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  1. #61
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    Trapped with Ms. Arias

    Chapter 18

    Learning more about Mr. Alexander


    L "looked upon " TA "with sadness, not just because of how he died but because of how he lived"

    L believed that TA was "a slave to his image", "never being what he wanted to be"

    To L, TA cared much about what others thought of him

    - to appear he was doing well financially (he was not)

    -Ta hosted fight night parties, etc.- "demonstrated wealth"

    L was sad about TA's "morals and his spiritual beliefs...could tell that he was not truly living in the way he wanted to live"

    -L could tell "looks at a person's behavior to assess the kind of person they are"

    -L gives example

    -states that TA didn't "act like he wanted to be a Mormon"

    -Ta was "highly motivated by sex" (evidence- "communications and conduct not only with Ms. Arias but with other women as well")

    -normal for others- "but are obviously well outside the norm if someone is of the Mormon faith"

    L felt that if TA shared his feelings ( actions showed he wanted to live "a less restrictive more normal sexual existence") with friends, he "would lose their love and friendship"

    L states could be wrong - if TA truly wanted to be member of LDS Church- "think about the guilt and shame he must have lived with. To me living with such guilt and/or shame would be a very sad way to live" (pg. 99)
    ================================================== =========

    Chapter 19

    Ms. Arias' Jail Calls


    phone calls in Maricopa jail can only be 12 min long before another call can be made

    during phone calls, defendants can say things that are detrimental to their case

    defendants are warned by their attys not to talk to others about their case- can be used against them in court

    some defendants think they are "smarter than their attorneys"... they do not listen to this advice"

    L gives this advice to all clients

    in non-death cases, L doesn't normally care about client's calls- in DP case everything important- always listens to calls- "not much of a burden" to listen

    normally not many calls- expensive

    the murderer had lots of calls- she would call friends, family, call others to ask why people were not picking up her calls- calls several X day and daily basis

    L amazed at all the calls- people who received her calls had to pay for them "and they were typically pointless" calls

    L stated was obligated to listen to calls- JM would be listening too and use calls for his case for death

    L states he "had a self-destructive client who thought she was smarter than anyone. So I assumed that she would try and pull something off during one of these calls, something that she thought might help her case" (pg. 101)

    State could use tapes at trial without advance notice

    murderer did not talk about trial too much on calls but, "she said so many other damaging things that I was sure that the State would bring them up during sentencing because these calls did not portray Ms. Arias in a good light" (pg. 102)

    - she would yell, act "mean-spirited" at mother, call her "stupid and/or guilt her into sending her money because she was starving"- not sending her money/book fast
    murderer did not care if mother had money- she would even tell mother how to budget money so had enough to send to her and to ignore her father if he objected-
    "...she had the unmitigated gall to give canteen items to other inmates and thus ask her mother for more money. It was pretty repulsive to listen to.." (pg. 102)

    L wanted Sandy to hang up on the murderer "..to my recollection she only did once"- never stood up to the murderer

    L was amazed at arrogance and narcissism of the murderer

    "Sandy was the parent but she never seemed to act like it at all"

    L not "reading too much into it because Sandy.....was empathetic to her daughter's situation"

    phone calls gave L "insight" into the murderer's relationship with people

    the murderer "degraded her mother and to others" , ordered her siblings around "acting superior to them even though she was in jail"

    L felt that the murderer thought world owed her something, very angry with mother (for what ??)

    "To me this was something I saw a fair amount of time in former clients who had been sexually abused. Thus, to me it was more evidence that Ms. Arias was mad at her mother for not caring enough to stop the abuse, more evidence that she was mad at her mother for not protecting her from the person sexually abusing her as a child." (pg. 103)

    the murderer was "kind and respectful" to father, but conversations very cold- did not talk often

    seemed to L that parents only talked to murderer "out of obligation to the other because of the biological link they shared"

    murderer manipulated mother- indirectly, talking bad of the father- or asking her to do things behind her father's back "because he was such a 'jerk' "

    father did not like that mother sent the murderer so much money

    L thought that money was "a big deal" to murderer

    L talks about her "fan base"- began after 48 Hours show- she received "a ton of mail"

    categories of mail:

    -biggest- men who wanted to have sex with her "Men who believed that once Ms. Arias was set free that she would come running into their arms and eventually into their beds"- L called them "suitors"

    - "a general assortment of weird people" (one woman shared her whole sexual history)

    to the murderer, fans were potential cash cows/ do things for her- she dedicated more time to "suitors"- thought they would generate more money for her

    L listened carefully to calls from "suitors" for "shenanigans"- never heard any- "assumes" JM never heard any either because he didn't use calls in court

