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Thread: AZ - Papago Farms, HispFem 45-65 (UP10021) & Child 10-12 (UP10007), Feb'12

  1. #1
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    AZ - Papago Farms, HispFem 45-65 (UP10021) & Child 10-12 (UP10007), Feb'12

    https://identifyus.org/en/cases/10021

    Someone remembers these dentures.


    Maxillae and mandible are completely edentulous. Full dentures found with the remains. The upper dentures have a yellow metal bar placed between the central incisors (#8 and #9). The lateral incisors (#7 and #10) have yellow metal brackets surrounding the tooth crowns. The lower dentures have a yellow metal star on the labial surface of the right central incisor (#25). The lateral incisors (#23 and #26) have yellow metal brackets surrounding the tooth crowns. See photographs.

    They belong to a female of undetermined race aged 45-65. There was a white lace collar with yellow stones with the remains. The remains were partial and skeletal and were found February 13 in a desert area in AZ, Pima County, Papago Farms.

    Her remains are associated with the remains of a child aged 10-12.
    https://identifyus.org/en/cases/10007
    There are few identifiers, but dentals are available. Sex and race are undetermined.

    For Teeth # 1, 2, 4, 6, 16, 31, and 32 "O" indicates that the permanent tooth crown is developing and is in the crypt. For Teeth # 22, 26, and 27 "O" indicates that the permanent tooth root is present, but the crown is missing postmortem. The right deciduous maxillary first molar is still present in the alveolus above the permanent right maxillary second premolar (#4).

    [ame="http://maps.google.com/maps?q=N+31+49.758+W+112+15.097&hl=en&ll=31.829441 ,-112.251434&spn=0.118136,0.264187&sll=32.008005,-111.58867&sspn=0.94325,2.113495&t=m&z=13"]N 31 49.758 W 112 15.097 - Google Maps[/ame]
    It's about three hours from Tucson and just about five miles from the Mexican border, so border crossers are a possibility.
    Last edited by CarlK90245; 10-06-2013 at 10:45 PM.

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  3. #2
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    I lived in Tucson for 5 yrs and have been in the Southwest my whole life, and I'm no expert but I can say those dentures look very much like the type of dental work seen on people who had it done in Mexico; judging by that and the location these two bodies were found, I would say probably border-crossers. I.E. slim chance of ever id'ing them.

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  5. #3
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    The chances are that they're not listed anywhere on US missing persons sites but I think they might be a little easier to identify if someone is looking for them because it's two people. Mother and child maybe? There are tons of middle aged female Does out there but fewer adult-child pairs.

    I wonder if the Spanish translations in Namus get any PR in Spanish speaking communities and south of the US border. Someone could find their loved ones in there.

    https://identifyus.org/es/cases/10021
    https://identifyus.org/es/cases/10007

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  7. #4
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    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/...r_dorothy.html
    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/..._danielle.html

    Help me out here guys... I found this possible match ages ago and dismissed it for the following reasons:

    1. The child namus states 'unknown sex' however the adult namus refers to a boy child.
    2. Dorothy Pitcher was not wearing her dentures.
    3. They went missing in 1993 but the estimated date of death of the IUDs is 2000-2010.

    However, it keeps bothering me.

    Surely, if a female adult and preadolescent went missing only 50 miles away from where a female adult and preadolescent child remains are found, I should submit this based on that alone??

    I don't want to waste anyone's time but hopefully it would be a quick elimination/confirmation based on the dentures in this case?

    DP

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  9. #5
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    https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/1081/0/
    https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/2883/1/

    Dorothy Pitcher has dental information available and entered according to Namus.

    Namus says they're currently comparing the child's DNA to a missing Mexican boy but I wouldn't think calling them in would be a waste of time if it prompted them to get DNA samples from relatives for the Pitchers. Danielle currently has no identifiers in the system.

    They probably would have mentioned the dentures if Dorothy had such distinctive ones I think. But you never know.
    Last edited by Donjeta; 08-26-2012 at 05:00 AM.

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  11. #6
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    The NamUs UP casefiles for these UID's are now inaccessible.

    https://identifyus.org/en/cases/10021
    https://identifyus.org/en/cases/10007


    Received word from a reliable source that UP 10021 was ID'd as Maria Teresa Gonzales-Cax dob 8-25-1954, and UP 10007 was ID'd as Nelson Omar Chilel-Lopez DOB 4-25-1997. The DNA exam was funded by Argentine Forensic Anthropology Team. Not sure if that means that they were from Argentina.
    Last edited by CarlK90245; 10-06-2013 at 10:44 PM.

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  13. #7
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    it doesn't necessarily mean that they are from argentina. the argentinian forensic team has been involved with many forensic recoveries and id's in argentina, el salvador, the former yugoslavia. they are experts in forensic anthropology an have helped to id many of the missing in those countries, sadly, they have had lost of experience with the missing in argentina during the junta years...

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