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Thread: AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #22

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Know? View Post
    My apologies, it's me who's confused I guess. I will not do scanner duty, you get behind.

    The guy today has a mom who lived on Bellevue where they searched for an unrelated person to Isa's case.
    Sorry I am still confused. Are you saying the guy in this incident has a mom who lives on Bellevue whose place was searched in Isa's case? http://www.tucsonnewsnow.com/story/1...-womans-throat

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    Lindsey Baum, Elizabeth Olten, Shantina Smiley/Azriel Carver, Susan Powell, Rachel Anderson, Kyron Horman, Isabel Celis, Sierra Newbold, Lyric Cook & Elizabeth Collins, Christopher Marks, Reena Williams - NEVER FORGOTTEN

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jules71 View Post
    Sorry I am still confused. Are you saying the guy in this incident has a mom who lives on Bellevue whose place was searched in Isa's case? http://www.tucsonnewsnow.com/story/1...-womans-throat

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    no, those are two separate things.
    This bee my opinion

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  4. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by time View Post
    There are at least two in that post. The guy who lives at apts on Bellevue but wasn't home/was probably in the hoosegow and the white tshirt guy maglighting it through the tunnels who, along with his girlfriend, asked about some search warrant (I think). Who is the third one? If it's not someone with the initials RR or a very drug addicted SC then I'm lost too
    New verb! ...maglighting


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    Quote Originally Posted by Salem View Post
    And remember - a difference of opinion is NOT a TOS violation. Sleuths can speculate and theorize. If you disagree with the subject of the speculation, then move past that part of the discussion. But don't try to stop the flow of ideas and theories from others.

    Thanks,

    Salem
    Question: Should I not post links (from MSM or pressers) that refute/clear up what the speculation(s) is based upon?
    "Normal" is just a setting on a dryer.

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  6. #30
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    :head spinning:

    Teach me to leave for the day.

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  8. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anita Richman View Post
    Time said "hoosegow"! snorting out loud
    Behave yourself lady
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    http://www.amw.com/fugitives/case.cfm?id=61288

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  10. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarolAnn View Post
    BBM

    But you were so good at reporting what they were saying on the scanners, you would be missed!
    And you didnt miss a darn thing. I followed you downstairs, and checked back and forth. Thanks for scribing during all that. I was praying so hard!

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  12. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ransom View Post
    Question: Should I not post links (from MSM or pressers) that refute/clear up what the speculation(s) is based upon?
    I know one of the mods will answer you but I think you help by posting something to alleviate speculation. Certainly saves time and often opens more discussion.
    ^^^^ everything up there is Moo

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  14. #34
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    It is sad when this thread goes dead Just makes me think this case, like so many others, won't ever be solved.
    ^^^^ everything up there is Moo

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  16. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by GutFeeling! View Post
    It is sad when this thread goes dead Just makes me think this case, like so many others, won't ever be solved.
    You read my mind. I was just thinking the same thing .

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  18. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by callyn View Post
    You read my mind. I was just thinking the same thing .
    I was actually IN your head ..... spacious around here LOL _ I jest I jest
    ^^^^ everything up there is Moo

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  20. #37
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    There are witness statements that allude to Becky "working many hours" or that she "worked a lot". As a nurse, I would assume that Mrs. Celis worked three or four twelve-hour shifts per week. Did Becky always work the day shift? How many days/hours per week did Sergio work at the dental office? Was he a full-time employee, or did he work only part-time? Did he work mostly during the day, or did he have evening work hours?

    If and/or when both parents were working, who looked after the Celis children? Was the 14-year-old son expected to care for his siblings when both parents were at work? If so, how long had the oldest child been charged with watching his younger siblings in the absence of their parents? Did Becky and Sergio have anyone besides family members caring for the children when they were at work or socializing? Who drove the children to school since they didn't attend neighborhood schools that were walking distance from their home?

    I'm not sure that the LE documents that we've seen thus far answered any of these questions or whether or not the answers are important in the grand scheme of the case, but I still don't have a clear picture of how this family lived from day-to-day.

