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Thread: NY - Etan Patz, 6, New York, 25 May 1979 - #2

  1. #601
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    I do think that that police have the right suspect. He did not seek police out, but relatives tipped police from a confession back in the 80's. When approached, he did confess.

    I hope that this isn't an enormous waste of time for everyone. I hope that somehow they can collaborate the evidence.
    Barely made it through 10th grade chemistry

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  3. #602
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoe Zo View Post
    I'm back and forth on whether he did do it or not, but I do know for me to 100% sure that he did it I need some kind of proof to take away all my doubts.

    How mentally ill was Hernandez back then, we really don't know. He married 2 times and had a child. Did the ex wives have mental problems them self so they were willing to marry a man with mental problems or did he do such a good job at hiding the mental problems that he was able to marry 2 different ladies and start a family with one of them?? Maybe his mental illness got worst with age?? Maybe, his mental health wasn't that bad when he was younger.

    It is hard to believe Hernandez move around without any one seeing anything but I also believe that people can be so caught up with what they are doing that they will not notice anything around them, even something right in front of them.
    I'm sure there were many people out at the time Etan was but if you notice not one person even seen him walking down the street so why would they notice Hernandez??
    I know I walked right by people I know and never notice them because my mind was someplace else and it wasn't till the person stopped me and said something did I notice them.
    Many people, in a hurry to get where ever they were going and not one notice Etan or Hernandez that day because maybe neither one of them did anything that stood out to others, is my guess.

    Also some people can be very sneaky and some people are just lucky at not getting caught doing wrong.

    I can see someone putting something in the freezer and no one will notice it. It could have been set behind another box or to the side that no one will notice also if you are busy working and you are not the only one going in and out of the freezer taking things or putting things in the freezer, why would you notice something that was put in or talking out of the freezer, mostly if it was just one thing. The freezer might have already had a lot of things in it, so one more thing added or taken out would not really been notice.

    As for the "No child porn, no more victims, no domestic violence, no molested kids, not even a self medicating drug charge or a drunk and disorderly while off his meds" -

    No Domestic violence - are we sure on this?? Not all woman report it as we all know.

    No child porn - are we sure on this?? Could he have had some over the years but got rid of it when he moved in with his ex-wife??

    Self medicating drug charge or a drunk - I hate to say this but my own father was a self medicating drunk, he is now deceased and now that I'm grown up I realize he was self medicating drunk, who had panic attacks and other issue from when he was in the war but at no time was he ever arrested for being drunk or for anything else.

    As for other victims - so far, we haven't heard any one coming forward saying he did something to them and so far LE has not said he did this to anyone else (which is a good thing) but is it possible Etan was his only victim??
    I don't know enough about people who do these kind of crimes to give an opinion on this one.
    Could someone do this just once because for that split second when he see little Etan, he seen an opportunity that he could get away with it which he hasn't seen since with anyone else??
    Is it possible a killer does it once and finds out it is something that they didn't like doing after all??
    I agree with each and everyone of your points individually. It is the total picture of ALL of those things not happening/not being seen/and/or/reported over the span of thirty years that sets my hinky meter that something doesn't fit here to me. Time will tell, hopefully....

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  5. #603
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    Quote Originally Posted by osadelnorte View Post
    Yep. My 6-yo is around 46-47 inches and my 3-yo is around 37.
    If I try to place my four year old at his height in a first grade classroom, he would be a dwarf. I think that his height was underestimated. Not that it matters
    Barely made it through 10th grade chemistry

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  7. #604
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    Quote Originally Posted by wfgodot View Post
    Village Voice poll currently running 61.54% - 38.46% against believing confession.

    Article, poll, here: Etan Patz Murder Suspect Pedro Hernandez: Do You Believe The Confession?
    If true, I feel so very bad for Etan family to have to go through this
    Last edited by Zoe Zo; 05-29-2012 at 11:03 PM.

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  9. #605
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    Quote Originally Posted by impatientredhead View Post
    I agree with each and everyone of your points individually. It is the total picture of ALL of those things not happening/not being seen/and/or/reported over the span of thirty years that sets my hinky meter that something doesn't fit here to me. Time will tell, hopefully....
    I agree, I just wish he would give something that only his family and the police would know - something to make us all sure. I want to believe he did it but I need something to show me he did do it.

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  11. #606
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    Quote Originally Posted by DevilsPlayThing View Post
    {snipped}
    The investigation conducted was somewhat 2 pronged {or more}. Detective Butler - who suicided in 1986 was NYPD. Assistant US Attorney GraBois investigation was more far reaching - but GraBois pursued Ramos.
    snipped

    thanks, great background information that I had no idea about
    I never realized that it was 2 separate or more investigations going on; I can see how Ramos appeared to be the focus though.

    there has been many wb members with links and information about that time and the area. The video of Etan's mother from that time period broke my heart. If PH did do it, I hope they can find something that can at least relieve the not knowing.
    "The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift." - Albert Einstein

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  13. #607
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    Not to beat a dead horse, but this is what the growth percentile calculator that I use for my job says about Etan's height and weight at 6 years and 8 months (and I know it doesn't matter, it' just confirms that his size would not have been typical)

    At 6 years and 8 months:

    your child is 50 pounds, and that is
    at the 54th percentile for weight.

    your child is 40 inches, and that is
    at less than the 3rd percentile for height.

    http://pediatrics.about.com/cs/usefu...te+Percentiles
    Barely made it through 10th grade chemistry

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  15. #608
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoe Zo View Post
    I'm back and forth on whether he did do it or not, but I do know for me to 100% sure that he did it I need some kind of proof to take away all my doubts.

