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  1. #1
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    If outsiders werent allowed in the pageants, who came up with the theory....

    that JonBenet was killed by a Pageant stalker? I was watching Painted Babies at 17, on Youtube ( [ame="http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnSdFMVFJ80"]YouTube - Painted Babies at 17 Part 2[/ame] ) and it said "Only parents, mainly mothers are allowed to attend the pageants, no outsiders are allowed" This documetary was made in 2007, did they change with rules after the murder of JonBenet? If not, can someone please refresh my memory, who came with up the theory that someone from JonBenet's Pageants was following her, stalking her and came up with the plan to killer her? I remember it being either in a book or a documentary about JonBenet. Also Patsy said she wasnt the one who filmed JonBenet when she was performing on stage. She said that the videos of JonBenets pageants that the news showed was filmed by someone else. If so, who? What mother would film a child performing or take interest in a childs performance besides their own? Unless it was one of the crazy stage moms stalking JonBenet lol
    Aunt Pam: JonBenet why don't you put your shoes on? JonBenet: Because I want to feel the rhythm of the earth under my feet.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shanny View Post
    that JonBenet was killed by a Pageant stalker? I was watching Painted Babies at 17, on Youtube ( YouTube - Painted Babies at 17 Part 2 ) and it said "Only parents, mainly mothers are allowed to attend the pageants, no outsiders are allowed" This documetary was made in 2007, did they change with rules after the murder of JonBenet? If not, can someone please refresh my memory, who came with up the theory that someone from JonBenet's Pageants was following her, stalking her and came up with the plan to killer her? I remember it being either in a book or a documentary about JonBenet. Also Patsy said she wasnt the one who filmed JonBenet when she was performing on stage. She said that the videos of JonBenets pageants that the news showed was filmed by someone else. If so, who? What mother would film a child performing or take interest in a childs performance besides their own? Unless it was one of the crazy stage moms stalking JonBenet lol
    The pageant videos were filmed by photographers hired by the pageant. The videos were then sold (by either the pageant or the photographer) to image licensing companies. I have seen videos of JonBenet on YouTube that were filmed by other people at the pageant, and the difference in quality is astonishing. It would be obvious if Patsy, not a professional, had filmed them.

    A photographer hired to take "cover girl" shots of JonBenet Ramsey in makeup and curls has sold the entire portfolio to a New York City agency for $7,500 after stashing the negatives in a rural bank vault.

    Randy Simons, whose glamorous pictures of the tiny beauty queen sparked a firestorm of criticism toward pageants, said he struck the deal with Sygma Photo Agency over the weekend after fielding bids from news outlets around the world for as much as $100,000.

    "I wasn't interested in the money. I let them go cheap," Simons said yesterday in an interview with The Denver Post. "I chose Sygma because I wanted the pictures to get worldwide coverage so this guy ( JonBenet 's killer) would have no place to hide."

    Sygma also agreed to pay Simons a percentage of any profits the company reaps through reselling the color pictures to TV news programs, newspapers and magazines. The Sygma official who negotiated the contract with Simons said his company doesn't talk to reporters.
    Last edited by eileenhawkeye; 06-28-2012 at 05:38 PM.

  3. #3
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    Most pageants of this type are held in hotels or other public areas. As far as I know, the general public is not prevented from attending or watching. But all participants must have been pre-registered or selected somehow, and for the kiddie pageants, you just have to register- they don't turn anyone down (as you can tell by watching "Toddlers & Tiaras"). The audience is comprised mostly of mothers, grandmothers, and other family members but I don't think anyone is prevented from watching.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  4. #4
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    I think the "JonBenet was killed by someone at a pageant" was pretty much inevitable after the footage came out. I don't think anyone started the theory; it's always been around since the case first hit the news.

