

I know that some people cannot stand him and blame him for SG's death. But the facts simply do not point to him as a poi.

Seaslug44 said:

What on Earth would be the motive to administer this drug to her?

Unlike any of the actual victims, JB called SG and hired her to come to his house to have sex. He did not make any attempt to conceal his identity. She arrived with a driver (witness). When she was on the phone with 911 he could be heard in the background trying to calm her down. When she did go missing he attempted to file a missing persons report. When the police asked to search his house he let them do it without a warrant. When the police asked him to take a polygraph test he agreed and let them administer it (even though it was his legal right to refuse).

I know that some people cannot stand him and blame him for SG's death. But the facts simply do not point to him as a poi.

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To kill her like all the others imo
what do you think I think pretty self explanitoiry
Hello...
why did sg say THEY>>>THEY >>>THEY were going to kill her & she is dead. Now bother others not me, I find alot of comments unstable of yours like the imaginary one ....totally off the wall, unrealistic out of touch ...just you look to start threads about mostly nonesense IMO IMO

Again where is this info on the drugged girl, to my knowledge there is only One other poster here who claims this, Fluke.

En Passant said:

To kill her like all the others imo
what do you think I think pretty self explanitoiry
Hello...
why did sg say THEY>>>THEY >>>THEY were going to kill her & she is dead. Now bother others not me, I find alot of comments unstable of yours like the imaginary one ....totally off the wall, unrealistic out of touch ...just you look to start threads about mostly nonesense IMO IMO

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So you are saying that JB is the SK who normally goes to great lengths to cover his tracks?

The same guy who didn't leave a trace of electronic forensic evidence (no traceable phone calls, emails or web browsing)?

You are saying that he is the same guy who didn't leave a shred of forensic evidence with the bodies?

The same guy who managed to pickup the girls without any witnesses?

The same guy who knew how to make all those taunting telephone calls to a victim's little sister in the exact precise way needed to avoid detection?

And you are also saying that this time he did the complete opposite of covering his tracks by inviting the girl to his home using his own computer to find her ad and his own phone to call her?

And you are saying that JB followed-through with his sinister plan to kill SG even though her driver was waiting outside his house to drive her home?

If all of this is true, then are we to assume that JB also figured out a way to completely fool a state-of-the-art polygraph test?

"Succinylcholine, SUX for short, is a neuromuscular paralytic drug. This means that it works at the junction of the nerves and muscles and causes muscular paralysis. It paralyzes all the muscles of the body, including those used for breathing. Without ventilatory support anyone who receives this drug will die from asphyxia. The bad news is that they will be wide awake while this occurs because SUX causes muscular paralysis but has no sedative effects."



If this drug was administered to SG, she would have never been able to make the 911 call or run through OB!

Seaslug44 said:

So you are saying that JB is the SK who normally goes to great lengths to cover his tracks?

The same guy who didn't leave a trace of electronic forensic evidence (no traceable phone calls, emails or web browsing)?

You are saying that he is the same guy who didn't leave a shred of forensic evidence with the bodies?

The same guy who managed to pickup the girls without any witnesses?

The same guy who knew how to make all those taunting telephone calls to a victim's little sister in the exact precise way needed to avoid detection?

And you are also saying that this time he did the complete opposite of covering his tracks by inviting the girl to his home using his own computer to find her ad and his own phone to call her?

And you are saying that JB followed-through with his sinister plan to kill SG even though her driver was waiting outside his house to drive her home?

If all of this is true, then are we to assume that JB also figured out a way to completely fool a state-of-the-art polygraph test?

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Thanks, SeaSlug44, for your detailed response. By every description, drugs did help cause Shannan's demise that night, but it is reasonable to assume that she took them herself. Her history of cocaine and prescription medicine was known to the family and the police. She had been diagnosed as being bipolar and often didn't take that medication. The combination of these things and perhaps alcohol might well have contributed to her erratic behavior.

Long Island does or did have at least one serial killer (and probably more than one). To fixate on the one incident that has the most detail is to lose sight of the whole.

Chanler said:

Thanks, SeaSlug44, for your detailed response. By every description, drugs did help cause Shannan's demise that night, but it is reasonable to assume that she took them herself. Her history of cocaine and prescription medicine was known to the family and the police. She had been diagnosed as being bipolar and often didn't take that medication. The combination of these things and perhaps alcohol might well have contributed to her erratic behavior.

