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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
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    El Segundo, California
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    CA - Holtville, WhtMale UP 10545, 20-35, in desert, Aug'12 - David Pangerl

    Starting a new thread for a newbie who doesn't yet have thread starting capabilities.

    NamUs UP # 10545 https://identifyus.org/en/cases/10545

    Unidentified White Male
    Found on August 11, 2012 in Holtville, Imperial County, California.

    Vital Stats
    Age: 20-35
    Height: 5'7" (67 inches)
    Weight: 150 lbs.
    Hair Color: Brown
    Head Hair: Light brown hair, could be lighter, undetermined due to decomposition and sun damage, full hair, about one inch

    Clothing and Accessories
    Clothing: black t-shirt, black starter shorts (dri-star).
    Footwear: Flip flops
    Jewelry: necklace (chrome or silver) with shark tooth attached.
    Possessions: Military duffle bag (marked 1065527 & 1085527) and green water canteen.

    Body condition
    Condition: Not recognizable - Decomposing/putrefaction
    Postmortem Interval: 1 day

    Circumstances
    Decedent found in desert campgrounds, extreme weather conditions, no food or water.
    Last edited by CarlK90245; 10-20-2012 at 11:37 PM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    87
    Thank you Carl! Okay, I was looking at the above UID and came across this MP also from CA. I know its probably a stretch, but here it is.

    David C. Groves
    https://www.findthemissing.org/en/ca...=circumstances

    The height and the weight is the same. There is no photo of the UID, so its a guess. The UID has short hair, the MP has long hair. But he could have cut it?
    Last edited by CarlK90245; 10-20-2012 at 11:36 PM. Reason: Added Name

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    El Segundo, California
    Posts
    7,856
    You have a tie-in on height and age, but I don't see a whole lot more.

    Stockton is quite a ways from Imperial County, and with a five month lag (and a one-day-old body) there isn't a real good tie-in there.

    His hair description is off not only on length, but also on the darkness (though they do say that might be mistaken).

    The body condition description says "not recognizable", but the body was intact enough to get fingerprints, so I would think that a prior gunshot injury would have probably been noticed. But that is not certain either.

    The military duffle and canteen would seem to suggest someone with a military background.

    None of these negatives are rule-outs, but I would probably want to see more before I got too excited.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    87
    Quote Originally Posted by CarlK90245 View Post
    You have a tie-in on height and age, but I don't see a whole lot more.

    Stockton is quite a ways from Imperial County, and with a five month lag (and a one-day-old body) there isn't a real good tie-in there.

    His hair description is off not only on length, but also on the darkness (though they do say that might be mistaken).

    The body condition description says "not recognizable", but the body was intact enough to get fingerprints, so I would think that a prior gunshot injury would have probably been noticed. But that is not certain either.

    The military duffle and canteen would seem to suggest someone with a military background.

    None of these negatives are rule-outs, but I would probably want to see more before I got too excited.
    And you are right. I thought about all that too, but its a start. Maybe not in the right direction, but still. Thank you for starting this Carl.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Long Beach, CA
    Posts
    1,349
    How about Adam Clayton Lyle Jones?

    https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/11063/17
    His Oldsmobile was found at the Grand Canyon National Park. I'd like to know which cities in California he had marked.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    87
    Could be. I wish NAMUS could provide photos of all the UIDs.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    7
    Holtville is over seven hours away from the Grand Canyon National Park - if this is Adam, how did he end up so far from his car?

    His disappearance raises lots of questions: why was he travelling cross country with just his laptop?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Long Beach, CA
    Posts
    1,349
    Quote Originally Posted by erigal80 View Post
    Holtville is over seven hours away from the Grand Canyon National Park - if this is Adam, how did he end up so far from his car?

    His disappearance raises lots of questions: why was he travelling cross country with just his laptop?
    He would have had to meet up with someone else and get a ride from them. I would like more information about his car when it was found (was it operable, etc?). Traveling cross country with just a laptop is strange. I wonder if the laptop was the only thing his family noticed was missing (he took clothes and hygiene products, but his family didn't notice that they were gone? I guess some hygiene items you can buy once you get to your destination, but sometimes that is expensive.).

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    2,229
    First name Richard
    Last name Donaldson

    Date LKA December 21, 2011 00:00
    Date entered 12/27/2011
    Age LKA 21 to years old
    Age now 22 years old
    Race White
    Sex Male
    Height (inches) 67.0
    Weight (pounds) 145.0

    from NamUs : https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/show/13464


    Height, weight, age, general US area and circumstances look pretty good. Charley project says he has mental health problems.
    Last edited by deca; 08-25-2012 at 08:10 PM. Reason: deleting extra stuff.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Reno, Nevada
    Posts
    180
    I'm confused, the NAMUS page says they estimate the man had been dead for 1 day, but that his face was unrecognizable and putrifying. I had to look up putrefaction on wikipedia and they provide a timeline that estimates a body takes about 4 weeks for the face to be unrecognizable. I could see it being different due to weather conditions, but 4 weeks sooner?
    Also, since this is a desert area, wouldn't the body be more likely to dry out and mummify rather than rot?
    Someone please set me straight!


  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
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    2,229
    Quote Originally Posted by micheleonelonly View Post
    I'm confused, the NAMUS page says they estimate the man had been dead for 1 day, but that his face was unrecognizable and putrifying. I had to look up putrefaction on wikipedia and they provide a timeline that estimates a body takes about 4 weeks for the face to be unrecognizable. I could see it being different due to weather conditions, but 4 weeks sooner?
    Also, since this is a desert area, wouldn't the body be more likely to dry out and mummify rather than rot?
    Someone please set me straight!
    I know there are a lot of factors that contribute to mummifcation so we can't be sure that simply being in a hot desert environment will preserve the body in that way.
    I was also confused about the 1 day. Either it is wrong, or something happened (animals? He had been in a bad fight or accident right before dying?).

  12. #12
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    Mar 2009
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    19,247
    How about the hair? How does it decompose enough in one day to be undetermined color?

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    17,673
    It appears with military duffle bag he could be military.

    Stupid question alert: Is it unusual for someone to be walking desert campground in flip flops?

    The reason I ask is I googled missing persons last seen wearing flip flops and I realize this is a long shot considering Kyle's been missing since 2007 but his mom said he's an adventureous type so who knows. Unfortunatley, I couldn't find any other description of Kyle (height weight, etc). He's a Canadian from British Columbia.

    On August 30, 2007, Kyle MACDONALD (24 yrs old) was dropped off by his girlfriend in Victoria's Inner Habour, where he boarded an 11:20 am Harbour Air flight to Vancouver. Kyle told his girlfriend he was going on a fishing trip. Kyle was carrying a Calvin Klein duffel bag, tackle box, small fishing rod, wearing shorts, a T-shirt and 'flip-flop' sandals.
    http://www.avcrimestoppers.ca/missing/kyle-macdonald

    Jamieson said her son is a skilled outdoorsman and would often go into the wilderness for several days at a time without giving his exact whereabouts. But she said he would never go for longer than a few days without contacting her.
    http://www2.canada.com/theprovince/n...9-775d7d15c507

    Also the shark tooth pendant (Kyle is/was a fisherman)

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donjeta View Post
    How about the hair? How does it decompose enough in one day to be undetermined color?
    That is what is throwing me off on the "1 day" information. I don't think intense sun would bleach out the hair color that fast.

    But we also have to consider that he could have been out there for a few days, injured or sick and slowly dying of thirst. So if he is lying in the sun under some scrub or something then maybe before he passes he is already sun burnt to blistering, his hair might be lightened by the sun, etc. That is the only thing I can come up with that could explain the 1 day issue.

    But can't the they look at the roots or some section of the head that didn't get exposed to sun as much?


    As far as the flip flips, since he was camping there it is likely that he had those for walking around the site. Sand is a problem. Maybe he had another pair of shoes? What was in the bag?

  15. #15
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    up north
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