    How mentally ill was Hernandez back then, we really don't know. He married 2 times and had a child. Did the ex wives have mental problems them self so they were willing to marry a man with mental problems or did he do such a good job at hiding the mental problems that he was able to marry 2 different ladies and start a family with one of them?? Maybe his mental illness got worst with age?? Maybe, his mental health wasn't that bad when he was younger.
    snipped, just wanted to mention, think post 589 in this thread has a link with a video (i'm sure its the one bodhi posted?) that mentioned 2 people that saw Etan walking down the street that day (hope i've heard that correctly)

    also that PH has 2 children from his 1st wife, a son & daughter but they are estranged from their father

    I also want more information, seems nowadays everyone is being diagnosed as bipolar or borderline bipolar among other things. But from some of those links his family seem to thing he got progressively worse over time. That could very well be from having killed a child?? I find it interesting that the sister was the one that reported it all those years ago. Seems some of his family in fact think he did it. The thing is you can't always believe every reporters articles.. so hopeful they reflecting what the family is really saying.
    "The intuitive mind is a sacred gift and the rational mind is a faithful servant. We have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift." - Albert Einstein

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  17. #609
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mystic View Post
    snipped, just wanted to mention, think post 589 in this thread has a link with a video (i'm sure its the one bodhi posted?) that mentioned 2 people that saw Etan walking down the street that day (hope i've heard that correctly)

    also that PH has 2 children from his 1st wife, a son & daughter but they are estranged from their father

    I also want more information, seems nowadays everyone is being diagnosed as bipolar or borderline bipolar among other things. But from some of those links his family seem to thing he got progressively worse over time. That could very well be from having killed a child?? I find it interesting that the sister was the one that reported it all those years ago. Seems some of his family in fact think he did it. The thing is you can't always believe every reporters articles.. so hopeful they reflecting what the family is really saying.
    Thank you, I did seem to have missed that post and didn't know Etan was seen or PH had more children.

    I do agree it does seem more these days to have been doagnosed with bipolar or other things.

    It could very well be, killing Etan could make him worst over the years, if he really did do it. Just wish we had real answer

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  19. #610
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    Quote Originally Posted by wfgodot View Post
    Village Voice poll currently running 61.54% - 38.46% against believing confession.

    Article, poll, here: Etan Patz Murder Suspect Pedro Hernandez: Do You Believe The Confession?
    This somewhat worries me although I understand people like to see physical evidence. However, I have not seen any indications that PH has an obsession for the Etan Patz case like John Mark Karr had with JonBenet. Also I don't see any history of confessing to crimes he did not commit. In fact, PH only confessed a few times to one murder where he strangled a child. He has now admitted the child was Etan Patz.

    I am not surprised he has mental problems, because you must be sick in the head in the first place to kill a little boy. I am afraid he will be released because people won't believe him or that after 30 years there is no physical evidence. Is it possible the killer of Etan will go free even when he confessed?

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  21. #611
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    Quote Originally Posted by sherlockh View Post
    This somewhat worries me although I understand people like to see physical evidence. However, I have not seen any indications that PH has an obsession for the Etan Patz case like John Mark Karr had with JonBenet. Also I don't see any history of confessing to crimes he did not commit. In fact, PH only confessed a few times to one murder where he strangled a child. He has now admitted the child was Etan Patz.

    I am not surprised he has mental problems, because you must be sick in the head in the first place to kill a little boy. I am afraid he will be released because people won't believe him or that after 30 years there is no physical evidence. Is it possible the killer of Etan will go free even when he confessed?
    I agree, it would be very sad if he did kill Etan and because of no real evidence he is set free. Maybe because of his mental illness he can't remember things as they happen back than which makes it hard for the police to say he really did this.

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  23. #612
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    Question - now that they have charged Hernandez and they are trying to build a case, is there a time limit the police have to build a case and move forward or release him?

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  25. #613
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoe Zo View Post
    Question - now that they have charged Hernandez and they are trying to build a case, is there a time limit the police have to build a case and move forward or release him?
    Release before trial depends on whether the judge will allow him a bond. If not he sits until trial. If he is given bond but cannot post it he sits until trial.

    Now that they have charged him there is a charge against him the state does have a deadline to be ready for trial. Part of your right to a speedy trial. In most states, though I have not looked at NY specifically, that averages around 180 days.

