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Thread: Penn State Sandusky Trial #12 (GUILTY-post verdict discussion)

  1. #201
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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    And, as always:

    Central Pennsylvania Gothic.

    It keeps on getting worse. Even if the Three Stooges were acting out of completely altruistic purposes, really thought they were being "humane," it blew up in their faces. Good Lord, even saying that they wanted Sandusky to get help doesn't mean anything if he doesn't get any help.

    Maybe, this could be at least partly justifiable if someone would have forced him to get help, and made sure he wasn't around young boys.

    (Yes, I'm in full rant today!)
    What gets me is that these 3 men all knew about 1998 and 2001, and Paterno we know knew about 2001 and maybe 1998, but until 2009, I believe, when Sandusky found out he was being investigated, for 8 years, they still saw him around boys at the school, the hotels, the games, even out of state games, and never stopped to think what was going on, never asked, never got involved again, knowing what they knew about him.

    What happened to the follow up they emailed about? Why did they take no action all those 8 years when they saw he was still behaving the same way with boys? Where was their concern for the children? Where was their concern for their own jobs if this came out? Where were their brains? Where was their thinking? Surely they had all realized if the situation became public this would be against them and the school...they acknowledged this before so why did they just stop being concerned about it after 2001? It's like they just put it in the back of their minds and used some magical thinking to dismiss it.

    2002 - no more complaints about JS, we got by another year
    2003 - ditto
    2004 - ditto
    2005 - ditto
    2006 - ditto
    2007 - ditto
    2008 - ditto
    2009 - oops, holy cow!
    2010 - I'd love to see the emails for that year as they prepared to testity

    No, they are not stupid men, in fact, very smart and well educated, but they made a very, very stupid decision and then stupidly stuck with it all those years without any concern about what JS was still doing with the boys, or even for their own jobs and school. Just frickin' unbelievable and they deserve whatever happens to them AFAIC.

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  3. #202
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    Jerry Sandusky evaluation will aid judge in sentencing

    http://www.centredaily.com/2012/06/2...valuation.html

    BELLEFONTE — Centre County Office of Probation workers soon will begin putting together Jerry Sandusky’s presentence investigation, a report that will aid the judge in sentencing the former Penn State defensive coach.

    Thomas Young, the office’s director, said the report will include information on the range of prison time that each count carries, charging documents such as the grand jury’s presentment, any restitution owed, any psychological or psychiatric reports, Sandusky’s version of events if he chooses to offer one, and statements from the victims if they choose to offer them.

    The office has 90 days to compile the presentence investigation report.
    -------

    “I expect to see a majority of the young men who testified at trial present again at sentencing,” said Tom Kline, the Philadelphia attorney representing a 23-year-old man known as victim 5.

    “The commitment of the victims has been exemplar. I expect my client to participate in the sentencing phase.”

    Sandusky was also ordered to be evaluated by the state Sexual Offenders Assessment Board to determine if he’s a sexually violent predator.

    Read more here: http://www.centredaily.com/2012/06/2...#storylink=cpy

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  5. #203
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reader View Post
    What gets me is that these 3 men all knew about 1998 and 2001, and Paterno we know knew about 2001 and maybe 1998, but until 2009, I believe, when Sandusky found out he was being investigated, for 8 years, they still saw him around boys at the school, the hotels, the games, even out of state games, and never stopped to think what was going on, never asked, never got involved again, knowing what they knew about him.
    I don't know if Curley knew about 1998 in 1998. He knew about by 2001. Paterno obviously knew about 2001, and knew that Sandusky was involved in a children's charity. And if Raykovitz knew, my God!

    How many failures were there?


