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  1. #1
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    Connecticut school district on lockdown after shooting report at a Newtown elemen #10

    Please continue the discussion here:

    At least 26 dead in shooting at Connecticut elementary school

    Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/14...#ixzz2F3id8S00

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    http://www.ksee24.com/news/local/Off...183652041.html
    Officials Release Names of Newtown Victims in School Massacre

    Children:
    Charlotte Bacon, 6
    Daniel Barden, 7
    Olivia Engel, 6
    Josephine Gay, 7
    Ana M. Marquez-Greene, 6
    Dylan Hockley, 6
    Madeleine F. Hsu, 6
    Catherine V. Hubbard, 6
    Chase Kowalski, 7
    Jesse Lewis, 6
    James Mattioli, 6
    Grace McDonnell, 7
    Emilie Parker, 6
    Jack Pinto, 6
    Noah Pozner, 6
    Caroline Previdi, 6
    Jessica Rekos, 6
    Aveille Richman, 6
    Benjamin Wheeler, 6
    Allison N. Wyatt, 6

    Adults:
    Dawn Hochsprung, 47
    Rachel Davino, 29
    Anne Marie Murphy, 52
    Lauren Rousseau, 30
    Mary Sherlach, 56
    Victoria Soto, 27
    Nancy Lanza[/QUOTE]
    Last edited by KateB; 06-21-2015 at 12:39 AM. Reason: repair url tag.

  2. #2
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    Continue here.
    Please stay on topic and be sure to leave the gun control issue in the gun control thread.

    Please remember we are a victim friendly forum and that includes AL's parents.
    Be respectful in your posting. Until we have more information they are victims and we would appreciate care in posting.
    Thanks.

  3. #3
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    I would just like to point out that the federal government spends only 13% on "welfare", as opposed to say, 20% on "defense" (which, IMO, is more offense than defense, but anyway...).

    http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=1258

    And further, we spend 50% more on corporate welfare (subsidies to businesses) than we do on aid to actual PEOPLE:

    http://thinkbynumbers.org/government...re-statistics/

    So for those who think we don't have the money to overhaul and beef up the mental health care system, you really need to be looking at your money going down the drain in OTHER places besides food stamps, WIC, etc. because the money we spend killing people in endless wars, and aiding corporate fat cats is a lot higher than the money we spend taking care of the poor and hungry.
    “Peace is not the product of terror or fear. Peace is not the silence of cemeteries. Peace is not the silent result of violent repression. Peace is the generous, tranquil contribution of all to the good of all." -Abp Oscar Romero

  4. #4
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    Mental health care is not in the hands of the govt is it?

    When one has insurance, one is paying huge amounts of the premium for fancy buildings and huge salaries. I read that the CEO of United Health Care received one billion dollars in salary for one year.

    Then there are all of the perks such as golf club memberships.

    The new healthcare law does state that the premium must now cover more health care costs than all of this other entitlement. Why don't people get upset about insurance companies?

    It is a mystery to me.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by human View Post
    Mental health care is not in the hands of the govt is it?

    When one has insurance, one is paying huge amounts of the premium for fancy buildings and huge salaries. I read that the CEO of United Health Care received one billion dollars in salary for one year.

    Then there are all of the perks such as golf club memberships.

    The new healthcare law does state that the premium must now cover more health care costs than all of this other entitlement. Why don't people get upset about insurance companies?

    It is a mystery to me.
    People do get annoyed at insurance companies. I know I do every time they refuse a charge which is.. regularly.

    But that's not really the point. I don't really think ACCESS to medical care or mental health care is a problem from a monetary perspective in this case at all. NL was getting almost $300,000 a year in alimony. PL was making almost 500k a year. That's a lot of cash... more than enough money for regular therapy/intervention/whatever the hell this kid needed. I don't think money was an issue. Frankly, we don't know if he wasn't receiving regular psychiatric care or not. Perhaps he was, perhaps his mental illness was just a simple case of "monster".

