Page 5 of 23 FirstFirst 123456789101112131415 ... LastLast
Results 101 to 125 of 553

Thread: Penn State Sandusky Trial #12 (GUILTY-post verdict discussion)

  1. #101
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    5,739
    Quote Originally Posted by LaLaw2000 View Post
    Well, I still believe in what I wrote in my post. Why didn't McQueary stop JS the moment he saw what was happening? All he did was leave a child victim in the hands of a child rapist in the shower, IMO. He left. He called his Dad, then they told Paterno the next morning, IIRC. That young boy was failed at every level.
    I think because McQueary was in a complete state of shock. The act obviously stopped. We've even heard from Dranov as to McQueary's state when he told his father, who said the same thing.

    As for McQueary could have been 'hired away' at some point, McQueary was exactly where he wanted to be, IMO. Penn State. He probably would have never left. His aspirations were most likely to be the new Paterno when Paterno left. It is my opinion that McQueary knows even more than what he has said.

    Until someone offers him a lot of money to go someplace, and maybe a better chance to become a head coach. In 2001, Paterno wasn't making any noises about retiring. He'd already outlasted one "successor," Sandusky.

    Jay Paterno was also in the program, and the logical successor. The timing isn't right either, as noted.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

  2. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to J. J. in Phila For This Useful Post:


  3. #102
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    784
    Quote Originally Posted by Pensfan View Post
    It's possible that one of Shultz', Raykovitz', Curley, and/or Spanier's defense attorney(s) spread this info to place all the blame on the dead guy who can't defend himself. Yep, all their clients wanted to do the "right thing", but most evil JoePa coerced them not to do the right thing.

    (Remember the putrid actions of Jerry's defense attorneys? They gave Matt S's tape describing his embarrassing abuse to the Today Show without his permission in an attempt to punish him and make it appear that he was a horrid liar. MS finally was able to admit he was also sexually abused after his grand jury testimony had occurred.)
    It wouldn't shock me to learn Schultz's attorney leaked the email. Based on his grand jury testimony, Schultz thought Curley had implemented the steps he suggested in his email, including reporting the incident to an outside agency. I can't say Schultz was entirely convincing, since he couldn't even name the agency, but it does give him a little separation from the rest of the Penn State 4.

    As for as blaming the dead guy who can't defend himself, I wouldn't worry about Paterno -- he's got legions of defenders.

  4. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to BigCat For This Useful Post:


  5. #103
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    293
    BigCat: How would Schultz' atty have gotten those 2001 emails?

    In 2004 there was a system change at PSU. Spanier thought that all the data (well, at least the emails) prior to that had been lost. Then, recently, it was determined that it was recoverable. So, it had been backed up prior to installing the new system.

    And, it was turned over to the Atty Gen. That's why Spanier is now suing PSU. He wants his email traffic for the years 1998-2004. So he can refresh his memory when he cooperates with the Freeh investigation, he said.

    So, Atty Gen has the emails. That man who was fired in the past few months over some related issue might have had them--at least Curley's--perhaps printed out. What does Freeh have and where did he get it?

    And how would anybody's atty have the emails in question at this juncture?

  6. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to pinktoes For This Useful Post:


  7. #104
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    293
    Mark Sherburne is the man i was referencing who was fired at PSU. His wife also works there. She does/did some coordinating of programs related to TSM. For a refresher on the details, it's at:

    http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/ind...thletic_2.html

    Wait a minute, do Curley and Schultz have the same atty? If so, and IF Curley has a copy of those emails, then that's how Schultz's atty would've gotten them. Even if they have different attys, they could share evidence with each other.
    Last edited by pinktoes; 07-02-2012 at 09:49 AM. Reason: add last para

  8. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to pinktoes For This Useful Post:


  9. #105
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    784
    Quote Originally Posted by pinktoes View Post
    BigCat: How would Schultz' atty have gotten those 2001 emails?

    In 2004 there was a system change at PSU. Spanier thought that all the data (well, at least the emails) prior to that had been lost. Then, recently, it was determined that it was recoverable. So, it had been backed up prior to installing the new system.

