Evidence #2

Here ya go. New thread fill er up

Ok, I had this typed once, and thread got closed before I posted it. You caught me Chico!
Ok, when LE gets to a crime scene where a murder has occurred, they have probable cause to search. However they cannot remove items, unless they feel that they are criminal, or related to this crime.
So they would have searched the property. The outbuildings, the vehicles on the property as well as the house. They don't type up a list for the judge of where they have searched, but if they find anything they want to further test or remove- they will type that up and take it to the judge requesting a warrant. So they search the house and get a warrant for the items of interest. They search the outbuildings, but see nothing of interest. They search the vehicles. The Durango and it shows signs of recently being driven. A knife is found inside and the witness indicates it was recently driven. That gets mentioned, because they want a warrant for the knife, pawn ticket, and soil samples (?). They search the Acura and nothing suspicious is found, so it doesn't get mentioned in the warrant. Same as the outbuildings.
Think of the house. Presumably they searched it. Did they mention they checked in the washer and dryer? No, there was nothing there of any interest. But, I would almost bet they looked. They looked at the walls, the pictures on the walls, the beds, under the beds, probably under mattresses. They did the same in the baby's room. None of this gets mentioned- if nothing significant is found. Same with the vehicles.

Thanks, mysteriew. I definitely understand better now what you're saying. But before I drop this, is there anyone that can verify that other vehicles were or were not there that night? I've heard so many things in so many cases that I'm having trouble remembering the specifics of the cars in this one. I thought I remembered hearing that the Durango was indeed the only vehicle on the scene but I can't be sure of that. Can someone refresh my memory?

JerseyGirl said:

Thanks, mysteriew. I definitely understand better now what you're saying. But before I drop this, is there anyone that can verify that other vehicles were or were not there that night? I've heard so many things in so many cases that I'm having trouble remembering the specifics of the cars in this one. I thought I remembered hearing that the Durango was indeed the only vehicle on the scene but I can't be sure of that. Can someone refresh my memory?

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I can't confirm it, but I also heard that the Durango was the only vehicle on the scene. Which blows my mind, considering Raven was going-and-a-blowing to a pick-up soccer game, leaving his wife and baby home ALONE without ANY transportation in case of an emergency.

So, my question of the day is: Did Janet tell Raven she was leaving him and he made sure she didn't have an vehicle in which to escape?

Pretty pre-meditated if that indeed is the case.

golfmom said:

I can't confirm it, but I also heard that the Durango was the only vehicle on the scene. Which blows my mind, considering Raven was going-and-a-blowing to a pick-up soccer game, leaving his wife and baby home ALONE without ANY transportation in case of an emergency.

So, my question of the day is: Did Janet tell Raven she was leaving him and he made sure she didn't have an vehicle in which to escape?

Pretty pre-meditated if that indeed is the case.

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But that seems like a lot of shuffling cars around especially for Raven to do alone. Plus, if the home teachers were at their house, what time was that--7:30-ish, could he pull that off in that amount of time? And if he killed Janet first then shuffled the cars around there would possibly have to be some evidence in the other cars, traces or something. But if he shuffled the cars around before he killed Janet, don't you think that Janet would have been calling someone saying "my husband is acting really weird, I think I need to get out of here?"

Is there any information out there from the friends that Janet was possibly instant messaging? Like, what time did their conversations stop? What made them come by early the next morning (like the early reports have said)?

Jenifred said:

But that seems like a lot of shuffling cars around especially for Raven to do alone. Plus, if the home teachers were at their house, what time was that--7:30-ish, could he pull that off in that amount of time? And if he killed Janet first then shuffled the cars around there would possibly have to be some evidence in the other cars, traces or something. But if he shuffled the cars around before he killed Janet, don't you think that Janet would have been calling someone saying "my husband is acting really weird, I think I need to get out of here?"

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If Raven is the perp, he could have planned this for months for all we know. Maybe he scheduled the appointments a week in advance, and Janet thought nothing of it. And from what we've heard, Raven was very energetic and didn't sleep much, (correct?). I don't think that shuffling the cars around would have been a problem for Raven. If they got home from work around 5:30 and the hometeachers got there at 7:00, that would give them an hour and a half to take the cars to the shop, (if that's what happened). If the shop was only a mile away, that wouldn't have been a problem.

