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Thread: NY - Etan Patz, 6, New York, 25 May 1979 - #2

  1. #51
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    I really find this alleged rape to be somewhat unbelievable. If the ex-wife knew about it and that's why she left him, why no report to the police? Why no report from the niece ever? I'm really doubtful charges would be pressed, because unless there's some sort of smoking gun, it's a he said, she said at this point.
    “Justice cannot be for one side alone, but must be for both.” - Eleanor Roosevelt


    In no way should any of my statements be construed as legal opinion or advice. I am a newly practicing lawyer (yay!) but not a verified poster here at WS. The above statement(s) are an expression of my personal opinion, for entertainment purposes only, and copyright.

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  3. #52
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    Very Interesting additional info.in the comments section following article.
    http://newyorkdailyphoto.com/nydppress/?p=7899

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  5. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by dotr View Post
    Very Interesting additional info.in the comments section following article.
    http://newyorkdailyphoto.com/nydppress/?p=7899
    Interesting.

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  7. #54
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    Etan Patz Case Renews Interest In Brooklyn Boy's 2010 Disappearance

    Police are hoping renewed interest in the Etan Patz disappearance will shed new light on a more recent case.

    Seven-year-old Patrick Alford went missing from his foster home in Brooklyn's Starrett City in January 2010.

    [snip]

    "There's been an intensive effort from that evening on to find him, and that has not yielded results in terms of locating him," said Deputy Police Commissioner Paul Browne. "So frankly we are exploiting the opportunity in this case to ask the media to pay some attention to a more recent one."

    More: http://brooklyn.ny1.com/content/top_...-disappearance


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  9. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by dotr View Post
    Very Interesting additional info.in the comments section following article.
    http://newyorkdailyphoto.com/nydppress/?p=7899
    So she left her kid and new puppy with some guy that she just met alone together at the park. The guy steals the puppy and sells. The guy turns out to be a child molesterer who breaks into the building and got caught then got beat up a year after the puppy and Etan go missing - which was the same day. And the young guy is not Ramos ? How many child molesterers were on Prince Street ?

    And the lampshop connection - I will have to re-read the lady talks / writes fast. Typical New Yorker. Good find.
    ~Human Beings Are All Members Of One Body.
    They Are Created From The Same Essence.
    When One Member Is In Pain,
    The Others Cannot Rest.
    If You Do Not Care About The Pain Of Others,
    You Do Not Deserve To Be Called A Human Being.~


    A Quote From 13th Century Famous Persian Poet Saadi Shirazi

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  11. #56
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    That comment woman's recall seems a bit complete for events 30+ years ago - rendering her account a bit suspect, I think.

    But, hey, maybe.

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  13. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by wfgodot View Post
    That comment woman's recall seems a bit complete for events 30+ years ago - rendering her account a bit suspect, I think.

    But, hey, maybe.
    Yeah, I just found a few posts of hers on some other blogs.
    I think she is a fiction writer. - Or from Mars.
    ~Human Beings Are All Members Of One Body.
    They Are Created From The Same Essence.
    When One Member Is In Pain,
    The Others Cannot Rest.
    If You Do Not Care About The Pain Of Others,
    You Do Not Deserve To Be Called A Human Being.~


    A Quote From 13th Century Famous Persian Poet Saadi Shirazi

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic72981_1.gif

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  15. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by DevilsPlayThing View Post
    Yeah, I just found a few posts of hers on some other blogs.
    I think she is a fiction writer. - Or from Mars.
    Possibly both.

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  17. #59
    I was gonna post on the blog - ask her a question {the name of the dude}. After reading her other postings elsewhere - then seeing your post here - I will pass. Man - I feel gullible.
    ~Human Beings Are All Members Of One Body.
    They Are Created From The Same Essence.
    When One Member Is In Pain,
    The Others Cannot Rest.
    If You Do Not Care About The Pain Of Others,
    You Do Not Deserve To Be Called A Human Being.~


    A Quote From 13th Century Famous Persian Poet Saadi Shirazi

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic72981_1.gif

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  19. #60
    John Walsh was on The Dr. Drew Show this evening. John Walsh said when he first went on a media program to talk about Adam - the Patzes were there with a photo of Etan - asking him to show Etan's photo.
    ~Human Beings Are All Members Of One Body.
    They Are Created From The Same Essence.
    When One Member Is In Pain,
    The Others Cannot Rest.
    If You Do Not Care About The Pain Of Others,
    You Do Not Deserve To Be Called A Human Being.~


    A Quote From 13th Century Famous Persian Poet Saadi Shirazi

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic72981_1.gif

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  21. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by DevilsPlayThing View Post
    And the lampshop connection - I will have to re-read the lady talks / writes fast. Typical New Yorker. Good find.
    You're right, after quickly reading (there was no other way - it read so fast!) her comments it reminded me I'd forgotten to take my blood pressure medicine, lol, and when I did that I noted on the calendar that I also had to meet the nurse practitioner this afternoon to pick up a fresh supply - had forgotten all about it. So at least her comments were extremely useful in that sense!