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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  7. #204
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    "As The Second Mile’s CEO Jack Raykovitz testified to the grand jury, he was informed in 2002 by Pennsylvania State University Athletic Director Tim Curley that an individual had reported to Mr. Curley that he was uncomfortable about seeing Jerry Sandusky in the locker room shower with a youth. Mr. Curley also shared that the information had been internally reviewed and that there was no finding of wrongdoing. At no time was The Second Mile made aware of the very serious allegations contained in the grand jury report."
    Second Mile's Press release
    http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/ind...ses_a_sta.html
    Nov 7, 2011

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  9. #205
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    http://www.centredaily.com/2011/09/0.../why-july.html

    I wrote that blog last September. I'm wondering if we'll see some additional fireworks this July.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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  11. #206
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    Quote Originally Posted by StellarsJay View Post
    "As The Second Mile’s CEO Jack Raykovitz testified to the grand jury, he was informed in 2002 by Pennsylvania State University Athletic Director Tim Curley that an individual had reported to Mr. Curley that he was uncomfortable about seeing Jerry Sandusky in the locker room shower with a youth. Mr. Curley also shared that the information had been internally reviewed and that there was no finding of wrongdoing. At no time was The Second Mile made aware of the very serious allegations contained in the grand jury report."
    Second Mile's Press release
    http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/ind...ses_a_sta.html
    Nov 7, 2011
    Well, that could be all that was reported. "No wrongdoing" is the key.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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  13. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    http://www.centredaily.com/2011/09/0.../why-july.html

    I wrote that blog last September. I'm wondering if we'll see some additional fireworks this July.
    Isn't there a grand jury meeting right now?

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  15. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCat View Post
    Isn't there a grand jury meeting right now?
    They are still in session.

    I'm sort of expecting something on TSM (Courtney) or Spanier.

    I really am not sure of the extent that they are investigating Gricar. They obviously were looking at his 1998 decision, but they may have looked and found no illegality.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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  17. #209
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    Wendell Courtnay
    November 17, 2011
    http://www.centredaily.com/2011/11/1...e-of-acts.html

    “The man who served as attorney for both Penn State and The Second Mile said that, contrary to a state grand jury report, he was never aware of a 1998 investigation into possible allegations of sexual misconduct by Jerry Sandusky.

    State College lawyer Wendell Courtney said he also never knew that then-graduate assistant Mike McQueary had told former Nittany Lions head football coach Joe Paterno about witnessing Sandusky allegedly sexually assault a boy in a Penn State shower in 2002. Paterno, according to the grand jury, in turn notified Athletic Director Tim Curley. Curley and Gary Schultz, senior vice president for finance and business, spoke with McQueary one week later.

    Courtney served as counsel for Penn State from the time he passed the bar in 1980 until 2008, all while working with the McQuaide Blasko law firm. He said in an interview he never was asked by Penn State whether police should be notified about any allegations of sexual abuse involving Sandusky.
    “Had I ever been asked, my response would have been, ‘Absolutely and immediately,’ ” Courtney said. “Had I ever had any inkling that Sandusky was engaging in behavior with children that was even remotely improper, nothing on God’s green earth would have kept me from making certain that the allegations were reported to the police authorities and thoroughly investigated.” According to the grand jury presentment: “Schultz testified that the 1998 incident was reviewed by university police and ‘the child protection agency’ with the blessing of then-university counsel Wendell Courtney. Courtney was then and remains counsel for The Second Mile.” Courtney also disputes the last sentence, saying he did not begin work for The Second Mile until April 2009.”

    So who was the lawyer who billed for consulting at the “three hour meeting” in 2001?

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  19. #210
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    Quote Originally Posted by StellarsJay View Post

    So who was the lawyer who billed for consulting at the “three hour meeting” in 2001?
    Could it be Cynthia Baldwin?

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  21. #211
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCat View Post
    Could it be Cynthia Baldwin?
    Baldwin was a judge at the time; as such, she technically was not a member of the bar and couldn't be taking clients.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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  23. #212
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    Lawyers lie sometimes to protect themselves.

    However, if ya'll want to look for a candidate other than Wendell Courtney, try Dan Bright. Another McQuaide Blasko atty, PSU/Dickinson Law grad, on TSM's Board of Directors. But i don't think so.

    Google Dan Bright McQuaide Blasko + Penn State

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  25. #213
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    CDT reporting that discovery for Curley and Schultz is looking a Courtnay.

    http://www.centredaily.com/2012/07/0...opular#wgt=pop

    (Note that the CDT in now a pay site, though you get 15 free views/month. I have to pay as well.)


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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  27. #214
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reader View Post
    What gets me is that these 3 men all knew about 1998 and 2001, and Paterno we know knew about 2001 and maybe 1998, but until 2009, I believe, when Sandusky found out he was being investigated, for 8 years, they still saw him around boys at the school, the hotels, the games, even out of state games, and never stopped to think what was going on, never asked, never got involved again, knowing what they knew about him.

