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  1. #1

    Inconsistencies: Making Murderer vs The Innocent Killer

    Hi Everyone,

    I know everyone has been watching & re-watching Making a Murderer on Netflix. Has anyone else read the book The Innocent Killer by Michael Griesbach?

    I'm pretty miffed as to how there can be some pretty obvious inconsistencies between a documentary actually showing us a firsthand account of what happened & then this book, written by Wisconsin prosecuting attorney, more accurately, a Manitowoc County ADA Michael Griesbach, who now also serves on the board of the Innocence Project.

    So, here are some of my questions:

    Halbach's Key:
    In the book, Griesbach states that one the third sweep of Avery's home, Lenk & Colborn moved the bookcase & a "set of keys" came falling out.
    In the doc, we are shown a single key on a fabric keychain (which we are then told the insane thought that the ONLY DNA found on the key & keychain was that of Avery...)
    Also, in the doc, the prosecution states that Avery's sweat was on the keychain, making it impossible for them to have planted because, as Kratz states, "Do the cops have a vial of Avery's sweat to plant?"
    However, in the book, Griesbach states that the DNA found on the keychain was Avery's skin cells, which could have easily been applied by a gloved hand rubbing the fabric keychain on any number of surfaces in Avery's home, including the slippers that were located next to the place the key was allegedly found.
    The doc also states that the key was found on the seventh entry, where the book says the third.

    Avery's Girlfriend:
    In the book, Avery's girlfriend Carla Schwartz is arrested after driving her car into a ditch, giving her her fifth DUI.
    In the doc, we see Avery's girlfriend Jodi Stachowski in jail for DUI, get released, have a few awkward conversations on the phone with Avery & eventually get... nudged out(?) by her parole officer?
    I guess Jodi Stachowski & Carla Schwartz are the same person? Any insight?

    The Blood Vial:
    In the doc, we watch the defense team open up a “sealed” evidence box. I don’t know where they are other than they seem to be in a back room somewhere & are opening the case on a hard plastic rolling cart. They find the cracked seal, open up the box & discover the pin hole.
    In the book, Griesbach states that the vial of blood was among the paper files, crammed into a box (I’m assuming the unsealed cardboard box we see in the doc) left out, unprotected in the Clerk’s office. This can’t be right, if the vial was left out in an open cardboard box, the doc would have definitely made a point of it, right? That’s a MASSIVE difference! How can we have watched them open up this evidence box & not have it mentioned that it was sitting in that open cardboard box.

    I’m about ¾ of the way through the book, so there is still time, but as of now many of my burning questions were left unanswered by the book. I still don’t understand how many things have been brushed over;
    Did anyone ever think to put a word out & call on the rest of the town to ask for any type of surveillance footage from around the town? Did no one say anything when she was reported missing? Did anyone look to see if she was seen on any security footage or traffic camera or anything anywhere to see if she in fact did leave?
    No one looked at anyone else as a potential suspect. It’s touched on in the slightest bit, but if you ask me, there are a lot of other suspicious characters involved both on the side of Avery & on the side of Halbach that seem much more likely suspects than Avery does. Buting points to this in episode 5 whilst discussing the voicemails on Halbach’s phone & brought up the roommate who didn’t even tell anyone she didn’t come back from a job at a convicted sex offenders house that she was apparently nervous about?- what happened with that? The ex-boyfriend who can’t possibly remember what time of day he last saw Halbach? The Co-worker who was so worried about the random calls that she wouldn’t tell him who it was calling her? The Brother….? Anyone who magically guessed her passwords? The two who planned the search & all but pointed Pam & Nicole Stern in the direction of the car & gave a camera & a map to…?
    There seems to be no regard to “conflict of interest” or recusal of anyone in Manitowoc? Everyone has their hands in everything! Strang mentions it in episode 5 in court, but then that’s it. Manitowoc wasn’t supposed to be there, but, Woops! They were & good thing because they’re the ones that found evidence. Please.
    The unbelievably horrible woman filming the search of Avery’s home saying they should take his shoes to PLANT FOOTPRINTS at the scene of any unsolved burglaries - HELLO?!
    The issue of Dassey saying the story he told was really that of Kiss the Girls & don’t we think it’s probably more likely that he watched the movie & not that he read the book?
    The unprofessionalism of Kratz (touched on in the book) when he speaks out to the media in such disgusting detail as if it were gospel & the “slip up” in court where he blatantly refers to Halbach as “this little girl, excuse me, not this little girl, this young woman” to obviously manipulate the jury’s heartstrings
    The fact that THERE IS NO BLOOD IN THE BEDROOM!
    - Earl Avery, Steven’s brother recently spoke out on Access Hollywood & mentioned this & other points.
    & many others. (all of which I’d love to discuss further)

    The book is a little bit hard to discern at time. Griesbach is clearly sure of Avery & Dassey’s guilt, but does clearly project his views on the insanity behind so many aspects. Most of the meat of the book is focused on the initial incarceration of Avery for the assault of Penny Beernsten & not a close play by play of the arrest, trial & conviction of Avery for the murder of Teresa Halbach.
    Griesbach openly expresses his admiration of Lenk, Colborn & Kusche, peppering in anecdotes of them (especially the late Gene Kusche), but then discounts his legitimacy as a composite sketch artist & points out how weird it is that he not only was so proud of his sketch that he actually got a judge to release the sketch to him which he showcased in a frame in the doc & according to the book, had hanging in his home, but that he must have realized how unlawful the entire timeline of the sketch was.

    As anyone else read the book? I’m curious to see what anyone else thinks.

  2. #2
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    I have not read the book, so I don't have much to add. And after hearing so much about it... I doubt I'll ever read it LOL

    If anyone is interested... or bored.... https://www.facebook.com/theinnocentkiller1 He posts on there quite often too, answering questions. I see he is wrong more than once about the facts though lol I wonder if he has started to read the transcripts yet? haha

  3. #3
    He was actually on both the dateline special & the ID channel special recently, as well


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  4. #4
    Ps: thanks, missy1974 for reading all of that. I think I got a little carried away & need to learn to edit!


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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoodbyeKitty27 View Post
    Ps: thanks, missy1974 for reading all of that. I think I got a little carried away & need to learn to edit!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Hi GoodbyeKitty! Two minor things. First, I think when he was talking about the box that contained the blood vial and court files he was discussing the larger box the entire case file was stored in. I was a large (3x2x2) box. In that box were all the court documents, transcripts and evidence boxes, including the box that contained the vial of blood. Second, the female officer said they should collect the shoes to see if they matched any unsolved B&E's. But that comment alone, along with her remarks about him not making it to the exoneree luncheon just shows their utter contempt for Avery.

  6. #6
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    Hi Kitty

    I haven't read the book, but yes Jodi and Carla are the same person.

    I disregard anything Jodi says, she's changed her tune and she smiled all the time in the doco. Who could smile when something like that had happened. She just liked her time in the limelight. And probably got paid for the later interview.

  7. #7
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    I haven't read the book, but wow...Those mistakes make me wonder if he even wrote it. I mean seriously...what the heck...

  8. #8
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    My hubby is driving me bonkers with this story. The only other crime story he has bothered with is OJ and Caylee Anthony. I haven't read enough to even form an opinion, but I'm enjoying reading the other members takes on it. I'm on DSL and it's fast, but my Netflix refreshes so much I can't get into the second episode.
    Media thread for Abby and Libby.


    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...5#post13163455

    WebSleuths Lingo thread.

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...bsleuths-Lingo

    Unless I provide a link, every one of my posts are to be considered rumor, Speculation, or simply MY OWN OPINION.

    We are the watchers. We are witnesses. We see what has gone before. We see what happens now, at this dangerous moment in human history. We see what's going to happen - what will surely happen - unless we come together: we - the Peoples of all Nations - to restore peace and harmony and balance to the Earth, our Mother.


    THE IGNORE BUTTON IS YOUR FRIEND!

  9. #9
    Sinsaint: I just can't believe that even if the crushed evidence box containing the blood vial was in that cardboard box, they didn't make more of a point of it in the doc.
    Re: the comment about the shoes, I may have misheard, I've watched it three times & went to rewatching some parts last night to fact check myself & I admit I didn't get to that part last night. I do remember, however the disgust I had for the laughter & unprofessionalism & especially considering she's filming!!! She KNOWS she will be heard saying that! It's insane!


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  10. #10
    LifeCitizen: thank you for clarifying. I feel a little silly but I wasn't aware when reading the book & thought it was a weird overlap of girlfriends! She is def scummy & probably only wanted to be with him at all for the cash out, but that's my opinion in this moment & is not to be taken as slander toward her, so I digress.


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  11. #11
    Bodester413: I wonder if he wrote it not thinking it would become such a huge case. To them, it was old news that has now blown up. If you are interested in the case I do suggest reading it. It's just something to consider, especially since there is a lot of information re: the first case & for nothing more than morbid curiosity (which none of us shy from, I'm sure) to hear a different perspective. Also interesting to try to figure out what the hell he really believes happened!


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  12. #12
    Tulessa: in driving my boyf crazy with it, too. He's not at all a TC nut, but he's patient as a saint & lets me go on & on about it!!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    curiouser & curiouser...


  13. #13
    GoodbyeKitty:

    I live in Wisconsin and remember the Avery case at the time he was being tried for the murder of TH. We only had Madison, WI news channels at the time, and they glossed over the story....only giving basic info that Avery was exonerated in a rape case by DNA but found guilty of the murder of TH. So, at the time, I assumed they must have had rock solid DNA evidence regarding the murder, since they had DNA evidence regarding the rape. Life went on and I forgot about the whole thing until "Making a Murderer" came to Netflix. I binge watched the first 3 episodes in December. I watched episode 4 and 5 recently, but it took me a while to get back to it because I was so disgusted with what I saw in the first three. It is very disturbing to me that this can happen. I just can't wrap my head around the lack of professionalism, the obvious disregard for truth and the obvious targeting of a suspect. Ken Kratz makes me the sickest of all. I can't stand his whiny voice and for him to say that he is now a "changed man" is bulls**t!!

    The fact that the head prosecutor admits to having a drug problem (and losing his license to practice law) should be a reason for Avery to at least get a new trial. I don't know weather Avery is guilty or innocent, but if all court cases are like this one, anyone charged with a crime could be railroaded like this! Thanks for your post, I might just have to read the book!

  14. #14
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    Welcome to websleuths Scarlett2k!

    And thanks for giving us a locals perspective.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by GoodbyeKitty27 View Post
    Bodester413: I wonder if he wrote it not thinking it would become such a huge case. To them, it was old news that has now blown up. If you are interested in the case I do suggest reading it. It's just something to consider, especially since there is a lot of information re: the first case & for nothing more than morbid curiosity (which none of us shy from, I'm sure) to hear a different perspective. Also interesting to try to figure out what the hell he really believes happened!


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    Good point. That very well could be. I probably will read it eventually. I wish I would have payed more attention to it back when it happened. I remember that press conference when they told what they thought had happened. It was just so horrible. I deliberately stopped keeping up with it after that....although that was almost impossible if you lived anyplace in Wisconsin. It was just everywhere.

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