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Thread: All Things Gary Schultz

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    All Things Gary Schultz

    Here's a link to the pdf transcript of the Curley/Schultz preliminary hearing.

    http://cnninsession.files.wordpress....transcript.pdf

    Starting on pg 124 is the cross examination of Tom Harmon by <Gary> Schultz's attorney, Thomas Farrell. It's an interesting read because some of Harmon's testimony contradicts what we learned in the Freeh report. SPORTSbyBROOKS made the following document that points out some of the discrepancies.

    http://media.sportsbybrooks.com/2012...estigation.pdf

    (Harmon was not interviewed by Freeh. I'm not sure if the declined an interview or the AG requested Freeh not interview him.)

    Perhaps Farrell's line of questioning gives us some indication of the strategy he plans to use in Schultz's perjury trial.
    Last edited by ynotdivein; 07-31-2012 at 05:50 PM. Reason: poster's request--corrected name

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    the more I read about psu the more it seems like it should be set in a valley in alabama rather than pennsylvania.
    IF I PUT IT HERE ITS MY OPINION. apparently i have no idea when i need to say that in a post, so this should cover it....IN MY OPINION anyways,

    welcome to the gates of hell JVDS.




    Jose Baez: “I sincerely believe that when we have finally spoken, everyone, and I mean everyone, will sit back and say, ‘Now, I understand. That explains it.’”



    Jose Baez to da judge :

    ".....that type of testing is unique. we requested that they be allowed to test items and that of course was objected to by the state and and uh the state uh granted or sustained their objection, denied our opportunity to have him test these items due to a very specialized field, subfield, of dna that he is one of the pioneers of uh in the alternative of we were granted the ability to test certain items by an outside lab...."

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    Quote Originally Posted by costalpilot View Post
    the more I read about psu the more it seems like it should be set in a valley in alabama rather than pennsylvania.
    LOL! Good one! I grew up in Bama and it is a die hard football state. They have Auburn and Alabama to worship and are just as gung ho as PSU!

    I kid you not, about half of my 260 FB friends are from Bama and the majority began posting Roll Tide and War Eagle pics a month ago.

    BTW......

    Tim Buckley is the first official transfer from PSU to NC State.

    http://www.wralsportsfan.com/ncsu/story/11372354/

    Sorry for the OT.

    moo

    wm
    ...and be sure your sin will find you out.

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    James Carville, Clinton's campaign manager, who also managed Robert Casey's 1986 gubernatorial victory in Pennsylvania, famously said: "Pennsylvania is Philadelphia and Pittsburgh with Alabama in between."

    Pennsylvania, politically and culturally, has the "T." Basically, if you take out Southeastern PA, the counties that surround Philadelphia and the Southwest, the counties that surround Pittsburgh, the area looks like a "T." It is also called "Pennsytucky."

    I grew up there, my family had lived on the edges of it for two centuries, I went to school there, and I held office there. It's pretty much true.

    Centre County is much more cosmopolitan that the rest of the area, ironically.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    I can't open the link. Anywhere that I can see the transcript that is not a pdf? I'm not sure why I am not able to open it.

    J.J., Harmon's retirement date--just a coincidence that it is two months after RFG's disappearance? IYO

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    Quote Originally Posted by rlc View Post
    I can't open the link. Anywhere that I can see the transcript that is not a pdf? I'm not sure why I am not able to open it.

    J.J., Harmon's retirement date--just a coincidence that it is two months after RFG's disappearance? IYO
    No. It seemed like he had been employed there for a while. Even with Sandusky, it was clear that he'd do well, pension wise, in retiring when he did.

    Try closing the PDF and reopening it again.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    Ex-Penn State official Schultz facing perjury charge wants access to Freeh files

    http://www.cbssports.com/collegefoot...reeh-files/rss

    The records Schultz wants include notes of interviews with former Penn State president Graham Spanier and with Cynthia Baldwin, the university's former chief counsel. It also seeks information related to a 1998 police investigation of Sandusky that did not result in charges at the time, and Baldwin's notes regarding a January 2011 with former football coach Joe Paterno.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCat View Post
    Ex-Penn State official Schultz facing perjury charge wants access to Freeh files

    http://www.cbssports.com/collegefoot...reeh-files/rss
    I hope one of them flips.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    I hope one of them flips.
    I see both Schultz and Curley blaming Spanier and Paterno at trial.

