Page 9 of 82 FirstFirst ... 7 8 9 10 11 19 59 ... LastLast
Results 121 to 135 of 1225
  1. #121
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    893
    Quote Originally Posted by Kamille View Post
    Bottom line is that none of his timelines work with the witness statement that he arrived at his parent's home at 4:30pm.

    MOO
    IMO If we need to talk about bottom lines, then the real bottom line here is clearly that Dale has not been charged with any crime. If he is in fact guilty I hope this will change in the future although I as well as others have obvious reservations about that. However the issue here IMO is not just who is responsible for MP's disappearance but also, if not more importantly, of where is MP, although the two are clearly linked together. JMO
    Last edited by Thor; 06-25-2012 at 03:14 PM.


  2. #122
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Orlando FL
    Posts
    1,340
    Quote Originally Posted by Thor View Post
    IMO If we need to talk about bottom lines, then the real bottom line here is clearly that Dale has not been charged with any crime. If he is in fact guilty I hope this will change in the future although I as well as others have obvious reservations about that. However the issue here IMO is not just who is responsible for MP's disappearance but also, if not more importantly, of where is MP, although the two are clearly linked together. JMO
    But the POINT is Dale cannot account for at least 30 mins. If he left 10 mins after Michelle arrived he would have arrived at his parents BY 4pm. So he probably harmed Michelle in these 40 minutes he tried to erase until he GOT CAUGHT by the neighbor's camera. That is where HIS LIES were exposed and why he will eventually BE CONVICTED. JMO


  3. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Jazzmaster For This Useful Post:


  4. #123
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    893
    Quote Originally Posted by Jazzmaster View Post
    But the POINT is Dale cannot account for at least 30 mins. If he left 10 mins after Michelle arrived he would have arrived at his parents BY 4pm. So he probably harmed Michelle in these 40 minutes he tried to erase until he GOT CAUGHT by the neighbor's camera. That is where HIS LIES were exposed and why he will eventually BE CONVICTED. JMO
    I don't know that Dale said he left 10 Mins after Michelle arrived, I may be wrong here and my brain is not functioning at optimum speed right know, I thought Dale said that it was Michelle who left after 10 minutes of her arrival at the condo, right? And assuming that he did leave 10 minutes after 10 minutes Michelle left, which makes it what? 20 minutes after MP's initial arrival, I still do not understand the significance of this ... I am getting lost here ...


  5. #124
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Orlando FL
    Posts
    1,340
    Quote Originally Posted by Thor View Post
    I don't know that Dale said he left 10 Mins after Michelle arrived, I may be wrong here and my brain is not functioning at optimum speed right know, I thought Dale said that it was Michelle who left after 10 minutes of her arrival at the condo, right? And assuming that he did leave 10 minutes after 10 minutes Michelle left, which makes it what? 20 minutes after MP's initial arrival, I still do not understand the significance of this ... I am getting lost here ...
    IIRC Dale said Michelle arrived at 4pm, they chatted briefly and she left 10 mins later and he left the same time as her for his parents. Problem is he was off by 42 minutes on when she arrived. He had been watching PC earlier so I doubt he was mistaken on when she arrived. IMO he changed the arrival and departure times to FIT his alibi not knowing the neighbor's camera caught her actual arrival times. Can you say BUSTED? All JMO


  6. The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to Jazzmaster For This Useful Post:


  7. #125
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    893
    Quote Originally Posted by Jazzmaster View Post
    IIRC Dale said Michelle at arrived at 4pm, they chatted briefly and she left 10 mins later and he left the same time as her for his parents. Problem is he was off by 42 minutes on when she arrived. He had been watching PC earlier so I doubt he was mistaken on when she arrived. IMO he changed the arrival and departure times to FIT his alibi not knowing the neighbor's camera caught her actual arrival times. Can you say BUSTED? All JMO
    Are we back here to the theory that Dale said Michelle arrived at 4pm? Ok then, I think there are plenty of posts above on this issue and it seems to me that it isn't clear who said what to whom and when. If you choose to believe Lauren is correct and Dale did not make a mistake, or that the entire episode actually took place to begin with and that Sr is lying as well, than that is your opinion and where is the debate there? Why don't we take this to it's logical conclusion and say that Dale is guilty and let's fill in all the blanks around it with what we like to believe and be done with it? Oh wait ...

    Lastly if you or I get to position the pieces on the chessboard to our likings, then it's mate in one I suppose, not much argument there.


    JMO
    Last edited by Thor; 06-25-2012 at 04:59 PM.