Long Island does or did have at least one serial killer (and probably more than one). To fixate on the one incident that has the most detail is to lose sight of the whole.

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The only proof of her erratic behavior is hinged on GC letting her in. Did he? That is questionable and has been up for debate a few times.
To me she displayed pretty on key behavior according to her own statements as fact that she was trying to be killed while calling for help. Which calling 911 for help is not erratic.

NoviceSleuth said:

"Succinylcholine, SUX for short, is a neuromuscular paralytic drug. This means that it works at the junction of the nerves and muscles and causes muscular paralysis. It paralyzes all the muscles of the body, including those used for breathing. Without ventilatory support anyone who receives this drug will die from asphyxia. The bad news is that they will be wide awake while this occurs because SUX causes muscular paralysis but has no sedative effects."



If this drug was administered to SG, she would have never been able to make the 911 call or run through OB!

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This times 100, thank you!

the quiet girl said:

The only proof of her erratic behavior is hinged on GC letting her in. Did he? That is questionable and has been up for debate a few times.
To me she displayed pretty on key behavior according to her own statements as fact that she was trying to be killed while calling for help. Which calling 911 for help is not erratic.

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Not to mention the fact that she was a prostitute calling the police from a clients house. Don't sound like erratic to me, sounds like a girl that knew she needed help at any cost....

Originally Posted by the quiet girl
"The only proof of her erratic behavior is hinged on GC letting her in. Did he? That is questionable and has been up for debate a few times.
To me she displayed pretty on key behavior according to her own statements as fact that she was trying to be killed while calling for help. Which calling 911 for help is not erratic."


Quiet girl,
To me that is key. Did he let her in or not. It matters. Big Time. Because if he didn't let her in, then that would explain why she kept running seeking help from whoever she believed was trying to kill her.

Someone here, I can't remember who, maybe Redbird, mentioned that GC had told Nancy Grace that he didn't let her in and then later changed his story that he did, but she fled anyway. I didn't know that. I have to find the transcripts to that show. I know he had said he wished he had done more, but that doesn't necessarily mean he didn't let her in. But if he did change his story like that, then I think he should take a lie detector test. I know and lived small town politics. It's not unheard of for a police officer to trust the word of well known politically involved citizen over a stranger or someone with a less than steller reputation. But Serial Killers sometimes have stellar reputations, (at least before they are caught.) I recently read an article about the pastor who worked with Dennis Rader (BTK), this pastor still can't believe that Dennis Rader is a sk. He is adamant that THAT is NOT the man he knew and he actually believes that he has to be possessed. Now my point is not whether the sk is possessed or psychopathic or whatever label you would like to put on someone who could be so evil. My point is that no one's word in this investigaton should be beyond skepticism.
Now, I'm not saying GC is the killer, but even if he lied because he was embarrassed for not letting her in (if that is the case or not, I don't know), but regardless, if he didn't let her in, he should fess up. Because that would explain why she kept running, and nix the speculation that she was acting irrationally.

the quiet girl said:

The only proof of her erratic behavior is hinged on GC letting her in. Did he? That is questionable and has been up for debate a few times.
To me she displayed pretty on key behavior according to her own statements as fact that she was trying to be killed while calling for help. Which calling 911 for help is not erratic.

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Hi, The Quiet Girl. To argue that the only indications of her erratic behavior is about GC let her in ignores the case as we know it.

Whether Gus Coletti "let her in" (whatever that might mean) seems a quibble. He opened the door; he saw her. Would a person on the run from a killer not rush in? (Wasn't shelter the purpose of her knocking? After all, she had her own cellphone.) Or do they wait for an invitation?

Shannan Gilbert arrived at the john's house with her regular driver. He was known to her boyfriend and made his identity known thereafter. There is no evidence that he knew the john. By all indications, she refused the driver's understandable hope to complete his assignment and drive her home. Instead she remained in the area, with which she had no familiarity, running frantically from house to house.

Nineteen-and-a-half minute 911 calls are uncommon and she seems to have been in no immediate danger when she made the call, much of it spent with two men who didn't know each other in the room. "Based on her 911 call," police described her as "disorientated" and "paranoid." To me, that sounds erratic, not "pretty on-key behavior," and, unlike everyone writing here, they actually heard the call. Her bipolarity and serious issues with cocaine and other drugs have been mentioned by the police, the family, and others.

People here want to solve the crime. The only cases connected with Long Island lack adequate details for "successful" sleuthing, so people here have become fixated on Shannan's tragic night of panic.