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  1. #1
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    Cooper Harris - Sidebar Thread

    This thread will be for discussion of the remaining jury selection and beyond that for anything that does not seem to fit in one of the many, available, topical threads in the Cooper Harris Forum.


    WSB-TV reports that a dozen of the original pool of 250 potential jurors have been interviewed in-depth. The Atlanta station reports that the judge on Thursday removed four of the first 12 potential jurors, and jury selection continues Friday.

    http://www.al.com/news/index.ssf/201...ry_select.html



    Nearly two dozen of the original pool of 250 potential jurors have been interviewed in depth so far, including eight on Monday.
    So far, the judge has qualified 16 people to serve on the jury, but that’s not nearly enough. They may need up to four times that many.
    Cooper’s death has generated a lot of news stories over the past two years, so Harris’ attorneys are trying to make sure potential jurors haven’t formed opinions from watching them, a task that has proved difficult.

    http://www.wsbtv.com/news/ross-harri...case/224243333


    Defense attorney Maddox Kilgore tried to lighten to mood with the first person brought in for questioning Monday.
    "You are the first candidate of the day, so you haven't had a lot of time to sit back in that room getting extra, extra nervous about being out here," Kilgore said with a chuckle.
    Lawyers for both sides got to ask questions they think will be important. Prosecutor Chuck Boring wanted to know more about whether the married other of a 3-year-old gets her news.
    "You're a fan of gossip websites," Boring asked. "Which type what gossip websites?"
    On her questionnaire, the woman had answered that she had an opinion in the case, leaning toward guilty.

    http://www.wtoc.com/story/31754930/d...s-harris-trial


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  2. #2
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    I don't think there will be the same level of shock if Ross is acquitted that there was when Casey was acquitted...at least not here. We've seen two high-profile acquittals in the past five years so the public knows they are possible. I think the jury's verdict could definitely infuriate most of us and maybe it's just me, but I could definitely see him getting non guilty whereas with Casey, I never thought in a million years she would get acquitted.

    I'm interested in seeing what defense his team uses. We already know quite a bit about what the prosecution has against him but we haven't heard much rebuttal.


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  3. #3
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    I had no doubt with Casey. That was a travesty. With this one, I lean heavily towards guilty of premeditation and intent and all that worst horrid stuff, but at this point in time, knowing only what I know now (which is a lot--been here since day 1), if I were on the jury and had to decide right this second I'd have to err on the side of reasonable doubt, because I just don't have the same level of certainty that I still have about Ms Anthony.
    Unless specified otherwise and linked, my posts are simply random thoughts of mine, in no particular order, not directed at any post or poster, including but not limited to the ones directly above mine. My opinion only, yours may vary. IMO. JMO. IMHO. JMHO. MOO. Disclaimer, small print, asterisk, and etc.

  4. #4
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    I think the prosecution is wise to bring the child endangerment charge, to make it an automatic felony murder. That's exactly right - because the 'best' possible scenario is that he was a selfish, thoughtless, negligent, uncaring parent who knowingly endangered his small child in the worst way. And at worst, he thought that he was so clever that he'd come up with an horrendous and sadistic murder plan that people would think was a complete accident.


    This case is hurting my heart so much. The way Cooper died. I am not easily shocked but I just HURT when I think about that poor wee bairn and the way he died The torture and the unimaginable pain he went through LH must be heavily medicated, for her to be able to get out of bed every day.


    Does anyone know, have either LH or JRH self-harmed or been medically treated for self-injurious behaviour, in any way, since Cooper's death?

  5. #5
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    I could see one of the following happening:

    The defense manages to convince the jury that Cooper's death was an accident and the jury acquits on all charges because he has suffered enough, already paid for what happened with almost 2 years in jail, and reputation ruined

    The jury believes that Ross killed Cooper intentionally but there is some reasonable doubt so they convict him on one of the lesser charges, so he might not go away for life, but he will get a sentence.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by flourish View Post
    I had no doubt with Casey. That was a travesty. With this one, I lean heavily towards guilty of premeditation and intent and all that worst horrid stuff, but at this point in time, knowing only what I know now (which is a lot--been here since day 1), if I were on the jury and had to decide right this second I'd have to err on the side of reasonable doubt, because I just don't have the same level of certainty that I still have about Ms Anthony.
    I also would have to err on the side of reasonable doubt at this point in time, vis-a-vis premeditation. I think largely because so much of what we know, or think we know, hasn't come from original sources. We've got reports from the media, which are notoriously unreliable, some legal documents (such as search warrants) that allege certain things, and mainly the testimony from the detective at the hearing. Not that I don't believe the detective, but someone telling me what someone else said or did isn't as convincing as seeing the first-hand evidence - video, computer evidence, etc.