    I do completely believe that some people are just monsters and completely unstable and nothing in this world...no pharmaceutical, no therapy, no loving family is going to change that.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gardenlady View Post
    I would just like to point out that the federal government spends only 13% on "welfare", as opposed to say, 20% on "defense" (which, IMO, is more offense than defense, but anyway...).

    http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=1258

    And further, we spend 50% more on corporate welfare (subsidies to businesses) than we do on aid to actual PEOPLE:

    http://thinkbynumbers.org/government...re-statistics/

    So for those who think we don't have the money to overhaul and beef up the mental health care system, you really need to be looking at your money going down the drain in OTHER places besides food stamps, WIC, etc. because the money we spend killing people in endless wars, and aiding corporate fat cats is a lot higher than the money we spend taking care of the poor and hungry.
    I just want to point out corporate welfare is a lot more then helping fat cats. It keeps businesses in the united states and also keeps prices on goods affordable like milk and produce so if we were to take those types of things away the prices of goods would rise and company's would leave. We would have even less agriculture then we do now and a lot less jobs in the US. The rich would still be rich and the poor would be worse off.

    I do agree we need to quit with the wars and the nation rebuilding . If we took all our foreign aid and money we use fighting for peace we could overhaul our whole health care system. The reinvestment of that money here would be a lot more helpful to us but overall it won't fix the problem . We have wonderful Drs here and we have moved forward so much in the mental health field but we can't cure mental health. People need to want to get help and they need to seek out professionals. One of the wonderful things about the US is we are built on freedom. There have been many cases over turned so we cannot force people to take medication. People cannot just be institutionalized and their rights taken away . Mental health isn't an exact science so there can be 3 different Drs who say 3different things. You can't predict who will do what Adam did. Throw all the money at the problem you want it won't slove the problem some people still won't get help and people will still have the right to refuse help. It would take a lot more then money to change the system you will have to get people in power who don't have a issue with taking away someones rights because they may do something to harm someone sometime.







    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk 2

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by newlyminted View Post
    People do get annoyed at insurance companies. I know I do every time they refuse a charge which is.. regularly.

    But that's not really the point. I don't really think ACCESS to medical care or mental health care is a problem from a monetary perspective in this case at all. NL was getting almost $300,000 a year in alimony. PL was making almost 500k a year. That's a lot of cash... more than enough money for regular therapy/intervention/whatever the hell this kid needed. I don't think money was an issue. Frankly, we don't know if he wasn't receiving regular psychiatric care or not. Perhaps he was, perhaps his mental illness was just a simple case of "monster".

    I do completely believe that some people are just monsters and completely unstable and nothing in this world...no pharmaceutical, no therapy, no loving family is going to change that.
    To me that is a lot of money, but to somebody else that might mean just getting by. I know a lot that make a tons more then me but they are barely getting by just like me. they drive new cars, bigger house payment etc so, i think really we are the same

  8. #8
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    Oct 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by human View Post
    Mental health care is not in the hands of the govt is it?

    When one has insurance, one is paying huge amounts of the premium for fancy buildings and huge salaries. I read that the CEO of United Health Care received one billion dollars in salary for one year.

    Then there are all of the perks such as golf club memberships.

    The new healthcare law does state that the premium must now cover more health care costs than all of this other entitlement. Why don't people get upset about insurance companies?

    It is a mystery to me.
    In 2014 the new mandatory health insurance laws kick in...many people also don't realize in some states you can get a rebate of the HI premiums paid in during 2012. Get involved and find out what you can do to receive possible rebates...one co worker got back $1800 from Anthem insurance this year...Don't Snooze or you might lose!!
    Last edited by Xavier; 12-29-2012 at 05:46 PM.

  9. #9
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    From the lack of information from the family and the family's mental health counselors, I 'm assuming this might be because there was a big lapse in therapy/counseling/medication on a regular basis throughout AL's 20 years

    And possibly no one wants to look bad, called negligent or incompetant that they fell asleep at the wheel guiding AL's treatment planning for his 20 years


    Or there is non-information due to patient confidentiality/privacy laws and maybe the family did everything they could and were very committed and regular on treatments

    AL sounds like a very stubborn guy, unwilling to make changes in routine, so AL could've pulled hissy fits to any kind of treatment his parents tried for him and they were content he was "harmless and docile" doing his thing in the basement so they might've abandoned the regular doctor/treatment appointments because he seemed "OK" in their eyes...and maybe they gave in to AL's demands because they got exhausted dealing with his fits and unwillingness to see what they're trying to do was all for his own good

    Maybe it's a combination


    Just my guess...
    Last edited by Xavier; 12-29-2012 at 05:43 PM.

  10. #10
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    According to report published Wednesday by the Washington Post, the authorities are moving swiftly to try to salvage the damaged computer.

    Investigators reportedly believe before massacring 20 children and six adults at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn., Lanza took a screwdriver or hammer to the hard drive. This creates a hurdle for the cops trying to gain an insight into what was going on inside Lanza’s head in the lead up to his terrible shooting frenzy. But depending on the scale of the damage, it is likely that forensic experts will be able to recover at least some of Lanza’s data. It is a complex, timely, and costly process that can involve piecing together crucial broken parts of the drive like a jigsaw. However, as the Post notes:

    Extraordinary recoveries have occurred. When the space shuttle Columbia disintegrated on reentry, investigators were able to recover hard drives that had fallen to Earth. “The data was almost 100 percent recoverable,” [Rob] Lee, the lead for digital forensic and incident response at the Sans Institute, a leading cybersecurity and training organization.
    The authorities will also be able to glean information about Lanza from other electronic sources. Given that the 20-year-old killer was reportedly a member of a technology club and likely spent a great deal of time at his computer, he surely had at least one email account. Assuming they can identify that account, investigating officers will be able to obtain a warrant to retrieve a record of Lanza’s email activity, which may offer a useful glimpse into his life and mindset. And if Lanza tried to cover that base by deleting his Gmail or Hotmail account, he probably didn’t realize that deleted emails usually remain backed up on centralized servers, at least for a few weeks.


    I'm wondering if they can find anyone AL emailed, since LE found no calls received or made on his cell AL seemed like a solitary hermit...

    http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_te...lectronic.html


  11. #11
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    This is one of the best photo albums from the Sandy Hook incident I've seen...and incredibly distrubing that a death threat/hoax was made during a church service.....


    Connecticut State Police officers walk out of St. Rose of Lima Roman Catholic Church after a threat to the church was received during the first day of Sunday services following the mass shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn., Dec. 16, 2012. The church was evacuated during noon mass due to the unspecified threat and remained closed the rest of the day.


    For all the disbelief and dismay, we actually know pretty well that most such events are committed by individuals with a particular set of characteristics. As my colleagues Mark Coulson, Jane Barnett and I noted in a 2011 article in the Journal of Police Crisis Negotiations, school shooters have generally been found to 1) have a history of antisocial-personality traits, 2) suffer from mental illnesses such as depression or psychosis and 3) tend to obsess about how others, whether other individuals or society at large, have wronged them. (These conclusions are similar to the findings of a 2002 U.S. Secret Service report on school shootings.) These individuals seethe with rage and hatred and despondency, until they decide to lash out at individuals or a society they believe has done them great wrong. Mental health, as well as our failure to address it as a society, is at the core of these events.



    Read more: http://ideas.time.com/2012/12/15/san...#ixzz2GU2vjlP1



    Read more: http://nation.time.com/2012/12/14/co...#ixzz2GU1xbZyG


    http://nation.time.com/2012/12/14/co...39758089753545

  12. #12
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    A lawyer who's asking to sue Connecticut for $100 million on behalf of a 6-year-old Newtown school shooting survivor who heard violence over the school's intercom system says the potential claim is about improving school security, not money.

    "It's about living in a world that's safe," http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...n_2381733.html

    When they find that world, I hope they let us know where it is!!!! Evil can pop up anywhere at anytime, this is not the schools fault JMO

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by flipflop View Post
    A lawyer who's asking to sue Connecticut for $100 million on behalf of a 6-year-old Newtown school shooting survivor who heard violence over the school's intercom system says the potential claim is about improving school security, not money.

    "It's about living in a world that's safe," http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...n_2381733.html

    When they find that world, I hope they let us know where it is!!!! Evil can pop up anywhere at anytime, this is not the schools fault JMO
    What utter BS!!

    How will they be able to afford to beef up school security if $100m has been paid out in the above lawsuit?
    You don't get a medal for switching alliances just before the result, as it becomes apparent the other team is set to win.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs G Norris View Post
    What utter BS!!

    How will they be able to afford to beef up school security if $100m has been paid out in the above lawsuit?
    No security sytem, above and beyond what the school already had, would be able to stop a madman with an army of guns ready to kill.

    Lets just say, all the windows and doors had bars on the windows and the school had armed guards at the door. What about recess time, are these parents expecting the state to build bunkers to teach in and hold the kids as we would prisoners and not let them out until dismissal time.

  15. #15
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    That school's principal, counselor and several of it's teachers laid down their own lives to try and save their students. Suing them now is pathetic, imo. That school had various security drills they routinely ran, in preparation of emergencies like this. They had a locked front entrance and the office personnel met the intruder upon his intrusion. It is not like they were ignoring the assault.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn

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