I guess there are too many variables that we don't know. But I'm very curious about the car situation, nonetheless.

mysteriew said:

Ok, I had this typed once, and thread got closed before I posted it. You caught me Chico!
Ok, when LE gets to a crime scene where a murder has occurred, they have probable cause to search. However they cannot remove items, unless they feel that they are criminal, or related to this crime.
So they would have searched the property. The outbuildings, the vehicles on the property as well as the house. They don't type up a list for the judge of where they have searched, but if they find anything they want to further test or remove- they will type that up and take it to the judge requesting a warrant. So they search the house and get a warrant for the items of interest. They search the outbuildings, but see nothing of interest. They search the vehicles. The Durango and it shows signs of recently being driven. A knife is found inside and the witness indicates it was recently driven. That gets mentioned, because they want a warrant for the knife, pawn ticket, and soil samples (?). They search the Acura and nothing suspicious is found, so it doesn't get mentioned in the warrant. Same as the outbuildings.
Think of the house. Presumably they searched it. Did they mention they checked in the washer and dryer? No, there was nothing there of any interest. But, I would almost bet they looked. They looked at the walls, the pictures on the walls, the beds, under the beds, probably under mattresses. They did the same in the baby's room. None of this gets mentioned- if nothing significant is found. Same with the vehicles.

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Thanks for the info! But the way I look at the search warrant info, the detective was only at the house 20 minutues before he left to get the search warrant. How could he have checked the entire house, out buildings and any and all vehicles in 20 minutes?

ewwwinteresting said:

Thanks for the info! But the way I look at the search warrant info, the detective was only at the house 20 minutues before he left to get the search warrant. How could he have checked the entire house, out buildings and any and all vehicles in 20 minutes?

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Maybe he saw enough to know that he would need a search warrant to get what he needed?

Moxie said:

Maybe he saw enough to know that he would need a search warrant to get what he needed?

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True....which would lead us to:

1. Overwhelming evidence of who did this waiting to be returned from the lab?

2. LE too zealous and didn't search everything they should have. The evidence they collected didn't pan out and now there is no evidence?

3. Jumped to the conclusion that Raven did this and he did not?

Any other ideas?

mysteriew said:

Ok, I had this typed once, and thread got closed before I posted it. You caught me Chico!
Ok, when LE gets to a crime scene where a murder has occurred, they have probable cause to search. However they cannot remove items, unless they feel that they are criminal, or related to this crime.
So they would have searched the property. The outbuildings, the vehicles on the property as well as the house. They don't type up a list for the judge of where they have searched, but if they find anything they want to further test or remove- they will type that up and take it to the judge requesting a warrant. So they search the house and get a warrant for the items of interest. They search the outbuildings, but see nothing of interest. They search the vehicles. The Durango and it shows signs of recently being driven. A knife is found inside and the witness indicates it was recently driven. That gets mentioned, because they want a warrant for the knife, pawn ticket, and soil samples (?). They search the Acura and nothing suspicious is found, so it doesn't get mentioned in the warrant. Same as the outbuildings.
Think of the house. Presumably they searched it. Did they mention they checked in the washer and dryer? No, there was nothing there of any interest. But, I would almost bet they looked. They looked at the walls, the pictures on the walls, the beds, under the beds, probably under mattresses. They did the same in the baby's room. None of this gets mentioned- if nothing significant is found. Same with the vehicles.

Click to expand...