    But if a lot of those things turn out to be true and accurate as reported and testified to, I might well be convinced beyond reasonable doubt.

    The internet searches are possibly the most damning IMO. "What temperature does it need to be" for a child in a hot car to die? "How long does it take for an animal to die" in a hot car? If those are actually the exact wording of his internet searches, that right there might be enough to push me beyond reasonable doubt. That's just not the wording a loving parent would use who is concerned about preventing such a thing from happening to his child. That's the wording someone would use who wants to kill their child in a hot car. A loving parent who wants to avoid such a tragedy would search for things like how common is it, how to keep from forgetting your child in the car, that sort of thing. A loving parent wouldn't be using wording that suggests they're looking for a "how to do it" guide. "How hot does it need to be and how long do I have to leave him in there?" JMO, MOO, etc. I'm not, at this point, 100% certain that's the wording JH used. I want to see the computer records or hear the audio of the interview or least see contemporaneous notes made by police when they interviewed him.

    Likewise, the reports of his behavior at the scene after he "discovered" little Cooper. I want to hear from the witnesses themselves, who were there and saw him. There were reports of at least one witness saying that JH said the baby had just started choking. Really? Is it true he said that? If one or more credible witnesses testifies to that.... well, there's no explaining a statement like that. At 4:30 that afternoon, the baby did not start choking. JH's behavior with the police, too, and his mysterious phone calls at the scene. They way it's been described, it was very bizarre and not at all the way a loving parent would behave. While a stranger starts doing CPR on your child, you walk off and start making phone calls? Really?

    If the reports that I've seen and heard prior to now, filtered through third-hand accounts, turns out to be true as reported when original evidence and testimony are presented, I'll probably be convinced "beyond reasonable doubt" that it was premeditated murder.
    JMO. MOO.

  7. #7
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    About the internet search. If he was worried about leaving Cooper in the car wouldn't the searches be more about how to avoid this happening, not how hot does it need to be? Does he have a thermometer, isn't a very day hot specific enough?

    Oops sonjay sorry I should have read ur whole post before posting.
    Rural Ontario

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by sonjay View Post
    I also would have to err on the side of reasonable doubt at this point in time, vis-a-vis premeditation. I think largely because so much of what we know, or think we know, hasn't come from original sources. We've got reports from the media, which are notoriously unreliable, some legal documents (such as search warrants) that allege certain things, and mainly the testimony from the detective at the hearing. Not that I don't believe the detective, but someone telling me what someone else said or did isn't as convincing as seeing the first-hand evidence - video, computer evidence, etc.

    But if a lot of those things turn out to be true and accurate as reported and testified to, I might well be convinced beyond reasonable doubt.

    The internet searches are possibly the most damning IMO. "What temperature does it need to be" for a child in a hot car to die? "How long does it take for an animal to die" in a hot car? If those are actually the exact wording of his internet searchi, that right there might be enough to push me beyond reasonable doubt. That's just not the wording a loving parent would use who is concerned about preventing such a thing from happening to his child. That's the wording someone would use who wants to kill their child in a hot car. A loving parent who wants to avoid such a tragedy would search for things like how common is it, how to keep from forgetting your child in the car, that sort of thing. A loving parent wouldn't be using wording that suggests they're looking for a "how to do it" guide. "How hot does it need to be and how long do I have to leave him in there?" JMO, MOO, etc. I'm not, at this point, 100% certain that's the wording JH used. I want to see the computer records or hear the audio of the interview or least see contemporaneous notes made by police when they interviewed him.

    Likewise, the reports of his behavior at the scene after he "discovered" little Cooper. I want to hear from the witnesses themselves, who were there and saw him. There were reports of at least one witness saying that JH said the baby had just started choking. Really? Is it true he said that? If one or more credible witnesses testifies to that.... well, there's no explaining a statement like that. At 4:30 that afternoon, the baby did not start choking. JH's behavior with the police, too, and his mysterious phone calls at the scene. They way it's been described, it was very bizarre and not at all the way a loving parent would behave. While a stranger starts doing CPR on your child, you walk off and start making phone calls? Really?

    If the reports that I've seen and heard prior to now, filtered through third-hand accounts, turns out to be true as reported when original evidence and testimony are presented, I'll probably be convinced "beyond reasonable doubt" that it was premeditated murder.

    Ross and LeAnne owned a dog. Maybe LeAnne knew Ross had left the dog, not Cooper, in a hot car for a long time. But feared Ross was (fill in the blank) enough to leave Cooper there too.

    Ross doesn't seem particularly good at owning up to his mistakes. Scenario: she gets mad about the dog in car, he says what's the big deal, she says the dog could have died, he says, bull, it wasn't hot enough, yada yada, ending with her worry he'd do that with Cooper.


    The searches about dying/deaths? By some accounts, Ross was depressed. Maybe he was thinking about himself dying. Not planning suicide, just feeling very depressed and morbid. Who knows.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by eileenhawkeye View Post
    I could see one of the following happening:

    The defense manages to convince the jury that Cooper's death was an accident and the jury acquits on all charges because he has suffered enough, already paid for what happened with almost 2 years in jail, and reputation ruined

    The jury believes that Ross killed Cooper intentionally but there is some reasonable doubt so they convict him on one of the lesser charges, so he might not go away for life, but he will get a sentence.

    I think the problem for Ross is that he is, at best, an extremely unlikable defendant. That's going to matter.

    Because the judge didn't sever charges (a mistake, IMO), the jury will know that in addition to causing his 2 year old son's horrible death, he's an adulterer and has knowingly sexted with minors.

    It's looking like the best jury the judge can hope to seat is one on which jurors have prior knowledge and opinions about Cooper's death, but say they can hear the evidence with open minds.

    Say one or two jurors have reasonable doubt. How willing are they going to be to defend that minority position against a majority who disagree with them, especially when all agree he IS responsible for Cooper's death?

    I think the only mitigating factor the jurors in that scenario would consider is if Ross had already been punished enough by the loss of his son. LE's testimony that he wasn't emotional at all until he was arrested, and then seemed to care only about how unfair and inconvenient his arrest was won't help him one little bit.

  10. #10
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    Philip A. Holloway
    ‏@PhilHollowayEsq
    Juror 45 in #JustinRossHarris #hotcardeath case says he has NO opinion on guilt & is NOT biased



    Philip A. Holloway
    ‏@PhilHollowayEsq
    Juror 45 confirms people are asking him about jury service on #JustinRossHarris #hotcardeath trial & he tells them he can't discuss it






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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hope4More View Post
    I think the problem for Ross is that he is, at best, an extremely unlikable defendant. That's going to matter.

    Because the judge didn't sever charges (a mistake, IMO), the jury will know that in addition to causing his 2 year old son's horrible death, he's an adulterer and has knowingly sexted with minors.

    It's looking like the best jury the judge can hope to seat is one on which jurors have prior knowledge and opinions about Cooper's death, but say they can hear the evidence with open minds.

    Say one or two jurors have reasonable doubt. How willing are they going to be to defend that minority position against a majority who disagree with them, especially when all agree he IS responsible for Cooper's death?

    I think the only mitigating factor the jurors in that scenario would consider is if Ross had already been punished enough by the loss of his son. LE's testimony that he wasn't emotional at all until he was arrested, and then seemed to care only about how unfair and inconvenient his arrest was won't help him one little bit.
    Ross might be unlikeable now but I think he is salvagable. He doesn't have a criminal record, for instance. He's your average, church-going middle-class college-educated guy living in the suburbs. I bet a lot of jurors will be from the same social class as him. If the defense manages to put reasonable doubt in the jury's mind, I don't think him being an adulterer or sexting with minors is going to matter. If Leanna takes the stand, and she is just as unlikeable as she was at the funeral, I can't see many jurors really giving a crap that he cheated on her, sort of like their life, their problem sort of thing. Also, there's another trial for the sexting stuff so if the jury wants Ross to be punished for it, the opportunity will be later.

  12. #12
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    Someone on the GJ thread suggested that Ross would be better off with a mostly male jury. I'm not sure I agree. Granted my husband would be less judgemental about sexting
    with adults than I would, the inclusion of minors would set off his 'daddy bear' instinct. Husband also does not believe in forgotten baby syndrome. He thinks it is either laziness or malice.
    Just wanted to throw out a different perspective.

  13. #13
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    Arrow

    Quote Originally Posted by Hope4More View Post
    I think the problem for Ross is that he is, at best, an extremely unlikable defendant. That's going to matter.

    Because the judge didn't sever charges (a mistake, IMO), the jury will know that in addition to causing his 2 year old son's horrible death, he's an adulterer and has knowingly sexted with minors.

    It's looking like the best jury the judge can hope to seat is one on which jurors have prior knowledge and opinions about Cooper's death, but say they can hear the evidence with open minds.

    Say one or two jurors have reasonable doubt. How willing are they going to be to defend that minority position against a majority who disagree with them, especially when all agree he IS responsible for Cooper's death?

    I think the only mitigating factor the jurors in that scenario would consider is if Ross had already been punished enough by the loss of his son. LE's testimony that he wasn't emotional at all until he was arrested, and then seemed to care only about how unfair and inconvenient his arrest was won't help him one little bit.
    BBM. I think in pretty much all of the cases I've followed and crime shows I've watched, when the perp is more concerned for their own future (i.e. having gotten caught) over what happened to the victim, it's usually because they wanted them dead/or already knew they were dead. They usually don't call 911 or delay doing it or don't ask how injured the person is or how they died. That's what usually trips them up. And LE is smart enough to figure that out.
    If I had just accidentally killed my child, you can believe I'd be beating myself up (or my spouse if they had done it) and I'd be fully cooperative with the police- not telling them "FU" and refusing to get off the phone.
    This is the year to locate Mark Dribin https://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...ht=Mark+Dribin NamUs MP#876 and Ilene Misheloff https://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...lene+Misheloff NamUs MP#6410 and bring them home to their families!

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  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by eileenhawkeye View Post
    Ross might be unlikeable now but I think he is salvagable. He doesn't have a criminal record, for instance. He's your average, church-going middle-class college-educated guy living in the suburbs. I bet a lot of jurors will be from the same social class as him. If the defense manages to put reasonable doubt in the jury's mind, I don't think him being an adulterer or sexting with minors is going to matter. If Leanna takes the stand, and she is just as unlikeable as she was at the funeral, I can't see many jurors really giving a crap that he cheated on her, sort of like their life, their problem sort of thing. Also, there's another trial for the sexting stuff so if the jury wants Ross to be punished for it, the opportunity will be later.

    The great unknown is what the DT will bring in that makes a case for reasonable doubt on the charge of malice murder. IMO, if all they have for that is a defense of distracted by sexual addiction which led to lethal forgetfulness setting in within a 2 minute window, Ross is done, no matter if the jury sees him otherwise as one of their own.

    I think that jurors being able to see a defendant as not dissimilar to themselves sometimes actually works against a defendant, because it's easier for jurors to think...yeah, I've been there too, but I would NEVER have......

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by LinasK View Post
    BBM. I think in pretty much all of the cases I've followed and crime shows I've watched, when the perp is more concerned for their own future (i.e. having gotten caught) over what happened to the victim, it's usually because they wanted them dead/or already knew they were dead. They usually don't call 911 or delay doing it or don't ask how injured the person is or how they died. That's what usually trips them up. And LE is smart enough to figure that out.
    If I had just accidentally killed my child, you can believe I'd be beating myself up (or my spouse if they had done it) and I'd be fully cooperative with the police- not telling them "FU" and refusing to get off the phone.
    Sounds like there were differing eyewitness accounts about Ross on the scene, I make allowances for inaccurate and incomplete media reporting, and it is theoretically possible Ross was initially in shock.

    At the police station, though....that's different, IMO. It's incomprehensible to me that Ross could be thinking about himself over Cooper so shortly after his baby's death, no matter how his baby had died, even if he had no involvement whatsoever.

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