  8. #126
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    10,121
    Quote Originally Posted by Thor View Post
    Are we back here to the theory that Dale said Michelle arrived at 4pm? Ok then, I think there are plenty of posts above on this issue and it seems to me that it isn't clear who said what to whom and when. If you choose to believe Lauren is correct and Dale did not make a mistake, or that the entire episode actually took place to begin with and that Sr is lying as well, than that is your opinion and where is the debate there? Why don't we take this to it's logical conclusion and say that Dale is guilty and let's fill in all the blanks around it to what we like to believe and be done with it? Oh wait ...

    Lastly if you or I get to position the pieces on the chessboard to our likings, then it's mate in one I suppose, not much argument there.


    JMO
    What do you choose to believe? Because a debate is usually two sides expressing opposing views. Not one side stating over and over again the information they have painstakingly gathered for the past 7 months and the other side saying "I disagree" without anything to sustantiate why.

    MOO


  9. The Following 10 Users Say Thank You to Kamille For This Useful Post:


  10. #127
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    893
    Quote Originally Posted by Kamille View Post
    What do you choose to believe? Because a debate is usually two sides expressing opposing views. Not one side stating over and over again the information they have painstakingly gathered for the past 7 months and the other side saying "I disagree" without anything to sustantiate why.

    MOO
    I am confused, the argument here, to the extent that there is one, is not on the evidence gathered by anyone, painstakingly or not, it's on the conclusions we derive from them.

    Specifically on this issue the theory goes that Lauren stated that Dale said to her MP arrived at 4:00 pm and because later we have a video footage that shows MP arriving at 3:18 pm then therefore Dale lied.

    I and at least one other disagreed that this proves Dale lied, the reasons for that can be found on several posts above.

    So what are the facts?

    1. Lauren states Dale said MP arrived at 4:00 pm.

    2. Presumably Sr. and/or other Dale's family members say Dale arrived at Sr's at 4:30 pm. (according to his attorney)

    3. There is a footage of MP arriving at Dale's at 3:18 pm


    So what are the opinions on those facts?

    They can be found on the posts above both by me and others.

    Conclusion: If I am asked a question that starts with the conclusion that Dale lied and therefore is guilty then there is not much argument there, is there? If he lied then he's probably guilty and I agree.

    What I said was that it is entirely questionable here that Dale and Sr. lied and that in any case has not been proven in a factual sense and that is in fact what is debatable.

    In other words the question cannot come with a forgone conclusion to the same question (that would be a rhetorical question only), and a conclusion cannot be arrived at without answering the question. To the degree that the question allows for different conclusions that is a called a debate.

    JMO
    Last edited by Thor; 06-25-2012 at 06:56 PM.


  11. #128
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    FL
    Posts
    5,653
    MP could have been on video at 3:18 and still been at his door at 4:00 or near too it and no one lied. I suggested before she may have stopped to talk to someone she knew at the complex and then headed over to Dale's. Or she was reading reading her text messages or fussing with the kids, something that delayed her to near 4:00. What if someone did stop to talk to her, and they waited until she left, followed her, or was waiting along a road for her, knowing she didn't have the kids, that is a possiblity. Were there any other people in that whole complex that had a camera and video? There had to be at least one person that saw her or Dale that day. No one? Every one talks about the hummer and how it stands out, but we don't have any one saying they saw her leave or come in or on the road, nothing. If the windows were tinted did they fear being see driving it? If not, then it doesn't make sense to take the Glow advertising off. You would want someone to think she left, to see that hummer leave that place. Eithere he was smart or he was dumb, he did it alone or he had help, which is it? No evidence of a crime in the condo. No sighting of her in that hummer coming or going. No sightings on the road, with or without the Glow advertising. How is this, with all the traffic cameras around.
    Your Dream must be greater than your fear!


  12. The Following User Says Thank You to Skully For This Useful Post:


  13. #129
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Posts
    10,121
    Quote Originally Posted by Thor View Post
    I am confused, the argument here, to the extent that there is one, is not on the evidence gathered by anyone, painstakingly or not, it's on the conclusions we derive from them.

    Specifically on this issue the theory goes that Lauren stated that Dale said to her MP arrived at 4:00 pm and because later we have a video footage that shows MP arriving at 3:18 pm then therefore Dale lied.

    I and at least one other disagreed that this proves Dale lied, the reasons for that can be found on several posts above.

    So what are the facts?

