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    All things Joe Paterno

    Maybe we can start a thread on JoPa as things develop. I am stunned by this:

    http://news.yahoo.com/paterno-family...5564--nfl.html

    Why is it I suspect this is the motivation?

    Paterno's estate could be sued for damages by victims of Sandusky's abuse, according to legal experts.
    I am intrigued at the "demand" that Freeh's group, hired by Penn State, preserve their notes.

    Why shouldnt the Paterno's start from scratch if they believe it to be inaccurate? That puzzles me, fwiw, and makes all of this look even more like a PR ploy. JMVHO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by believe09 View Post
    Maybe we can start a thread on JoPa as things develop. I am stunned by this:

    http://news.yahoo.com/paterno-family...5564--nfl.html

    Why is it I suspect this is the motivation?



    I am intrigued at the "demand" that Freeh's group, hired by Penn State, preserve their notes.

    Why shouldnt the Paterno's start from scratch if they believe it to be inaccurate? That puzzles me, fwiw, and makes all of this look even more like a PR ploy. JMVHO.
    It appears from the 'demand' that Paterno's family doesn't so much want to launch their own proble but to go through Freeh's report and try and dismantle all things related to Paterno.

    Chances are they want to restate any blame which was directed at JoPa and place it on everybody else.

    The fact that the Paterno family continues in this quest has to be creating chaos on the Administration and Trustees at Penn State.

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    I would be interested in a psychological profile on Joe Paterno, Graham Spanier, Tim Curley, and Gary Schultz. I can imagine they are enablers as they are obsessed with power and control. Paterno is probably a lot like Cindy Anthony.




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    o/t a wee bit, but I never thought, when I started the first Jerry Sandusky thread, that events would spiral in the direction they've gone. But spiral they have, to the cover-up involving Penn State administrators and, ultimately, Joe Paterno, and to the conviction of Jerry Sandusky, pedophile. (And thank you to all WS-ers + mods who did lots of work to make the Sandusky et al. case a forum in Featured Case Discussion - gratifying, and a first in my book!)

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    Yeah, I don't think they can make any demands of the Freeh Group. I thought the Paterno's weren't afraid of the truth? Guess as long as it was THEIR TRUTH, they weren't. They are vile people. :/

    I didn't think anyone could look worse than Sandusky, the actual monster but I was wrong. Evidently the Paterno family wants to look as bad or worse. Just accept it and move on. Paterno wasn't the Vaunted Saint his image claimed. He did wrong by these kids. Just admit it. Years from now it'll be part of the narrative on Paterno but odds are people will remember the many good things he did too but by continuing to deny, by continuing to blame everyone else and pass the buck, they just make JoePa look worse. Much worse.

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    Much ado over the JoePa statue of course. Deadspin's Drew Magary takes a look at an important aspect....

    No One Is Currently Guarding The Joe Paterno Statue

    ---
    Anyway, with everyone fighting over the fate of the statue, I thought to myself: Hey, shouldn't someone be guarding that thing? What's to keep an aspiring Bart Simpson from sneaking out in the dead of night and taking a hacksaw to that statue's neckline? Surely, someone at PSU would want that JoePa statue protected at all costs. So I decided to call the university and see if anyone was in charge of standing between bronze JoePa and hurled feces.
    ---
    the rest at the link

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    Quote Originally Posted by wfgodot View Post
    Much ado over the JoePa statue of course. Deadspin's Drew Magary takes a look at an important aspect....

    No One Is Currently Guarding The Joe Paterno Statue


    the rest at the link
    Oh, now that wasnt a good idea. Nothing like making a suggestion to folks...

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    Paternoville, a student encampment formed prior to home games, has had its name changed to Nittanyville by the students.

    http://www.centredaily.com/2012/07/1...oville-to.html


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    Here's an article on Paterno from 1987.

    IN THE WORLD OF COLLEGE ATHLETICS . . . : HE'S NOT AN AVERAGE JOE : Paterno Wants to Win--and Usually Does--but What Sets Him Apart From Many Football Coaches Is That He Won't Put Game Ahead of Academics, Integrity

    http://articles.latimes.com/1987-05-..._1_joe-paterno

    Paterno has plenty to say on a variety of topics.

    --SMU: "It's unbelievable to think that kind of corruption came right from the top of the power structure. The NCAA did what it had to do" in canceling SMU's 1988 football season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCat View Post
    Here's an article on Paterno from 1987.