    The Freeh report gave foundation for Curley to claim he was simply "Paterno's errand boy", and Spanier defended his press release supporting the two by telling a communications officer he backed Curley and Schultz “because he had asked them to take care of something, they did it ... and he should not abandon them merely because things did not turn out well.”

    Won't be a defense to perjury in any case, but ...
    "I believe it is an established maxim in morals that he who makes an assertion without knowing whether it is true or false, is guilty of falsehood; and the accidental truth of the assertion, does not justify or excuse him." - Abraham Lincoln

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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    I hope one of them flips.
    If Schultz doesn't flip, at least it looks like he plans to put up a fight. I hope he does. He was beginning to look like a patsy in this whole mess.

    Right from the beginning, the mantra was "Paterno reported McQueary's allegation to the police." But Schultz is not a cop. On page 228 of the transcript I linked to above, Schultz testified before the grand jury that he didn't even realize the University police conducted a criminal investigation in 98. That's consistent with the emails between Schultz and Harmon included in the Freeh report. Harmon only updates Schultz on the status of the DPW investigation, as if the University officer is just tagging along. At no time does he write to Schultz, "our officer ran a sting operation."

    So in 2001, Schultz never suggested reporting the allegation to the University police because he thought it was DPW's responsibility to investigate. Just like 1998.

    I'm not suggesting Schultz is blameless. I don't, however, see any reason he would want to cover up the 2001 incident. Unfortunately for him, no one is concerned about his legacy, so he's the fall guy.

    JMO

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCat View Post
    If Schultz doesn't flip, at least it looks like he plans to put up a fight. I hope he does. He was beginning to look like a patsy in this whole mess.

    Right from the beginning, the mantra was "Paterno reported McQueary's allegation to the police." But Schultz is not a cop. On page 228 of the transcript I linked to above, Schultz testified before the grand jury that he didn't even realize the University police conducted a criminal investigation in 98. That's consistent with the emails between Schultz and Harmon included in the Freeh report. Harmon only updates Schultz on the status of the DPW investigation, as if the University officer is just tagging along. At no time does he write to Schultz, "our officer ran a sting operation."

    So in 2001, Schultz never suggested reporting the allegation to the University police because he thought it was DPW's responsibility to investigate. Just like 1998.

    I'm not suggesting Schultz is blameless. I don't, however, see any reason he would want to cover up the 2001 incident. Unfortunately for him, no one is concerned about his legacy, so he's the fall guy.

    JMO
    According to the Freeh report, backed up some e-mails and notes, Schultz did look at the files in 2001.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    According to the Freeh report, backed up some e-mails and notes, Schultz did look at the files in 2001.
    I saw the note about reviewing the 1998 history. I didn't see much detail.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCat View Post
    I saw the note about reviewing the 1998 history. I didn't see much detail.
    I think pages 227-8 of the preliminary hearing, Schultz's grand jury testimony entered into the record, clearly conflict with the e-mails.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    I think pages 227-8 of the preliminary hearing, Schultz's grand jury testimony entered into the record, clearly conflict with the e-mails.
    How does a perjury trial work? Does the prosecution only need to prove one false statement? For instance, Curley clearly lied to the grand jury when he said he didn't know about the 98 investigation. So even if McQueary were to recant on the witness stand, it doesn't change the fact that Schultz and Curley gave false answers to other questions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCat View Post
    How does a perjury trial work? Does the prosecution only need to prove one false statement? For instance, Curley clearly lied to the grand jury when he said he didn't know about the 98 investigation. So even if McQueary were to recant on the witness stand, it doesn't change the fact that Schultz and Curley gave false answers to other questions.
    It would have to be a lie about a material fact, I think. If Schultz were asked what the colors were of Penn State, and he answered green and yellow, that would not be perjury, from my understanding.

    http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/perjury


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    James Carville, Clinton's campaign manager, who also managed Robert Casey's 1986 gubernatorial victory in Pennsylvania, famously said: "Pennsylvania is Philadelphia and Pittsburgh with Alabama in between."

    Pennsylvania, politically and culturally, has the "T." Basically, if you take out Southeastern PA, the counties that surround Philadelphia and the Southwest, the counties that surround Pittsburgh, the area looks like a "T." It is also called "Pennsytucky."

    I grew up there, my family had lived on the edges of it for two centuries, I went to school there, and I held office there. It's pretty much true.

    Centre County is much more cosmopolitan that the rest of the area, ironically.
    An outstanding read on the cultural makeup of Pennsylvania is Albion's Seed by David Hackett Fischer.

    [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Albions-Seed-British-Folkways-Cultural/dp/0195069056/ref=la_B000AQ4LL8_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1343875438&sr=1-1"]Amazon.com: Albion&#39;s Seed: Four British Folkways in America (America: A Cultural History) (9780195069051): David Hackett Fischer: Books@@AMEPARAM@@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51LFih9-INL.@@AMEPARAM@@51LFih9-INL[/ame]

    The Quakers settled around Philadelphia, of course. They were followed by the Scots-Irish, so called because they came from the English-Scottish borders via Northern Ireland. They would eventually become the pioneers and cowboys. They quickly moved westward into Alabama and beyond. Germans settlers followed into central PA after the Scots-Irish moved on.

    Here's a wikipedia entry about the Central Pennsylvania accent:

    [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Central_Pennsylvania_accent"]Central Pennsylvania accent - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

    The Scots-Irish are typically Protestant, independent, individualistic, quarrelsome (think Hatfields and McCoys), skeptical of educational institutions, and adverse to hierarchical organizations. Good luck getting a 100,000 rednecks to wear all white and chant "We Are...." an educational institution. Not going to happen.

    Germanic cultures, on the other hand, are characterized by devotion to heirarchical military, ecclesiastical, and education institutions. So no surprise to see names like Harmon and Schultz involved in this particular scandal. Throw in a head coach who ran the football program like a Renaissance Pope and you have the unique ingredients for Central Pennsylvania Gothic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCat View Post
    An outstanding read on the cultural makeup of Pennsylvania is Albion's Seed by David Hackett Fischer.

    Amazon.com: Albion's Seed: Four British Folkways in America (America: A Cultural History) (9780195069051): David Hackett Fischer: Books

    The Quakers settled around Philadelphia, of course. They were followed by the Scots-Irish, so called because they came from the English-Scottish borders via Northern Ireland. They would eventually become the pioneers and cowboys. They quickly moved westward into Alabama and beyond. Germans settlers followed into central PA after the Scots-Irish moved on.

    Here's a wikipedia entry about the Central Pennsylvania accent:

    Central Pennsylvania accent - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    The Scots-Irish are typically Protestant, independent, individualistic, quarrelsome (think Hatfields and McCoys), skeptical of educational institutions, and adverse to hierarchical organizations. Good luck getting a 100,000 rednecks to wear all white and chant "We Are...." an educational institution. Not going to happen.

    Germanic cultures, on the other hand, are characterized by devotion to heirarchical military, ecclesiastical, and education institutions. So no surprise to see names like Harmon and Schultz involved in this particular scandal. Throw in a head coach who ran the football program like a Renaissance Pope and you have the unique ingredients for Central Pennsylvania Gothic.
    The Germans (Mennonites) were actually here beginning in the 1680's, the "Krefeld Familes" and were coming well into the 1850's, after the '48 Revolution. The first Bible printed west of the Alleghenies was printed in Somerset, PA in 1813. It was Luther's translation and it was printed in German. A lot of Centre County's original settlers were ethnic Germans.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    Thread topic: All things Gary Schultz.

    Fascinating info/food for thought in the last several posts though, for those with an ethnological or linguistic bent.
    You can hold back from the suffering of the world. You have free permission to do so and it is in accordance with your nature.
    But perhaps this very holding back is the one suffering you could have avoided.
    Franz Kafka

    Be not simply good. Be good for something.
    HDT

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    Quote Originally Posted by ynotdivein View Post
    Thread topic: All things Gary Schultz.

    Fascinating info/food for thought in the last several posts though, for those with an ethnological or linguistic bent.
    Well it is a German name.

    While there is a substantial German ancestry population in the area, I would not attribute Schultz (presumed) ethnicity as a reason for "just following orders." The Germans that were in PA 1683-1860 or so were basically people that were at odds with the powers that be in their homelands. They did not have the "obedience" tradition.

    Also, looking at the emails, it wasn't a question of Schultz, "just following orders." He seemed to be an actual participant in the decisions.

    I am a bit surprised that it was Spanier, and not Schultz, who would see the "downside." Schultz was at least closer to LE and should have understood the problems.

    Make any sense (and back on topic)?


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    Also, looking at the emails, it wasn't a question of Schultz, "just following orders." He seemed to be an actual participant in the decisions.
    The whole response was an exercise in bureaucratic paralysis. All the discussion about contacting "his organizaton" and maybe the "other organization." It's maddening. Like a nightmare out of a Kafka novel. Why didn't they attempt to find the child, immediately?

    Instead, Schultz took 10 days to research the 98 case and devise a 3 point plan to handle McQueary's allegation. When he learned that Spanier, Curley, and "Joe" were not comfortable with his plan, he folded like a lawn chair. He was non-confrontational and passive, which is the "Penn State way" according to Vicky Triponey.

    (The woman who stood up to Joe Paterno http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/15/us/tri...ate/index.html)

    And even if Paterno was not behind the plan, Curley certainly attempted to give the impression that Paterno was behind it in order to give his alternative plan more authority. That says a lot about how things worked at Penn State, I think.


    JMO

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCat View Post
    The whole response was an exercise in bureaucratic paralysis. All the discussion about contacting "his organizaton" and maybe the "other organization." It's maddening. Like a nightmare out of a Kafka novel. Why didn't they attempt to find the child, immediately?
    It wasn't bureaucratic paralysis, though Penn State is a bureaucracy. They began to look at this on the same day it was reported. I'm not convinced that they, initially, thought this was any different that the 1998 incident, except it wasn't the parent or child complaining. That changed when they heard from McQueary.

    Instead, Schultz took 10 days to research the 98 case and devise a 3 point plan to handle McQueary's allegation. When he learned that Spanier, Curley, and "Joe" were not comfortable with his plan, he folded like a lawn chair. He was non-confrontational and passive, which is the "Penn State way" according to Vicky Triponey.

    (The woman who stood up to Joe Paterno http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/15/us/tri...ate/index.html)
    The plan was three days after talking to McQueary. I can understand, based on the 1998 experience, why they thought this was nothing too serious, just Sandusky "horsing around," prior to that.

    And yes, I can understand not trying to find the identity of the child, and saying, *We should let DPW handle that part. They are the experts.* (Okay, DPW screwed up badly.) If they actually followed the 2/25/01 plan, I wouldn't be too upset. It is a bit slow, but it still gets everything over to the proper authorities, even if a fortnight later.

    And even if Paterno was not behind the plan, Curley certainly attempted to give the impression that Paterno was behind it in order to give his alternative plan more authority. That says a lot about how things worked at Penn State, I think.
    The change in the plan originated either with Curley, giving the impression that Paterno was in favor of it, or with Paterno. Even if the former, Paterno had to know that there wasn't an investigation, because no investigator talked with him, and he was part of that reporting chain.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    What happened in the conversation Curley had with Paterno?
    Curley must have told Paterno it is way worse than they thought-- what he and Schultz got from McQueary was an explicit report of sexual assault- way beyond what Paterno had allowed himself to hear yet (he did not ask McQueary for details.)
    And did he also inform or remind Paterno that there had been an earlier investigation?

    How did Paterno respond? Why did Curley become uncomfortable? Was he ordered to keep it in house, or was he told that it was his decision and the entire responsiblity for whatever happened was his?

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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    I hope one of them flips.
    The more the Paterno family continues their public fight to protect Joe's name and now their appeal of the NCAA sanctions it makes me wonder if some of their intention is to ward off Curley & Schultz from laying the blame on JoPA?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tipstaff View Post
    The more the Paterno family continues their public fight to protect Joe's name and now their appeal of the NCAA sanctions it makes me wonder if some of their intention is to ward off Curley & Schultz from laying the blame on JoPA?
    The only guys in that conversation were Curley and Paterno.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    The only guys in that conversation were Curley and Paterno.
    Isn't it possible that the public fight the Paterno family continues to battle may also serve as a warning to anyone that would malign Joe's name in court that they will go after them as well.

    The Paterno's do seem to have unlimited interest and funds in their fight to reconstruct JoPA's name, his win record and reputation.

    I don't find it unreasonable that they would attempt to warn anyone like Schultz, Curley or Spanier if he gets indited (or anyone else for that matter) not to flip and blame Jo - or lookout here they and their lawyers come.

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