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  1. #1
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    OK - 3-year-old son shoots, kills mother

    Police: Woman, 26, fatally shot by 3-year-old son in 'horrible, horrible accident' (Tulsa World)

    ---
    In an interview with child specialists, the boy “confirmed what the evidence led investigators to assume,” Sgt. Dave Walker said. “We think this is a horrible, horrible accident.”
    ---

  2. #2
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    My heart sank when I read the thread title. How horrible for this three year old who will no doubt remember this and suffer a lifetime due to the memories of this incident.

    Still, it is the responsibility of the adults in the home to make certain children can not access guns.

    ~JMO~

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  3. #3
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    My heart sank -- after realizing I didn't even blink when I saw the headline in the World. The damage done with unsecured weapons seems now a weekly occurrence.

  4. #4
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    These stories really infuriate me......why do parents leave loaded guns around the house, accessible to kids? How stupid can you be? Now the mother is dead and this poor little child knows he shot his mommy. This absolutely disgusts me that it has happened once again.

  5. #5
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    Tulsa Police release victim's name, new detail in Monday afternoon accidental shooting (Tulsa World)

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    Christa Engles, 26, was in a residence with the toddler and her 10-month-old daughter about 4:30 p.m. Monday when, according to Tulsa Police Homicide Sgt. Dave Walker, the boy shot her in the head while she appeared to be changing her daughter’s diaper in their living room.

    “There was a holster on a table right (by) where she would have been changing the diaper,” Walker said Tuesday.
    ---
    Detectives believe the boy picked up a loaded 9mm semiautomatic handgun from the low-lying table near the couch while his mother was distracted and accidentally fired at her.
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    lengthy article at the link

  6. #6
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    A Tulsa Police sergeant told NBC News that there was a lot of guns in the house.

    The boy apparently found the "large-calibre" handgun under the sofa.
    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-n...er-son-4696248

    Detectives believe the toddler picked up the gun from a low-lying table near the sofa while his mum was distracted.
    http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-n...er-who-4697433

  7. #7
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    I think most parts of the U.S. have become too crowded for everyone to carry a gun; in much of California, I'd be just as likely to hit a neighbor as an intruder if I fired off a round. (In lots of communities, houses are only 16' apart and built from light wood frames.)

    But for obvious reasons, I realize we aren't going to debate that here.

    So can someone explain to me why ANYBODY needs a "houseful" of guns? Against whom are they preparing to go to war? (Please don't respond "zombie apocalypse" unless you can explain how such a thing could actually occur!) I'm seriously asking.

  8. #8
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    There have been guns in our home since forever. many were sold off/given away as the hunters in the family moved out of the house. at the present time there are 6 guns here. one 12 gauge shotgun, a 10 gauge shotgun, 1 old deer rifle, one fairly new deer rifle, a .22 pistol and a .38 pistol. only the 38 is loaded, and it hasn't been fired in about a year (at an armadillo).

    im not sure why we have most of them, nobody hunts anymore, but there they are. we have no children in the house, and if they come to visit they couldn't reach any of the guns since all but my 38 are in racks over doors.(in addition to being unloaded) my 38 is wherever I am. (with the safety on)

    we live in the boonies, and I feel safer knowing I have a gun. mostly its used for killing armadillos, possum, snakes and nutria. deer and rabbits run all over this place, but it doesn't occur to me to shoot them, they do little or no harm and they beautify my world. rumor has it that there are wild pigs in the woods, but ive never seen or heard them, if I did I would probably shoot them, as they are very dangerous.

    uncle takes all the guns down about once a year to clean them, otherwise I don't think about them.

    my husband is British. it took him a long while to get over his distaste for guns in general. now he knows what they aren't used all the time, certainly not to kill people, none of that. he has only actually heard me shoot one bullet in 12 years LOL. (ok 2, once he heard me on the phone shooting a snake) guns are part of who I am, and he accepts that. he doesn't want to learn to shoot, and that's fine too.

    I guess you could say we have a houseful of guns, but no people have ever been harmed by them. I am not worried about zombies, although I know a few odd folks who actually do. I consider myself to be a responsible person, not a 'gun nut'. they are just a normal part of my life.

  9. #9
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    Poor little guy
    A few months ago I truly considering getting a gun. I am a single female and live alone with my 15 month old son. But after weeks of thinking about it I desided it was pointless.
    The chances of someone breakin in to rape or murder me wasnt as high as my son finding it if I had it ready to protect myself. If I locked it up and put it up high I wouldnt have the chance to get to it in time. So I said forget it. Anyway praying for the poor child and family. Just sad anyway you look at it.