The problem that we have here...is lack of media coverage. Thank about the Peterson case the media was camped outside his doorstep.. the media puts the heat on the LE to find the killer. We need to find a way to raise money to find the killer. Money always talks. Anyone have any ideas who to ask for money? I promise I'm still trying to use my media coverage contact to try and push this story out. Why doesn't everyone write the talk shows that are out there. If we all do it maybe they will pick it up. Montel, Oprah, etc.. etc...
What about the lady that talks about the Natalie murder all the time? I can't think of her name right off the top of my head.
I don't know I'm just so frustrated right now

bluegirl said:

The problem that we have here...is lack of media coverage. Thank about the Peterson case the media was camped outside his doorstep.. the media puts the heat on the LE to find the killer. We need to find a way to raise money to find the killer. Money always talks. Anyone have any ideas who to ask for money? I promise I'm still trying to use my media coverage contact to try and push this story out. Why doesn't everyone write the talk shows that are out there. If we all do it maybe they will pick it up. Montel, Oprah, etc.. etc...
What about the lady that talks about the Natalie murder all the time? I can't think of her name right off the top of my head.
I don't know I'm just so frustrated right now

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We are all on the same boat here bg! I think the problem is nobody that knows Janet or Raven are willing to talk to the media. If they were, I think we would have massive media coverage on this case. Think about it, if Scott's or Laci's family and friends refused to say anything, the media coverage would have been zilch. If Natalee's family and friends refused to talk to the media, there would be no coverage. There has been no reward offered by the husband or the families. There is just not much to report when LE AND Family AND Friends are not talking.

I guess we could all get together and put a reward out there....now wouldn't that look stupid:doh: ...a bunch of websleuthers are offering a reward because the husband and family and those that know Janet haven't! Hmmm...maybe that is news??

bluegirl said:

What about the lady that talks about the Natalie murder all the time? I can't think of her name right off the top of my head.

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Greta Van Susteren at Fox News? I never watch her, but the posters on the Natalee Holloway board talk about her and her coverage of Natalee's case all the time.

Hoppy

hoppyfrog said:

Greta Van Susteren at Fox News? I never watch her, but the posters on the Natalee Holloway board talk about her and her coverage of Natalee's case all the time.

Hoppy

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I'm sure that's it. I have her on in the background right now, and it's another full show about Natalee.

Jenifred said:

But that seems like a lot of shuffling cars around especially for Raven to do alone. Plus, if the home teachers were at their house, what time was that--7:30-ish, could he pull that off in that amount of time? And if he killed Janet first then shuffled the cars around there would possibly have to be some evidence in the other cars, traces or something. But if he shuffled the cars around before he killed Janet, don't you think that Janet would have been calling someone saying "my husband is acting really weird, I think I need to get out of here?"

Is there any information out there from the friends that Janet was possibly instant messaging? Like, what time did their conversations stop? What made them come by early the next morning (like the early reports have said)?

Click to expand...

..........as far as shuffling the cars around........

.........we have heard that the VX was parked down the road with a for sale sign on it........

..........raven was presumably driving the Durango that night
.........he'd given the Jeep to a friend...

....so, leaves only the Acura ( in the shop ? out for an oil change ?)

...the bike...........(mysteryview had asked earlier,) was a 2001 Ducati...............who knows where that was that night................or where it is now ????

...........it still amazes me that ONLY the durango is listed ( as far as we can tell) on the warrant..........and DID LE simply believe raven when he said that was the vehicle he drove that night ?
...........surely LE has checked on ALL of the abaroa vehicles and accounted for them.............

I found parts of this article very interesting as it relates to Janet's case.

http://www.johnsoncitypress.com/default.asp?SectionID=DETAIL&ID=49367
Parents of slain ETSU student to be on CNN

By Sam Watson
Press Education Writer
swatson@johnsoncitypress.com

ATLANTA — Increasingly frustrated after nearly eight months of questions, slain East Tennessee State University student Johnia Berry’s parents are scheduled to appear soon on national television in hopes of expediting her killer’s capture.



Joan and Mike Berry will appear on an upcoming installment of CNN Headline News legal analyst Nancy Grace’s show to discuss their daughter’s murder investigation.

“There’s something wrong with our system,” Mrs. Berry said Tuesday in a telephone interview. “It’ll be eight months, and there’s still a killer out there.”

The 21-year-old student was stabbed to death at her west Knoxville apartment complex Dec. 6, just days before she was to graduate from ETSU with a degree in criminal justice and criminology.

Despite releasing a sketch of a man sought for questioning a few weeks after the murder, Knox County Sheriff’s Department investigators had not made an arrest as of Tuesday.