    1. Lauren states Dale said MP arrived at 4:00 pm.

    2. Presumably Sr. and/or other Dale's family members say Dale arrived at Sr's at 4:30 pm. (according to his attorney)

    3. There is a footage of MP arriving at Dale's at 3:18 pm


    So what are the opinions on those facts?

    They can be found on the posts above both by me and others.

    Conclusion: If I am asked a question that starts with the conclusion that Dale lied and therefore is guilty then there is not much argument there, is there? If he lied then he's probably guilty and I agree.

    What I said was that it is entirely questionable here that Dale and Sr. lied and that in any case has not been proven in a factual sense and that is in fact what is debatable.

    In other words the question cannot come with a forgone conclusion to the same question (that would be a rhetorical question only), and a conclusion cannot be arrived at without answering the question. To the degree that the question allows for different conclusions that is a called a debate.

    JMO

    Okay so let me get this straight. You are suggesting that Lauren may be mistaken about what she heard regarding the time DSJr said that Michelle arrived at the condo, or she may be correct but DSJr may be mistaken about the times he told the family and presumably LE that Michelle arrived at the condo and when she left. This is not a theory. Lauren herself stated this information in a phone call with Vinnie Politan on his show dated Nov 29th.

    So you believe that the discrepancy there means nothing? And that it doesn't seem suspicious at all that there is a 40 minute difference? Or do you believe that DSJr never said that to the family or LE? What is your conclusion about that information?

    You are presuming that it was a member of DSJrís family who was the alibi witness as per his lawyerís statement but there is not one quote from anyone on his legal team, in his family, or LE that stated this. I have asked for a link to this info but perhaps you missed my request?

    So in essence, your debate is not to poke holes in any theories presented based on the information that has been gathered and provide some of your own for us to consider, but to poke holes in the mounting evidence against Dale Smith Jr, the LE named prime suspect in the case. I believe a mod indicated in the last thread that this is the Michelle Parker thread and not the defend Dale Smith Jr thread.

    So letís just say again for argumentís sake that all of the information and evidence that has been gathered by LE that points to DSJr can be ďinterpretedĒ in a different way, which can always be the case and is the reason why defence attorneys exist, and that heís actually completely innocent of any wrong doing. And that Michelle left the condo at some point after dropping the children off perfectly well and fine.

    So we know she arrived at 3:18pm. What happened next? What time did she leave? We canít count on DSJrís account because he might have been just estimating and could have been off by about 40 minutes or Lauren may be mistaken about what he actually said. Where was Michelle when the Waterford text was sent over an hour after she arrived? We know she wasnít in Waterford. Why didnít anyone see her or the Hummer during that time? A poster on this board claimed he saw her exiting the hwy shortly before she arrived at the condo. There is video surveillance of her stopping for lunch. There may be some other people in the over 700 tips who saw her and/or her vehicle prior to arrival as well.

    So can we assume that no one saw her after that arrival since LE continue to maintain that they believe DSJr is involved? Why didnít she call her son as she always does if he arrives home before her? Why didnít she call or text anyone other than that one word text to her brother which was a lie. How far do you figure she got before she met with foul play? Her phone was at Hoffner and Semoran travelling west and pinging at some time. What was that ping? When was it? We've only been told about two pings. The Waterford text and the last ping before the phone powered down near the Jesse Black Saloon in Oakridge. So was the Waterford text the ping at Hoffner and Semoran, less than 3 miles away from the condo over an hour after she arrived? What is your conclusion about that ping?

    Or do you believe that she didnít meet with foul play and that she threw away her phone, drove to Walden Circle, stripped off the decals and took them with her, left her purse and all identification and bank cards behind and just walked away from her life? Why did she travel west instead of east towards home where she told her family less than an hour earlier she was headed?

    What is your theory or opinion of what happened to Michelle Parker. Not just your theory or opinion of why the evidence or information gathered against Dale Smith Jr means nothing because he hasnít been arrested. What are your conclusions based on the information that has been provided?
    TIA

    MOO


  14. The Following 10 Users Say Thank You to Kamille For This Useful Post:


  15. #130
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    175
    Great post, Kamille, THANK YOU!

    And here's a reminder for those who seem to think police never even explored other possibilities for Michelle's disappearance:

    Nov. 28, 2011
    OPD CHIEF PAUL ROONEY: After numerous tips and investigative leads, we are officially naming Dale Smith, the ex-fiance, as the primary suspect in the disappearance of Michelle Parker. Many questions will be asked why Dale Smith wasn't considered a suspect prior to today. And the answer is we had to look at every aspect in the case before we could come out publicly and state that Mr. Smith is our primary focus.