    L "recalls" a suitor - lived in Missouri- worked on farm- around 60 years old - he was "thrilled" she called him "This man would tell her how he had a room for her once she got out of jail"

    L said he had sexual interest in her "and she knew it"- would "feign interest in him and without fail he would eventually ask .. if she needed anything"- she pretended she was OK-she made it feel as if she "was practically doing him a favor by allowing him to send her money...or..book. In this regard, she was amazing" (pg. 104) L said it was "so pathetic"

    L said she had plenty of "suitors" and money to buy things from the jail "canteen"

    L amazed that State never used calls in third phase of trial- may never know- he would have- "there never a time when I thought Ms. Arias was deserving of the death penalty more than when I listened to her on theses calls" (pg. 105) and L against DP under "any circumstance"- said the murderer "sounded like a monster...[ she was] truly sickening to me"

    talks about friend Donovan- came to trial almost every day- murderer often called her

    -served as a "quasi-spokesperson"- they met in jail when housed together, not life-long friends

    - the murderer manipulated her into her personal assistant on outside

    - this made the murderer seem, to L, "like a very scary person in her ability to manipulate others"

    L thought if jurors heard calls, they would despise her- for crime and personal too

    "If I was the prosecutor on the case, I would have had Dr Demarte refer to these calls as examples that supported her diagnosis as doing so would have been a way to illustrate to the jury, perhaps without saying so, that Ms. Arias was a monster whose life needed to end. Fortunately for Ms. Arias, that never happened." (pg. 105)
    ================================================== ==============

    Chapter 20

    Ms. Arias' "Ninja Story"


    seemed like a "bull**** story" to L, but back then, couldn't prove it was a "bull**** story"

    if that was the murderer's story , he had to work with it at the time

    L didn't know when she was going to change the story- couldn't hold up case- had to prepare a case

    had to have murderer talk to experts anyway even with that story to see what they said

    "I had to try to minimize the damage that my client was doing to her own case...If..story was going to change...admit the 'ninja story' was not true.....the sooner the better."

    L states, to him, what happened on 6/4/2008 did not include ninjas "or any other person for that matter"

    L did not "vocalize these beliefs" to the murderer and did not "assert to her that I believed her 'ninja story' .....over time she began to sense that I did not believe this story"- she came, in time, to telling him different story

    "If she got up on the stand and told the 'ninja story' she would be found guilty of First Degree Murder and she would be sentenced to death" (pg. 108)

    L felt that the murderer believed that others would accept the "ninja story"- she could convince the jury that it was true

    L had to show her that "real people" would not accept her story, but couldn't disclose confidential material to them

    L did not need to have her permission to disclose evidence already in public

    with help of Mit Spec, showed class of undergrads CBS docu- gave them questionnaire- did they believe the "ninja story"?- no one believed it

    after- the murderer told story of self-defense- "ninja story" now dead

    L didn't believe the self defense story either- "You may notice ....Ms. Arias' revised version of events I have been using the word 'story' "

    had she revised her story sooner, before Samuels' meeting, he wouldn't have been attacked on stand

    always possibility that she wouldn't have changed story- needed to have her evaluated

    " ...I was trying to save Ms. Arias' life, yet at the same time she was trying to make it harder for me to do my job" (pg. 109)
    ================================================== ==========

    Next:

    Chapter 21
    The Murder Weapons

    Chapter 22
    Ms. Arias' Supposed Guilt Phase Witnesses
    ================================================== =============
    ----------------------

    Travis Alexander (1977-2008)

    Teghan Alyssa Skiba (RIP sweet baby)
    -------------------------
    No one can make you feel inferior without your consent. -Eleanor Roosevelt

    Let us be kind to one another, for most of us are fighting a hard battle. - Ian MacLaren

    The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it - Flannery O'connor

  2. #62
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    JODI ARIAS ANALYSIS
    TRAPPED WITH MS. ARIAS
    (George Barwood- a staunch supporter from England)

    "This blog is some observations about Kirk Nurmiís performance as a lawyer for Jodi Arias, in light of some of the information he discloses about the pre-trial preparations in the first of three books about the case...."

    https://geebee2.wordpress.com/2015/1...with-ms-arias/

    He hasn't, in fact, changed his position of the murderer's innocence (as his Tweet alluded to )
    ------------------------------------------------------------



    Link: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CUsKUnDUkAAXs3_.png
    ------------------------------------------------------------------
    ----------------------

    Travis Alexander (1977-2008)

    Teghan Alyssa Skiba (RIP sweet baby)
    -------------------------
    No one can make you feel inferior without your consent. -Eleanor Roosevelt

    Let us be kind to one another, for most of us are fighting a hard battle. - Ian MacLaren

    The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it - Flannery O'connor

  3. #63
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    156
    Quote Originally Posted by YESorNO View Post
    Trapped with Ms. Arias

    Chapter 18

    Learning more about Mr. Alexander


    L "looked upon " TA "with sadness, not just because of how he died but because of how he lived"

    L believed that TA was "a slave to his image", "never being what he wanted to be"

    To L, TA cared much about what others thought of him

    - to appear he was doing well financially (he was not)

    -Ta hosted fight night parties, etc.- "demonstrated wealth"

    L was sad about TA's "morals and his spiritual beliefs...could tell that he was not truly living in the way he wanted to live"

    -L could tell "looks at a person's behavior to assess the kind of person they are"

    -L gives example

    -states that TA didn't "act like he wanted to be a Mormon"

    -Ta was "highly motivated by sex" (evidence- "communications and conduct not only with Ms. Arias but with other women as well")

    -normal for others- "but are obviously well outside the norm if someone is of the Mormon faith"

    L felt that if TA shared his feelings ( actions showed he wanted to live "a less restrictive more normal sexual existence") with friends, he "would lose their love and friendship"

    L states could be wrong - if TA truly wanted to be member of LDS Church- "think about the guilt and shame he must have lived with. To me living with such guilt and/or shame would be a very sad way to live" (pg. 99)
    ================================================== =========

    Chapter 19

    Ms. Arias' Jail Calls


    phone calls in Maricopa jail can only be 12 min long before another call can be made

    during phone calls, defendants can say things that are detrimental to their case

    defendants are warned by their attys not to talk to others about their case- can be used against them in court

    some defendants think they are "smarter than their attorneys"... they do not listen to this advice"

    L gives this advice to all clients

    in non-death cases, L doesn't normally care about client's calls- in DP case everything important- always listens to calls- "not much of a burden" to listen

    normally not many calls- expensive

    the murderer had lots of calls- she would call friends, family, call others to ask why people were not picking up her calls- calls several X day and daily basis

    L amazed at all the calls- people who received her calls had to pay for them "and they were typically pointless" calls

    L stated was obligated to listen to calls- JM would be listening too and use calls for his case for death

    L states he "had a self-destructive client who thought she was smarter than anyone. So I assumed that she would try and pull something off during one of these calls, something that she thought might help her case" (pg. 101)

    State could use tapes at trial without advance notice

    murderer did not talk about trial too much on calls but, "she said so many other damaging things that I was sure that the State would bring them up during sentencing because these calls did not portray Ms. Arias in a good light" (pg. 102)

    - she would yell, act "mean-spirited" at mother, call her "stupid and/or guilt her into sending her money because she was starving"- not sending her money/book fast
    murderer did not care if mother had money- she would even tell mother how to budget money so had enough to send to her and to ignore her father if he objected-
    "...she had the unmitigated gall to give canteen items to other inmates and thus ask her mother for more money. It was pretty repulsive to listen to.." (pg. 102)

    L wanted Sandy to hang up on the murderer "..to my recollection she only did once"- never stood up to the murderer

    L was amazed at arrogance and narcissism of the murderer

    "Sandy was the parent but she never seemed to act like it at all"

    L not "reading too much into it because Sandy.....was empathetic to her daughter's situation"

    phone calls gave L "insight" into the murderer's relationship with people

    the murderer "degraded her mother and to others" , ordered her siblings around "acting superior to them even though she was in jail"

    L felt that the murderer thought world owed her something, very angry with mother (for what ??)

    "To me this was something I saw a fair amount of time in former clients who had been sexually abused. Thus, to me it was more evidence that Ms. Arias was mad at her mother for not caring enough to stop the abuse, more evidence that she was mad at her mother for not protecting her from the person sexually abusing her as a child." (pg. 103)

    the murderer was "kind and respectful" to father, but conversations very cold- did not talk often

    seemed to L that parents only talked to murderer "out of obligation to the other because of the biological link they shared"

    murderer manipulated mother- indirectly, talking bad of the father- or asking her to do things behind her father's back "because he was such a 'jerk' "

    father did not like that mother sent the murderer so much money

    L thought that money was "a big deal" to murderer

    L talks about her "fan base"- began after 48 Hours show- she received "a ton of mail"

    categories of mail:

    -biggest- men who wanted to have sex with her "Men who believed that once Ms. Arias was set free that she would come running into their arms and eventually into their beds"- L called them "suitors"

    - "a general assortment of weird people" (one woman shared her whole sexual history)

    to the murderer, fans were potential cash cows/ do things for her- she dedicated more time to "suitors"- thought they would generate more money for her

    L listened carefully to calls from "suitors" for "shenanigans"- never heard any- "assumes" JM never heard any either because he didn't use calls in court

    L "recalls" a suitor - lived in Missouri- worked on farm- around 60 years old - he was "thrilled" she called him "This man would tell her how he had a room for her once she got out of jail"

    L said he had sexual interest in her "and she knew it"- would "feign interest in him and without fail he would eventually ask .. if she needed anything"- she pretended she was OK-she made it feel as if she "was practically doing him a favor by allowing him to send her money...or..book. In this regard, she was amazing" (pg. 104) L said it was "so pathetic"

    L said she had plenty of "suitors" and money to buy things from the jail "canteen"

    L amazed that State never used calls in third phase of trial- may never know- he would have- "there never a time when I thought Ms. Arias was deserving of the death penalty more than when I listened to her on theses calls" (pg. 105) and L against DP under "any circumstance"- said the murderer "sounded like a monster...[ she was] truly sickening to me"

    talks about friend Donovan- came to trial almost every day- murderer often called her

    -served as a "quasi-spokesperson"- they met in jail when housed together, not life-long friends

    - the murderer manipulated her into her personal assistant on outside

    - this made the murderer seem, to L, "like a very scary person in her ability to manipulate others"

    L thought if jurors heard calls, they would despise her- for crime and personal too

    "If I was the prosecutor on the case, I would have had Dr Demarte refer to these calls as examples that supported her diagnosis as doing so would have been a way to illustrate to the jury, perhaps without saying so, that Ms. Arias was a monster whose life needed to end. Fortunately for Ms. Arias, that never happened." (pg. 105)
    ================================================== ==============

    Chapter 20

    Ms. Arias' "Ninja Story"


    seemed like a "bull**** story" to L, but back then, couldn't prove it was a "bull**** story"

    if that was the murderer's story , he had to work with it at the time

    L didn't know when she was going to change the story- couldn't hold up case- had to prepare a case

    had to have murderer talk to experts anyway even with that story to see what they said

    "I had to try to minimize the damage that my client was doing to her own case...If..story was going to change...admit the 'ninja story' was not true.....the sooner the better."

    L states, to him, what happened on 6/4/2008 did not include ninjas "or any other person for that matter"

    L did not "vocalize these beliefs" to the murderer and did not "assert to her that I believed her 'ninja story' .....over time she began to sense that I did not believe this story"- she came, in time, to telling him different story

    "If she got up on the stand and told the 'ninja story' she would be found guilty of First Degree Murder and she would be sentenced to death" (pg. 108)

    L felt that the murderer believed that others would accept the "ninja story"- she could convince the jury that it was true

    L had to show her that "real people" would not accept her story, but couldn't disclose confidential material to them

    L did not need to have her permission to disclose evidence already in public

    with help of Mit Spec, showed class of undergrads CBS docu- gave them questionnaire- did they believe the "ninja story"?- no one believed it

    after- the murderer told story of self-defense- "ninja story" now dead

    L didn't believe the self defense story either- "You may notice ....Ms. Arias' revised version of events I have been using the word 'story' "

    had she revised her story sooner, before Samuels' meeting, he wouldn't have been attacked on stand

    always possibility that she wouldn't have changed story- needed to have her evaluated

    " ...I was trying to save Ms. Arias' life, yet at the same time she was trying to make it harder for me to do my job" (pg. 109)
    ================================================== ==========

    Next:

    Chapter 21
    The Murder Weapons

    Chapter 22
    Ms. Arias' Supposed Guilt Phase Witnesses
    ================================================== =============
    Y/N,

    Thank you so much for taking the time to share your insights of this book! I really appreciate all that you have done and continue to do!

    What is really amazing to me is that Nurmi recognizes just how manipulative JA is but refuses to acknowledge this is just the way she interacted with TA! Why can't he or won't he? I just don't understand. But yet and still, he is very harsh, IMO, of TA and his sex life and how he lived his life. There has been no one, not one, that ever voiced their concerns about TA's behavior.

    His assessment of TA is too harsh and very unfair. Again, MOO.

  4. #64
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    Maryland
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    What's with Nurmi and the incessant complaints that people don't show him enough gratitude? Jodi doesn't send so much as a card for saving her life, Sky Hughes hasn't thanked him for showing her the pedophile letters. He reminds me of my father-in-law who thought people should send thank-you notes to people who had sent them thank-you notes.
    We may have all come on different ships, but we're in the same boat now ~ Martin Luther King Jr.

  5. #65
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    Nov 2012
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    The land of bad juries
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    Quote Originally Posted by lewcch3 View Post
    Y/N,

    Thank you so much for taking the time to share your insights of this book! I really appreciate all that you have done and continue to do!

    What is really amazing to me is that Nurmi recognizes just how manipulative JA is but refuses to acknowledge this is just the way she interacted with TA! Why can't he or won't he? I just don't understand. But yet and still, he is very harsh, IMO, of TA and his sex life and how he lived his life. There has been no one, not one, that ever voiced their concerns about TA's behavior.

    His assessment of TA is too harsh and very unfair. Again, MOO.
    I read the book and I agree with you 100 percent. It is baffling to me how KN can't seem to fathom that dealing with JA was a real PITA for anyone. That, and how he knows she is a liar but we have to believe everything she says about the relationship. There is a real disconnect there.

  6. #66
    Working off Yes or No's excerpts:


    L "looked upon " TA "with sadness, not just because of how he died but because of how he lived"

    L believed that TA was "a slave to his image", "never being what he wanted to be"

    To L, TA cared much about what others thought of him

    - to appear he was doing well financially (he was not)

    -Ta hosted fight night parties, etc.- "demonstrated wealth"

    L was sad about TA's "morals and his spiritual beliefs...could tell that he was not truly living in the way he wanted to live"

    -L could tell "looks at a person's behavior to assess the kind of person they are"

    -states that TA didn't "act like he wanted to be a Mormon"

    _---------------_-_-----------




    OK. So Nurmi, after everything, now looks back at the man his client slaughtered and whose memory he helped defile, and.....pities him?

    But not for being victimized, tormented, and killed by his client. Nope. Because Nurmi feels he understands Travis well enough to say that Travis didn't really want to be Mormon, that Travis wasn't living the life he wanted, that even the generous and fun things Travis did like hosting parties at his house were a lie meant to demonstrate wealth Travis didn't have.

    I wouldn't have thought it possible. Not only is the killer never going to be satisfied with the pain she's caused, but her attorney isn't done vilifying Travis either.

    I guess he won't be satisfied until he's tried to sully or to destroy every single last thing that was wonderful or warm or remarkable about Travis.

    Like his client, again and again he reveals everything about himself in his attempt to strike back, and nothing at all about his target.
    RIP, Cassini. To her tireless overseers- job well done.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hope4More View Post
    Working off Yes or No's excerpts:


    L "looked upon " TA "with sadness, not just because of how he died but because of how he lived"

    L believed that TA was "a slave to his image", "never being what he wanted to be"

    To L, TA cared much about what others thought of him

    - to appear he was doing well financially (he was not)

    -Ta hosted fight night parties, etc.- "demonstrated wealth"

    L was sad about TA's "morals and his spiritual beliefs...could tell that he was not truly living in the way he wanted to live"

    -L could tell "looks at a person's behavior to assess the kind of person they are"

    -states that TA didn't "act like he wanted to be a Mormon"

    _---------------_-_-----------




    OK. So Nurmi, after everything, now looks back at the man his client slaughtered and whose memory he helped defile, and.....pities him?

    But not for being victimized, tormented, and killed by his client. Nope. Because Nurmi feels he understands Travis well enough to say that Travis didn't really want to be Mormon, that Travis wasn't living the life he wanted, that even the generous and fun things Travis did like hosting parties at his house were a lie meant to demonstrate wealth Travis didn't have.

    I wouldn't have thought it possible. Not only is the killer never going to be satisfied with the pain she's caused, but her attorney isn't done vilifying Travis either.

    I guess he won't be satisfied until he's tried to sully or to destroy every single last thing that was wonderful or warm or remarkable about Travis.

    Like his client, again and again he reveals everything about himself in his attempt to strike back, and nothing at all about his target.
    I think he's trying to convince people he didn't believe Travis deserved what happened to him when in fact that's exactly what he believes.
    We may have all come on different ships, but we're in the same boat now ~ Martin Luther King Jr.

  8. #68
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    purple bbm are my comments

    Quote Originally Posted by YESorNO View Post
    Trapped with Ms. Arias

    Chapter 16

    The Letters


    L thinks this was mistake- State could have convinced jury that they were forged- " I believe if they had Ms. Arias would be on death row as you read this"

    oh, so if the jury saw the forged letters, and heard the horrible phone calls, jodi would be on death row right now. so actually instead of nurmi being so proud for getting her life w/o parole, shouldn't he be crediting juan for not admitting that stuff into evidence? can't have it both ways nurmi!
    ================================================== ============

    Chapter 17

    The Phone Sex Tapes


    "What I got was unbelievable"

    "This was a recording of a conversation Mr. Alexander had with Ms. Arias, the woman who would wind up killing him within a month of having this conversation with him"


    talk was about "mundane things" in beginning (traveling, business, etc)- TA said he had intentions to visit the murderer in Yreka ("Does one visit their crazy ex-girlfriend who is stalking them?")

    or maybe travis was just telling her he would so she wouldn't get mad, then later have 'something come up' and not make it?

    their conversation-talked about Abe -"someone who likely dated" the murderer and kissed her- TA not happy- Ta wanted to "whip Abe's 'A'" because kissed "his girlfriend"

    "The fact that Ms. Arias was not Mr. Alexander's girlfriend at the time of the kiss didn't seem to matter to Mr. Alexander"

    this part of "the sex tape" was very important to L

    "..because it told me that Mr. Alexander seemingly had a violent streak because he had expressed a desire to be violent with Abe."

    or maybe he was showing a bit of machismo to impress her, you know talking like a tough guy, like most men do... 'yeah i'll kick his...'

    TA said something in tape unbelievable to L- "He said that Ms. Arias' orgasm sounded like a 12 year old girl having her first orgasm...Ms. Arias was shocked as well"- then "Mr. Alexander repeated himself" and then said "something to the effect of 'it was like corking the pot of a 12 year old' "

    okay when I first heard it? i said THE EXACT SAME THING to my brother who was watching with me, 'omg she sounds like a little girl' and i thought SHE was kinda the sick one for trying to sound that way, cuz you know she was faking it, so why would she even do that? moan naturally you freaky broad. quit trying to act so 'innocent' when you squeal. she wasn't shocked either that he said that.

    L said, before trial, before everyone hated the murderer, "What would you think if you heard Mr. Alexander saying this on tape before he had been killed?... about anyone who said this? Would you think they were a pedophile?"

    NO! omg i say way darker stuff than that all the time... i don't mean it~!

    "If someone made these comments to you would you let them be alone with your daughter?"

    should i be left alone with my daughter for saying the same thing about her baby moans? seriously...

    "facts are stubborn things"

    "It is a fact that Mr. Alexander said these things on tape."
    ================================================== ========
    after reading this excerpt, i forgot who was on trial here again... i'm wondering if my boyfriend died, and they got my texts and saw one from me saying 'if you are late for dinner i'm gonna kick your butt!, or even KILL YOU! my bf would know i was joking and i would be relaying it in a joking way... if i had mr. nurmi the mind reading, language expert, defending me, i'm sure he'd write a book saying i was sexually abused because i'm emulating language my dead pedophile dad told my mother (all quasi psychobabble), and then in another chapter say i had violent tendencies.

    well if he thought he was going to get on the 'good side' of the 'haters' (the jodi haters), i think he just alienated both sides with this discombobulated make your mind up mess he calls a book.

    but thanks for the summaries YESorNO!!!! appreciate em!~
    Last edited by MistyM; 11-29-2015 at 05:21 AM.
    OCCAM'S RAZOR : "All other things being equal, the simplest solution is the best."

  9. #69
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    YesorNo, continuing thanks for your reportage on this horrendous 1/3 of a book. IMHO, he's trying so hard to get the approbation (best word I can think of at the moment) from both the Jodi lovers and haters. So far, he seems to be alienating both groups. That's pretty much where he stood during the trial(s). No mind-changing or pity for him so far.

    What will we find out in books 2 and 3? Or, is he waiting on social media to decide how well he's convinced him before he even pens these?
    The greatest trespasser on justice still wishes it done to him.

    EDWARD COUNSEL, Maxims

  10. #70
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    Trapped with Ms. Arias

    Chapter 21

    The Murder Weapons


    weapons- gun, knife, never entered into evidence, never found ( "or so I believed")

    questions: "where did they come from...where now"

    answers "may not mean that much to my case"

    "If the knife used to kill Mr. Alexander was the knife found in Mr. Alexander's dishwasher it was never identified as the murder weapon....[knife] could be lying somewhere in the desert, it could be in a landfill somewhere, heck it could be anywhere" (pg. 110)

    L didn't care about finding knife - could only hurt the murderer's defense (especially if knife used was not from TA's house and brought it with her- no self-defense there)

    L talks more about the knife if found- fingerprints or not

    The gun- "meaningless" also to him, but hoped it was never identified, although if found, maybe it wasn't grandpa's gun and would support murderer's story

    But grandpa's gun was antique and same caliber as gun that shot TA

    could not ever be proven that gun used was TA's

    "Given the evidence I had at the time, there would be no way to link a gun found discarded near the Grand Canyon and determined to be the murder weapon ever belonged to Mr. Alexander." (pg. 112)

    L stated, even if found a gun- she still shot, stabbed TA 27 times - "...regardless of whose gun it was, she still went to great lengths to kill him as opposed to 'protecting herself' as she claimed"

    L was concerned if gun was found to be grandpa's and tied to casing found in bathroom

    L didn't think grandpa would remember specific gun that was stolen from house, but he might be able to identify it- would prove that the murderer wasa liar- nothing new, but would add more to "the pile of lies she told"

    L wasn't going to look for gun
    ================================================== =====

    Chapter 22

    Ms. Arias' Supposed Guilt Phase Witnesses


    after is trial, the murderer went on TV- interview

    she "complained about how certain people could have testified that they had seen bruises on her arm and I chose not to call them as witnesses"

    she did not provide why L didn't call "these supposed witnesses....she chose to portray herself as a victim"

    L wasn't happy about what she said- could not respond- still her atty- case not over

    L upset that she gave interview- caused damage to case- she was lying about him too- he could not respond

    today, L happy she did interview in public- he can talk because it's not "privileged information"- she waived it herself when she did public interview

    who were witnesses and why not use them?

    -only had 1 actual witness with decent testimony, but he came "with too much baggage"- even if what he said was true, people wouldn't believe him anyway

    -his list witnesses were: her mother, former boyfriend Matt, and "two other men whose name I will keep to myself so as to keep them out of this mess"

    Matt was the "actual witness"- he claimed to have seen bruises on arm- couldn't remember when

    But problem with him being witness- in States' mind, he had something to do with letters

    Det Flores went to Matt's house to see if he could find evidence of forged letters and such- didn't find any

    also, JM "would be allowed to state that Matt was willing to lie " about the bruises because he also helped her with the forged letters- then they would have to discuss actual letters

    L thought that any discussion would make the murderer out to "look like a crazy person who took elaborate steps to slander Mr. Alexander's character by creating these letters" (pg. 114)

    would also make Matt look like liar about bruising

    Matt on stand- one step closer to death row- his job to save murderer's life

    murderer's mother- she would lie for her and badly- she lied to L about seeing bruising on murderer's arm

    -- met mother in Public Defender's reception office over a weekend ( the murderer told L that he should speak to mother about bruising- L thought "I smell a rat")

    L didn't like mother- she accused him of being unethical when he wanted to leave and start own practice

    --L stated mother was "juvenile, rude and untrustworthy"

    --mother and murderer on 1 jail call- mother called L's wife "skinny *****" (after son Carl and his wife met L in Las Vegas)- mother never met L's wife- L's wife only said hello to Carl and his wife

    --after L updated mother about case, answered any questions she had, he ask her if he had seen any bruises on murderer's arm- L "found it funny" that he had to ask her- when he asked her "it was like a thought bubble went on above her head reading 'Oh yeah, I forgot to tell him about seeing bruises, Jodi wanted me to tell him that' " (pg. 117) - she said yes

    --L asked where/when on arm? she " 'couldn't remember' "- inability to answer more questions and body language, to L, she was lying- knew jury would reach same conclusion

    --JM could bring in jail call recordings- calls "were awful"

    another witness- man L will call "Frank"

    --murderer claims that she met "Frank" and another guy at PPL meeting, Tempe, Fla- both men noticed bruises on her arm- "Frank" made joke that TA beating/bruising her

    --L had real names of "Frank" and the other man

    --L and "my former Co-counsel" drove to outskirts of Phoenix to see the other man (not "Frank") - he wasn't home- out of town for few months (according to neighbor)- put his card on screen door

    --other man called L "right back" ("even though he was out of state") before they got back to Phoenix- did not recall any convo with the murderer about bruising and "joke", TA beating murderer- claimed "Frank" was on other side of room when he did speak to her, but not about bruising

    -needed to contact "Frank"- "real 'Frank" had a common name and was not easy to track down"- never found him- "I never held any delusions that he would have been helpful to Ms. Arias' case, in fact, I really sensed that just the opposite was true"

    the murderer "remained either convinced that this person could set her free or that my failure to find him is reason enough to have her conviction overturned" (pg. 120)- the "quest to find 'Frank" goes on"
    ================================================== ========

    Next:

    Chapter 23
    Witness Interviews With the State's Guilt Phase Witnesses

    Chapter 24
    The State's Interview With Ms. Arias' Actual Guilt Phase Witnesses
    End of Section 3 (pg 139)
    ================================================== =============
    ----------------------

    Travis Alexander (1977-2008)

    Teghan Alyssa Skiba (RIP sweet baby)
    -------------------------
    No one can make you feel inferior without your consent. -Eleanor Roosevelt

    Let us be kind to one another, for most of us are fighting a hard battle. - Ian MacLaren

    The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it - Flannery O'connor


  11. #71
    Madeleine74's Avatar
    Madeleine74 is offline Of course it's my opinion; who else's would it be?
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    "L" should have kept his opinions about TA, i.e. "the real victim" to himself. He has no place to judge Travis or even try to delve into TA's psyche. They were strangers and they will always be strangers. "L's" only job was to provide a defense to his client and basically keep her off of death row. That was probably going to happen regardless, given the makeup of the juries. And even if she did get a death penalty, she wouldn't be executed anyway, at least not for decades, if ever.

    His only comments should be on what he knows for sure, which is how he tried his case, how he dealt with his client, the trial from his perspective. Whether or not TA was or wasn't living an authentic life has no bearing on his murder and doesn't give anyone mitigating factors for killing him since TA wasn't attacking anyone and certainly not the day he was killed.

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Madeleine74 View Post
    "L" should have kept his opinions about TA, i.e. "the real victim" to himself. He has no place to judge Travis or even try to delve into TA's psyche. They were strangers and they will always be strangers. "L's" only job was to provide a defense to his client and basically keep her off of death row. That was probably going to happen regardless, given the makeup of the juries. And even if she did get a death penalty, she wouldn't be executed anyway, at least not for decades, if ever.

    His only comments should be on what he knows for sure, which is how he tried his case, how he dealt with his client, the trial from his perspective. Whether or not TA was or wasn't living an authentic life has no bearing on his murder and doesn't give anyone mitigating factors for killing him since TA wasn't attacking anyone and certainly not the day he was killed.

    Amen.
    RIP, Cassini. To her tireless overseers- job well done.

  13. #73
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    Here's a coo-coo for you:

    The Defense Attorney (Kirk Nurmi)
    My Take On L. Kirk Nurmiís Book Ö


    "Before I begin this blog, there is one thing I want to make clear: I do not know Jodi Arias, Iíve never met her, Iíve never written to her. I simply want to set the record straight.

    I only know from what I have found out, that Jodi wasnít at the scene when Travis Alexander was murdered, and she didnít kill anyone, most certainly she did not murder Travis Alexander. She has been the victim of a false prosecution and she should not be in prison..."

    https://trialbypictures.wordpress.co...ey-kirk-nurmi/
    ----------------------

    Travis Alexander (1977-2008)

    Teghan Alyssa Skiba (RIP sweet baby)
    -------------------------
    No one can make you feel inferior without your consent. -Eleanor Roosevelt

    Let us be kind to one another, for most of us are fighting a hard battle. - Ian MacLaren

    The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it - Flannery O'connor

  14. #74
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    Wait! There's one more about the book: (really- her whole website is laughable, IMO)

    The Presumption of Guilt

    "As clearly stated in L. Kirk Nurmi’s book, there was absolutely NO presumption of innocence for Jodi Ann Arias, it never existed. He somehow ‘KNEW’ for a fact that Jodi was guilty and from start to finish and beyond. That was and is his position...

    There was a far better way to handle Jodi Arias’ case appropriately. Using this approach might even have resulted in a verdict of not guilty, or better yet, for the case to be thrown out of Court for cause...."

    https://trialbypictures.wordpress.co...tion-of-guilt/
    ----------------------

    Travis Alexander (1977-2008)

    Teghan Alyssa Skiba (RIP sweet baby)
    -------------------------
    No one can make you feel inferior without your consent. -Eleanor Roosevelt

    Let us be kind to one another, for most of us are fighting a hard battle. - Ian MacLaren

    The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it - Flannery O'connor

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by YESorNO View Post
    Wait! There's one more about the book: (really- her whole website is laughable, IMO)

    The Presumption of Guilt

    "As clearly stated in L. Kirk Nurmiís book, there was absolutely NO presumption of innocence for Jodi Ann Arias, it never existed. He somehow ĎKNEWí for a fact that Jodi was guilty and from start to finish and beyond. That was and is his position...

    There was a far better way to handle Jodi Ariasí case appropriately. Using this approach might even have resulted in a verdict of not guilty, or better yet, for the case to be thrown out of Court for cause...."

    https://trialbypictures.wordpress.co...tion-of-guilt/

    RIP, Cassini. To her tireless overseers- job well done.

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