The parents garnered Grace’s attention after waiting 2 1/2 hours in line for a book signing to thank her for airing a brief report on the murder on Court TV. Grace’s producer called last week to invite the couple to her show.

They were originally scheduled to appear live on Grace’s show tonight at 8 p.m., but producers contacted the family on Tuesday to reschedule the interview as an Aug. 3 taping for a full program on the murder and investigation. No air date had been set.

Mrs. Berry said she hoped to make it through the interview without becoming emotional. The passage of time had not eased her family’s loss.

“It just affects every aspect of your life,” Mrs. Berry said. “The person just didn’t kill Johnia. He killed a lot of people who loved her.”

Producers also had asked Knox County Sheriff Tim Hutchison to appear on the Grace program, but a department spokeswoman said the sheriff’s schedule was tentative. She also said the department had no progress to report.

Mrs. Berry said she and her husband, who reside in the Atlanta area, remained supportive of the department’s investigative efforts, but they were frustrated by slow lab work on DNA evidence and Tennessee laws that limit whether DNA is gathered from criminals.

“Some of the DNA is taking so long to get back,” she said. “That seems to be the hold-up.

“We feel like the sheriff’s department has been working really hard, but sometimes they come to a standstill,” Mrs. Berry said.

She contrasted the delays to the immediate DNA reports compiled in the high-profile case of Natalee Holloway, who disappeared in Aruba in May during a high school graduation trip.

“It’s hard to understand how some cases get top priority and some cases take years,” Mrs. Berry said. “It shouldn’t matter whether you have money or prestige.”

State Sen. Ron Ramsey and state Rep. Steve Godsey, both R- Blountville, had been working with the family on the issue, she said, and the family had mailed 2,000 post cards to lawmakers in hopes of expediting the DNA results. She said Godsey had been particularly helpful.

Along with bringing further attention to the need for legal reforms for such investigations, Mrs. Berry said, she hoped the national television appearance would lead to developments in the case, either from someone who recognizes the man in the sketch or someone who has knowledge about the crime.

“I don’t feel like people do things like this and keep it a secret,” Mrs. Berry said. “Somebody’s got to know something.”

A $10,000 reward for information leading to an arrest in the murder was announced in February. The Carole Sund/Carrington Memorial Reward Foundation, a fund created by families of three women murdered near Yosemite National Park in 1999, provided half of the money. An anonymous source provided the other $5,000.

Mrs. Berry said the family also had sponsored a billboard campaign in the Knoxville area to advertise the reward.

A former Bristol resident who was preparing to start graduate studies at the University of Tennessee, Johnia Berry was killed around 4 a.m. on Dec. 6. She was found outside a downstairs apartment in west Knoxville’s Brendon Park Apartments, 404 Rhodora Road, where she lived on the top floor. Her roommate, Jason Aymami, 23, also was stabbed and ran to a convenience market to call 911. Aymami’s injuries were treated at a local hospital, and he was soon released. In late December, the Knox County Sheriff’s Department released a sketch and description of a man sought in the investigation. The composite drawing, created from a witness’ description, showed a man in his 20s, about 5 feet, 8 inches tall, weighing around 150 pounds and wearing a blue Atlanta Braves baseball cap.


Notice the reward, billboard and media appearances. This family waited 8 months and are now totally frustrated. The family could have been doing this 7 months ago when the case was familiar. Sometimes that blind belief in the LE isn't so helpful in a case!

lauriej said:

..........as far as shuffling the cars around........

.........we have heard that the VX was parked down the road with a for sale sign on it...........

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I don't believe for a second that LE would just take Raven's word for it if that car was parked on a local corner. I believe that they would have searched that one too. Maybe they did and we just don't know about it. But IMO, unless those vehicles were under lock & key, LE would have been interested in checking them out.

lauriej said:

...the bike...........(mysteryview had asked earlier,) was a 2001 Ducati...............who knows where that was that night................or where it is now ????

Click to expand...

I don't think that Raven had the bike anymore.

ewwwinteresting said:

The 21-year-old student was stabbed to death at her west Knoxville apartment complex Dec. 6, just days before she was to graduate from ETSU with a degree in criminal justice and criminology.

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What a horrible irony. I hope that the new media attention will bring some answers to this family.

Thanks for the link, EI - it does get you thinking that it could all come down to slow lab work, and no real fire to force LE to move more quickly.

Hi all - it has been confirmed that Raven had affairs while he worked at Eurosport. Does anyone know if the affairs were with people who worked at Eurosport, and if so, how many did he have? If you are not comfortable posting, I understand, just pm me. thanks.

Regarding vehicles at the crime scene:

I have received some information which I'll pass along here...keeping in mind, this is UNCONFIRMED information, but I personally feel very confident in it's accuracy (take that for what it's worth, as I have no way to actually verify any of this...)

There was only ONE vehicle at Ferrand Drive when LE arrived on the scene - the Dodge Durango, which was parked in the parking area beside the house.

The VX was parked at a shop, presumably for repairs, a good distance away from the area. (No idea WHEN the VX was actually dropped off at this garage. No idea the NAME of this garage, or, where it is located. No idea what TYPE of service was being perfromed.)

The Acura was taken into a garage, presumably for routine service, ie., oil change perhaps, the afternoon of the murder. (It is POSSIBLE that the Acura might have been left for service at a dealership, but not certain.)

Now, if this is true, several things immediately come to mind:

- Janet was at home, with Kaiden, while Raven presumably went to play soccer...with no vehicle around?

- Seems odd that in times of seemingly dire financial straights, that there would be money for car service? And for TWO cars, at the same time even?

- If LE in fact only searched the Durango, then they must have been fairly certain that there was no possibility of the other cars being of any interest to the crime/crime scene

- I realize that there are many people that drop off their vehicles at garages, so as to have them there the next morning, etc. But in this case, the timing seems so odd. We can surmise, I suppose, that Janet at least, worked that day...getting home, I don't know, maybe sometime between 4-6? And we've also heard that the Mormon hometeachers were at the house that evening. So I guess it's possible - Janet gets home from work, they drop off the Acura, (one must have driven the Acura and the other the Durango), then get back home in time for the hometeachers, etc. And, as one last thought on timing: IF the Acura was at a dealership for service, and if that dealership was the local Acura dealership, well, it's worth noting as a point of reference that there is NO Acura dealership in Durham. The closest one is in the adjacent town of Chapel Hill. Just guessing, but, from Ferrand Drive to Performance Acura in Chapel Hill is maybe 15-20 minutes. Just seems so rushed to me, but, perhaps that's just me.

- I would assume, too, that with the Acura now in the shop, that Raven was planning on taking Janet to work the next day, etc.?

Anyway - as I said, this is all certainly UNCONFIRMED information. But, certainly interesting and worthy of speculation I think...

Moxie said:

Hi all - it has been confirmed that Raven had affairs while he worked at Eurosport. Does anyone know if the affairs were with people who worked at Eurosport, and if so, how many did he have? If you are not comfortable posting, I understand, just pm me. thanks.

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I would like to post this, however, although I have been following this case here since my friend Janet's death, I have been relucant to post as I do not want to be recognized. Among the group of Janet's true friends, noone really wants to believe that Raven is capable of this. Although all signs do point to him, we just DON'T want to believe it.

I can confirm that Raven had affairs. Even while they were dating, Raven was never certian about the relationship. He was never all that reluctant to cheat, although he always returned to Janet, apologetic and revitalized. I think he always struggled between what he thought was right ( living a rightous church lifestyle) and what his soul told him he wanted.

Janet was one of the prettiest girls in school...always with the most incredible body, and always down for a game of skins (when we were actually able to take off the shirts and forget the heat). She was wonderful, beautiful and amazing. I think he always loved how "perfect" she was, it really fit his mold. However, all of us married folk know that no one is perfect when you live with them 24/7.

Raven, although a wonderful person to be around, has alway had a dark side. A side searching for answers and "soul".

He has had affairs, and questions about the relationship, long before he married Janet. I love Raven, and truly hope he is innocent of this.