    That statement was made 11 days after Michelle disappeared. It sure sounds to me like they spent quite some time investigating other possibilities and ruling them out before naming DSJR suspect. JMO.


  16. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to SleuthDecay For This Useful Post:


  17. #131
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    893
    Quote Originally Posted by Kamille View Post
    Okay so let me get this straight. You are suggesting that Lauren may be mistaken about what she heard regarding the time DSJr said that Michelle arrived at the condo, or she may be correct but DSJr may be mistaken about the times he told the family and presumably LE that Michelle arrived at the condo and when she left. This is not a theory. Lauren herself stated this information in a phone call with Vinnie Politan on his show dated Nov 29th. ....
    Ok I'm not suggesting anything it seems that you are in this case. The fact is that Lauren stated the DS said MP arrived at 4:00 pm ... we know the rest. The theory is that DS therefore lied. I don't agree with that and we have a difference of opinions. As to what I think on this issue is that there is not enough known to make a determination as to whose recollection is correct and what that implies, that particulars of which can be found somewhere above this post and it would be too time consuming for me to re-state it.

    So you believe that the discrepancy there means nothing? And that it doesn't seem suspicious at all that there is a 40 minute difference? Or do you believe that DSJr never said that to the family or LE? What is your conclusion about that information?

    No I believe the discrepancy does not prove in this case Dale lied or otherwise, again I refer you to a previous post of mine above.

    You are presuming that it was a member of DSJr’s family who was the alibi witness as per his lawyer’s statement but there is not one quote from anyone on his legal team, in his family, or LE that stated this. I have asked for a link to this info but perhaps you missed my request?

    You are correct, since the attorney said in Dale's timeline defense rested on the contention that he couldn't have done the crime between 3:18 pm and 4:30pm because he was a Sr's I presume that there is a testimony to that effect. I never got a requested for a link, but this particular point has been debated before and has been a subject in TV shows such as Nancy Grace.

    So in essence, your debate is not to poke holes in any theories presented based on the information that has been gathered and provide some of your own for us to consider, but to poke holes in the mounting evidence against Dale Smith Jr, the LE named prime suspect in the case. I believe a mod indicated in the last thread that this is the Michelle Parker thread and not the defend Dale Smith Jr thread.

    I am not sure what "mounting evidence" you are referring to, I would say there are "mounting theories" perhaps, and even of that I'm not sure since it seems to me that often times we find ourselves re-visiting the same issues where Dale is concerned, and I would point out that on many occasion I have presented an alternative view, however one can simply disagree on a theory, state the reasons why and needs not to necessarily have an alternate theory, as it is the case with many posts. And no I don't think this is "the defend Dale Smith Jr thread" nor is it "the accuse Dale Smith Jr thread", I think this is the missing person forum abut the Michelle Parker case as I suspect you know already. The only reason we talk about Dale is because many posters want to talk about Dale, I for one would prefer we talked much more about Michelle and most importantly where she might be and less about how guilty or innocent Dale is, but I am only one of many I suppose.

    So we know she arrived at 3:18pm. What happened next? What time did she leave? We can’t count on DSJr’s account because he might have been just estimating and could have been off by about 40 minutes or Lauren may be mistaken about what he actually said. Where was Michelle when the Waterford text was sent over an hour after she arrived? We know she wasn’t in Waterford. Why didn’t anyone see her or the Hummer during that time? A poster on this board claimed he saw her exiting the hwy shortly before she arrived at the condo. There is video surveillance of her stopping for lunch. There may be some other people in the over 700 tips who saw her and/or her vehicle prior to arrival as well.

    This are all questions that on many occasions have been asked here and go to the central question of what happened to Michelle and I have on more then one occasion given my thoughts as to the possibilities. However ultimately IMO there is precious little in terms of evidence to know for sure, at least not on the public record, the police might have further evidence but thay are not known at this time.

    So can we assume that no one saw her after that arrival since LE continue to maintain that they believe DSJr is involved? Why didn’t she call her son as she always does if he arrives home before her? Why didn’t she call or text anyone other than that one word text to her brother which was a lie. How far do you figure she got before she met with foul play? Her phone was at Hoffner and Semoran travelling west and pinging at some time. What was that ping? When was it? We've only been told about two pings. The Waterford text and the last ping before the phone powered down near the Jesse Black Saloon in Oakridge. So was the Waterford text the ping at Hoffner and Semoran, less than 3 miles away from the condo over an hour after she arrived? What is your conclusion about that ping?