    What happened to the follow up they emailed about? Why did they take no action all those 8 years when they saw he was still behaving the same way with boys? Where was their concern for the children? Where was their concern for their own jobs if this came out? Where were their brains? Where was their thinking? Surely they had all realized if the situation became public this would be against them and the school...they acknowledged this before so why did they just stop being concerned about it after 2001? It's like they just put it in the back of their minds and used some magical thinking to dismiss it.

    2002 - no more complaints about JS, we got by another year
    2003 - ditto
    2004 - ditto
    2005 - ditto
    2006 - ditto
    2007 - ditto
    2008 - ditto
    2009 - oops, holy cow!
    2010 - I'd love to see the emails for that year as they prepared to testity

    No, they are not stupid men, in fact, very smart and well educated, but they made a very, very stupid decision and then stupidly stuck with it all those years without any concern about what JS was still doing with the boys, or even for their own jobs and school. Just frickin' unbelievable and they deserve whatever happens to them AFAIC.
    It is likely Jerry Sandusky molested boys during those times when no complaints were filed. There could be complaints that we do not know of outside of Penn State.
    Last edited by HMSHood; 07-05-2012 at 12:34 PM.




    HMS Hood
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  29. #215
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    In the same e-mail, according to CNN, Mr. Curley also suggested that if Mr. Sandusky "is cooperative," Penn State "would work with him" to tell Second Mile. If not, Mr. Curley wrote, the university would inform both Second Mile and outside authorities

    http://chronicle.com/article/Records...stions/132725/


    The really horrible part is that they didn't do any of these options, it seems.

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  31. #216
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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    I don't know if Curley knew about 1998 in 1998. He knew about by 2001. Paterno obviously knew about 2001, and knew that Sandusky was involved in a children's charity. And if Raykovitz knew, my God!

    How many failures were there?
    Enough to ruin the lives of at least 10 boys and probably many more unknown to us.

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  33. #217
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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    And, as always:

    Central Pennsylvania Gothic.

    It keeps on getting worse. Even if the Three Stooges were acting out of completely altruistic purposes, really thought they were being "humane," it blew up in their faces. Good Lord, even saying that they wanted Sandusky to get help doesn't mean anything if he doesn't get any help.

    Maybe, this could be at least partly justifiable if someone would have forced him to get help, and made sure he wasn't around young boys.

    (Yes, I'm in full rant today!)
    If one wanted to keep the situation entirely confidential, they might not want Jerry to seek treatment from a therapist outside their "inner circle". If there was a convenient psychiatrist with an interest in keeping things quiet, however, who could also promise to keep Jerry away from young TSM boys, and also had his own position and salary to protect.......well, it just makes me wonder...

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  35. #218
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    Spanier asks court to overrule Penn State's objections to his lawsuit

    STATE COLLEGE — Former Penn State president Graham Spanier is asking the court to overrule the university’s objections to providing him with emails he sent that may be part of an internal university investigation.

    Spanier has filed suit against Penn State in an effort to obtain those emails, which he said he needs in order to cooperate with authorities investigating the university’s handling of child sexual abuse allegations against Jerry Sandusky.



    Read more here: http://www.centredaily.com/2012/07/0...#storylink=cpy

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  37. #219
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardymum View Post
    If one wanted to keep the situation entirely confidential, they might not want Jerry to seek treatment from a therapist outside their "inner circle". If there was a convenient psychiatrist with an interest in keeping things quiet, however, who could also promise to keep Jerry away from young TSM boys, and also had his own position and salary to protect.......well, it just makes me wonder...
    Gosh, I didn't know Dottie was a psychiatrist!

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  39. #220
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    ohiogirl: you said "The really horrible part is that they didn't do any of these options, it seems."

    Well, these people all knew each other; went to the same functions; Linette Courtney, Wendell's wife, was on TSM's Board in 1998 and Wendell was later, as well as doing pro bono work for them.

    I imagine that rather than make an "official notification" to TSM, that they simply handled it informally. Thru Courtney or someone else. Just not on Penn State letterhead, so to speak.