    IN THE WORLD OF COLLEGE ATHLETICS . . . : HE'S NOT AN AVERAGE JOE : Paterno Wants to Win--and Usually Does--but What Sets Him Apart From Many Football Coaches Is That He Won't Put Game Ahead of Academics, Integrity

    http://articles.latimes.com/1987-05-..._1_joe-paterno
    Oh, the ironininny.
    No comment.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCat View Post
    Here's an article on Paterno from 1987.

    IN THE WORLD OF COLLEGE ATHLETICS . . . : HE'S NOT AN AVERAGE JOE : Paterno Wants to Win--and Usually Does--but What Sets Him Apart From Many Football Coaches Is That He Won't Put Game Ahead of Academics, Integrity

    http://articles.latimes.com/1987-05-..._1_joe-paterno
    Prescient quote:

    "He makes decisions based on what's best for the business, not necessarily the individual."

    Ya THINK?
    No comment.

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    Oh thanks again Big Cat for posting that article. It's full of gems given what we know now. Too many to post.
    No comment.

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    Phil Sheridan: Paterno, not Sandusky, brought down Paterno's legacy

    http://articles.philly.com/2012-07-1...aham-b-spanier

    Joe Paterno's reputation was not destroyed by Jerry Sandusky. His legacy was not permanently stained by Louis Freeh.

    It was Paterno who ruined Paterno. That was the painful and unavoidable message contained in Freeh's blistering report, which was released Thursday morning.

    Paterno knew as far back as 1998 that Sandusky was being investigated for possible child abuse. He never took actions to stop his longtime assistant coach, never reported him outside the Penn State bubble. Worst of all, there is evidence Paterno persuaded other university officials not to report Sandusky in 2001.

    Sandusky's victims were the children he raped and abused. The men who shielded him - Paterno, Graham B. Spanier, Tim Curley, and Gary Schultz - were victims only of their own arrogance and failure to do even the most fundamentally decent things when given the chance. That arrogance and failure allowed Sandusky to victimize more innocent children.

    More at link.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by IzzyBlanche View Post
    Oh thanks again Big Cat for posting that article. It's full of gems given what we know now. Too many to post.
    Sorry to quote my own post, but here's a beaut:

    "I don't think I ever put winning a football game ahead of what was best for a kid."

    No comment.

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    Paterno family still doesn't get it
    Review of Freeh report unneeded, won't help coach's legacy

    http://espn.go.com/college-football/...eport-unneeded

    The Paterno family's announcement Monday that they're hiring their own experts to do a comprehensive "review" of the Freeh report that scathingly fingered Joe Paterno as part of a cover-up that allowed suspected child molester Jerry Sandusky to operate for years is yet another bald attempt to put preserving Paterno's legacy as a football coach above all else. In other words, it reeks of the same sort of hubris and misplaced priorities that led to so many grotesque things happening at Penn State in the first place.

    The family's promise to avenge the dismantling of their late patriarch's reputation, no matter how long it takes, is also sure to draw mocking comparisons to the credibility problem O.J. Simpson battled when he vowed to find the "real" killer of Nicole Brown Simpson. ................

    The footing to make unilateral pronouncements or demands in Paterno's name is gone now, but the Paterno family hasn't gotten the message.

    It's as if they're behaving on muscle memory based on years of watching Joe operate.

    More at link....

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    note to Paterno family, if it isnt CLEAR to you that Joepa was a LIAR, then read Sally Jenkins July 12 article in the Washington Post:

    she makes the point that Joe LIED about knowing anything at all about the 1998 investigations, and that he lied to her on national TV. The Freeh report revealed that he knew ALL about it.

    of course your lawyers and "experts" may want to quibble with whether or not "Joe" meant Paterno, or "coach" mean coach Paterno or they may want to make all kinds of courtroom accusations and innuendos to try and obscure what is obvious to everyone else, but this is the court of public opinion, and in this court common sense prevails, not lawyer tricks.

    so, too bad.
    IF I PUT IT HERE ITS MY OPINION. apparently i have no idea when i need to say that in a post, so this should cover it....IN MY OPINION anyways,

    welcome to the gates of hell JVDS.




    Jose Baez: “I sincerely believe that when we have finally spoken, everyone, and I mean everyone, will sit back and say, ‘Now, I understand. That explains it.’”



