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Thread: CA - Sierra LaMar, 15, Santa Clara County, 16 March 2012 - #5

  1. #1626
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrainneDhu View Post
    There are many sexual assault cases where the victim was forced to undress by the perp. The victim folded their clothing neatly, trying to buy time before the perp assaulted them.

    I'm not saying that is what happened here but the clothes being neatly folded does not preclude that it was a forced strip during an assault.
    I can see a victim doing that, whether or not she was neat in other situations. I imagine a victim shaking and having a hard time folding the clothes, but that doesn't mean she couldn't accomplish the task.

    I also think that a deranged perp might have done this after the fact. In the Oakland County Child Killer case, the killer left the children clean and laid out, prompting people to think that he worked for a funeral home, laundry, etc. (like neatly folded suggests military to some in this case). Based on new evidence, I doubt that was it ... rather, it was just the killer's signature. I wonder if LE suspects something similar in this case, i.e., this is a person who has struck before or may strike again.

    The perp might have left the purse near the phone at a later time. It does seem risky, but maybe risk appeals to the perp?

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  3. #1627
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    Quote Originally Posted by TxLady2 View Post
    I was gonna say.... if the LEO who said the clothes were folded neatly was a man, then some men don't see neat the same way most women do. However, if her mom was shown the clothes in the bag, then says she doesn't fold that way, then I guess that's a moot point. Wonder if they showed these clothes to her still in the bag before they were handled by LE? Probably. Mom could have misspoke, wouldn't be the first time one was wrong about their kids' habits. Did she actually take notice of the way she folded her clothes to take for a sleepover or visit with her dad? Or is she just going by how she folds them to put away at home? My stepdaughter would fold everything very, very neatly as long as I was paying attention, or if she was packing to visit her mom. But folding them and putting them away in her dresser was a different story.
    I would think since Sierra often visited her father on the weekends that Marlene was very well aware of how Sierra packed her clothes and how she folded them. In fact, Marlene may have had to go back and refold some clothes of Sierra's so they wouldnt be all wrinkled for her stay away on the weekends. She was pretty adamant that Sierra did not fold clothes neatly. So I would think that was something Sierra just did not do on a consistent basis.

    I know some men who are extremely neat and can put some women to shame on how they fold clothes. Maybe it is because their mothers taught them to do them this way when they were growing up and its just second nature to them. And these are regular guys.

    It did make me wonder if this person could still live with his mother even as an adult now.

    JMO though
    Last edited by oceanblueeyes; 04-05-2012 at 09:17 AM.
    "Pardon Our Noise, It's the Sound of Freedom" USMC New River Air Station, Jacksonville, North Carolina

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  5. #1628
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    Quote Originally Posted by imkeylime View Post
    I can see a victim doing that, whether or not she was neat in other situations. I imagine a victim shaking and having a hard time folding the clothes, but that doesn't mean she couldn't accomplish the task.

    I also think that a deranged perp might have done this after the fact. In the Oakland County Child Killer case, the killer left the children clean and laid out, prompting people to think that he worked for a funeral home, laundry, etc. (like neatly folded suggests military to some in this case). Based on new evidence, I doubt that was it ... rather, it was just the killer's signature. I wonder if LE suspects something similar in this case, i.e., this is a person who has struck before or may strike again.

    The perp might have left the purse near the phone at a later time. It does seem risky, but maybe risk appeals to the perp?
    I have always felt that kidnappers/rapists and murderers are some of the highest risk takers there are. I think it is part of the sick game they play. Catch me if you can, sort of thing.
    "Pardon Our Noise, It's the Sound of Freedom" USMC New River Air Station, Jacksonville, North Carolina

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  7. #1629
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    What I found most interesting on NG was they showed a picture of SL wearing a black Sharks jersey and she had sent this picture to a friend that morning presumably before leaving for the bus stop. They said this top was 'similar' to what was found folded up in her purse. They did state that they didn't know if it was a picture SL took of herself that morning or one she had taken at a prior time. I would bet it was a picture she took of herself that morning. Now IF she did take that picture that morning and that is exactly what was found in her purse then it sounds like someone forced her to strip or change clothes shortly after abducting her.

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  9. #1630
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dee226 View Post
    It's never been clear to me about the clothes. I originally was thinking it was a second set but now i'm leaning toward them being what she wore that morning and there was a female involved who folded them and put them in the bag. Maybe it was leaked originally that there was urine on them. That would make more sense if she had worn them.
    I have already mentioned that Dee. Either this person is still living with a domineering mother who requires him to do everything neatly or he had the type of mother that required everything to be neat and orderly while growing up. If this person has done this before like Cliff Van Zant suspects then often they have a love-hate relationship with their mothers. If this perp is ever caught it will be interesting to see if Sierra had a lot of features like this person's mother. Same hair color, skin tone, petite, etc.

    Or as you have stated he could have a female accomplice. We have heard about several cases recently where the perps will be a female and male team.

    I have always felt these are the clothing that Sierra had on when she left her home. There is no logical reason why she would put the clothes on and send a pic to a friend and then take them back off. And it was confirmed last night on NGs show that it is the Shark shirt they found in her purse.

    IMO
    "Pardon Our Noise, It's the Sound of Freedom" USMC New River Air Station, Jacksonville, North Carolina

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  11. #1631
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    I have followed this case from the beginning and have read all the posts (I think!). The neatly folded clothes bothers me, too. I've also wondered how she could disappear so quickly, even though her house is at the end of a cul-de-sac.

