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  1. #1
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    PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #14

    This is the thread on Ray Gricar, the former district attorney of Centre County, PA. Please continue the discussion here.

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    Old Unclassified Thread [June to August, 2006]

    Note that, perhaps uniquely on the Internet, these threads begin from the first week after Ray Gricar disappeared.

    Thank you.
    Last edited by J. J. in Phila; 04-18-2015 at 05:49 PM.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    Thanks for new thread.

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    I realize that it may not be sound retirement planning however many people do live on government retirement checks. A friend of mine gets $4000. a month and with her house and cars paid for all she has to do is buy food and pay utilities. She travels. In a few years she can add SS benefits of $1700. a month to that. Her income while working was similar to RFG's.

  4. #4
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    RFG's pension would have been good, but neither PEF or LG would have gotten nearly as much if he died after retirement. The problems are that:

    1. It was going to be two people in the household neither working.

    2. Some things, such as traveling, do cost money.

    3. RFG and PEF had no idea how long retirement would be.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila
    "Not without a forensic audit."


    Those type of Audits span over a financials for many years. Is this what Tracker has done, you've done, or Trackers expert? I thought we were were talking about a couple of documents Tracker purchased which would of course be impossible to do a amateur forensic audit or even an expert one. Thus we must trust what investigators have told us right?

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperSmith View Post
    Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila
    "Not without a forensic audit."


    Those type of Audits span over a financials for many years. Is this what Tracker has done, you've done, or Trackers expert? I thought we were were talking about a couple of documents Tracker purchased which would of course be impossible to do a amateur forensic audit or even an expert one. Thus we must trust what investigators have told us right?
    It is a lot more than "a couple of documents", it is a manila envelope full. There is a bit more out there and I am making every effort to acquire it.

    No forensic audit was performed. It brings into question what type of review the "investigators" did and how did they reach the conclusion they announced, notably since the tax return portion that detailed investments was suppressed by a court order, yet the amount paid in taxes was rather small?

    What we find out may well support your theory as much as anyone else's.
    Unless otherwise noted, my posts are opinions or theories only and may not be used outside of WS unless permission is requested in advance.

    Please help find Lauren Jackson Missing since 1988 Spring City PA

    Pennsylvania Missing Persons Cases:
    Lauren Jackson, Amanda DeGuio, Ray Gricar, Kortne Stouffer, Jamie Metzger, Toni Sharpless

    "I'm not smarter than anyone else, I'm just more stubborn", "There are only two things you need to be a great homicide detective. The first is an intimate knowledge of the law. The second: An undying sense of curiosity. What happened here, and who made it happen?", "There are three motives in most murder cases: sex, money, or revenge. - Detective Joe Kenda

    "Never assume you know anything or everything about a missing person, a POI or the details of a case" - Me

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperSmith View Post
    Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila
    "Not without a forensic audit."


    Those type of Audits span over a financials for many years. Is this what Tracker has done, you've done, or Trackers expert? I thought we were were talking about a couple of documents Tracker purchased which would of course be impossible to do a amateur forensic audit or even an expert one. Thus we must trust what investigators have told us right?

    Well, if we were to trust the investigators, we have DZ saying suicide, we have MTM saying walkaway, and SPM saying "homicide is the least likely." Should we trust these investigators?

    We are not talking about "us" doing a forensic audit. We, well at least I, am saying that one is necessary before we can make a determination.

    We can look at what is out there and say, "For a guy making what RFG was making and what his expenses were, he sure doesn't have a large estate and does not appear to have large assets in 2004."


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    I don't see suicide with no body. I still don't see anyone walking away from his retirement, retirement planning or no.

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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    Well, if we were to trust the investigators, we have DZ saying suicide, we have MTM saying walkaway, and SPM saying "homicide is the least likely." Should we trust these investigators?

    We are not talking about "us" doing a forensic audit. We, well at least I, am saying that one is necessary before we can make a determination.

    We can look at what is out there and say, "For a guy making what RFG was making and what his expenses were, he sure doesn't have a large estate and does not appear to have large assets in 2004."
    That is their opinions on what they personally believed happened and not a piece of evidence such as they found the Mini in Lewisburg. Since you bring it up though perhaps we shouldn't believe in any of the "eyewitnesses" LE has reported right? He may not have been in Lewisburg at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MissJ View Post
    I don't see suicide with no body. I still don't see anyone walking away from his retirement, retirement planning or no.

    Strictly from a financial standpoint, either suicide or walkaway make sense. In short, his heirs would get more money that if he retired first and then was hit by a bus. For some people, that would be a motive.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?


  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post

    We are not talking about "us" doing a forensic audit. We, well at least I, am saying that one is necessary before we can make a determination.

    We can look at what is out there and say, "For a guy making what RFG was making and what his expenses were, he sure doesn't have a large estate and does not appear to have large assets in 2004."
    So you believe that these questions were never thought of by LE or FBI? I'm insulted.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperSmith View Post
    That is their opinions on what they personally believed happened and not a piece of evidence such as they found the Mini in Lewisburg. Since you bring it up though perhaps we shouldn't believe in any of the "eyewitnesses" LE has reported right? He may not have been in Lewisburg at all.
    And, without a forensic audit, the opinion that there is no money unaccounted for is just that, opinion.

    Witnesses, and physical evident, however, is more than just opinion. I will agree, LE is of the opinion that RFG was in Lewisburg on 4/16/05.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperSmith View Post
    So you believe that these questions were never thought of by LE or FBI? I'm insulted.
    I believe the PSP when they say, to CNN, that there was no forensic audit.


    What happened to former Centre County DA Ray Gricar?

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by J. J. in Phila View Post
    And, without a forensic audit, the opinion that there is no money unaccounted for is just that, opinion.

    Witnesses, and physical evident, however, is more than just opinion. I will agree, LE is of the opinion that RFG was in Lewisburg on 4/16/05.
    No it means after looking at his finances in a lessor time frame than that of a forensic audit that they found no money missing and this of course is limited to his salary only. The pension was not yet in play.

    Fraud usually triggers a forensic audit which of course no fraud was suspected

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    It would be extremely difficult to plan a scheme for a walkaway over a 10, 15, 20 year span while going through 2 divorces and funding your daughters education and gifting your current girlfriend.

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