    And, it was turned over to the Atty Gen. That's why Spanier is now suing PSU. He wants his email traffic for the years 1998-2004. So he can refresh his memory when he cooperates with the Freeh investigation, he said.

    So, Atty Gen has the emails. That man who was fired in the past few months over some related issue might have had them--at least Curley's--perhaps printed out. What does Freeh have and where did he get it?

    And how would anybody's atty have the emails in question at this juncture?
    If he has them, then he got them from his client. I thought Schultz received a copy of the emails he did not send himself. I know if I was recommending going to an outside agency, I would have kept as much documentation as possible. Just a guess on my part.

  10. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to BigCat For This Useful Post:


  11. #106
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    5,739
    Quote Originally Posted by pinktoes View Post
    BigCat: How would Schultz' atty have gotten those 2001 emails?
    The "secret file" was in Schultz's Office.

    Further, they might have gotten them on discovery.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

  12. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to J. J. in Phila For This Useful Post:


  13. #107
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    5,739
    A call for a special prosecutor to investigate both Corbett's conduct and Gricar's 1998 decision:

    http://www.pennlive.com/editorials/i...ecutor_in.html


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

  14. The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to J. J. in Phila For This Useful Post:


  15. #108
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    293
    So...it was Curley/Schultz' atty who leaked those recent emails to CNN? They have a hearing coming up in mid-July, related to their Aug trial.

  16. #109
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    51
    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    I was referring to two separate victims.
    You've referred to "B.K." as a victim in past posts as well, but the GJ presentment was very careful NOT to identify the victims by anything other than their initials:
    "Victim 6, who is now 24 years old, was acquainted with Victim 5 and another young boy inThe Second Mile program, B.K.; their interaction with Sandusky overlapped."
    I think "B.K." is listed as he is since he corroborated part of Victim 6' story, but was a minor at the time. If he were a victim, he would have been assigned a number.
    Using initials on message boards is a slippery slope, especially when referring to victims and even worse when getting it wrong.

  17. #110
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    5,739
    Quote Originally Posted by BennyProfane View Post
    You've referred to "B.K." as a victim in past posts as well, but the GJ presentment was very careful NOT to identify the victims by anything other than their initials:
    "Victim 6, who is now 24 years old, was acquainted with Victim 5 and another young boy inThe Second Mile program, B.K.; their interaction with Sandusky overlapped."
    I think "B.K." is listed as he is since he corroborated part of Victim 6' story, but was a minor at the time. If he were a victim, he would have been assigned a number.
    Using initials on message boards is a slippery slope, especially when referring to victims and even worse when getting it wrong.
    First, "B. K." is how he is identified in the public grand jury report. I have no idea if those are his actual initials or not. They might have discussing how to identify him after getting take out at a Burger King for all I know. I have no idea if your real name is Benny or not either.

    B. K. was subjected to similar treatment by Sandusky as Victim 6. He was known in 1998, but in 2011 he was overseas in the military and could not testify. That is why there were not 11 victims and he was not called. The statute of limitations has not expired on the incident and Sandusky might yet face charges relating to B. K.
    Last edited by J. J. in Phila; 07-02-2012 at 01:54 PM.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

  18. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to J. J. in Phila For This Useful Post:


  19. #111
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    285
    http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/ind...no_fans_m.html

    "Patriot-News Capital Bureau Chief Jan Murphy had simultaneously been trying to get an answer out of Spanier — via email, his preferred avenue of correspondence — about what he knew of any improper conduct by Sandusky. On the afternoon of Sept. 16, 2010, she forwarded me this exchange:

    Murphy: “Hi — Are you aware of any police investigation into Jerry Sandusky for suspected criminal activity that occurred while he was a Penn State employee? If so, can you elaborate on what you know. Thanks.”

    Spanier: “I haven’t heard this. Can you tell me more?”

    Murphy: “By ‘this,’ you are referring to any police investigation into Jerry Sandusky, correct?”

    Spanier: “Correct.”

    Murphy: “One more clarifying question on your statement. Are you aware of any suspected criminal behavior that Jerry Sandusky engaged in while he was a Penn State employee?”