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  23. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by wfgodot View Post
    You're right, after quickly reading (there was no other way - it read so fast!) her comments it reminded me I'd forgotten to take my blood pressure medicine, lol, and when I did that I noted on the calendar that I also had to meet the nurse practitioner this afternoon to pick up a fresh supply - had forgotten all about it. So at least her comments were extremely useful in that sense!
    Too funny. I am smiling. Yes, very important to not run out.
    ~Human Beings Are All Members Of One Body.
    They Are Created From The Same Essence.
    When One Member Is In Pain,
    The Others Cannot Rest.
    If You Do Not Care About The Pain Of Others,
    You Do Not Deserve To Be Called A Human Being.~


    A Quote From 13th Century Famous Persian Poet Saadi Shirazi

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic72981_1.gif

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  25. #63
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    I wish that there were some way to find bodies on a more global scale. If we could let cadaver dogs roam free in search for a scent, and then flare when they find it..... I wish.
    Barely made it through 10th grade chemistry

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  27. #64
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    I also agree, I honestly don't believe Etan is very far from where he was taken (much like Beverly Potts' case) , I think he remained somewhere in the neighborhood, just with the circumstances, that's what I think. It would be great if they would let cadaver dogs run all over new york!!!
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  29. #65
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    I don't think Etan was killed immediately after his being used for whatever nefarious purpose he was taken; if indeed he was abducted on his way to the bus stop, I believe he was kept alive for some time. And I don't believe his body is to be found nearby.

    He could still be alive. Unlikely of course, but nothing disproves it.

    As for cadaver dogs on the prowl, this one seems to have whiffed (no pun) in the attempt to "scent" the long-dead. I have great respect for task dogs and their trainers, and am loathe to say anything at all bad about a dog, any dog, but really - sometimes I think we think their abilities, to spell dog backwards, are somehow god-like*. They're safe bets to find the dead above ground, and perhaps the newly dead buried underground. But the long since departed? Perhaps with the perfect trainer and the perfect dog, it's possible, 33 years on. But we're in short supply of perfection on this planet.

    (*as the great G.K. Chesterton wrote, "I always like a dog so long as he isn't spelled backward.")

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  31. #66
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    I also have wondered how dogs are expected to pick up scents decades later, I see that they use that technique in many missing persons cases that are years old, and I'm not sure how reliable that can be. Right after the event has taken place, I absolutely believe dogs can track smells days later, maybe even a year...but decades later, I wonder..
    Have You Seen Me?
    Deanie Marie Pyle Peters
    Mary Jo Lee Long
    Leanna "Beaner" Warner
    Jodi Huisentruit
    Amy Billig
    Rachael Garden
    Stacie Madison and Susan Smalley
    The Springfield Three
    Fawn & Rozlin Abell
    The Forth Worth Trio
    Rachel Mellon Skemp

    ***
    https://www.findthemissing.org/en/photos/full/20806
    Where is Sharon Rose Sons?
    Discuss her case here: http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...aron+rose+sons

    "We lose our keys, we lose our glasses..but how, in America, do we lose our children?!"-Molly Bish's Mother
    **All posts are my opinion.**

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  33. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by wfgodot View Post
    Rest in Peace, Etan Patz (Huffington Post)

    much more at link above

    Does anyone think that Etan might still be alive? Or that he was kept alive significantly longer than the day he disappeared? I'm wondering.
    You know, this very thought has crossed my mind as well. He may not know who he is. There was a recent article in a People magazine about a man who finally after 30+ years found his real bio dad again. His bio mother had left with him when he just a baby and he ended up being adopted by another family who did not know he had a father looking for him (they never located his bio mother who took him).

    One of the reasons I feel he *could* still be alive is that I read in an article somewhere and also some posters were discussing it, that Ramos came into a fairly large sum of money around the time this all happened. Makes you wonder if he sold him to someone overseas somewhere. I kind of wish that would be the case. He could speak a different language by know and not really remember what had happened to him. I can hardly remember anything before I was about 8-10 yo, just bits and pieces. I think sometimes liars use some truth in their lies, so maybe the comment about putting him on the train to his aunt's house was a little part of the truth of him selling Etan. Does anyone know if Ramos has family and if so have they ever been located or interviewed?
    Last edited by txanmom; 04-27-2012 at 01:57 PM. Reason: had baby boy in place of man-how could a baby boy find his real dad, duh!!

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  35. #68
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    I don't think I"ve ever seen or read anything in which Ramos' family participated. As for the perhaps-mythic $10,000, I also don't think I have ever happened upon documentation sufficient enough to satisfy me that he actually did come into a large sum of money. Of the many things Ramos is, he is also a fabulist.

    But if one believes he was truth-telling, it certainly could have had something to do with Etan.

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  37. #69
    Well in this case LE first placed the jars in the basement - which in theory would detect buried then cement covered target. Jars possibly showed that there was a possibility that there was a target - {I am assuming because all there are in this case is media reports. Some cases you can read the test results - police reports - court records - transcipts - search warrants - polygraph results - other related offical documents. But not with this case.}
    After jar or jars bring positive result - the dog or dogs also hit on a target. But nothing is found. {Chinese food ? - was this under the cement ?}
    Also the equipment which detects if ground disturbances were possibly utelized. But since nothing was found - did the jars really get a positive result in the first place. Did the scent dog really alert - were they going to dig the entire basement anyways? Has the media ever done a FOIA request regarding this case? Most missing person cases do not have an Assistant US Attorney physically participating in the search and investigation in the manner GraBois did with this case. Possibly now making FOIA request impossible. Or someone has filed a Privacy Act Request regarding this case. Which has long ago been granted.

    Etan's case is a vast contrast from others - even where juveniles are victims. Where volumes of case documentation are viewable. Ramos would have filed an appeal or appeals to his current convictions. The appeals contain facts of the crimes - and extensive background information. Ramos has filed Civil Rights Suit or Suits from SCI Dallas - where he is housed - for prison conditions. Yet no record of an appeal for his convictions are recorded. He was described as a jailhouse lawyer type - helping other inmates with their cases years ago. This description seems accurate as his newest Civil Rights Suit has some activity in 2011.

    I just find it highly unusual that the only documentation regarding Etan case are photographs. WM3 - for 1 example not only was information released regarding the 3 and the victims - but even multiple transcripts of the best friend of the victims - a juvenile who was like 10 years old. No parent or attorney by his side. And the time the interviews conducted the case was not consindered solved - no suspects in custody. That is just 1 example and 1 case. Compared to Etan's case there are 0 documents. Actually a person would be more hard pressed so to say - to find a case where no police reports or search warrants - grand jury indictments - civil suit transcript - court transcipts - interview transcripts - polygraph records - of some of those involved especially someone convicted such as Ramos - would not be easily found.
    ~Human Beings Are All Members Of One Body.
    They Are Created From The Same Essence.
    When One Member Is In Pain,
    The Others Cannot Rest.
    If You Do Not Care About The Pain Of Others,
    You Do Not Deserve To Be Called A Human Being.~


    A Quote From 13th Century Famous Persian Poet Saadi Shirazi

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic72981_1.gif

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  39. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by wfgodot View Post
    I don't think I"ve ever seen or read anything in which Ramos' family participated. As for the perhaps-mythic $10,000, I also don't think I have ever happened upon documentation sufficient enough to satisfy me that he actually did come into a large sum of money. Of the many things Ramos is, he is also a fabulist.

    But if one believes he was truth-telling, it certainly could have had something to do with Etan.
    I truly wish that would be so. I am so sorry for SP and JP they have been through he77.

    ot**love your boston! I have 2, Dexter and Eva, they are the best!

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  41. #71
    To Tell The Truth
    By: Jose Antonio Ramos
    { Prison Address }

    http://www.prisoners.com/ttttruth.html
    ~Human Beings Are All Members Of One Body.
    They Are Created From The Same Essence.
    When One Member Is In Pain,
    The Others Cannot Rest.
    If You Do Not Care About The Pain Of Others,
    You Do Not Deserve To Be Called A Human Being.~


    A Quote From 13th Century Famous Persian Poet Saadi Shirazi

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic72981_1.gif

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  43. #72
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    if this is even borderline inappropriate please advise or delete as i mean absolutely no disrespect to anyone, but as anyone discussed at all or felt slightly uncomfortable about the images that have been made available of Etan? There seems to be so many of him without his shirt on, or in what I feel slightly odd positions? He is extremely beautiful photogenic child & the images look to me to be professionally taken from my perspective of an amateur-semi pro photographer.

    Are these considered "normal" & "innocent" pictures of the time? I say that because he went missing a year before I was born, so I am not all that familiar with the style & also due to the fact that I have a 9 year old son & while I have pictures of him as a baby with very little clothing, I have never set up a photo shot with him in a professional setting in such a manner?

    Again, no disrespect. I am brand new to this case & just right off the bat felt odd about something that probably means nothing, but I can't shake it.

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  45. #73
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    Hi thisgirl, Etan's father was a professional photographer. IMHO and only IMHO there is nothing nefarious about his father's photos of Etan.


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  47. #74
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    Certain of the pictures published of Etan have always been viewed by some as problematical, both then and now.

    If we assume they were pictures taken by the professional photographer in his home, it is inappropriate to discuss them fully as the family are victims, not suspects. It remains an area of the case beyond the WS purview.

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  49. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by wfgodot View Post
    Certain of the pictures released of Etan have always been viewed by some as problematical, both then and now.

    If we assume they were pictures taken by the professional photographer in his home, it is inappropriate to discuss them fully as the family are victims, not suspects. It remains an area of the case beyond the WS purview.
    thank you kat & wfgodot. I appreciate you taking the time to respond. i was unaware of the connection. somehow today was the first day that i had ever heard of this case & i am very interested. will try to become more informed before i involve myself in further discussions.

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