    I believe she was taken by someone she had at least seen before, though she may not have known them very well. It's possible that the black-clothing man mentioned is involved if he suddenly got access to a vehicle. However, I'm thinking there are other, better and easier explanations.

    What about a lawn care company? Those folks often have small, closed trailers for their equipment. Someone like Sierra would get used to seeing people from one of those perhaps as often as weekly. Perhaps she just said hi to them. Perhaps she only waved to one regularly. Regardless, that kind of passing familiarity might well have been enough for her to get close enough for her to get snatched on that day.

    There are other similar possibilities, too--one of those quick-fix plumbers or electrical services, an exterminator. They would all have trailers or trucks where she could be easily hidden in a matter of moments. Once hidden, there would be some time to get her out of her clothes and get them folded neatly (if that's what happened. I'm not yet convinced that the folded clothes are related to her disappearance).

    Hiding her in one of those trailers would give the perp some time, so he could toss her bag and phone on his way out of the development and not have to return to the area to dispose of them. Though, if it was a lawn care guy, he may have returned to the area the following week to work and on his next trip simply disposed of those items after one of the initial searches had cleared that area.

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  13. #1632
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    On my way to work this morning I had this thought an I put myself in the perps head for a second. If Sierra is still alive and believe me I am hoping she is. And I have her hidden in Gilroy or San martin she is now no longer there. As the LE made the annoucement those are the next two areas to be searched. I would be saying Thank you LE for telling me in advance your next move.
    And now be long gone.
    TYBEE U WILL ALWAYS BE MISSED AND LOVED.


    http://www.amw.com/fugitives/case.cfm?id=61288

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  15. #1633
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    Quote Originally Posted by JDB View Post
    On my way to work this morning I had this thought an I put myself in the perps head for a second. If Sierra is still alive and believe me I am hoping she is. And I have her hidden in Gilroy or San martin she is now no longer there. As the LE made the annoucement those are the next two areas to be searched. I would be saying Thank you LE for telling me in advance your next move.
    And now be long gone.
    I thought about that but I am hoping they have a suspect or suspects in mind and may have announced where they are going next to see if he/they would make a move.

    IMO
    "Pardon Our Noise, It's the Sound of Freedom" USMC New River Air Station, Jacksonville, North Carolina

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  17. #1634
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    Quote Originally Posted by oceanblueeyes View Post
    I have always felt that kidnappers/rapists and murderers are some of the highest risk takers there are. I think it is part of the sick game they play. Catch me if you can, sort of thing.
    This makes sense to me. If the cell/purse were left as "clues," like another poster has suggested, perhaps her shoes/socks will be found somewhere as well ... closer to where she is even.

    I'm not sure the handcuff box is related to this case (or if the used condoms were or weren't in it), but if so, that could be another one.

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  19. #1635
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    I had always assumed the folded clothes were SL's extra clothes in an overnight bag. Now, I am thinking otherwise...

    Based on recent posts (above), I'm starting to think she was forced to strip right when she was abducted. If the perp discarded the clothes just a short distance away, neatly or regularly folded, we could conclude a few things:
    • The perp drove a vehicle large enough for SL to disrobe quickly and fold her clothes---maybe a van?
    • OR - There were 2 perps. One driving and one instructing SL.
    • OR - The perp came back and disposed of the clothes. This could be the reason why the phone & clothes were discarded in the opposite direction where the handcuffs/condoms were found and the new search location (in Gilroy/San Martin). But I STILL think this is unlikely.


    QUICK QUESTION: Does anyone have a map of the areas that were already searched?

    #findsierra

    JMO

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  21. #1636
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    Searchers will concentrate on Gilroy and San Martin today as they search for Sierra LaMar today. Also, there is an app you can download that could help bring her home.

    ~~~

    A 'QR code' has been released on many posters of LaMar that will allow you to download information about her on a smartphone. The information includes pictures of her, links to Facebook and Twitter, what to do if you see her and immediate access to Santa Clara County emergency response.
    http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?sec...bay&id=8609317
    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. ~ Aristotle

    The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense.

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  23. #1637
    Quote Originally Posted by 90Nine View Post
    Do you know what the building is on her home property in the back? there are several cars parked behind it and a path leading to and from the house. It's the structure behind the white gates.
    I noted the same thing and seems to be an adjacent access road, and would there would be some level to/from this and maybe someone would have seen something on that day or some unusual activity in the days prior. Also maybe a security camera?

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  25. #1638
    Quote Originally Posted by sarx View Post
    According to the Namus site she was wearing grey shoes and the text at 0711hrs was regarding meeting before school to go over some homework. Interesting.
    https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/show/14258
    How can the shoes be confirmed if no one saw when she left?
    Would a pair of shoes be noted as missing so that must be wht she was wearing?

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  27. #1639
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    I apologize in advance if this has been answered already...

    Have they been able to establish the time Sierra left the house. IOW, could she have allowed a person, into her home. Was there anything out of place? Had the home been cleaned of prints?

    If she was in her home the abductor could have forced into their fantasy outfit. Then later, an accomplice picked them up at the end of the driveway? Can they determine when the phone migrated away from home?

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  29. #1640
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    Working on a new thread, will be closing this one in a few...

    Ima
    When your child goes missing: A Family Survival Guide
    Missing Adult Checklist
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  31. #1641
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    Closing thread, please continue here...

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7759992#post7759992"]Thread #6[/ame]
    When your child goes missing: A Family Survival Guide
    Missing Adult Checklist
    Websleuth's Resource Center

    F.R.I.E.N.D.S.
    Fight for you

    Respect you
    Include you
    Encourage you
    Need you
    Deserve you
    Stand by you


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