    Spanier: “I think I answered your question. The answer is ‘no.’ ”


    Ganim wasn't working alone...

  20. The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to StellarsJay For This Useful Post:


  21. #112
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Somewhere over the rainbow
    Posts
    2,506
    Quote Originally Posted by LaLaw2000 View Post
    Well, I still believe in what I wrote in my post. Why didn't McQueary stop JS the moment he saw what was happening? All he did was leave a child victim in the hands of a child rapist in the shower, IMO. He left. He called his Dad, then they told Paterno the next morning, IIRC. That young boy was failed at every level.

    As for McQueary could have been 'hired away' at some point, McQueary was exactly where he wanted to be, IMO. Penn State. He probably would have never left. His aspirations were most likely to be the new Paterno when Paterno left. It is my opinion that McQueary knows even more than what he has said.

    Just my thoughts and opinion. It's cool for each of us to have a differing opinion.

    MOO
    Amen and hallelujah. McQueary was in his late 20s and a division 1 (D1) college quarterback who by size alone could easily overpower Sandusky. A D1 quarterback (who started every game of his senior season) has to know how to think quickly and react quickly. He "slammed his locker shut" to stop it? Please. And what must have been going through the poor victim's head? He must have thought it was someone who could save him. Too bad the person who showed up was spineless. I'm not buying what McQueary is selling. He is a coward. IMO
    "The word which God has written on the brow of every man is Hope." - Victor Hugo

    "Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle." - Plato


    Everything I post is my opinion only, but it is both my God given and Constitutionally protected right to do so!

  22. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Mama-cita For This Useful Post:


  23. #113
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    7,474
    Quote Originally Posted by pinktoes View Post
    BigCat: How would Schultz' atty have gotten those 2001 emails?

    In 2004 there was a system change at PSU. Spanier thought that all the data (well, at least the emails) prior to that had been lost. Then, recently, it was determined that it was recoverable. So, it had been backed up prior to installing the new system.

    And, it was turned over to the Atty Gen. That's why Spanier is now suing PSU. He wants his email traffic for the years 1998-2004. So he can refresh his memory when he cooperates with the Freeh investigation, he said.

    So, Atty Gen has the emails. That man who was fired in the past few months over some related issue might have had them--at least Curley's--perhaps printed out. What does Freeh have and where did he get it?

    And how would anybody's atty have the emails in question at this juncture?
    I don't know, but one of the articles I read last night (sorry, no link) stated that one of the victim's attorneys had READ the emails. Exaggeration? I don't know that either.

    Perhaps smelling settlement $$$, the attorneys for Curley, Moe, and /or Larry are sharing the emails with the victims' attorneys.
    Last edited by Pensfan; 07-02-2012 at 03:25 PM.

  24. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Pensfan For This Useful Post:


  25. #114
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    7,474
    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    A call for a special prosecutor to investigate both Corbett's conduct and Gricar's 1998 decision:


    http://www.pennlive.com/editorials/i...ecutor_in.html

    There is a bit of bias in this article, but others without knowledge of PA's history of questionable AGs might find it interesting.
    https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...eW6msuNKC2p1zg

  26. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Pensfan For This Useful Post:


  27. #115
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,022
    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    I don't think he would have been shocked if he was aware of Victim 6/B. K.

    He would have had time to process it by the conversation with Curley.
    I've posted before that what MM interpreted as 'shock', in that he said JP slumped back in his chair and looked stunned, could also be that JP WAS stunned, to learn that here these allegations were again after 1998, when he knew JS had been investigated and hopefully scared off abusing children, even though he was not charged. JS was at least out of the football program and JP thought his own involvement was over. Now, here is it again and happened in HIS program's quarters with an independent witness that did still work for him...it would be known, discussed, what to do to get it away from me and my program?...who can I trust to handle it? Why now, why me??

    To me, this is just as plausible a scenario as him being just 'shocked'. IMO

    Quote Originally Posted by Rlaub44 View Post
    I have been wondering the same thing JJ. I also noted the wording in Curley's e-mail - "After giving it more thought and talking it over with Joe"; as if the second thoughts about the plan occurred before the conversation with Paterno.