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  41. #221
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardymum View Post
    If one wanted to keep the situation entirely confidential, they might not want Jerry to seek treatment from a therapist outside their "inner circle". If there was a convenient psychiatrist with an interest in keeping things quiet, however, who could also promise to keep Jerry away from young TSM boys, and also had his own position and salary to protect.......well, it just makes me wonder...
    Your right! It would take a very immoral psychologist to keep this secret and endanger other little boys, but I will bet my retirement that Sandusky never sought "help". In the fixated pedo's mind, nothing is wrong with "loving" little boys and "showing them affection".

    Don't believe the pro-pedophile supporters' statistics that attempt to prove that pedophiles are very unlikely to rape/molest children after release from prison. Their desire to participate in deviant sexual behavior is a life-long problem.

    The pro-pedophile (low recidivism) studies are skewed...
    -because several studies failed to eliminate incest sickos who were no longer able to rape children because their children became adults while they were in prison.
    -because the researchers only calculated the pedophiles' crimes that caused additional incarceration (How many crimes occurred but weren't caught?)
    -because they only calculated recidivism within a very short length of time (failed to use long-term studies)
    -because some of these studies relied on the pedophiles to honestly answer the researchers' questionnaires (How many do you really think honestly answered when they were asked if they were still raping/molesting children?)

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  43. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pensfan View Post
    Your right! It would take a very immoral psychologist to keep this secret and endanger other little boys, but I will bet my retirement that Sandusky never sought "help". In the fixated pedo's mind, nothing is wrong with "loving" little boys and "showing them affection".

    I think licensed psychologist are mandatory reporters, at least as far as the victim is concerned. Dr. Chambers was, and did report it.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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  45. #223
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    Jonathan Dranov
    As of 2005, Dranov was the Assistant Chief of Medical Staff of Mount Nittany Medical Center.
    Dranov is currently a Director of the Foundation that seeks its charitable funding. It is the only hospital where Dranov has admitting privileges..
    Joe and Sue Paterno donated $1 MM to the Hospital for its new wing in 2009. The Mount Nittany fundraising foundation, headed by Dr. Jon Dranov and the Paternos, raised $9.7 million total.
    John McQueary worked there, retiring sometime after 2007. He was Chief Operating Officer/Administrative Director of the Centre Medical and Surgical Associates, which was associated with the Mt. Nittany Center and has now been absorbed into it.

    Let great men guide you, grasshopper.

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  47. #224
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    Quote Originally Posted by StellarsJay View Post
    Jonathan Dranov
    As of 2005, Dranov was the Assistant Chief of Medical Staff of Mount Nittany Medical Center.
    Dranov is currently a Director of the Foundation that seeks its charitable funding. It is the only hospital where Dranov has admitting privileges..
    Joe and Sue Paterno donated $1 MM to the Hospital for its new wing in 2009. The Mount Nittany fundraising foundation, headed by Dr. Jon Dranov and the Paternos, raised $9.7 million total.
    John McQueary worked there, retiring sometime after 2007. He was Chief Operating Officer/Administrative Director of the Centre Medical and Surgical Associates, which was associated with the Mt. Nittany Center and has now been absorbed into it.

    Let great men guide you, grasshopper.
    Dr. Dranov's specialty is internal medicine. http://foundation.mountnittany.org/a...d-of-directors

    He would not be treating Sandusky for anything related to pedophilia or be qualified to even diagnose a psychological problem. He might have had some experience with it in residency, but not that much.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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  49. #225
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    JJ, I was looking at the connection between Dranov and Paterno, not with Sandusky. I don't know how well the media quoted what Dranov told the Grand Jury but what came out initially made McQueary sound really bad. Then, at the trial, Dranov seemed to have shifted emphasis from "He told me three times he didn't see penetration/sex/whatever" to "He was shocked and shaking."
    I think Dranov's first story was very cya for himself and Paterno et al, leaving lots of room for doubt. When it became clear that a lot of people wanted Sandusky convicted, Dranov subtly switched gears, but still didn't want to show that he as a doctor should have done more to get the crime reported. I would add Dranov to the stooges and think it was very unfortunate that the McQuearys sought his advice..
    I see why you thought I was pursuing psychologists, though.

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