  10. #10
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    thepinkdragon is offline Verified US Army Veteran/Certified Veteran's Mental Health & PTSD Advocate
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    Quote Originally Posted by giagreen View Post
    Poor little guy
    A few months ago I truly considering getting a gun. I am a single female and live alone with my 15 month old son. But after weeks of thinking about it I desided it was pointless.
    The chances of someone breakin in to rape or murder me wasnt as high as my son finding it if I had it ready to protect myself. If I locked it up and put it up high I wouldnt have the chance to get to it in time. So I said forget it. Anyway praying for the poor child and family. Just sad anyway you look at it.
    That is why they sell biometric safes. You lock it up and leave it next to your bed and no one but you can open it, unless they are using your hand of course. There is no excuse for leaving a loaded handgun anywhere a small child can access it. I question why it was so accessible. So sad.


  11. #11
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    Mira, I have the same discussion with my father, who lives in a rural part of Colorado. His idea is that his few guns are there for protection against wildlife, not so much other humans.

    And he understands that my perspective is difference after a lifetime in NYC and LA. I've never had to deal with anything but possums, raccoons and skunks--none of which require a firearm.

    It seems like hunters end up collecting rifles and shotguns, never quite disposing of one as they acquire another. I grew up in a house with four rifles belonging to my grandfather. I had a vague idea they were secreted in the garage somewhere, but I swear I never even laid eyes on them! They were relics from his hunting days in his home state of Kansas, but were never taken out in Florida.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nova View Post
    So can someone explain to me why ANYBODY needs a "houseful" of guns? Against whom are they preparing to go to war? (Please don't respond "zombie apocalypse" unless you can explain how such a thing could actually occur!) I'm seriously asking.
    Serious answer is that some folks really like firearms just like other people have a thing for fancy cars or collecting jewelry. There are so many different types it is easy to collect a variety over the years.

    When a person already owns a few weapons but then they come across something they really really want there is often a tendency to create an excuse/need to justify the purchase to non-gun lovers (especially spouses) and sometimes that involves quite a bit of stretching.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nova View Post
    Mira, I have the same discussion with my father, who lives in a rural part of Colorado. His idea is that his few guns are there for protection against wildlife, not so much other humans.

    And he understands that my perspective is difference after a lifetime in NYC and LA. I've never had to deal with anything but possums, raccoons and skunks--none of which require a firearm.
    I was raised as a city girl (silicon valley) and never around firearms. As an adult I bought my own and never had male family members to maintain them. I live in a rural area by myself now and yes we have wildlife including coyotes, fox, rattlesnakes, copperheads, armadillos, wild pigs, some areas have bear/bob cats, but this isn't Alaska, there are no man-eating Polar bears so the threat from wildlife is very low. I have absolutely NO desire to kill wildlife and have never aimed a weapon at them much less shot any. None have ever tried to kill me or my dogs so why would I slaughter them? Just because I can? (I did lose some chickens to a snake, but chose to capture/release the snake in another area and secure the hen house -- problem solved).

    I keep six firearms around the house (three 9mm handguns, a .38, shotgun and AR). Since all were bought by/for me most all have been customized to make them more comfortable/user friendly (i.e. lights, grips, trigger adjustments, lasers, padded stocks, whatever I like to increase accuracy/ease of use).

    No kids in this house so all are kept loaded in cases or holsters (but even I keep them up high or behind glass so the dogs don't mess with them).

    FYI Nova the "zombie apocalypse" typically does NOT refer to actual zombies. It is generally used to refer to any situation that could cause major civil unrest and possibly lead to hoards of dangerous humans (i.e. riots).
    Last edited by Sonya610; 12-02-2014 at 09:29 AM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonya610 View Post
    Serious answer is that some folks really like firearms just like other people have a thing for fancy cars or collecting jewelry. There are so many different types it is easy to collect a variety over the years.

    When a person already owns a few weapons but then they come across something they really really want there is often a tendency to create an excuse/need to justify the purchase to non-gun lovers (especially spouses) and sometimes that involves quite a bit of stretching.
    Excellent answer IMO. Who needs 20 pairs of shoes? 1 pair should be enough right? It's not about need. The tragedy is that someone left the gun out where the child could find it.

  15. #15
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    Years ago, a local woman was shot & killed as she drove her car. Two small children in the backseat picked up a gun that had worked it's way to the back floorboard from under the driver's seat. It was a tragedy in our town. Guns & gun owners were not to blame. Whomever left a firearm unsecured is responsible. The same in this case & every other in the news that I can remember.

    I have had my old SW 38 for years. Occasionally it comes out for a cleaning & target practice. Take my gun & add a couple zeros to count Mr noZ's firearms. He has a couple hunting guns & target shooting guns & a bunch of collectibles. None, not a single one, of our weapons can be accessed by anyone else- child, friend, burglar. Everyone else, can & should be as responsible.

    Ok, maybe a burglar could make away with something, but he will need heavy equipment & a lot of help.



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