  5. #5
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    I do not know too much about the case being from the UK. But I had heard about Jonbenet Ramsey before she died , there had been an article about America's child beauty pagents and she was mentioned. So I would not be surprised if she had been in American media before her death.
    I did watch a documentary about it though, and in it there were talking to some people who went to the pagaents (mothers I think), and they said they did get paedophiles attend, and said people would be like "oh no he is here again". I do not know the accuracy of this (it seems mad to me to send your child to dance around in a crowd where you now there are paedophiles), and I cannot remember the documentary name. It was about a new investigator that was hired by the prosecutors to loo into the case. He starte doff by thinking they were guilty after listening to the police, and then when he actually looked at it did not think they were guilty. If anyone nows his name, it might help find the documentary.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by brit1981 View Post
    I do not know too much about the case being from the UK. But I had heard about Jonbenet Ramsey before she died , there had been an article about America's child beauty pagents and she was mentioned. So I would not be surprised if she had been in American media before her death.
    I did watch a documentary about it though, and in it there were talking to some people who went to the pagaents (mothers I think), and they said they did get paedophiles attend, and said people would be like "oh no he is here again". I do not know the accuracy of this (it seems mad to me to send your child to dance around in a crowd where you now there are paedophiles), and I cannot remember the documentary name. It was about a new investigator that was hired by the prosecutors to loo into the case. He starte doff by thinking they were guilty after listening to the police, and then when he actually looked at it did not think they were guilty. If anyone nows his name, it might help find the documentary.
    Do you have more information about this article like was in a newspaper or magazine? What exactly did it say about JonBenet? How much of the article was her? What was the source? Are you sure you read the article before 12/26/96?

  7. #7
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    I cannot remember the article, I am racking my brains, but it is a brief article I read seventeen years ago. I just remember it was a short article talking about the culture of these pagaents in America. It was definetly before she died though. She was mentioned only very briefly. basicly it mentioned that the two most "famous" pagaent queens were Jonbenet ramsey and another little girl. It spoke of them as arch rivals and then contrasted their backgrounds as the other little girl came from a much poorer background and lived in a trailer etc, where as it said Jonbenet came from a wealthy family and her mother could afford to spend a fortune on preparing her for pageants. It was only really two or three lines that mentioned them. The only reason i remember it at all is because Jonbenet was murdered, and was written about in a teen magazine I read (I think they called her little miss dead !) and I realised it was the little girl I had read about previously. It cannot have been written that long before she was murdered because I do not think I would have remembered her for that long.
    Now I think about it, it might even have been in an american magazine. I know in about 1995 a friend brought me some american magazines over from the states. they were like people magazine, that type of thing. It was definetly from a magazine or newspaper targeted to adults, not teenagers so the chances are it was either one of these american magazines, or a british newspaper. Was there ever any documentaries about the pageants back then, it might even have been a review.
    The documentary was called "who killed the pageant queen".

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by brit1981 View Post
    I cannot remember the article, I am racking my brains, but it is a brief article I read seventeen years ago. I just remember it was a short article talking about the culture of these pagaents in America. It was definetly before she died though. She was mentioned only very briefly. basicly it mentioned that the two most "famous" pagaent queens were Jonbenet ramsey and another little girl. It spoke of them as arch rivals and then contrasted their backgrounds as the other little girl came from a much poorer background and lived in a trailer etc, where as it said Jonbenet came from a wealthy family and her mother could afford to spend a fortune on preparing her for pageants. It was only really two or three lines that mentioned them. The only reason i remember it at all is because Jonbenet was murdered, and was written about in a teen magazine I read (I think they called her little miss dead !) and I realised it was the little girl I had read about previously. It cannot have been written that long before she was murdered because I do not think I would have remembered her for that long.
    Now I think about it, it might even have been in an american magazine. I know in about 1995 a friend brought me some american magazines over from the states. they were like people magazine, that type of thing. It was definetly from a magazine or newspaper targeted to adults, not teenagers so the chances are it was either one of these american magazines, or a british newspaper. Was there ever any documentaries about the pageants back then, it might even have been a review.
    The documentary was called "who killed the pageant queen".
    Wait...the article about JonBenet pre-murder was called "Little Miss Dead"? Because I've read that article, and it was written after her death; after all, look at the title.

  9. #9
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    No sorry for the confusion the little Miss dead article (seriously this is a child, how insensitive could they get) came out after that. I read it and when i did so I remembered having read about the little girl briefly before. But as i said that article was very brief and she was mentioned alongside her rival and their backgrounds contrasted. Definetly two different articles. I really wish I could remember, but given that it was quite short I suspect it might have been a review of some sort, and as I had some us magazines at the time it could have been an american article.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by brit1981 View Post
    No sorry for the confusion the little Miss dead article (seriously this is a child, how insensitive could they get) came out after that. I read it and when i did so I remembered having read about the little girl briefly before. But as i said that article was very brief and she was mentioned alongside her rival and their backgrounds contrasted. Definetly two different articles. I really wish I could remember, but given that it was quite short I suspect it might have been a review of some sort, and as I had some us magazines at the time it could have been an american article.
    Well we know for a fact that JonBenet was never in any pageant documentary or TV show, so it couldn't have been a review for something like that.