    Jose Baez to da judge :

    ".....that type of testing is unique. we requested that they be allowed to test items and that of course was objected to by the state and and uh the state uh granted or sustained their objection, denied our opportunity to have him test these items due to a very specialized field, subfield, of dna that he is one of the pioneers of uh in the alternative of we were granted the ability to test certain items by an outside lab...."

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    Quote Originally Posted by costalpilot View Post
    note to Paterno family, if it isnt CLEAR to you that Joepa was a LIAR, then read Sally Jenkins July 12 article in the Washington Post:

    she makes the point that Joe LIED about knowing anything at all about the 1998 investigations, and that he lied to her on national TV. The Freeh report revealed that he knew ALL about it.

    of course your lawyers and "experts" may want to quibble with whether or not "Joe" meant Paterno, or "coach" mean coach Paterno or they may want to make all kinds of courtroom accusations and innuendos to try and obscure what is obvious to everyone else, but this is the court of public opinion, and in this court common sense prevails, not lawyer tricks.

    so, too bad.
    Well, those references to Paterno prevailed with Louis Freeh and that's enough for me and most people...they need to give it up......

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    There is no way that Paterno didn't know what was going on. He knew... and he allowed those children a horrid abuse. I'm wondering what type of pervert he was that he could turn his back on those children while his "friend", his "assistant coach" could do such a monsterous thing.

    “Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.” Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sr.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reader View Post
    Well, those references to Paterno prevailed with Louis Freeh and that's enough for me and most people...they need to give it up......
    your exactly correct...spent a little time at the pennlive comment thread last night where over 270 Central Pennsylvanians commented on the Paterno's pathetic attempts at legacy retoration. it isnt pretty for them, at all. The overwhelming response there is for them to just shut up. pretty much everyone but the true die hard joepa cool aid drinker realizes that this misguided attempt is only making it worse for Joe.

    Which leads me to believe that the Paterno lawyers have helped unbalance the Paterno's already tilted judgements in favor of this diastrous plan, and to noones great surprise, it is a plan which will suck many of the retirement dollars that ole Joe and his co-conspirator, Spanier, funneled into the patriarch's bank account at the 11th hour and out of the families greedy little hands, into their lawyers bank accounts.

    there is a certain karmic irony here. the Paterno's, half blind with the power crazed ego lust that propelled their dead patriarch, are duped into believing a transparently flawed "expert" investigation will magically resurrect the legacy of the fallen despot. and it is the lawyers who pull them over the edge with legalistic arguments, which are fine in the controlled American courtroom, which heavily favors the guilty, as long as they have enough money to keep paying the lawyers, who are intimately aware of ALL the courtroom slight of hand and smoke and mirrors they use on a daily basis to hide the truth from unsuspecting and easily duped jurors.

    but this isnt court. this is the court of public opinion, where the truth stands a much better chance of being recognized. Lawyer tricks in the court of public opinion are more easily seen for what they are. They are not given the pompous gravitas at large in the community that they are afforded in the hamstrung, criminal-friendly court room.

    consequently, when a Paterno lawyer argues that an email which refers only to "coach" is ambiguous and doesn't refer to "the" Coach, well that is fine in the criminal coddling court room, and a measure of doubt may cloud the mind of juries who are constanly bombarded with the ridiculously flawed "beyond a resonable doubt" instruction.

    but in the light of day, in the court of public opinion, when the Paterno lawyer makes that ridculous claim, it is easily seen as the courtroom trickery it is. The whole world knows that when the President of Penn state university changes his mind on a policy that would out Sandusky, which he has already agreed upon with Curly and Schultz, and which, by the way, would solve the problem and put an end to the Sandusky reign of terror, and when he does so unilaterally, at the last minute, after talking to the "coach"....well the whole world outside a courtroom knows which coach Spanier is talking about.

    But inside the courtroom, the Paterno lawyer can create maybe a tinge of "resonable doubt" in at least one jurors mind. ( dont forget the jurors have been hand picked by defense experts, highly paid professionals who know what signs to look for in potential jurors that show them to be the most vulnerable to the atty's slight of hand arguments).

    but not in the light of day. here the truth is not so easily obscured. and when the lawyers assure the Paternos that for a few million dollars (they hardly put it THAT way) they can turn reality into fantasy, and joepas legacy back into the fantasyland the Paternos want everyone to believe....well, that plumb is just too ripe for the state-made-weathy Paterno's to reject.

    but all its going to do is solidify in most folks minds what is becomming more and more obvious every day. It turns out, the Paterno's are no better than their dead patriarch, and by attempting to pull the wool over our eyes with lawyer slight of hand arguments, they are actually making our vision clearer. Now, maybe, even more folks in Central Pa. and happy valley and the penn state "family" will more clearly see who and what was in charge of their University for the last 40 years.

    and its the greedy lawyers who are egging the unsuspecting Paternos on. oh well, they end up with some of the ill got Paterno millions, and there is a certain justice to that after all.
    IF I PUT IT HERE ITS MY OPINION. apparently i have no idea when i need to say that in a post, so this should cover it....IN MY OPINION anyways,

    welcome to the gates of hell JVDS.