    Or do you believe that she didn’t meet with foul play and that she threw away her phone, drove to Walden Circle, stripped off the decals and took them with her, left her purse and all identification and bank cards behind and just walked away from her life? Why did she travel west instead of east towards home where she told her family less than an hour earlier she was headed? What is your theory or opinion of what happened to Michelle Parker. Not just your theory or opinion of why the evidence or information gathered agai


    Again I don't think one needs to have a theory on anything, some things are not known period, however if you go over all my posts, and there are many, you would find that whatever faults I might have, not having an opinion is not one of them. It is practically impossible at this time and in one single post to re-litigate virtually all issues that have been discussed in the past 6 months or so as you probably would agree. I did comment on the issue of the Lauren's statement as did others, and I may comment on any further points you might have (just not so many at once) as others may.

    IMO
    Last edited by Thor; 06-26-2012 at 01:45 AM.


  18. #132
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Winter Park, FL
    Posts
    321
    WHERE IS MICHELLe?!?!?!?


  19. The Following 12 Users Say Thank You to Cblewife For This Useful Post:


  20. #133
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    3,542
    We can only hope that Michelle is found soon. If she is deceased (and I sadly believe she is) perhaps our Tropical Storm Debbie will help wash up more evidence. I remember back in August 2008 we had Tropical Storm Fay and that helped flood the area where little Caylee was found and dislodged her remains. If Michelle is buried, perhaps this storm will help find her or at least find enough evidence that LE has that final piece of the puzzle that will help convict Dale.

    Always hoping, tho, that Michelle is found alive. But at this point, I doubt it very much.

    As always, JMO MOO


  21. The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to What'sThatClue For This Useful Post:


  22. #134
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Santa Cruz, California
    Posts
    255
    *****SPOILER ALERT****** THIS IS MY OPINION ONLY

    I am changing my time line to include Dale Senior coming back to the house with Dale to take care of Michelle and the Hummer.

    In reviewing why certain "Dale couldn't possibly be guilty" types have become so prolific and distorting information so perversely, I went back to thread 20 and saw some footage of Dale Sr's marijuana court date. The reporter asked Dale Senior what he thought about Michelle's disappearance and mentions that "then you two take off." or something close. I thought Sr's reaction was interesting. So, IMHO, it was Dale Sr. and not Dale's mom who brought him back to the condo. Although, if he were more competent, Dale COULD have done it alone, he obviously wanted his da-da.

    That explains to me why LE is having so much trouble bringing this case to trial. When my friend was murdered, the perp's lover became an accessory after the fact. (days after the fact) To avoid having the guilty parties point fingers at each other during two separate trials and risking smart attorneys creating enough reasonable doubt so that juries would convict neither, the DA left out a good deal of evidence and charged only the perp (who is still in prison and this happened in 1982).

    So, anybody know if Dale Sr. has a truck other than he white work truck?

    BTW, after working with mandated clients for almost 20 years, about 1/3 of whom where meth addicts, Dale sure looks the part to me. Which would mean, if were true, that he is very unstable and highly volatile. So I would warn posters who have mentioned that they don't think he's dangerous to anyone other than intimates, that he could be lethal. I doubt if he was intimate with the life guard he helped kill or the guy he cold cocked with a chair in Bell Isle.


  23. The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to GrammaMaybe For This Useful Post:


  24. #135
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ohio
    Posts
    3,419
    Just providing info here. There is another person who claims to know DS and says that MP dropped off the twins at 4pm.

    HTH

    FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - #1 - Page 18 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
    Last edited by KateB; 05-04-2015 at 10:46 PM. Reason: repair url tag.
    No temptation has overtaken you except what is common to mankind. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can endure it. - 1 Corinthians 10:13 (NIV)

    We are all one poor choice from being a subject on this forum. Think twice.


  25. The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to mikkismom For This Useful Post:


Page 9 of 82 FirstFirst ... 7 8 9 10 11 19 59 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - #24
    By imamaze in forum 2010's Missing
    Replies: 465
    Last Post: 06-11-2015, 09:33 PM
  2. FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - #13
    By imamaze in forum 2010's Missing
    Replies: 628
    Last Post: 12-14-2011, 10:33 PM
  3. FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - #11
    By imamaze in forum 2010's Missing
    Replies: 598
    Last Post: 12-11-2011, 09:46 AM
  4. FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - # 9
    By imamaze in forum 2010's Missing
    Replies: 787
    Last Post: 12-08-2011, 09:12 PM
  5. FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - # 2
    By imamaze in forum 2010's Missing
    Replies: 640
    Last Post: 11-27-2011, 01:12 PM

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •