I'm new here and thought I'd share my thoughts on the Darlie case (if you guys are not sick of hearing newb opinions already!)
Like many here, I wanted Darlie to be innocent. I really REALLY wanted her to be innocent. And I still do. Unfortunately, very recently (only in the past few days!) I have come to realise that she isn't.
However, I do not believe she calculatedly killed the boys in cold blood. I don't believe the crime was premeditated or planned in any way. I think she intended to take her own life after the murders.
I believe a combination of many factors led to her snapping one night and carrying out this atrocity. We know she had suicidal intentions a few weeks before the murders. An increasingly unhappy marriage, financial difficulties, postpartum depression, instability from diet pills and perhaps other hormonal problems (I read somewhere she didn't get her period for a year preceding the murders! ) would have consolidated these suicidal feelings and led her to decide to take her life. I believe she was a deeply disturbed individual, suffering from histrionic personality disorder on top of suicidal depression who wanted to avenge her problems with Darin by punishing him in the worst way possible.
I believe she was furious and her self-esteem was at an all-time low when she went to sleep that night after her and Darin discussed separation. I believe she was suicidal, and had been for many months and intended to kill herself after taking the lives of the boys.
For whatever reason (fear, pain...) she couldn't follow through with the suicide, and panicked, making the decision within seconds to create the intruder scenario and stage the crime scene. I believed Darin helped her stage the crime scene.
There are many reasons why I have reached this conclusion, but I think the main one is the fact that this case is so damn complicated. I don't think the prosecution's argument of Darlie committing the murders in cold blood, with no mitigating circumstances and actively taking glee in the deaths of her sons adds up. I also don't believe Darlie's argument of an intruder holds up either - the fibres on the knife are damning.
That is what leads me to believe that the crime scene was staged, very very quickly and without much planning. I believe that if Darlie had planned to kill her sons and carried out the crime in a cold, calculated manner that the crime scene would have been staged MUCH more carefully. The footprint under the vacumn and the blood being washed away from the sink are indicators that Darlie just didn't think the logistics of staging the crime scene through very well. And that has what always stood out for me.
I also don't believe enough has EVER been made of her suicidal intentions in the weeks/months before the murders.
I have no opinion as of yet what her family may really know about what happened that night. I do know that I feel deeply sorry for Drake,Darlie Kee and her other daughter.
I admit from the beginning I have not read the transcripts - this is just the conclusion I have formed what I have read - various forums, pro and anti-Darlie websites, youtube documentaries, etc, etc. Thought I'd share
I haven't seen anyone else with the same opinion, and am definitely not as knowledgeable about the case as most here, but I've always thought the suicide type talk in her diary might have been about the boys' deaths and not her own. To me, the crime seems premeditated due to the staging and the wounds seem to have a pattern and forethought. IMO, hers were similar in the pattern to the boys' but of course, much less deadly.
I believe it was premeditated. I think she's a psychopath.
You need to look at premediation even if it was only minutes. The cut screen leads to it or could as there is no blood outside anywhere so it's not likely she stabbed the children prior to cutting the screen.
I too believe these murders were revenge on Darin. Her anger on the 911 call leads me to believe this.
Thanks Cami, I know you are something of an expert on this case so it means a lot to know that you agree!
The 911 call has always been a source of confusion for me.
On one hand, her hysteria and panic could lead you to believe that she is telling the truth - or, at least, hugely remorseful for the act she carried out earlier. At points, she really does seem tormented. For example, when she screams ''Karen!!'' (or could it be 'Darin!!'') - that pains me, it seems genuine...in some way. Similarly with the ''hurry, please hurry'', and asking about the ambulance etc. I don't know, when I first heard the call all I could think of was INNOCENCE. We know Darlie is a poor actress from her post-conviction interviews, but....some things in that call just make my heart reach out to her.
On the other hand, the ''somebody came in here intentionally and did it DARIN'', and the ''Darin...I promise'' are hugely damning. Also, I'm no expert - thankfully I've never had to make a 911 call myself - but I'm guessing the standard 911 call goes something along the lines off ''we need an ambulance - this is my address - HURRY!!!!'' I think a lot of unnecessary information was given on the call and it was unnecessarily long. Like I said, though, I am no expert.
The call still confuses me a lot.
When do ya'll believe that Damon was stabbed the second time? After it was figured out that he was stabbed twice, I first thought that she hollered DARIN and not Karen, to notify him that maybe Damon moved? I cant remember the timeline, but could he have been stabbed the 2nd time while Darin was downstairs? Seems odd to me that she would holler for Karen.
I just re-read the transcript of the 911 call. There's a lot wrong with it. Darlee doesn't immdiately ask for help, she starts by saying what happened (BBM):
The 911 operator is the first to mention the ambulance.00:00:00 911 Operator #1 ...Rowlett 911...what is your emergency..
00:01:19 Darlie Routier ...somebody came here...they broke in...
00:03:27 911 Operator #1 ...ma'am...
00:05:11 Darlie Routier ...they just stabbed me and my children...
00:07:16 911 Operator #1 ...what...
00:08:05 Darlie Routier ...they just stabbed me and my kids...my little boys...
00:09:24 911 Operator #1 ...who...who did...
00:11:12 Darlie Routier ...my little boy is dying...
In addition, Darlee said she was sleeping when the stabbings occurred. She wavers between seeing one or two men running
out through the garage.
02:02:20 Darlie Routier ...some man ...came in ...stabbed my babies ...stabbed me ...I woke up ...I was fighting ...he ran out through the garage ...threw the knife down ...my babies are dying ...they're dead ...oh my God...04:35:12 Darin Routier ...they took (unintelligible) ...they ran (unintelligible)...04:44:10 Darlie Routier ...oh my God ...oh my God ...why would they do this...She was already covering for fingerprints and again using the singular for the perp:05:19:09 Darlie Routier ...somebody who did it intentionally walked in here and did it Darin...
That tells the story for me. If she had been telling the truth, she wouldn't have had such inconsistencies in the call.05:04:21 Darlie Routier ...(unintelligible) his knife was lying over there and I already picked it up...
05:09:20 Darlie Routier ...God ...I bet if we could have gotten the prints maybe ...maybe...
The greatest trespasser on justice still wishes it done to him.
EDWARD COUNSEL, Maxims
After watching the YouTube documentary done by a WS member .. (i wish i could quote her name .. Ill come back with the link.. She pieced things together so well) That I too think I've come to realize that Darlie probably meant to take herself out that night and chickened out.. . Or, if it wasn't that, I feel it was also spur of the moment with no planning involved. I think as much planning as walking to the kitchen. I'm starting to feel as though it was her frustration with physically being strapped down with the Boys all day while facing severe mental issues .. and I am leaning away from it being financially motivated; although I'm sure a factor. Part of me feels postpartum psychosis may be to blame.
Case in point, this is why we will never be sick of this case... There are so many theories, I myself change my thoughts on this case often .. All excluding her innocence tho.. She killed her boys, no question. I just wish we knew why .. It drives me crazy!! I know I'm not alone .. Thanks for ur thoughts. Iove reading new theories!!
Sent from my iPhone
q<3 VHead <3
Sent from my iPhone
q<3 VHead <3
lets you download a study on 911 calls and things that can indicate guilt or innocence. It's very good. And there are several things that strongly suggest guilt in Darlie's 911 call, such as:
1. Innocent people usually immediately start with an urgent plea for help for the victims. Guilty people give a description of the incident.
2. Innocent people mention the victim first. Notice how Darlie says "they just stabbed me and my kids." Guilty people mention themselves first.
3. Innocent people are focused on getting help for the victims. Guilty people give extraneous information (like about how someone intentionally walked in and did this and about picking up the knife and how we might have gotten fingerprints...)
4. Innocent people refuse to accept the death of family members (even in cases when the person is obviously dead). Guilty people will say the victim is dead even when they can't be sure he is. Darlie says "my babies are dying, they're dead."
5. Guilty people have contradictions in what they say - such as Darlie sometimes speaking of one person, sometimes of more than one.
6. Guilty people use the word "just" in describing what happened as when Darlie says "just stabbed me and my kids." "Just" is a way of minimizing what happened. Innocent people say "He stabbed him!"
It's very interesting research and I think Darlie definitely fits the guilty profile.
Depending on which study you believe depression is prevalent in up to 70% of maternal filicides. There is also a well established and documented link between filicide and suicide with psychotic parents having a much higher proportion of past suicide attempts.
I have no problem believing Darlie was depressed or suicidal. I have no problem believing she murdered two bright and beautiful little boys. I do not believe for a moment though she was psychotic at the time of those murders. PPD perhaps but not PPP in my opinion.
Psychotic mothers behave so much differently to how Darlie reacted. Psychotic mothers do not collude or cover up their crimes as a general rule. In one study of 29 psychotic maternal filicides 23 mothers confessed to the crime compared to just 9 in 26 non-psychotic filicides. Dena Schlosser and Andrea Yates are prime examples of psychotic maternal filicides. JMO and FWIW
"Emotional abuse isn't calling someone a name; it isn't simply raising your voice at someone you're meant to love...it's a concerted effort, a campaign, designed with the sole purpose of destruction. Your destruction. Emotional abuse crushes your spirit. It steals a piece of your soul. It changes everything about you and how you interact with others. You are never the same having survived it. In its wake, you question everything you ever thought you knew. You wonder what's wrong with you. You believe you aren't worth loving. You doubt yourself - constantly. And you learn to live with scars no one sees."
Munchausen by Proxy induce from her husband playing head games.
You know the more I've thought about this, I believe if Darlie were truly suicidal she would never have appealed her death sentence. She would have let them kill her.
Intruders don't just walk up and murder 2 sleeping little boys for no reason. That alone would have to make everyone suspicious even before they start looking at Darlie's behaviors and the 911 call and the blood spatter evidence, etc, etc.
Just like Jeffrey MacDonald's case. His 2 little daughters stabbed umpteen times? That's rage and that's familial rage.
Debate is healthy. Let freedom ring!
My question is: will they ever execute Darlie? I'm starting to think TX may just let her languish on death row forever. It wouldn't bother me if they did, but it seems like they hurry along other executions.
Debate is healthy. Let freedom ring!
I dont know much about 911 responders but I do know that they know the patterns of speech and language of people in need of help and they know when someone is trying to lay the groundwork to cover something up.
I've been wondering why I haven't seen a post from someone who is a 911 dispatcher with opinions or a list like yours to detail why her call is so contrived....until now.
Her call is so bogus they could use it as a case study in how to detect phony calls from people who have just committed a crime.
With all the noise her family and other people generate about her alleged innocence (interesting twist of a phrase, eh?) I don't know if they ever will set her date and execute her. With U.S. becoming less inclined to favor executions, we're probably moving further away from her personal D Day daily instead of closer.
It being a circumstantial case I think the likelihood of whoever sets her date going through with it is diminished. The person or people who have to sign the execution papers don't want this one hanging over their heads on the unlikely chance that Martians invade the planet and find irrefutable evidence of The Intruder buried in the ground in Roswell. I realize I'm mixing metaphors here, but indulge me, please.
I think the most punishment Texas could inflict would be 30+ years in DR. The worst thing in a pathological liar's life is knowing that they failed to get over on someone and that they lose. I used to work for one. Sick, sick people who do a lot of damage to everyone around them all for the sake of their own ego.
The only problem with letting her slide on the List of Departures is that it would eventually make it hard for Texas to keep executing other convicts who were behind her in line. Someone would file a bunch of lawsuits and they'd have to stop executions altogether.....and Texas can't have THAT.
The upside (other than the obvious) is that, by the time they inject her, Drake would be an adult and he might publicly come out against her. That would make Darin feel like he's off the hook and he would come forth with what he knows. We'd finally find out why he failed the polygraph so miserably.
I don't he was involved or colluded in the coverup. The only thing he might have is a one on one confession from Darlie and his admission that he promised her he'd never rat on her for Drake's sake.
Darlie called 911 (you know, the number you usually call when you need cops, an ambulance or a fire truck) and screamed "somebody just stabbed me an my kids!" I'm not a 911 operator but um, yea, logic tells me she needs an ambulance. She wasn't calling 411 or FTD. She wasn't ordering chocolate covered strawberries or Valentine's Day cards. She was calling a number that's entire design is to send emergency responders quickly. The employees answering that phone are trained to figure out what assistance is needed. Why? Because not every caller is calm or coherent enough to just say what they need.
My son dislocated his knee about two weeks ago at a baseball field. My brother had to call 911. He didn't instantly say "send an ambulance!" He said... My nephew was playing ball, he hurt his leg and we can't even pick him up. No mention of an ambulance but he pretty much said we needed one. I called 911 on my neighbors a few years ago. I told them I heard a guy and woman arguing, a little girl crying not to hurt her mommy and two gunshots. I never once said I needed cops or an ambulance. I simply told them why I was calling... I thought someone needed help. 911 could figure out what help was needed based on my description.
My brother forgot to specifically request an ambulance. Does that mean he caused my son's injuries? Nope. I decided to tell the 911 operator what I heard as opposed to requesting specific services. Does that make me the perpetrator? Yea, probably not. I agree.... Call 911 and say what you need but when emotions are running high logic flies out the window. But in this case Darlie made it very clear she needed medical help right away.