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  1. #1
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    Apr 2013
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    Shelf Issue

    I'm new here as of five minutes ago, so I apologize if I'm posting in the wrong place. Thought this would be of interest, re the shelf/weight/flipping issue.

    http://media2.abc15.com/html/pdf/ariasmotion1.pdf

  2. #2
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    sipping coffee at the Purple Rose Theatre
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    this is a huge issue and will be one on rebuttal. The defense has already tried to block the state on even carrying out tests on shelving. This thread is OPEN FOR DISCUSSION

  3. #3
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    Does anyone live in Travis' house? Seems like they should be able to just go there and have JW stand on it (since nurmi used JW in the jammed finger experiment).
    "If Jodi's lips are moving...if her pen is moving...then she lie, lie, lies!"

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by wasnt_me View Post
    Does anyone live in Travis' house? Seems like they should be able to just go there and have JW stand on it (since nurmi used JW in the jammed finger experiment).

    I believe Flores went to the home on March 14 and tested the shelves. This is the info that the state is attempting to present to the jury.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by wasnt_me View Post
    Does anyone live in Travis' house? Seems like they should be able to just go there and have JW stand on it (since nurmi used JW in the jammed finger experiment).
    Yes, someone lives in the house. Katiecoolady posted awhile back that the Alexander family actually met the homeowners and were invited in. That was the first time one of the sisters was ever in the home. I believe I have that information correct. If I don't someone please correct me and if I can find the post I will link it here.
    Keep your children safe. Keep them close. Love them like there's no tomorrow.

  6. #6
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    Mar 2013
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    Quote Originally Posted by SK174 View Post
    I'm new here as of five minutes ago, so I apologize if I'm posting in the wrong place. Thought this would be of interest, re the shelf/weight/flipping issue.

    http://media2.abc15.com/html/pdf/ariasmotion1.pdf
    I think once the state presents this it is all over. Done. If any juror is feeling sympathetic and trying to believe her story of woe, this will make it clear her version of events did not happen and be forced to concede she is a liar and her story from that could not have happened, which means...no self defense.

  7. #7
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    Oct 2009
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    First of all, SK174

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    Welcome to all new members. Thank you for joining the conversation. Please take a moment to become familiar with the TOS and rules, etiquette and information.

    mni wiconi I Stand With Standing Rock

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
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    Do we know when the court will rule whether the testing of the shelves in the closet will be admitted or not?

    I do not understand exactly what precedence could be used to deny the use of the testing of the shelves...

    In the court docs posted above there is a case sited as precedence... But I have to admit I did not read the details...

    sorry if my legal lingo is incorrect... I am no expert.... Evidently...

    JMO


    TIA

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by IHAVENOCLUE View Post
    Do we know when the court will rule whether the testing of the shelves in the closet will be admitted or not?

    I do not understand exactly what precedence could be used to deny the use of the testing of the shelves...

    In the court docs posted above there is a case sited as precedence... But I have to admit I did not read the details...

    sorry if my legal lingo is incorrect... I am no expert.... Evidently...

    JMO


    TIA
    This would be a good question for the legal thread but one of the lawyers said something about Juan needing to prove these are the same shelves from June 4 and that they are in the same condition.

    But hey, if they are the same shelves then they should get to use them! (That was me )

  10. #10
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    Nov 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeeBee View Post
    This would be a good question for the legal thread but one of the lawyers said something about Juan needing to prove these are the same shelves from June 4 and that they are in the same condition.

    But hey, if they are the same shelves then they should get to use them! (That was me )
    Thanks, MeeBee!

    I would think using the same type of shelves... Obtained from pics/Det. Flores investigation/etc. would be sufficient for use in testing...

    for instance... If testing the results of a baseball swing to someone's head... And the exact baseball bat had been lost... Wouldn't a similar bat of same weight, length, make, and model be admitted as evidence?

    Kind of seems like Legal Testing of Evidence 101 to me....

    But, again, I am no expert....

    In other words... It seems like the DT is really stretching to prevent this evidence in court... Since it would pretty well break the case for them...

    JMO
    Last edited by IHAVENOCLUE; 04-14-2013 at 02:30 PM. Reason: IOW... DT scrambling to avoid the evidence...


  11. #11
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    Mar 2013
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    Quote Originally Posted by SK174 View Post
    I'm new here as of five minutes ago, so I apologize if I'm posting in the wrong place. Thought this would be of interest, re the shelf/weight/flipping issue.

    http://media2.abc15.com/html/pdf/ariasmotion1.pdf
    "Any testimony regarding the weight capacity of the shelves that currently stand in the Master Bedroom Closet at 11428 E Queensborough Ave, Mesa, Arizona 85212, and/or the reaction these shelves would have to her weight should be precluded as irrelevant and inadmissible pursuant to Rules 401 and 402 Arizona Rules of Evidence."


    Haha! I think she had the gun in the pocket of her robe that she put on after sex/while taking pics of Travis.

