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  1. #46
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    I'm waiting to hear that the white-shirted deputy gets a movie contract.


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  3. #47
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    Angry

    Quote Originally Posted by SuziQ View Post
    A man has come forward alleging he saw Jerry Sandusky and a prominent Penn State University donor sexually abusing two boys together aboard a private plane, it was claimed on Monday.
    The FBI is reportedly taking the accusations 'seriously,' and has opened an investigation into a pedophile sex ring that could spread well beyond the former Penn State football coach.

    The newest allegations, if proven true, could indicate that the sexual abuse of young boys was even more widespread and more horrific than initially thought.


    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz23RQGXoP5
    Sickening. I am pretty sure that Jerry Sandusky is involved in a pedophile ring and had others involved. The Second Mile was likely the front group for their perversion.




    HMS Hood
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  5. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reader View Post
    Oh my! how delusional...this Joepa worship is getting really twisted...can you please explain how they worked it out to come to this conclusion because I just can't follow that kind of thinking....

    BTW, have you seen the 'communist' T-shirts?
    They are really delusional.




    HMS Hood
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  7. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    Respectfully snipped



    I went to a junior/senior high school in west central PA starting in the early to mid 1970's. I started at age 11. I am reasonably sure that seniors perhaps 18-20 year olds were naked in the locker room/showers at the same time I was; it was required to shower after phys-ed. I'm reasonably sure that, at some point, my phys-ed teachers saw me, and my classmates, naked. It wasn't an issue.
    But your phys ed teacher wasn't in the showers with you, was he? And that's different. All of you were students.

    I'm told that in the girls phys-ed teacher would check to see that they were actually showering.

    In the mid-80's I had phys-ed classes in college, required (in my case adaptive). I did use a public shower area after class. I would not have thought twice about seeing someone 10-12 in there, if their parent had access to the University. I don't recall it, because I wasn't looking at 10-12 year old boys.
    BBM for focus. You are talking about children with their parents. I already said I can understand that. But Jerry Sandusky wasn't in the shower with any of his own kids.

    It isn't uncommon to get that age range. In one art class, where, ironically, we had naked models, we had one girl, whose parent had some affiliation with Penn State, who was 13-14.

    In that environment, it was not too uncommon. When I initially heard about Sandusky's "water play," I really thought that this was all it was.

    The problem is, if you did have a pedophile ring, it would make a convincing cover.
    With all due respect, apples to oranges. To go back to your first example, what do you think your parents would have said if your phys ed teacher had jumped in the shower with the students?

    In my middle-school gym classes also, the teachers would come in to make sure we were really showering. But no way they ever showered with us.

    And this guy sees Sandusky routinely showering with different boys and thinks nothing of it?

    I'm sorry, that's just weird and creepy and says a lot about him, none of it good. IMO of course.
    Last edited by IzzyBlanche; 08-13-2012 at 10:39 PM. Reason: clarification
    Be kind, for everyone is fighting a great battle.


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  9. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by IzzyBlanche View Post
    But your phys ed teacher wasn't in the showers with you, was he? And that's different. All of you were students.
    I'm sure that I was in there with people that were adults.


    BBM for focus. You are talking about children with their parents. I already said I can understand that. But Jerry Sandusky wasn't in the shower with any of his own kids.



    With all due respect, apples to oranges. To go back to your first example, what do you think your parents would have said if your phys ed teacher had jumped in the shower with the students?
    I think it they were actually exercising with up, working out, instead of supervising, nobody would have thought it was improper. We were sweaty and dirty; they we're not.

    In my middle-school gym classes also, the teachers would come in to make sure we were really showering. But no way they ever showered with us.

    And this guy sees Sandusky routinely showering with different boys and thinks nothing of it?

    I'm sorry, that's just weird and creepy and says a lot about him, none of it good. IMO of course.
    I would not have thought anything about it, with a few qualifications. If it is mid-afternoon, there were other people there, in and out, I wouldn't think anything about it. It's like the YMCA; you have people there of all ages in the shower together. These are basically public showers, or at least open to the guests of people that are supposed to be there.

    When I first heard about the shower incident from 1998, I thought that it might have been just an innocent act that was misinterpreted. When you take a look at the circumstances, alone, at night, neither Sandusky nor the victim actually vigorously exercising or dirty, and touching, it very clearly wasn't.

    That's one of the reasons it could be ideal cover for a pedophile ring.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?


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  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    I'm sure that I was in there with people that were adults.
    I am not arguing that. I am saying that none of those adults in the shower with you were authority figures. They were fellow students. That is a huge difference.

    I think it they were actually exercising with up, working out, instead of supervising, nobody would have thought it was improper. We were sweaty and dirty; they we're not.
    Maybe you're right. I disagree however. This subject has been discussed ad nauseum on WS, and I haven't seen any convincing evidence from anyone--either on WS or other forums where this topic has been discussed--that it is normal and proper for coaches/teachers/authority figures to shower with their charges.

    I would not have thought anything about it, with a few qualifications. If it is mid-afternoon, there were other people there, in and out, I wouldn't think anything about it. It's like the YMCA; you have people there of all ages in the shower together. These are basically public showers, or at least open to the guests of people that are supposed to be there.
    I'm a member of my local YMCA. The only people of different ages I see in the shower together (I mean together, as opposed to side by side under adjoining shower heads, which by the way I have actually NEVER seen without a parent present) are obviously mothers and their children who are too young to be in the opposite-sex locker rooms.

    I am becoming really curious about these free-for-all Y's where minor, preteen kids shower alongside grown men with no parent present. OF course I've never been in the men's locker room to witness what occurs there, but I can't imagine it's such a world away from the women's side.


    Rest of original post respectfully snipped
    Be kind, for everyone is fighting a great battle.


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  13. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by IzzyBlanche View Post
    I am not arguing that. I am saying that none of those adults in the shower with you were authority figures. They were fellow students. That is a huge difference.

    Maybe you're right. I disagree however. This subject has been discussed ad nauseum on WS, and I haven't seen any convincing evidence from anyone--either on WS or other forums where this topic has been discussed--that it is normal and proper for coaches/teachers/authority figures to shower with their charges.

    Well, in my case, as a 7th grader, that senior would be an authority figure, perhaps as much as Sandusky. Sandusky was not their teacher and coach and tried to be regarded as a friend. They were not calling him "Mr. Sandusky," but "Jerry."


    I'm a member of my local YMCA. The only people of different ages I see in the shower together (I mean together, as opposed to side by side under adjoining shower heads, which by the way I have actually NEVER seen without a parent present) are obviously mothers and their children who are too young to be in the opposite-sex locker rooms.
    Well, we might have a different definition of "in the shower together." I would interpret it as being in the same shower room, under separate shower heads. I think that is what these people all meant. They would see Sandusky with a child under the next shower head; he's under the east head and the child is under the west head.

    I am becoming really curious about these free-for-all Y's where minor, preteen kids shower alongside grown men with no parent present. OF course I've never been in the men's locker room to witness what occurs there, but I can't imagine it's such a world away from the women's side.


    Rest of original post respectfully snipped
    I would not call it a "free-for-all." I know that, at 11, to be in a public shower and have a 55 year old come in next too me, under a different shower head, and shower. Likewise, at 49, if I walked into a public shower and saw an 11 year old boy showering, I wouldn't (at least until this) give it a second thought. Frankly, I might not even notice him.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?


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  15. #53
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    I'll tell you guys up front that I haven't read every post of this thread. But I will tell you that showering with an 11 year old boy shouldn't EVER happen if you are an adult, even a parent. This is appropriate and most every adult I know would back away from this situation.


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  17. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by shefner View Post
    I'll tell you guys up front that I haven't read every post of this thread. But I will tell you that showering with an 11 year old boy shouldn't EVER happen if you are an adult, even a parent. This is appropriate and most every adult I know would back away from this situation.
    Well, when I was 11, it happened, and I didn't and don't consider it inappropriate in a public shower area. Maybe it is just a male thing.

    Touching would be, obviously.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?


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  19. #55
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    http://thelibertyblog.org/2011/06/17...panier-800592/

    I didn't know SPANIER had a commercial pilot license and was using the PSU planes.


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  21. #56
    I hope Spanier wasn't flying a PSU plane in which Sandusky and the rich donor had their alleged tryst with a boy (or was it boys?).


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  23. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by nittanylioness234 View Post
    I hope Spanier wasn't flying a PSU plane in which Sandusky and the rich donor had their alleged tryst with a boy (or was it boys?).
    I wonder if he was flying any place on the weekend of 4/15-4/17/05?


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?


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  25. #58
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    If I were to hazard a guess -- my opinion only of course -- this was always a special service for wealthy alumni and donors. Further, I suspect that this kind of thing is not terribly uncommon. For example:

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTitnDgw3Gc"]Tom Brokaw, 1989 "White House Call Boy Scandal" Reagan/Bush White House Pedophile ring - YouTube[/ame]

    Somehow, amazingly, these types of stories keep cropping up and are rarely if ever really investigated.

    I hate to subscribe to conspiracy theories. But in some respects it makes sense. Obviously child prostitution is a very real thing. Equally obvious is that there is a demand for this particular perversion that goes beyond some relatively small number of isolated losers. You don't need to look beyond Hollywood, or advertising, to understand that this particular perversion is more common than most would admit. And those with power and money, well i suspect that they can indulge in whatever they want.

    Look at the Catholic Church scandal. Actually look at the reported numbers. Over FOUR THOUSAND Priests (yes, really!) were accused of taking part in this in the United States alone. To put that into perspective, what that number tells us is that they ALL knew about it. Every priest in America knew exactly what was going on, and none, not one, did anything except continue the cover up. Hell, I would bet good money that it's still going on today. And that's only what the Catholic Church is willing to admit to. How many of these cases were never reported?

    Apparently the numbers are also pretty horrific when you look at the Boy Scout thing. So again, is it then so hard to imagine that these same perversions are not equally enjoyed (yes, I cringed writing that) by those with money and power?

    Again, just spit-balling here. But if I were to GUESS it would be that this college had pretty much anything their donors wanted, on tap and ready to go.
    DISCLAIMER: The above is my OPINION only. Unless stated otherwise, I neither claim nor imply any inside knowledge or expert opinion about any subject I happen to be discussing. The reader assumes full responsibility for any conclusions my writing might cause them to reach. Warning: may cause drowsiness, do not operate heavy machinery while reading


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  27. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by shefner View Post
    I'll tell you guys up front that I haven't read every post of this thread. But I will tell you that showering with an 11 year old boy shouldn't EVER happen if you are an adult, even a parent. This is appropriate and most every adult I know would back away from this situation.
    When I was a kid this was not uncommon in athletic facilities or pools. However, I certainly never had a coach hop in the shower with me.
    DISCLAIMER: The above is my OPINION only. Unless stated otherwise, I neither claim nor imply any inside knowledge or expert opinion about any subject I happen to be discussing. The reader assumes full responsibility for any conclusions my writing might cause them to reach. Warning: may cause drowsiness, do not operate heavy machinery while reading


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  29. #60
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    Good background on Spanier and the Neisworth case...

    Down In The Valley V: Spanier’s Culture of Secrecy And Penn State’s Other Ignored Child Sexual Abuse Scandal

    http://jonathanturley.org/2012/07/20...abuse-scandal/

    .........What could then cause this breach of faith among the best and brightest in American academe? Historian Theodore White observed that “All endeavors which are directed to a purely worldly end, contain within themselves the seeds of their own corruption.” Here, the seeds of corruption corroding the Penn State football program and the university itself, may have been planted just one year before the infamous Sandusky assault by another allegation of sexual abuse against a PSU educator.......

    Paul McLaughlin, 45, claimed that he had been sexually abused by a prominent PSU professor and two of the prof’s friends. In the call, he pointedly told Spanier that he had a taped confession from the professor. The PSU president wouldn’t hear it – didn’t even want to acknowledge it. “He told me whatever I wanted to get from the school, I wasn’t going to get it, and this was a guy with an impeccable reputation, and unless he was convicted of a crime, they weren’t interested,” McLaughlin said. Spanier told McLaughlin not to bother sending the tape. McLaughlin sent him the tape anyway........

    According to McLaughlin, Neisworth incriminated himself on an audio tape in which the professor allegedly admitted to serving the youth alcohol and engaging in sexual activities. Cecil County, Maryland authorities transcribed the tape and brought charges against Neisworth. Those criminal charges were ultimately dismissed after the tape was deemed inadmissible, but McLaughlin claims he sued Neisworth in civil court and was offered a “six-figure” confidential settlement to resolve the matter. He accepted the offer........

    The disregard for the veracity of McLaughlin’s complaint is bad enough, and the refusal to even hear the alleged taped confession is mind-boggling, but perhaps most incredible is Monk’s analysis of the university’s moral responsibility. Neisworth’s “duties did not involve direct contact with children,” intones the polymath, thus it follows that, in Penn State’s view, no concern need be shown by the university for his contact with children away from the campus. That’s quite an incredible take on a complaint of child sexual abuse. The total disregard for the safety of children who might come into contact with the alleged employee-pedophile is likewise shocking on a professional and human level. It’s also the same approach taken by Spanier, Shultz, Paterno, and Curley, just a year later when they decided that the best option in the face of a credible report of child rape was to tell Sandusky that his youthful “guests” would no longer be welcome in the Lasch Building’s shower stalls.

    What happens away from Penn State stays away from Penn State, or so it was tragically claimed.

    Spanier’s undue concern for secrecy and his desire to control university operations outside of Board scrutiny may have created a situation that even he can’t make disappear. By keeping a blind-fold over the Board, he may have given an opening to victim’s lawyers by allowing them to argue the Board negligently failed to discharge their oversight duties............ That comment hits like blood in the water for lawyers seeking to prove that the Board shirked its legal obligation to oversee the university and its officials thus permitting the abuse to occur through its collective negligence. “This could increase our liability,” a current trustee said, “possibly by millions.”...........

    It was French playwright Victor Hugo who, with the imprint of the bloody French Revolution still seared in the collective mind of his countrymen, declaimed:

    The little people must be sacred to the big ones, and it is from the rights of the weak that the duty of the strong is comprised.
    Some in the palaces of leadership at Penn State — like the Bourbon kings of old — ignored this irremeable law of duty as they had so many other things. They should not be surprised by the magnitude of the reckoning.


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