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  1. #1006
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Quote Originally Posted by Maigret View Post
    I think it would still go to trial if he says 'accident' as QPS probably have enough to go for premeditated not accidental JMO
    To me, if someone pleaded guilty to the lesser charge of manslaughter when they were originally charged with murder, whether a trial would go ahead or not for the higher charge would depend on how strong the evidence for the higher charge was. The reason that I say this is that I supported a friend through a murder case. Her son was murdered. When it came to the actual trial (it had been through all the committal mentions, hearings etc.), the defendant elected to plead guilty to manslaughter rather than murder. Even though the prosecution were quite convinced that it was actually murder they accepted the guilty plea for manslaughter as they felt that to go through with a trial there was a strong chance that he would be found not guilty due to the level of evidence required and the fact that the key witnesses were not strong articulate types. There was cultural issues, grief issues and some people are better at public speaking than others and this wasn't a strong point for the key witness (my friend). For the prosecution, the acceptance of the guilty plea for the lesser charge ensured that the person didn't get away with the crime even though they probably had a shorter jail term. To the prosecution that was better than the person completely getting away with it. The acceptance of the guilty plea also saved my friend (the mother of the murder victim) the grief and trauma of being cross examined in the court again at the trial. It was quite distressing for her and the court process kept bringing up all of the grief and stress of the horrid event, so in some ways it was a blessing to be spared this again.

    So, in my humble opinion, whether or not they accept a guilty plea for manslaughter instead of murder will depend on how strong the evidence that they have against the defendant is and how likely they think that the jury will favour a guilty verdict. I personally don't believe that they will accept the lesser charge if they have a strong case (meaning strong evidence, witnesses capable of testifying etc.) for the greater charge.

    Obviously this is all hypothetical as at this point in time we have no evidence to suggest that anyone is even considering pleading guilty to a lesser charge at this point in time.

    All of this is my humble and honest opinion as we wait for justice to unfold for Allison.
    Last edited by Seeking; 07-11-2012 at 07:50 AM. Reason: extra words

  2. #1007
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Townsville Qld


    Quote Originally Posted by CouchCop View Post
    I am truely baffled about the whole defence situation and how it is going to be bank-rolled. I cannot for the life of my come up with a scenario where a family member/s have access to the sort of fund a heavy-duty trial like this will run to in costs. Surely if a law firm is going to do a pro-bono case, they would have to justify to someone within the system, why they are doing a pro-bono case. (i.e. that they are absolutely and without a doubt convinced of his innocence). GBC, I would assume, would have access to support through legal-aid but he's bringing in big guns??? At some stage last week there was talk of having legal triplets represent him, but that no longer seems to be the case .... does that say that the budget for defence does have a bottom line. It was interesting that one of the legal-triplets is associated with the Griffith University "Justice Project" (Nyst). From what I've read about that, the project is about clearing the names of the wrongfully incarcerated .... "Hurricane Carter" being probably their biggest name in incarcerations that went wrong. I was fortunate in being able to attend an address that "Hurricane" gave in Brisbane circa 2004. His address was so incredibly inspiring which is why he alligned himself to the Griffith Uni Justice Project. Again, why would Nyst be so convinced of GBC's innocence to attach his interest to this case. Does it beg a question?

    If, alternatively the money is coming from some group such as the Baptist Church I would be jumping up and down in protest if I were to be a contributor to the Church. Surely the Church, or any other authority, who has in its possession funds from people with good intentions have to be accountable for how they distribute their funds.
    I'm fairly sure the Baptist Church isn't bankrolling GBC'S legal fees. Something like this would have to be approved by church members or Elders who aren't all totally gullible. I have known a number of these people over the years and most are in those positions with the right motives.

    There was a member of a Brisbane Baptist church listed as one of the people offering surety if GBC skipped bail (Dr I. Thomas) but this was his personal money (he's a wealthy specialist doctor) not church funds. Churches are run like businesses these days and they all have budgets to meet similar to retail sales targets. They have to pay their pastors, church admin workers, missionaries sent by the church and pay their bills. Huge slush funds to pay for relatives of Baptist pastors who get themselves into trouble aren't factored in to a church budget. IMO.

  3. #1008
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    up north
    This thread will be closing in 10 minutes. Please proceed to the newest thread, located at the link below:

    Thank you!

    Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #33 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
    Last edited by OkieGranny; 02-24-2016 at 01:24 PM. Reason: broken link

  4. #1009
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Quote Originally Posted by Fergie View Post
    Hi I have only posted twice as a Brookfield local with my daughter Valkarian but I have lurked affectionately and with interest since the first thread. I was disappointed when my daughter posted that she had left more flowers on Allison's fence and she was criticized as harassing Allison's daughters. If you saw the sign on the fence on the left of the flowers saying "we will miss you Allison, your parents and daughters are in our thoughts" just after Allison was found - this was Valkarian. It was prominent in the CM photos. I think Allison's daughters would have been touched to see the many expressions of shared community grief and if you knew my daughter she could never harass anyone, she is a much better person than most - kind caring and very funny. We both went to the cricket match at Brookfield showgrounds and spent up big for Allison.