    This whole thing is horrific - Central PA Gothic to be sure - but I wish I knew exactly how this happened. In any case, it was a horrible decision and a terrible lack of judgment by people who should have known better, especially if, as we now have heard, they sought legal advice before choosing Plan B.
    BBM - However, even the way you put it with the 2nd thoughts by Curley coming first (about changing the plan) and then the convo with Paterno possibly running those changes by him, he still indicates no argument from Paterno about the changes and indicates he is on board, as J. J. also said.

    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    Well, I think you need evidence that he knew. It is possible, certainly, but possible isn't the same as, "It happened."
    I fully understand that. I never stated 'it happened' this way. Did you and others miss that in my post it was explained this was a process of deduction I was making from the available information and that it was IMO? I think that's allowed here, right?

    [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8106668&postcount=66"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Penn State Sandusky Trial #12 (GUILTY-post verdict discussion)[/ame]

    Quote Originally Posted by pinktoes View Post
    BigCat: How would Schultz' atty have gotten those 2001 emails?

    In 2004 there was a system change at PSU. Spanier thought that all the data (well, at least the emails) prior to that had been lost. Then, recently, it was determined that it was recoverable. So, it had been backed up prior to installing the new system.

    And, it was turned over to the Atty Gen. That's why Spanier is now suing PSU. He wants his email traffic for the years 1998-2004. So he can refresh his memory when he cooperates with the Freeh investigation, he said.

    So, Atty Gen has the emails. That man who was fired in the past few months over some related issue might have had them--at least Curley's--perhaps printed out. What does Freeh have and where did he get it?

    And how would anybody's atty have the emails in question at this juncture?
    From their clients? It's very possible various ones involved, seems Schultz most possible since he supposedly has the 'secret file', copied all the emails written between the 3 of them, as a record and protection in the future. They all obviously knew this was a very sticky situation and might come back to bite them in the butt later on, which it did and has.

    Been there, done that...when I was a state admin, used to copy a lot of emails between my boss and myself regarding various cases being worked on in the district offices, as he waved with the wind and HIS bosses, and liked to delete his emails so he could have deniability. I did it for the same reasons, a record and protection/proof of what he had earlier agreed to and/or told me to do.
    Last edited by Reader; 07-02-2012 at 03:44 PM. Reason: correct curley to schultz

  28. The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to Reader For This Useful Post:


  29. #116
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,022
    Quote Originally Posted by Pensfan View Post

    There is a bit of bias in this article, but others without knowledge of PA's history of questionable AGs might find it interesting.
    https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...eW6msuNKC2p1zg
    Read and saved....very interesting...thanks!

  30. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Reader For This Useful Post:


  31. #117
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,022
    Paterno family: Release all emails and records

    http://www.centurylink.net/news/read...org%3E&ps=1011

    STATE COLLEGE, Pa. (AP) Joe Paterno's family is calling on the Pennsylvania attorney general and former FBI Director Louis Freeh to release all emails and records related to their investigations into the Penn State child sex abuse scandal.
    ------

    CNN reported one email outlined a change in plans among administrators after Athletic Director Tim Curley spoke to Paterno.

    Short article....

  32. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Reader For This Useful Post:


  33. #118
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    7,022
    2001 Penn State Officials Discussed Jerry Sandusky With Lawyers For 3 Hours

    http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-footbal...rup/in/2304037

    That's three hours of lawyering, at least two rounds of emails, at least one meeting with accuser Mike McQueary, one apparent meeting with Joe Paterno and a potential eventual sit-down with Sandusky himself, but not a single phone call to police or child welfare authorities. Unsurprisingly, Curley and Schultz face perjury charges.
    Little more at link....

  34. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Reader For This Useful Post:


  35. #119
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Canada "A"
    Posts
    7,894
    This case is/was relatively simple. I'm glad the jury saw that. If we take away all of the grandeur of Penn State, the positions held, those who held them, football etc. etc. It's simple. Jerry Sandusky is a Pedophile who raped young boys while some chose to allow it. Now on to who turned a blind eye
    All posts are my opinion only unless supported by a link
    Keep calm and carry on

  36. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to Bravo For This Useful Post:


  37. #120
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    5,739
    Quote Originally Posted by Reader View Post
    Read and saved....very interesting...thanks!
    As soon as you start citing Keisling, you lose me completely.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

  38. #121
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    5,739
    Quote Originally Posted by Reader View Post
    Paterno family: Release all emails and records

    http://www.centurylink.net/news/read...org%3E&ps=1011

    STATE COLLEGE, Pa. (AP) Joe Paterno's family is calling on the Pennsylvania attorney general and former FBI Director Louis Freeh to release all emails and records related to their investigations into the Penn State child sex abuse scandal.
    ------

    CNN reported one email outlined a change in plans among administrators after Athletic Director Tim Curley spoke to Paterno.

    Short article....
    Be careful what you wish for, you might get it.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

  39. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to J. J. in Phila For This Useful Post:


  40. #122
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    NYC transplant to rural PA
    Posts
    2,527
    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    Be careful what you wish for, you might get it.
    I look at it like a bandage over hairy skin. Just rip it off, as soon as possible and as fast as possible, so it gets the pain over and done in one big jolt. I think both Paterno's supporters and family members need this to happen!
    "Nobody's ever completely given peace a chance before, Ghandi tried it, Martin Luther King tried it, and they were shot...". - John Lennon

  41. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to elmomom For This Useful Post:


  42. #123
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Somewhere over the rainbow
    Posts
    2,506
    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    Be careful what you wish for, you might get it.
    And it may not be the result they hope for. But maybe they know Joe didn't use email and would would take it as vindication that there is no paper "proof" that Joe acted improperly, only the words of Curley and Spanier?
    "The word which God has written on the brow of every man is Hope." - Victor Hugo

    "Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle." - Plato


    Everything I post is my opinion only, but it is both my God given and Constitutionally protected right to do so!

  43. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Mama-cita For This Useful Post:


  44. #124
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Canada "A"
    Posts
    7,894
    Quote Originally Posted by elmomom View Post
    I look at it like a bandage over hairy skin. Just rip it off, as soon as possible and as fast as possible, so it gets the pain over and done in one big jolt. I think both Paterno's supporters and family members need this to happen!
    I agree. Who knows what may have been said on his deathbed. Regardless thankfully there are people who choose to accept the true rather than live with a despicable lie.
    All posts are my opinion only unless supported by a link
    Keep calm and carry on

  45. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Bravo For This Useful Post:


  46. #125
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    5,739
    Quote Originally Posted by Mama-cita View Post
    And it may not be the result they hope for. But maybe they know Joe didn't use email and would would take it as vindication that there is no paper "proof" that Joe acted improperly, only the words of Curley and Spanier?
    Curley, Schultz, and Spanier, and maybe a few others from 1998.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

  47. The Following User Says Thank You to J. J. in Phila For This Useful Post:


Page 5 of 23 FirstFirst 123456789101112131415 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Penn State Sandusky Trial #11 (Verdict - GUILTY!)
    By ynotdivein in forum Jerry Sandusky General Discussion threads
    Replies: 2358
    Last Post: 06-30-2012, 02:09 PM
  2. Penn State Sandusky Trial #10
    By ynotdivein in forum Jerry Sandusky General Discussion threads
    Replies: 1211
    Last Post: 06-21-2012, 01:46 PM
  3. Penn State Sandusky scandal: AD arrested, Paterno, Spanier fired; coverup charged #7
    By wfgodot in forum Jerry Sandusky General Discussion threads
    Replies: 589
    Last Post: 02-10-2012, 07:03 PM
  4. Penn State Sandusky scandal: AD arrested, Paterno, Spanier fired; coverup charged #4
    By wfgodot in forum Jerry Sandusky General Discussion threads
    Replies: 602
    Last Post: 11-29-2011, 03:06 PM
  5. Penn State Sandusky scandal: AD arrested, Paterno, Spanier fired; coverup charged #3
    By wfgodot in forum Jerry Sandusky General Discussion threads
    Replies: 590
    Last Post: 11-21-2011, 11:22 AM

Tags for this Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •