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  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by believe09 View Post
    If Perry was a minor, his fingerprints were on cards which may have been destroyed within a certain time frame...possibly when his chronological age reached the age of majority in his state. Tawni Lee Mazzone/Maricopa Jane Doe was my learning curve for juvie records-no juvenile fingerprints are in electronic databases unless the crime attains a certain seriousness. (We lucked out HUGE with Tawni because although her juvie record should have been destroyed along with her print card, it was warehoused instead-so it is always worth a phone call!)

    Now, I am not clear as to whether or not LA has a file on this John Doe any more??
    You're right about the fingerprints, they probably don't exist now. I was just indulging in "wishful thinking" - wishing I could take today's technology and apply it to some of these older, unsolved cases. Wouldn't that be nice?

    Regarding whether or not a file exists, the answer is I don't know. When I originally spoke to an officer about this, he could not have cared less about this. I know LE is overworked, underpaid, etc., so it's not unusual for there to be a lack of interest over such an old case. Also, my inquiry came shortly after Hurrican Katrina, which probably didn't help.

    I've e-mailed Plaquemines County Sheriff's Dept. and basically asked the same questions I asked the first time, i.e., was this John Doe ever identified, did they compare him to Perry Corlew, had there been any similar types of suicides. So far I've not heard anything, but will definitely post whatever I find out.

  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billylee View Post
    Wow, I hadn't seen this before now, but when I first read the "suicide letter", all I could think of was.....this was not a suicide. Other than the fact that the young man's writing sounds like it was written by someone much older and much more sage, I also hear a bit of something leaning toward incest or something as equally guilt ridden. What makes these folks so sure it WAS a suicide, is this letter the only thing? Letters can be written and forged by anyone with a good brain and good hand. JMO
    I wondered about the suicide note, too - it seems so mature for a 16-17 year old boy. That is why I've wondered about the age of John Doe , and if he might have been older than originally stated.

    I wish we had some way of knowing the condition of John Doe's feet - he was shoeless and from what I've read, no shoes were found. Obviously if he had walked far, his feet would be scratched, cut, dirty.

    The place where he hanged himself was not remote, but it was off the beaten path a little. If John Doe was not from the area, then the question arises as to how he got there and how he knew about the place. Perhaps he lived in the area in the past, or had relatives in the area.

    The reason I rule out murder is that the suicide note is detailed regarding John Doe's feelings about not fitting in; his parents providing all the advantages; implications of past psychiatric care - how would the murderer know that the info he put in the suicide note would apply to his victim? John Doe might have been identified, at which time his family would read the suicide note and would have been able to tell if it sounded totally unlike anything John Doe had ever said or written before. And how would a murderer know John Doe wasn't an orphan, or estranged from his family - the note sounds like John Doe cared about his parents and wanted them not to feel blame.

    I think if someone killed John Doe, it would be more likely he/she would have written a brief "good-bye cruel world" type of note.

  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by frankr View Post
    One thing not mentioned or suggested is that it could be that the young man was not a criminal hiding from a past, but was simply, gay. Homosexuality wasn't remove from the DSM until 1973, and so it's possible, especially in a state like Louisiana, that the boys parents had taken him to see a psychologist and/or psychiatrist, for that reason.
    I thought about that, too. Homosexuality could be one reason why this young man was so introspective - he might have been looking within himself to figure out what was "wrong" with him.

    This part of the suicide note seems to fit with this theory:

    "I implore you to see a psychiatrist in order that you might understand my death and my life. Ask thoroughly about what I was and you will see that it is not tragic that I am gone, but more natural than if I continued."

    The reference to understanding his death and life ("what I was") might be referring to homosexuality or some other type of behavior that John Doe felt was out of the norm or unnatural.

    This part of the note - "It is best if I cease to live, quietly, than risk that later I will break and shatter by violence or linger years under care" - at first made me think John Doe was holding back some anger that he was afraid will manifest itself. But reading it in light of John Doe possibly being gay, it takes on another meaning to me. "Break and shatter by violence" could mean he feared for himself physically/emotionally, and if he didn't "break and shatter" he might "linger years under care."

    I'd enjoy any comments about this. Thanks.

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marilynilpa View Post
    I wondered about the suicide note, too - it seems so mature for a 16-17 year old boy. That is why I've wondered about the age of John Doe , and if he might have been older than originally stated.

    I wish we had some way of knowing the condition of John Doe's feet - he was shoeless and from what I've read, no shoes were found. Obviously if he had walked far, his feet would be scratched, cut, dirty.

    The place where he hanged himself was not remote, but it was off the beaten path a little. If John Doe was not from the area, then the question arises as to how he got there and how he knew about the place. Perhaps he lived in the area in the past, or had relatives in the area.

    The reason I rule out murder is that the suicide note is detailed regarding John Doe's feelings about not fitting in; his parents providing all the advantages; implications of past psychiatric care - how would the murderer know that the info he put in the suicide note would apply to his victim? John Doe might have been identified, at which time his family would read the suicide note and would have been able to tell if it sounded totally unlike anything John Doe had ever said or written before. And how would a murderer know John Doe wasn't an orphan, or estranged from his family - the note sounds like John Doe cared about his parents and wanted them not to feel blame.

    I think if someone killed John Doe, it would be more likely he/she would have written a brief "good-bye cruel world" type of note.
    Maybe it was written by one of the parents. I know, that thought is way out there, but when I first read the letter, it sounded to me like there was sooooo much emphasis on "not blaming the parents for his death". Why would someone do that and the reference to "being given all the advantages" and "psychiatric care"? Could it be one of the parents did him in, as they were frustrated with whatever behavior they were trying to "fix" for him, after years of giving him all the advantages and care they could? Particularly if it was some behavior that the parent(s) just could not tolerate and caused them to feel shamed or ridiculed by. Terrible thought, but I do wonder if any foul play was totally ruled out. I just find that note really odd.

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billylee View Post
    Maybe it was written by one of the parents. I know, that thought is way out there, but when I first read the letter, it sounded to me like there was sooooo much emphasis on "not blaming the parents for his death". Why would someone do that and the reference to "being given all the advantages" and "psychiatric care"? Could it be one of the parents did him in, as they were frustrated with whatever behavior they were trying to "fix" for him, after years of giving him all the advantages and care they could? Particularly if it was some behavior that the parent(s) just could not tolerate and caused them to feel shamed or ridiculed by. Terrible thought, but I do wonder if any foul play was totally ruled out. I just find that note really odd.
    I don't think it was written by anyone other than the kid. Here's why. When I think back to my high school and think of the kids who are now "out" (on Facebook generally), they were all intelligent and eloquent. One is now a news reporter, and most of them could have written something like that. The letter is from a troubled, gay, eloquent teenager who was probably into literature and had seen psychiatrists.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by frankr View Post
    I don't think it was written by anyone other than the kid. Here's why. When I think back to my high school and think of the kids who are now "out" (on Facebook generally), they were all intelligent and eloquent. One is now a news reporter, and most of them could have written something like that. The letter is from a troubled, gay, eloquent teenager who was probably into literature and had seen psychiatrists.
    I agree with you. The kids I went to school with in the 70's who are now "out" were very smart kids, creative, well-spoken and more introspective than their peers. The note does seem to make sense when read in light of the young man being gay in the 70's.

    I wonder if his comment about "break and shatter by violence" might refer to his concerns over being beaten up or abused in some way if his sexual preference became known.

    He also would have faced the draft, and the prospect of being a gay man in the military could have concerned him as well.

  7. #52
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    This article had another snippet of the young man's writings:

    http://news.google.com/newspapers?id...,2716052&hl=en

    "I am a bomb of frustration and should never marry or have children. It is safest to diffuse the bomb harmlessly now. I do not want to bother with being a 'reformed and cured' person limping through life. I am this self-centered."

    I wonder if he was eventually cremated, as he wished, or if his remains were interred pending possible future identification? I saw one source that said he was buried, but I'm not sure if it's correct.

    Interestingly, evangelical Christian pastor Chuck Swindoll wrote a piece relatively recently on suicide prevention that references this John Doe's notes:
    http://www.eons.com/groups/topic/159...ection-?page=2

  8. #53
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    This case is very interesting. My first thought in reading the information was that the person could possibly have been a pedophile - hence the should "never marry or have children". The thought that one of the parents could be involved was intriguing. It prompted me to consider that the young man could have been abusing someone and it was discovered.

    Wish we could find out more info.

  9. #54
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    My impression of this young man's writings makes me wonder about schizophrenia or bipolar disorder. Something about it leads me to believe he was intelligent but suffered from some sort of mental condition which led him to believe he should never marry (and subject another person to his problems) or have children (and risk passing on his condition to a child). Whatever the cause, he definitely was suffering horribly from anguish over it, horribly enough to feel like the world was better off without him. On the other hand, I think one of the reasons teens commit suicide is because they have difficulty imagining a future time when their current problem will no longer be a problem. For instance, being heartbroken or troubled severely over something that they believe will never get better. I remember how dramatic things felt as a teenager, like I was the only person in the world who ever had their heart broken quite so badly & like it would never get better, when really all it took was a few months & something new in life to take my mind off it.
    Such a sad situation & somewhere in the world are parents who loved this child dearly & never knew what happened to him.

  10. #55
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    I don't see this unidentified case on doenetwork any more, was he IDed?


  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by HollywoodBound View Post
    I don't see this unidentified case on doenetwork any more, was he IDed?

    Was this case ever on the doenetwork?

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marilynilpa View Post
    I wondered about the suicide note, too - it seems so mature for a 16-17 year old boy. That is why I've wondered about the age of John Doe , and if he might have been older than originally stated.

    I wish we had some way of knowing the condition of John Doe's feet - he was shoeless and from what I've read, no shoes were found. Obviously if he had walked far, his feet would be scratched, cut, dirty.

    The place where he hanged himself was not remote, but it was off the beaten path a little. If John Doe was not from the area, then the question arises as to how he got there and how he knew about the place. Perhaps he lived in the area in the past, or had relatives in the area.

    The reason I rule out murder is that the suicide note is detailed regarding John Doe's feelings about not fitting in; his parents providing all the advantages; implications of past psychiatric care - how would the murderer know that the info he put in the suicide note would apply to his victim? John Doe might have been identified, at which time his family would read the suicide note and would have been able to tell if it sounded totally unlike anything John Doe had ever said or written before. And how would a murderer know John Doe wasn't an orphan, or estranged from his family - the note sounds like John Doe cared about his parents and wanted them not to feel blame.

    I think if someone killed John Doe, it would be more likely he/she would have written a brief "good-bye cruel world" type of note.
    I couldn't agree with you more. You said exactly what I have felt for a long time. Also when discussing Emile Durkheim (I used to use him a lot, especially in my Graduate thesis so I am very familiar with his works). In an earlier post it mentions he was a Pshycologist (can't think of correct spelling) but the person who posted didn't mention his famous study on suicide. This study was mentioned a lot while I was in college (by the way I have a Masters in Sociology and its the polar oppose of Phycology in many ways) and have always considered Durkheim a sociologist and father of education, instrumental in creating education/school system in France. I can see Durkheims influence in his letter. I've read his work on suicide and can see how his writing influenced the victim. As far as the posts stating this writing is too complex for someone so young, I disagree. I myself wrote very complex papers as a young teenager, way more deep and complex then anything I'd be capable of writing today. In school my papers were often read aloud even in grad school but can't see myself today writing anything worth reading. I don't doubt this is a suicide.

  13. #58
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    I agree with some of the above posters. On reading some of the details of the suicide note I immediately thought "homosexual". Back then homosexuality was not accepted as it is now. Maybe he was told he was "deviant", "abnormal" etc; etc; to the point where he believed he was. Maybe his parents sent him to a phychiatrist to try to "cure" him. This also explains in why he felt he could never live a normal life as he would feel he had to hide this part of himself and could never truly be himself. Also explains why he felt he could never marry or have children.

    Surely someone somewhere misses this poor guy! This case has me intrigued and I wish there was more information out there.

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by tabacue View Post
    This case is very interesting. My first thought in reading the information was that the person could possibly have been a pedophile - hence the should "never marry or have children". The thought that one of the parents could be involved was intriguing. It prompted me to consider that the young man could have been abusing someone and it was discovered.

    Wish we could find out more info.
    I thought this too. I was rereading this thread today and immediately thought of an episode of SVU where a teenage boy turned himself in to the police because he had thoughts about molesting his stepbrother. He wanted to be stopped and given help before it happened. Maybe John Doe had feelings like that and thought this was the only way to prevent him doing harm to anybody.

  15. #60
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    I can not find this case on Doe or NaMUS... any idea if he is listed anywhere?
    A run-away may leave on purpose, but that doesn't mean that they are able to get back home.... Never stop searching.

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