    Jose Baez: “I sincerely believe that when we have finally spoken, everyone, and I mean everyone, will sit back and say, ‘Now, I understand. That explains it.’”



    Jose Baez to da judge :

    ".....that type of testing is unique. we requested that they be allowed to test items and that of course was objected to by the state and and uh the state uh granted or sustained their objection, denied our opportunity to have him test these items due to a very specialized field, subfield, of dna that he is one of the pioneers of uh in the alternative of we were granted the ability to test certain items by an outside lab...."

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    Quote Originally Posted by believe09 View Post
    Maybe we can start a thread on JoPa as things develop. I am stunned by this:

    http://news.yahoo.com/paterno-family...5564--nfl.html

    Why is it I suspect this is the motivation?



    I am intrigued at the "demand" that Freeh's group, hired by Penn State, preserve their notes.

    Why shouldnt the Paterno's start from scratch if they believe it to be inaccurate? That puzzles me, fwiw, and makes all of this look even more like a PR ploy. JMVHO.

    of course, thats what it is, after all. made worse by the reality that it is a PR trick which will be manned with legalistic, court room arguments. even wosre for the Paternos, but great for their lawyers, who are gonna now get their share of the last minute Pasterno state stolen millions.

    interesting that the great moralist joe stole that money with the aid of Spanier, even as the whole sordid mess was coming down around them. as this plays out its a wonder Spanier isn't in jail, cause he is looking more and more like the king pin that joe used to prop up his fiefdom. It was HE that rejected the agreement to put Sandusky away after talking to the coach.

    And wasn't it Spanier's sterling reputation that the bOT's pointed to as the reason they were so easily duped? Yes, it was. "well, if Spanier says everything is OK, then it must be. Next agenda item. OH, a NEW retirement contract for Joe? Replete with added millions, and sky boxes, and jet travel, and so on, is that the next item Mr. Spanier?" "Agreed".

    meeting adjourned.
    IF I PUT IT HERE ITS MY OPINION. apparently i have no idea when i need to say that in a post, so this should cover it....IN MY OPINION anyways,

    welcome to the gates of hell JVDS.




    Jose Baez: “I sincerely believe that when we have finally spoken, everyone, and I mean everyone, will sit back and say, ‘Now, I understand. That explains it.’”



    Jose Baez to da judge :

    ".....that type of testing is unique. we requested that they be allowed to test items and that of course was objected to by the state and and uh the state uh granted or sustained their objection, denied our opportunity to have him test these items due to a very specialized field, subfield, of dna that he is one of the pioneers of uh in the alternative of we were granted the ability to test certain items by an outside lab...."

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    from your post coastal-

    there is a certain karmic irony here. the Paterno's, half blind with the power crazed ego lust that propelled their dead patriarch, are duped into believing a transparently flawed "expert" investigation will magically resurrect the legacy of the fallen despot
    But they want to do this expert investigation, apparently, using the Freeh group's material. Umm, and they are expecting a different outcome?

    My dad used to tell this story-A man is banging his head against a wall over and over again, crying out in pain. Another man asks him why he continues to bang his head against the wall? The first man replies, "Because it feels so good when I stop."

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    I want to go back and get the MSM reports regarding Joe and his reorganizing his estate before he died...didnt he transfer his assets?

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    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/16/sp...ife-for-1.html

    According to documents filed with the county, the house’s fair-market value was listed at $594,484.40. Wick Sollers, a lawyer for Paterno, said in an e-mail that the Paternos had been engaged in a “multiyear estate planning program,” and the transfer “was simply one element of that plan.” He said it had nothing to do with the scandal.
    and

    “I can’t see any tax advantages,” Frolik said. “If someone told me that, my reaction would be, ‘Are they hoping to shield assets in case if there’s personal liability?’ ” He added, “It sounds like an attempt to avoid personal liability in having assets in his wife’s name.”
    This is part of the story I recall.