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  22. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by BetteDavisEyes View Post
    There are witness statements that allude to Becky "working many hours" or that she "worked a lot". As a nurse, I would assume that Mrs. Celis worked three or four twelve-hour shifts per week. Did Becky always work the day shift? How many days/hours per week did Sergio work at the dental office? Was he a full-time employee, or did he work only part-time? Did he work mostly during the day, or did he have evening work hours?

    If and/or when both parents were working, who looked after the Celis children? Was the 14-year-old son expected to care for his siblings when both parents were at work? If so, how long had the oldest child been charged with watching his younger siblings in the absence of their parents? Did Becky and Sergio have anyone besides family members caring for the children when they were at work or socializing? Who drove the children to school since they didn't attend neighborhood schools that were walking distance from their home?

    I'm not sure that the LE documents that we've seen thus far answered any of these questions or whether or not the answers are important in the grand scheme of the case, but I still don't have a clear picture of how this family lived from day-to-day.
    I don't have answers to all of your questions, but I do recall that SC and BC spoke about aunts and uncles that would pick the kids up from school if they were unable to do so. They spoke of this during the "couch interview".

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  24. #39
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    I would have thought if they were social people (SC and RC) we would have heard more from friends etc - and more friends would have turned up to help search rather than relatives we heard about - they just seemed really busy with their kids.

    Are dental offices open of an evening? Wish mine was lol
    ^^^^ everything up there is Moo

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  26. #40
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    Very good questions, BDE.

    If mom is working a 12 hour shift, someone needs to be caring for Isabel. The boys are pretty capable of doing homework and making a frozen pizza if need be---but somebody needed to look after the 6 yr old during those times. I am curious if Sergio stepped in to do all of that, or if an aunt or babysitter did those things.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn

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  28. #41
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    The statement came from a neighbor on JVM, about a 1/4 down the transcript. DP the neighbor said it.

    snipped

    DP: He seemed like a nice person to me. Whenever I stopped by and visited him going in and out of the neighborhood, when he was out there with the boys or doing, you know, things in his garage, working on bicycles or whatever it was he was doing. I didn`t see a whole lot of Mom, because she worked all the time.


    http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP...5/ijvm.01.html

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  30. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzDaisyCrazy View Post
    I don't have answers to all of your questions, but I do recall that SC and BC spoke about aunts and uncles that would pick the kids up from school if they were unable to do so. They spoke of this during the "couch interview".
    Uncles... like RR or JM for instance I wonder. I do remember an Aunt being mentioned, too.

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  32. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by callyn View Post
    New verb! ...maglighting
    Nah, JBR's case claimed the maglighting aspect. That's how her skull was bashed in. Before that it was a candlestick in the library by the butler.

    OT moo waiting for new news. Praying that Isa is home soon.

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    Today a woman found in an alley near Broadway & Craycroft, Isa's area, was found today dying, later she died & there was an arrest of another woman but a man got away from TPD, this woman was a teenager. Can't tell you how my heart hurts. How sad. I didn't realize it was a teenager.

    They dropped her in an alley! sob...

    Sorry for the O/T This was on KOLD 13 tv or might be on Tucson News Now online later.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ransom View Post
    Question: Should I not post links (from MSM or pressers) that refute/clear up what the speculation(s) is based upon?
    Yes. Of course. They are very helpful to the discussion and would be welcome.

    Thanks,

    Salem
    "I'll put it this way: I certainly wouldn't want them behind me in a knife fight." -- Ad".

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  38. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Know? View Post
    My apologies, it's me who's confused I guess. I will not do scanner duty, you get behind.

    The guy today has a mom who lived on Bellevue where they searched for an unrelated person to Isa's case.
    I heard the same thing. It's been bugging me all day. I know there are a ton of apartment/duplexes on bellevue, but when I heard that on the scanner it really caught my attention.

