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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCityAccountant View Post
    Here is my question....why wasn't there a match on Namus when FLEK was entered??
    Do you mean a DNA match? I could be wrong but I was under the impression that there is not a centralized database like the criminal one (CODIS), where they can just run all missing persons DNA and look for a match. I think they have to do each DNA comparison based on suggestions and leads. That is why we have a list of DNA rule out's for FLEK. Those are people others have submitted and were specifically checked.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1&2&3 View Post
    Looking at the young Kimberly Doss (McGee), she does not have the space betwee her two front teeth that we see in the picture of Lori in the pink hat. At 16, Kimberly would not have been wearing the slip on teeth, whatever they are called. In fact, they probably weren't even made at that time. Also,the height is off too much. We know that Lori was tall and a big boned girl.

    IMO, all these factors rule Kimberly Doss ( McGee) out of being Lori Kennedy Ruff.



    During the last thread we had a discussion about how teeth shift with age and pregnancy. The picture of Lori in the pink hat is from around 2008 after she had just given birth. We're comparing a picture or a 16 year old and 45-48 year old. Look at Lori's earlier pictures and the gap in her teeth does not seem as big, IMO. Also, Kimberly could have had braces at 14-15 to get those perfectly straight teeth but then not worn her retainer after she left home. That would also account for the shift. MOO.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener1850 View Post
    During the last thread we had a discussion about how teeth shift with age and pregnancy. The picture of Lori in the pink hat is from around 2008 after she had just given birth. We're comparing a picture or a 16 year old and 45-48 year old. Look at Lori's earlier pictures and the gap in her teeth does not seem as big, IMO. Also, Kimberly could have had braces at 14-15 to get those perfectly straight teeth but then not worn her retainer after she left home. That would also account for the shift. MOO.
    At 16 KRD would not have had her wisdom teeth pulled, wouldn't that account for a shift in the teeth? More space in the back means the teeth can shift.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCityAccountant View Post
    More Pic's to compare....
    Again, a good resemblance...but on closer inspection I see a few discrepancies. One, LEK'S forehead is slightly lower than the other girl's; the second concerns her teeth. The missing girl's visible eyetooth (2nd to the left--or her right--from the top front teeth) is even with her other teeth. If you zoom in on these photos of LEK'S you can see she has a markedly longer eyetooth than the tooth next to it - it's definitely pointed as well, whereas the missing girl's tooth is not noticeably so. The third concerns the brow lines. LEK's are darker and fuller, and they go further in towards her nose than the missing girl's do. The eyebrows of the missing girl begin even with (or slightly in from) the inner corners of her eyes. If you zoom in, you can see that LEK'S eyebrow-line starts just beyond the inner corner of her eyes.

    Another way to see this is taking a 3x5 card and marking off the distance between the eyebrows above the nose on each face (zoom in to do this). With the missing girl--that distance is just about the same as the width of one of her eyes, corner to corner. But on LEK's face, the distance between her brows is smaller than the width of one of her eyes.
    Last edited by PoirotryInMotion; 08-01-2016 at 01:42 AM.
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  5. #65
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    You all are making some great points. I'm enjoying reading what everyone is coming up with. My gut feeling is that I don't think it's KD (the teeth are making it hard for me to see), but the scars/freckle matches give me enough doubt to say that she should be compared with LEK for a rule-out at the very least.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCityAccountant View Post
    At 16 KRD would not have had her wisdom teeth pulled, wouldn't that account for a shift in the teeth? More space in the back means the teeth can shift.
    While one of my kids had wisdom teeth pulled at that age, I'd agree--that's not the norm. But here's the thing...while teeth may shift around or wear down over time, the eyeteeth do not grow longer. Zoom in and compare the eyeteeth you can see. LEK's has the more typical pointed 'fang' appearance and it's longer than the tooth right next to it. KRD's eyetooth on the other hand is absolutely level with the teeth on either side.
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  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by PoirotryInMotion View Post
    While one of my kids had wisdom teeth pulled at that age, I'd agree--that's not the norm. But here's the thing...while teeth may shift around or wear down over time, the eyeteeth do not grow longer. Zoom in and compare the eyeteeth you can see. LEK's has the more typical pointed 'fang' appearance and it's longer than the tooth right next to it. KRD's eyetooth on the other hand is absolutely level with the teeth on either side.
    I wish we had more pic's of KRD to compare.