    Of course we all know it usually takes years to go to trial but that is only if the defendant waives his right to a speedy trial thus giving the defense more time to prepare as well. If the defense thinks the case is shaky or was rushed to indictment they may demand a speedy trial and use the lack of evidence to their benefit.

    Assuming he doesn't say he is guilty.

    If he sticks with not guilty which I don't understand if he has been trying to confess for so long and feels so guilty, but if he fights it and goes to trial I assume they will say he is diminished and should have had an attorney before the confession was taken.

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  27. #614
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    Quote Originally Posted by impatientredhead View Post
    Release before trial depends on whether the judge will allow him a bond. If not he sits until trial. If he is given bond but cannot post it he sits until trial.

    Now that they have charged him there is a charge against him the state does have a deadline to be ready for trial. Part of your right to a speedy trial. In most states, though I have not looked at NY specifically, that averages around 180 days.

    Of course we all know it usually takes years to go to trial but that is only if the defendant waives his right to a speedy trial thus giving the defense more time to prepare as well. If the defense thinks the case is shaky or was rushed to indictment they may demand a speedy trial and use the lack of evidence to their benefit.

    Assuming he doesn't say he is guilty.

    If he sticks with not guilty which I don't understand if he has been trying to confess for so long and feels so guilty, but if he fights it and goes to trial I assume they will say he is diminished and should have had an attorney before the confession was taken.
    I think the not guilty plea was entered for him by his lawyer while Pedro's being evaluated. IIRC
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  29. #615
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    Could the height issue be as simple as 4'0" being mistranslated as 40"?

    4'0" would be 66th percentile for 6 years, 8 months.

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  31. #616
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    Quote Originally Posted by impatientredhead View Post
    Release before trial depends on whether the judge will allow him a bond. If not he sits until trial. If he is given bond but cannot post it he sits until trial.

    Now that they have charged him there is a charge against him the state does have a deadline to be ready for trial. Part of your right to a speedy trial. In most states, though I have not looked at NY specifically, that averages around 180 days.

    Of course we all know it usually takes years to go to trial but that is only if the defendant waives his right to a speedy trial thus giving the defense more time to prepare as well. If the defense thinks the case is shaky or was rushed to indictment they may demand a speedy trial and use the lack of evidence to their benefit.

    Assuming he doesn't say he is guilty.

    If he sticks with not guilty which I don't understand if he has been trying to confess for so long and feels so guilty, but if he fights it and goes to trial I assume they will say he is diminished and should have had an attorney before the confession was taken.
    Thank you for helping me to understand what will happen

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  33. #617
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    Quote Originally Posted by necco View Post
    Could the height issue be as simple as 4'0" being mistranslated as 40"?

    4'0" would be 66th percentile for 6 years, 8 months.
    That's a really good guess, Necco!
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  35. #618
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    Etan Patz’s parents show the strain as their son’s alleged killer meets with his lawyer
    Confessed kidnapper Pedro Hernandez is still on suicide watch at Bellevue Hospital

    The strain of being in the public eye again got to Etan Patz’s parents Monday as investigators struggled to corroborate the confession of the deranged man who says he killed their son three decades ago.

    “I wish this could end,” an exasperated Julie Patz said when she ran into reporters and photographers outside her SoHo building. “This is taking my freedom away. I just wish this could be over.”

    Asked upon her return whether she believes cops got the right guy, she replied: “No comment. It’s an ongoing investigation.”

    http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/...icle-1.1086198

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  37. #619
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    I'm kinda wondering if PH really did the crime too. Just seems odd to me that he confesses now since it was back in the news almost to the exact day it happened. If he is crazy maybe he was making it up. Def need some solid evidence.
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  39. #620
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~Lisa~ View Post
    Etan Patz’s parents show the strain as their son’s alleged killer meets with his lawyer
    Confessed kidnapper Pedro Hernandez is still on suicide watch at Bellevue Hospital

    The strain of being in the public eye again got to Etan Patz’s parents Monday as investigators struggled to corroborate the confession of the deranged man who says he killed their son three decades ago.

    “I wish this could end,” an exasperated Julie Patz said when she ran into reporters and photographers outside her SoHo building. “This is taking my freedom away. I just wish this could be over.”

    Asked upon her return whether she believes cops got the right guy, she replied: “No comment. It’s an ongoing investigation.”

    http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/...icle-1.1086198
    My heart breaks for her

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  41. #621
    Quote Originally Posted by Zoe Zo View Post
    My heart breaks for her


    Mine too.
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  43. #622
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    I guess this says it all.

    Those poor people.



    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-...could-be-over/

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  45. #623
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    I guess this says it all.

    Those poor people.



    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-...could-be-over/
    OMG. What a horrible nightmare. I give these poor people so much credit.
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  47. #624
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    I guess this says it all.

    Those poor people.



    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-...could-be-over/
    So very sad. Seem like this will never be over for them

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  49. #625
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wondergirl View Post
    I guess this says it all.

    Those poor people.



    http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-...could-be-over/
    That's awesome! I'm glad somebody can do that.
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