    ETA: I apologize for mentioning something that should be in the scanner thread. When my neighborhood was surrounded by LE for the 2nd time in just over a month the first thing I thought of was that they had found Isabel or that another child had been taken. To say it was frightening is an understatement. So I was glued to the scanner listening to what was going on and that's when I heard about the suspect in today's incident sometimes living with their mother at the apt. complex on Bellevue. It had me thinking all day that there could be some obscure connection, but as the details of today's situation were released I realized that it must be totally unrelated and just a bizarre coincidence.
    Last edited by DhyanaAZ; 05-30-2012 at 01:29 AM. Reason: Clarification

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  40. #47
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    I didn't connect the Bellevue's lol! I just heard the cross streets!

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  42. #48
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    Okay I am confused. Are you speaking of this incident today?
    http://www.kgun9.com/news/local/155461945.html

    This involved an 19 year old woman, a 20 year old man and a 16 year old female victim.

    Video that mentions the Celis case and how they are unrelated.
    http://www.kvoa.com/videos/tpd-woman...sible-suspect/

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  44. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prof View Post
    Okay I am confused. Are you speaking of this incident today?
    http://www.kgun9.com/news/local/155461945.html

    This involved an 19 year old woman, a 20 year old man and a 16 year old female victim.

    Video that mentions the Celis case and how they are unrelated.
    http://www.kvoa.com/videos/tpd-woman...sible-suspect/
    Yep, that's the one. I should have been more specific in my reply. Sorry 'bout that. I was trying to explain how this morning as it was happening it was a horrible sense of deja vu, and how I spent the day wondering if it was indeed connected. I found out later as the news stories were posted that it was a totally unrelated incident. Again, I'm sorry if I'm being too vague. It's been a long stressful day.
    Last edited by DhyanaAZ; 05-30-2012 at 02:30 AM. Reason: Clarification

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  46. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by GutFeeling! View Post
    I STILL can't get JM out of my head. The fact that there is no mention in the dump just makes me more suspicious, add to the the fact he was obviously a regular in the house that would know the comings and goings of the family and imo had access to come and go as he pleased.
    I agree and have a few thoughts (theories) about this that include information gleaned from the recently released LE docs (I have not painstakingly researched all docs as many here have gratefully done). Specifically, many have expressed interest in "maglighting" guy NMc who lives with his gf close to the Celis home. It is also reported by a relative of JM that JM resided with the SC/RC family for approximately 6 months. If NMc is approximately 35, not too big a difference in age exists between JM and NMc. I wonder if while living as neighbors, the two men forged an acquaintance or friendship. Could there be some level of collaboration between the two?
    With that said, IMO it's more likely NMc is a well intentioned, possibly, too eager guy who took it upon himself to search tunnels for a missing child. Living in such close proximity to the Celis', it is possible NMc learned of Isabel being missing when her family initially searched for her in the neighborhood.
    The use of two vehicles (the Jetta and the other, was it a hatchback?) may be attributed to something as simple as where each car was parked at his home and in which car it was easiest to leave. LE watched him when he returned to the Jetta, possibly returning home. Maybe gf was waiting with breakfast prepared, something they agreed upon when he left their home. Once engaged with LE, he may have remembered he was due home hence, his sudden exit. Also, LE reported the gf was headed to work which could explain NMc needing to return the Jetta to gf. Later, when NMc was noted by LE to be in the other vehicle, he was then in his own car.
    JM on the other hand, is glaringly absent from the LE reports. Especially when one considers the detail provided about other family members, their cell phone screen shot photos and the search warrant served on their truck.There has been speculation here that the reported December visit by CPS to the Celis' home might somehow be linked to JM's stay with the Celis family. There are also the rumors of JM's income being associated with illegal activities, his maybe owing money to the "wrong" people and the possibility of consequences exerted against JM for illegal involvement.
    I wonder if speculation of a retaliation aspect to Isabel being taken from her home is one in which JM exerts retaliation against SC. The reported "hoax" phone call saying SC borrowed $170K from a physician employer might be a misrepresentation or half-truth put out there by JM to assure criminal acquaintances he could pay his debt. JM might be very angry with this family not coming through for him.
    All this is only my opinion.

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