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    Quote Originally Posted by costalpilot View Post
    your exactly correct...spent a little time at the pennlive comment thread last night where over 270 Central Pennsylvanians commented on the Paterno's pathetic attempts at legacy retoration. it isnt pretty for them, at all. The overwhelming response there is for them to just shut up. pretty much everyone but the true die hard joepa cool aid drinker realizes that this misguided attempt is only making it worse for Joe.

    Which leads me to believe that the Paterno lawyers have helped unbalance the Paterno's already tilted judgements in favor of this diastrous plan, and to noones great surprise, it is a plan which will suck many of the retirement dollars that ole Joe and his co-conspirator, Spanier, funneled into the patriarch's bank account at the 11th hour and out of the families greedy little hands, into their lawyers bank accounts.

    there is a certain karmic irony here. the Paterno's, half blind with the power crazed ego lust that propelled their dead patriarch, are duped into believing a transparently flawed "expert" investigation will magically resurrect the legacy of the fallen despot. and it is the lawyers who pull them over the edge with legalistic arguments, which are fine in the controlled American courtroom, which heavily favors the guilty, as long as they have enough money to keep paying the lawyers, who are intimately aware of ALL the courtroom slight of hand and smoke and mirrors they use on a daily basis to hide the truth from unsuspecting and easily duped jurors.

    but this isnt court. this is the court of public opinion, where the truth stands a much better chance of being recognized. Lawyer tricks in the court of public opinion are more easily seen for what they are. They are not given the pompous gravitas at large in the community that they are afforded in the hamstrung, criminal-friendly court room.

    consequently, when a Paterno lawyer argues that an email which refers only to "coach" is ambiguous and doesn't refer to "the" Coach, well that is fine in the criminal coddling court room, and a measure of doubt may cloud the mind of juries who are constanly bombarded with the ridiculously flawed "beyond a resonable doubt" instruction.

    but in the light of day, in the court of public opinion, when the Paterno lawyer makes that ridculous claim, it is easily seen as the courtroom trickery it is. The whole world knows that when the President of Penn state university changes his mind on a policy that would out Sandusky, which he has already agreed upon with Curly and Schultz, and which, by the way, would solve the problem and put an end to the Sandusky reign of terror, and when he does so unilaterally, at the last minute, after talking to the "coach"....well the whole world outside a courtroom knows which coach Spanier is talking about.

    But inside the courtroom, the Paterno lawyer can create maybe a tinge of "resonable doubt" in at least one jurors mind. ( dont forget the jurors have been hand picked by defense experts, highly paid professionals who know what signs to look for in potential jurors that show them to be the most vulnerable to the atty's slight of hand arguments).

    but not in the light of day. here the truth is not so easily obscured. and when the lawyers assure the Paternos that for a few million dollars (they hardly put it THAT way) they can turn reality into fantasy, and joepas legacy back into the fantasyland the Paternos want everyone to believe....well, that plumb is just too ripe for the state-made-weathy Paterno's to reject.

    but all its going to do is solidify in most folks minds what is becomming more and more obvious every day. It turns out, the Paterno's are no better than their dead patriarch, and by attempting to pull the wool over our eyes with lawyer slight of hand arguments, they are actually making our vision clearer. Now, maybe, even more folks in Central Pa. and happy valley and the penn state "family" will more clearly see who and what was in charge of their University for the last 40 years.

    and its the greedy lawyers who are egging the unsuspecting Paternos on. oh well, they end up with some of the ill got Paterno millions, and there is a certain justice to that after all.
    You're absolutely right about the desperation of the JoePa loyalists. They're clinging to the belief that "the coach" referred to Sandusky in Curley's email, even though the subject line was PATERNO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by IzzyBlanche View Post
    Sorry to quote my own post, but here's a beaut:

    "I don't think I ever put winning a football game ahead of what was best for a kid."

    As long as the kid was on his football team.

    Obviously, if you happened to be anyone else and/or hadn't been issued the PSU sports equipment needed to help defend yourself, all bets were off.

    My father (also a head football coach) used to have an old expression that goes like this:

    "Some of the greatest love affairs only involve one person."

    It seems rather fitting for that (once) much-revered superman known as JoePa. Heh. Pa. Paterno. Paternal.
    Pater: a title given to a father deity

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