  12. #12
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    Mar 2013
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    P.s. anyone ever get the urge to call the defense "Bert'n'ernie" like me. Love yalls.

    But anyhow, thank you and your post IS relevant and so so important. Thank you and please share anything else you feel is important! Great eye!

  13. #13
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    Mar 2013
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    14
    #1464
    Today, 01:33 PM

    Kamille
    Registered User

    Join Date: May 2009
    Posts: 5,713
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MrsPC
    couldn't sleep last night thinking about this case but was wondering about the timeline for Arias clean-up of the crime scene & subsequent drive to W Jordan UT to see Burns.

    5:33pm the photo of the bloody baseboards is accidentally shot

    Travis is killed, then Arias drags his body to the shower.

    Arias deletes photos from the camera.

    Arias washes & dries all the bedding. Arias washes another load of clothing, towels, the camera, etc.

    Arias pours water in the bathroom floor & along the hall & possibly turns on the shower to wash away evidence there.

    Arias moves some furniture around downstairs, a new floor cleaning machine is left sitting out, she puts up the dog gate so Napoleon can't go upstairs & she locks Travis bedroom door.

    Supposedly per her testimony her luggage & stuff had already been loaded into the car earlier in the day.

    At 10:30pm she calls Burns to tell him she got lost & will be in UT the next morning.

    Near the AZ/NV Hoover dam checkpoint Arias supposedly pulls over on the side of the road and changes her bloody clothes & washes her hands.

    At 11:37pm, 11:48pm & 11:53pm phone records reflect she called Travis phone. Records show she was between Kingman, AZ and the NV border when the calls were made. This area is about 206 miles or 3.5 hrs from Travis home. And, this area is still 75 miles away from the Hoover Dam border area where Arias claims she pulled over & changed her bloody clothes.

    Considering the 5:33pm photo of the bloody baseboards & the 11:37 pm call to Travis phone from an area only 3.5 hours away from his home -- means Arias had about 2.5 hours (because of the time of the calls to Travis phone -11:37pm) to clean up the crime scene at Travis home, do the laundry, dispose of the rope (if there really was a rope,) dispose of the gun, the knife and her bloody clothes -- all IN Arizona.

    here's a map - A is Travis home, B is the area where Arias calls to Travis phone were made, & C is Hoover Dam checkpoint area where Arias claims she pulled over and D is where Burns resided

    http://goo.gl/maps/mF4te

    Arias arrived at W Jordan UT between 10 & 11:00am per Burns (per google maps it's about 11 hr trip from Mesa)
    I'm sceptical about the laundry issue because I tend to think that the bedding may have been put in the washer after the sex but prior to the killing. Either JA in her "helpful cleaning lady way" or TA because he was a bit OCD about cleanliness apparently. So if that's the case, all she had to do in the clean up was transfer the bed linens from washer to dryer (where they were found) and drop in the new washer load and turn it on before leaving.

    MOO

    She did testify that they put the sheets in the washer after sex but before shower pics.

  14. #14
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    Apr 2013
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    I don't see why the Prosecution can't just bring in the actual shelves. I can't remember who built those homes (it was a some what well known developer who does "tract" homes) but the closet shelving might have been part of the amenities package..........which would mean the developer would contact the contractor who would know who the shelving was built and installed by. Bring in a 5'6, 120-125 lbs gal and let her do a demonstration. I mean, JA really got into detail how she popped up to the top shelf and reached back to get the gun while only having her toes on the edge of the shelf....either the 2nd or 3rd.
    Major fail, folks, I have several well made shelving units like that, you put more weight at the front edge that what is on the actual shelve and the whole shelf flips towards you, to say nothing about the weight rating. Mine have a load max of 20-30 lbs, depending on the length of the shelf. At 5'1 and 105 lbs, I'm sure not going to climb them!

    JMO, OMO, MOO, etc., etc........

  15. #15
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    Nov 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bernina View Post
    I don't see why the Prosecution can't just bring in the actual shelves. I can't remember who built those homes (it was a some what well known developer who does "tract" homes) but the closet shelving might have been part of the amenities package..........which would mean the developer would contact the contractor who would know who the shelving was built and installed by. Bring in a 5'6, 120-125 lbs gal and let her do a demonstration. I mean, JA really got into detail how she popped up to the top shelf and reached back to get the gun while only having her toes on the edge of the shelf....either the 2nd or 3rd.
    Major fail, folks, I have several well made shelving units like that, you put more weight at the front edge that what is on the actual shelve and the whole shelf flips towards you, to say nothing about the weight rating. Mine have a load max of 20-30 lbs, depending on the length of the shelf. At 5'1 and 105 lbs, I'm sure not going to climb them!
    I so agree that it seems to be fairly easy to track down the original shelves (if they have been removed since 2008), or create workable demos...

    Again... It sounds like DT is throwing up a smokescreen...

    and if the Prosecution CAN'T use demos... Then I want to know why... And in detail!

    JMO

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