    Anyhoo I am responding to a call for assistance from Curiosasacat and have been doing some sleuthing for the ABC websleuths community, I can confirm that on a very dark and rainy night you can see a car at the top of the driveway of Allison's house from the road even when the lights of the car are off so this may help us to evaluate the rumour that locals driving past the house at 11.00pm on the night that Allison was murdered saw a car with all four doors open. Had to test this rumor when my husband was at work as OH is QPS and he would not approve.

    Just 2 days before GBC was arrested I saw him at the local shops as I was waiting for someone and had to stand there as he slowly walked past and looked at me with that sullen, angry and defensive expression. He was in the Prado with the Settled number plates and the damage on the front passenger side. Creepy.

    I love following this largely warm and caring community and look forward to your company and investigative talents every day.
    Dear Fergie
    Thank you for your post and I am sorry that your daughter felt that her gesture was not appreciated.

    Your insights into the circumstance and reality around Allison's murder are very much appreciated and I hope you will stick around longer, not just to lurk.

    Welcome back!

  5. #1010
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Quote Originally Posted by Bayside View Post
    One thing I will say is that of course he thinks he is guilty lol.

    I might add too that my hubby does not tell me everything because he knows I might tell my friends lol.

    I do have the ability to snoop and I use this ability often haha. He really should learn to delete his text messages and lock his briefcase if he doesnt want me to know things lolol.
    Word is round as a hoop for it!!!!

  6. #1011
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Quote Originally Posted by Liadan View Post
    After spending a lot of time contemplating on the reading of how to conduct fraud. Basically its a free rein for an individual with their own company- they are no checks and processes that money has to be accounted for - the tax office can be held at arms length with two sets of books. (I reckon there are 15 in GBC's case!) And really these people have immigrated from Zimbabwe - so who knows what sort of offshore accounts existed for them in that country. I wouldn't be putting any money into a Rhodesian/Zim bank way too risky with government being so unstable. So perhaps this is their modus operandi because they already had these accounts established they continued to use them while in Oz. You are not allowed to bring bucket loads of cash into Oz but you can use any money you earned overseas in that country or elsewhere without the tax man needing to know about it. At least that is what I am reading.
    To me this appears as a HUGE tax minimization scheme. I am thinking quite a bit of the company money was siphoned off to an account overseas that was kept armslength for the Australian business. Then perhaps the overseas company bought the property and the shares etc seemingly untouched by the BC's? The link to Canada is also strong - do they have accounts there for when they visit Adam?

    Also I don't think lawyers would mind picking up wads of cash in instalments or having an overseas credit card to spend up big in Bora Bora or the Bahamas if indeed there was the overseas bank account that the BC's could use to fund the defence for GBC. This is the fight of his life. There is going to be no greater need for the money than to fight for his freedom so it is a wise choice now to pull out all stops for the defence lawyers.

    Please note that absolutely none of this is FACT AT ALL - it is just my musings and my humble opinion!
    Yes and that is why the forensic accounting process can take so long. A very good friend of mine is a forensic accountant in the CMC. Nothing to do with this case but the inquiries into the Gordon Nuttall & Ken Talbot case took a LONG time to unravel. These people, the BC family no doubt have a web of accounts as many business people do. However they had accountants & financial advisors who'd have to assist. Records subpoenaed I'd imagine going back quite some way.

    The thing to remember is that for every circumstantial case such as this the over-riding thing that is paramount is:


    circumstantial or not the question that remains for BC legal team to work on will be trying to disprove that GBC would appear to be the only person who beyond reasonable doubt was likely involved in this sad case that could have potentially murdered ABC.

    Ie. If he didn't do it then who else had means, opportunity & motive?

    Unless she DID walk late at night or very early the next morning then the logical conclusion is foul play at home. It's just a little too convenient to think that if she walked out that night, hair done and all that, that someone was there and that a very rare and highly opportunistic monent arrived resulting in killing someone randomly.

    So, who else could have done it? Someone will be accountable. Her autopsy will speak loudly, perhaps so will the forensic accountants findings.

    Lastly. If GBC remains adamant he was not involved then WHO does HE think ended his angels life? He'd have rolled on TM, NBC would not have M.O.M. one would think & I doubt ABC would kill herself.

    Suspect lists are narrowed. Until there is only 1 person (+ possible accessory) that had had M.O.M.. It was the same with Sica. Dead people speak really loudly when foul play is at hand.

    I would not like to be in GBCs position at all. Unless something truly startling and very strange indeed pops up to seriously lead jurors to believe GBC wasn't involved and someone else had M.O.M. then his odds aren't that great seemingly. He can say he didn't do it, wasn't involved till the cows come home. Fact remains someone did this and he appears to have a huge amount of M.O.M at this time and no one else does.

    All of this is my own opinion & surmising. It is not fact just what I think. Take it or leave it😊

  7. #1012
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    up north
    Closing now!

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