904 users online (244 members and 660 guests)  


Websleuths News


Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 79
  1. #31
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Pure Michigan
    Posts
    2,035
    THIS, is why I love you!

    Missy, it makes no sense because IMO, they all had to scramble as they went along.

    We have found this with Narratives, BD statements, Searches, why should it be ANY different with EVIDENCE logs?!?!

    Again, just my 2 pennies.
    Quote Originally Posted by missy1974 View Post
    sorry Zool... I should have referenced it. In cross of Groffy, Day 10 Page 64.

    Q. It was locked or unlocked?

    A. The driver's door was unlocked when I got there.

    Q. Okay. The other doors were locked?

    A. Yes, the other doors were locked.

    Q. And that would be actually four more doors, correct, including the rear?

    A. That's correct, four doors.

    Q. Now, if I understand, what you did was, by opening the driver's side door, you were able to sort of reach over and, with your gloves, unlock the front passenger side door first, right?

    A. That's correct, I did that.

    Q. And then from that location, that position on either side, front and passenger, you were able to easily reach around and unlock the rear driver and passenger side doors.

    A. That's correct, I unlocked those doors.

    Q. And then you were able to open all four of those doors, wide open, for taking pictures and what not?

    A. That is absolutely correct.


    You can continue on reading from there, but it is never clarified how that rear door was open although Buting says 4 more doors including the rear.... well that rear door doesn't just magically open from the inside. What I did gather is.... not all of those pictures were taken on the same day, and somewhere in one of these threads I actually figured out what pics were taken on what day. But I think it is fairly certain that they had that rear cargo door open on the 6th of November, at the latest the 7th. Why? because we know they did presumptive blood tests back there, the spatter on the inside door, TH's blood, etc.

  2. #32
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Pure Michigan
    Posts
    2,035
    Maybe??

    Or maybe someone is fudging the truth??
    Quote Originally Posted by RANCH View Post
    Maybe they hooked the battery cable up to use the door lock switch. Or maybe the Rav4 has an inside manual door lock (no handle though) on the rear door like my Explorer has. JMO

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    Chicagoland
    Posts
    2,705
    Quote Originally Posted by ZOOL View Post
    Thanks, zerbert! Do you have any idea what those two items between the parking light assembly and the crumpled paper are? The darker, cylindrical one looks like a lipstick container and the other, longer thing looks as if it's some sort of thumb-dropper (if my choice of wording will suffice??)

    ETA
    ah yes! Calumet lists the light as driver's side blinker, item 9577
    Thanks for making me go back and look at that car! I firmly believe she hit the deer. I'm guessing she went back to Avery's afterward to see if she could find a replacement lens. After all, she would have to visit a junkyard at some point to replace it. With the cost of Toyota len's, I doubt very much she would have gone to a dealer.

    You can see carnage in the picture---look very closely at the crack in the bumper--you can see flesh sticking out. Someone wouldn't have been hit with her own car, would they?? Gruesome thought, I know.


    Attached Images Attached Images

  4. #34
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Pure Michigan
    Posts
    2,035
    Exactly.

    Quote Originally Posted by missy1974 View Post
    Obviously. But no one testified to doing that, and Groffy never testified to even trying the automatic door lock first thing Sunday morning and discovering the battery disconnected. Stahlke "discovered" it.

    Either way, I'm now convinced that they did have a key or had one made, which explains 05-205 8037 key copy for Toyota Rav in the evidence log IMO It does not explain why the other key, the one found in SA's bedroom, is not in the evidence list.

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Sacramento CA
    Posts
    8,715
    Quote Originally Posted by BigCityAccountant View Post
    Thanks for making me go back and look at that car! I firmly believe she hit the deer. I'm guessing she went back to Avery's afterward to see if she could find a replacement lens. After all, she would have to visit a junkyard at some point to replace it. With the cost of Toyota len's, I doubt very much she would have gone to a dealer.

    You can see carnage in the picture---look very closely at the crack in the bumper--you can see flesh sticking out. Someone wouldn't have been hit with her own car, would they?? Gruesome thought, I know.



    I was a passenger in my brothers Ranger pickup when we hit a deer on the front driver's side.

    Way more damage was sustained than what is seen in this photo.