  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by brit1981 View Post
    I do not know too much about the case being from the UK. But I had heard about Jonbenet Ramsey before she died , there had been an article about America's child beauty pagents and she was mentioned. So I would not be surprised if she had been in American media before her death.
    I did watch a documentary about it though, and in it there were talking to some people who went to the pagaents (mothers I think), and they said they did get paedophiles attend, and said people would be like "oh no he is here again". I do not know the accuracy of this (it seems mad to me to send your child to dance around in a crowd where you now there are paedophiles), and I cannot remember the documentary name. It was about a new investigator that was hired by the prosecutors to loo into the case. He starte doff by thinking they were guilty after listening to the police, and then when he actually looked at it did not think they were guilty. If anyone nows his name, it might help find the documentary.
    Try reading up on the case using other materials. Most are available online. There are some excellent books written by people actually involved. And a great website filled with resource material here: http://www.acandyrose.com. It will be fascinating reading.
    You have to scroll to the "JonBenet Archives". It will give you a lot of facts, a lot to think about, and a basic knowledge about the case. NONE of it is from a magazine article or written by random reporters who really do not have the facts straight. You will find the autopsy report (if it were up to me, reading this most basic case document would be required reading for any poster) as well as crime scene photos and police interviews with her parents. Get through that, and you'll have a tremendous understanding of the case and be able to make an informed decision- the only kind that matters, as far as I am concerned.

    There will always be pedophiles wherever children's activities take place. This includes kids' sports, scouting events, competitions, dance recitals, kiddie pageants, and school plays. Pedophiles like to look at their prey, even if they can't get to them. Presence of a pedophile at JB's pageant does not exclude the parents from being suspects.
    THIS time, we get it RIGHT!

    This post is my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy or take it anywhere else.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by eileenhawkeye View Post
    Well we know for a fact that JonBenet was never in any pageant documentary or TV show, so it couldn't have been a review for something like that.
    Ah, Ok. Well I have no idea what the article was then. As I said she and the other girl were only mentioned for two or three lines. If it were not for later reading Jonbenet had been murdered I would not have recalled any of it.

    I now the prescene of paedophiles does not exclude the parents, but it presents yet another risk especially if they could follow the children around. I wonder if it could be possible to see if any single men keep popping up in the pagaent audiences. If it was an intruder though, I do not think they were just targeting Jonbenet. The horrible ransom note sounds like real hatred towards the parents.

    I remember watching that documentary and wondering why parents allowed their children to be on stage if they knew there were paedophiles watching (especially as the impression given was that they recognized individuels).

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by brit1981 View Post
    Ah, Ok. Well I have no idea what the article was then. As I said she and the other girl were only mentioned for two or three lines. If it were not for later reading Jonbenet had been murdered I would not have recalled any of it.

    I now the prescene of paedophiles does not exclude the parents, but it presents yet another risk especially if they could follow the children around. I wonder if it could be possible to see if any single men keep popping up in the pagaent audiences. If it was an intruder though, I do not think they were just targeting Jonbenet. The horrible ransom note sounds like real hatred towards the parents.

    I remember watching that documentary and wondering why parents allowed their children to be on stage if they knew there were paedophiles watching (especially as the impression given was that they recognized individuels).
    brit1981,
    Have you ever considered that the purpose of the documentary was to directly influence you with the idea that a pedophile external to the Ramsey household was responsible for her death?

    After all if you have the money and the ability to sow the seeds of doubt, why not?


    .

  14. #14
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    The pageants were an obvious area to explore. A lot of rumors came out. IMO, the perp wasn't that familiar with JBR's pageants--except possibly what he saw in the house. She was never mentioned by name in the note. The article about Access Graphic's success only a few days earlier seems to be the trigger---a beauty pageant daughter with a wealthy father had all the ingredients for a kidnapping plan. I do believe Lou Smit thought it was a pedophile.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by UKGuy View Post
    brit1981,
    Have you ever considered that the purpose of the documentary was to directly influence you with the idea that a pedophile external to the Ramsey household was responsible for her death?

    After all if you have the money and the ability to sow the seeds of doubt, why not?


    .
    There was absolutley no doubt it was designed to show it was an external intruder.

    But I think Maikai has a point. If it was not the parents, then they were the targets. The murder and note seems so full of hatred, that it could easily be someone who hated the parents and had no intention of kidnapping Jonbenet, but just wrote it in a sadistic rage hence the rambling. The strangulation and the head injuries were certainly overkill. It would be interesting to now if there were any people in the area with problems with sudden rages etc.

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