    As for the height...who really measures their 16 year old anyway...I certainly didn't. Not even sure if the pediatrician did at that age. I can see the family being off a few inches on the height when they reported her missing. Do we know how tall Blake was? She is only a few inches shorter than Blake. My Cuban friend is really tall and from the pic's she would tower over FLEK. I call her again tomorrow and ask her again how tall she is.

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    Last edited by BigCityAccountant; 08-01-2016 at 02:17 AM.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener1850 View Post
    One way to verify this claim would be for someone to get FLEK's entire name change request file. I've been very curious what she put as her reason for the name change and how she established her Dallas residency. Does anyone here know how to request the name change documents?
    I couldn't stop thinking about this. What would looking at her name request file reveal? So I did a little Googling...

    From https://studentaffairs.unt.edu/sites...ge%20FINAL.pdf (Note: the following is the current
    process. Undoubtedly the process in 1988 was slightly different, but that would require doing more research on when & how the laws changed.

    The process involves filling out two forms: an "Original Petition for Change of Name of an Adult", & an "Order Granting Change of Name of an Adult". What we have is the second. What the first form would contain is the petitioner's current name, address, gender, race, date & place of birth,Texas driverís license number (if the petitioner has one), the last 4 digits of her Social Security number (which even in the 1980s a person might not have), a statement that the petitioner has not committed any serious crimes or is a sex offender (the last was an offense that was not on the public's radar in the 1980s, so I suspect it was asked), & the reason for the requested change.

    As much as some think there might be something in the answer to that last question, the instructions downplay the importance of that answer. "This doesnít have to be lengthy. You can simply write: 'I never liked my name,' or 'I want to take my stepfatherís last name as my own,' or whatever explanation suits your situation."

    However, I think the information on this form might still provide some useful information. One would be a possible address for her in July 1988 -- if it's not the maildrop at 6102 Mockingbird. (And if it is, that raises the question: was one of the first things LEK did when she appeared in Dallas to open a mailbox at this address? If so, out of all of the possible maildrops in Dallas, why did she pick this one?) Another would be that we'd have another sample of her handwriting -- something that some of us have wished for in order to pry some more information from the notes page.

    But as for her reason for the name change, I suspect we'll find she wrote something like "I never liked my name". It's simple, & doesn't force her to come up with any detailed explanation. Then again, someone who forged an unneeded letter of reference might have felt compelled to invent a story; if so, the story might contain a grain of truth.

    I'd still make investigating her bankruptcy case a priority over this case, though.

  9. #69
    I have a question about the two pictures of FLEK in the pink and the id picture. I have difficulty seeing this as the same person. The nose and teeth appear different. Did she have work done after the photo id picture or before? Do we know it's the same person because of the timeline of events? I'm fascinated by this mystery!

    ETA: Are there other pictures of her that look similar to the one with the hat? I know looks change when one gains weight, but her teeth look so different. Pregnancy didn't change mine one bit.
    Last edited by iteach3rdgrade; 08-01-2016 at 02:58 AM.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by iteach3rdgrade View Post
    I have a question about the two pictures of FLEK in the pink and the id picture. I have difficulty seeing this as the same person. The nose and teeth appear different. Did she have work done after the photo id picture or before? Do we know it's the same picture because of the timeline of events? I'm fascinated by this mystery!
    It appears to me that the nose is different after the Idaho ID photo so I'd suspect nose surgery, if she had it, would've happened between summer 1988 and the passport photo (1990?--don't have my notes handy right now). Subsequent photos have her nose with a more 'pinched' tip which also kicks off to her left slightly. I've seen this pinched tip happen with a couple people I knew who had aggressive rhinoplasties back in the 1970s, though I've never seen the tip go off to one side. But I think it could be an effect of surgery, possibly due to internal scar tissue.
    Last edited by PoirotryInMotion; 08-01-2016 at 03:26 AM. Reason: Tmi ;)
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  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by iteach3rdgrade View Post
    I have a question about the two pictures of FLEK in the pink and the id picture. I have difficulty seeing this as the same person. The nose and teeth appear different. Did she have work done after the photo id picture or before? Do we know it's the same person because of the timeline of events? I'm fascinated by this mystery!

    ETA: Are there other pictures of her that look similar to the one with the hat? I know looks change when one gains weight, but her teeth look so different. Pregnancy didn't change mine one bit.
    Yes I've brought up the teeth thing in that pink pic before here too - I think her teeth deteriorated markedly over time. Possible reasons for this are pregnancy (mine never did but I guess for some people they do), drug use, bulimia. I believe we know that FLEK may have struggled with bulimia so to me this seems the most likely and also fits in with her poor state of mental health that we know occurred in latter years.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCityAccountant View Post
    Here is my question....why wasn't there a match on Namus when FLEK was entered??
    CODIS is actually very limited. For what we are trying to do, any of the commercial DNA services would be better. Much bigger database, and relatives show up. If LE would use forensic genealogy many old cases of UID would be solved.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigCityAccountant View Post
    I wish we had more pic's of KRD to compare.

    As for the height...who really measures their 16 year old anyway...I certainly didn't. Not even sure if the pediatrician did at that age. I can see the family being off a few inches on the height when they reported her missing. Do we know how tall Blake was? She is only a few inches shorter than Blake. My Cuban friend is really tall and from the pic's she would tower over FLEK. I call her again tomorrow and ask her again how tall she is.

    Unfortunately, we can't use this picture to guess her height with any precision, IMO. Is she wearing heels or barefoot? The pictures from the Texas Business Women's meeting are the only full length ones we have of FLEK where you can see her shoes. I understand why people have looked at those pictures and concluded FLEK was very tall. She was taller than most women there. We can also see her heels under the table in the picture where she is sitting. They look like a 2-3" heel to me, but that is just a guess. If Lori was really 5'8" as her medical records stated, then her heels made her 5' 10"- 5' 11". If she was really 5' 10" then her heels made her 6 foot to 6' 1" tall. I could see it either way but none of the pics give us a clear reference point to measure by and It's really hard to guess height from photos, IMO.

    I'm going with the fact her height was "a little over 5' 8" in her medical records". It's mentioned in the live chat here: http://live.seattletimes.com/Event /Live_chat_with_investigator_reporter_about_Jane_Do e_case?Page=1

  14. #74
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    I wonder if we can use this to estimate her height....

    Behind the group seems to be a wall partition...I found a similar one on Amazon which states it is 70.75" tall. 70.75" converts to 5.9" and FLEK appears to be a little taller than the partition.


    https://www.amazon.com/Decorative-Pr...n+room+divider

    However, I'm still going to submit it...at the very least to rule her out. There are just too many coincidences to say for sure that it is not her and as I said before, who measures their 16 year old? It is very possible the family guessed at KRD's height and was way off.
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  15. #75
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    Take a look at FLEK's height in relation to the woman she is standing next to holding up a dream catcher. What do you think the difference is in height between them? How tall would you say that woman is? We don't know, but she appears short next to Lori in this picture. Then look at her in the other group pictures from that same day. What is Lori's height in relation to that same woman? What is the woman's height in relation to the others in that group? Perception of height changes depending on where Lori and the other woman are standing. The woman who appears short next to Lori, appears average height in the group photo--she's even taller than one other person. Make of this whatever you want, but these are my observations. I'm still going with Lori was a little over 5' 8" without heels (as her medical records said) and appeared near 6 foot only because she had on heels. MOO.
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