    This is very minor damage in my opinion.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    SK, Canada
    Posts
    3,678
    I have thought about her hitting a deer many times.... and a few weeks ago, one of the guys at work hit a deer on his way to work (on a highway). He had a bit more damage, and dang, I wish I had taken a picture! LOL There was little deer hairs stuck on the vehicle.... totally made me think of you BCA LOL Butttttt I didn't see any scrapes like I see on TH's vehicle. At one time I thought maybe it happened while someone was driving it to it's hiding spot... but then it doesn't make any sense that the light cover is in the RAV4 and propping up the rear seats. That wasn't someone throwing it in the back.... that was someone placing it under those seats for purpose. It's all very confusing LOL

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Location
    Chicagoland
    Posts
    2,705
    Quote Originally Posted by missy1974 View Post
    I have thought about her hitting a deer many times.... and a few weeks ago, one of the guys at work hit a deer on his way to work (on a highway). He had a bit more damage, and dang, I wish I had taken a picture! LOL There was little deer hairs stuck on the vehicle.... totally made me think of you BCA LOL Butttttt I didn't see any scrapes like I see on TH's vehicle. At one time I thought maybe it happened while someone was driving it to it's hiding spot... but then it doesn't make any sense that the light cover is in the RAV4 and propping up the rear seats. That wasn't someone throwing it in the back.... that was someone placing it under those seats for purpose. It's all very confusing LOL
    LOL--I have seen both--just catching a snip of a deer and total front ends completely damaged. I think it depends of how fast your going and how much breaking time before impact. But the location is concerning. The deer would have to be coming from the driver's side because there is no damage to the passenger side. So, if that is the case-the deer had to travel across 1 lane of traffic before she hit it. Unless she was preoccupied with something else, she should have seen it hop into the oncoming traffic lane. Which could also be the reason, it was only minimal damage.

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    SK, Canada
    Posts
    3,678
    Quote Originally Posted by zerbert View Post
    I'm not sure what the crumpled looking paper is. If you're talking about the very dark cylinder looking thing above the pencil, I think that's where the seats fasten to on the floor. You can sorta kinda see it on this walkaround here. https://youtu.be/j92xU4r_w10?t=3m56s And agreed, the square thing is a camera card, and I don't think the contents were ever made public, were they? Or even entered into evidence? *boggle*
    The crumpled up paper is a granola bar wrapper.... I hadn't noticed the hole in the floor between the pencil and the seats... by the looks of it, it would be for the seat belt for the seat behind the drivers seat.... but where is the seat belt??? That is kinda weird that it would be missing.

    And yes the square thing is an SD card, I have yet to see if there was anything on the card, but it could just be that we have not seen it yet. Also.... just a note.... that little card had the name "Teresa" written on it, one of the officers testified to seeing that through the tinted window on Nov 5th.

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    591
    Quote Originally Posted by BigCityAccountant View Post
    Thanks for making me go back and look at that car! I firmly believe she hit the deer. I'm guessing she went back to Avery's afterward to see if she could find a replacement lens. After all, she would have to visit a junkyard at some point to replace it. With the cost of Toyota len's, I doubt very much she would have gone to a dealer.

    You can see carnage in the picture---look very closely at the crack in the bumper--you can see flesh sticking out. Someone wouldn't have been hit with her own car, would they?? Gruesome thought, I know.
    BCA -- The gunk on the passenger's side windshield-vertical certainly seems suspicious. In addition, the trajectory of the circled impact points implies that the same, large object collided with the car. A deer would be a logical conclusion. I do not recall any testimony citing a detailed examination of the collision's marks. I suppose that testimony would have been part of the Nov 6 - 7 examinations.

    gunk.JPG
    gunk2.JPG
    gunk3.JPG
    Last edited by ZOOL; 03-22-2016 at 08:47 AM.

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    SK, Canada
    Posts
    3,678
    Zool ~ I do not think you will find a detailed examination. IIRC the only testimony about the damage was just acknowledging that it was damaged when the RAV4 sat for hours on the 5th on the Avery lot. I don't think there was any other testimony from the lab about any testing or really.... anything else about it. We do have another thread specific to the RAV4 if you are interested http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...hp?300114-Rav4 We discussed the damage, the location, the contents of the RAV4, etc.


  11. #41
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    591
    Missy -- I suppose speculation about the time of the collision is probably more important than anything else. Perhaps the cellphone records would show a call from TH to ....who knows? I imagine most people would make a call. Also, was there any testimony about a deer? When you take into consideration, the trajectory of the circled impact areas in BAC's photo, it certainly seems logical that a rather large object collided with the RAV4 and left some gunky looking organic stuff. I have to admit that some times I lost interest in the transcript and skimmed sections which bored me. So...I guess keywording "deer" is now in order, huh?
    Last edited by ZOOL; 03-22-2016 at 09:01 AM.

  12. #42
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    591
    Quote Originally Posted by ZOOL View Post
    BCA -- The gunk on the passenger's side windshield-vertical driver's side headlight compartment certainly seems suspicious. In addition, the trajectory of the circled impact points implies that the same, large object collided with the car. A deer would be a logical conclusion. I do not recall any testimony citing a detailed examination of the collision's marks. I suppose that testimony would have been part of the Nov 6 - 7 examinations.

    gunk.JPG
    gunk2.JPG
    gunk3.JPG

    *click individual image for enlarged view
    This is just a correction to my previous post due to my inability to edit within the allotted time frame. My earlier post foolishly described the first image's location.

  13. #43
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Somewhere in the Summertime - UK
    Posts
    180
    I am sure the Deer back story is Red Herring. The key things for me are the first two interviews in the back of the O'Neill's police car, which were not under caution. Both Avery and Dassey are trying to formulate a narrative to throw officers off the scent.

    I have posted this elsewhere, but listen to Dassey responding to questions and what he offers without prompting.

    Dassey interview audio:
    Transcript:http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-co...-2005Nov06.pdf

    I would urge people to listen whilst reading. The detail is damning and Brendan is not the 'Slow Kid' he becomes in later interviews.

    And Avery can remember the exact details of the denomination of notes he uses to pay TH, but cannot describe what she looks like or the colour of her hair, nor what she or he was wearing that day?

    Avery first conversation with O'Neill: https://youtu.be/m-5ZUFmV2lU
    Written report: http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-co...-2005Nov05.pdf

    Guilty. The pair of them.
    We are not all born equal so Justice always has to be.

  14. #44
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    591
    Quote Originally Posted by missy1974 View Post
    Attachment 89198

    I don't think the red car was drivable, don't even think it had tires. This picture shows just how close it was to the car beside it.
    Missy ~ Rather than "towed", this image implies to me that the RAV4 was moved to that location with a flatbed wrecker, then left in a position with its rear opposite the red car's front. Such an inference would then explain why the investigation has Exhibit 63 -- that is, a picture of the Avery Junkyard flatbed. Thus it may also lead to further speculation that TH phoned Avery's Junkyard for road assistance. Consequently the phone records again become instrumental. For example, a call would have gone to the main office. This then suggests that either Earl or Charles could have become involved. So at that point the Denny third-party liability evidence which the Court (and the Appeal) refused on the grounds that a direct connection could not be made between the third person and the crime (see paragraph 38, page 19 State v Avery (Opinion) - 2011 - August - 24) becomes relevant provided that TH's cellphone record shows a call to Avery's Junkyard preferably sometime after 3:30 pm.

    Attachment 90915

  15. #45
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    591
    Quote Originally Posted by Hoosen_Fenger View Post
    I am sure the Deer back story is Red Herring...<SBM>
    Hooawn Fenger ~ At the moment, I tend to agree. According to Day 4, Trial Transcripts, ppg. 19 - 22, Bobby Dassey and Mike Osmunson acquired a fresh deer on the night of Nov 3. Under cross examination, Att. Strang confirms that date by drawing Bobby's attention to Exhibit 123, a deer tag dated Nov 4. The implication here is that their fresh road kill can not be a possible source of a collision between TH's RAV4 and a deer on the afternoon of Oct. 31.

Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 ... LastLast


Similar Threads

  1. List of Prosecution Evidence*** LIST ONLY **NO DISCUSSION**
    By daisy7 in forum George Zimmerman Trial/Trayvon Martin
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 05-24-2012, 01:03 AM
  2. Let's List Evidence That Ties Casey To The Crime Scene...
    By Cayleefan in forum Caylee Anthony 2 years old
    Replies: 216
    Last Post: 11-03-2010, 08:20 AM
  3. 2010.07.09 - Evidence List for Inspection
    By Jomo in forum Caylee Anthony 2 years old
    Replies: 136
    Last Post: 07-14-2010, 05:11 PM
  4. List of Items of Evidence
    By Plenum7 in forum JonBenet Ramsey
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 09-22-2006, 10:39 AM

Tags for this Thread