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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by NvrEndgStry View Post
    I read the article. It was written in 2012. In 2011, the IRS revamped the IRS ITIN and corrected the issue--which they link to in their article, but make it appear as if it is a current problem. I'm not certain why they updated the article for 2016?
    The link to the IRS site which explains how the ITIN works now;

    https://www.irs.gov/individuals/gene...in-information
    They are still doing it

    http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017...x-credits.html

  2. #32
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    The Somali refugee who unleashed a brutal slashing rampage at the Ohio State University that left 11 injured on Monday, is just 18 years old according to NBC.
    But with his balding hair, mustache and goatee, Abdul Razak Ali Artan has the appearance of someone who could be much older.
    Authorities have not yet verified the terror suspect's age - but it is possible pretending to be younger could have helped Artan's immigration status in the US.
    Artan entered the U.S. in 2014 - when he was around 16, based on current reports of his age.
    As a minor, he would have been eligible for Special Immigrant Juvenile Status - if he could persuade a court he was under 18 and abused, neglected, or abandoned by his parents.
    The Status, one of the faster routes to a green card, and allows for extra benefits, such as having the card application fee waived.
    On the other hand, as a minor, if his parents had already been granted asylum, they could apply for him to join them as he was unmarried and under the age of 21.
    However, it could be difficult to verify his true age as he entered the United States as a refugee.
    Many fleeing persecution in their country are unable to provide legal documentation, which can be seized, withheld or simply never issued in their country of birth.

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz4gRudTnm9
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

    I'm not sure if his actual age was ever determined.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Momma2cam View Post
    I don't feel there is no threat- I know the threat is dismal and I'm more likely to die by getting struck by lightning, driving to work in the morning, airplane crash, a brain aneurysm, you name it. That is based in statistics and facts, not feeling.

    I do understand the fear, though, and when we operate on fear, we are in survival mode and not using the cognitive part of our brain. I get it. And, as I said, I understand the argument that we just shouldn't let in any more refugees because we cannot possibly vet them well enough since the current standard is not enough (risk 1 in 3 billion). If that's your argument, claim it!

    The argument for more extreme vetting, at least as far as refugees go, though is just not informed.

    Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk
    We don't even check social media. There is NO extreme vetting.

  4. #34
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    Politically-motivated crime hits record high in Germany amid tensions over refugee crisis, Turkey and terrorism
    Government figures also show 'disproportionate' rise in crime committed by non-Germans

    Lizzie Dearden @lizziedearden Tuesday 25 April 2017

    Right-wing political parties and movements have blamed Angela Merkel’s decision to open Germany’s borders to refugees in 2015 – sparking the arrival of more than a million asylum seekers – for a series of deadly terror attacks and mass sexual assaults in Cologne.

    An Afghan asylum seeker injured four people in an axe attack on a train in July, while days later a Syrian refugee blew himself up in Ansbach.

    A rejected Tunisian asylum seeker who Germany had attempted to deport killed 12 people in a lorry rampage at a Christmas market in Berlin. All three attacks were linked to Isis.

    There was also a significant increase in crime motivated by “imported” ideologies – up 66 per cent - including Isis supporters and jihadis, and over Turkey and the Kurdistan Workers’ Party (PKK) terrorist group.


    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7701736.html

    So it does worry me when people shrug and say 'what's the problem...the refugees are all vetted.' Because vetting is not the only problem.

    There is a huge disconnect culturally with many refugees---who have no desire to assimilate and live peacefully within our cultural norms. We can see that very clearly in Brussels, Malmo, and the suburbs of Paris.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Momma2cam View Post
    I don't feel there is no threat- I know the threat is dismal and I'm more likely to die by getting struck by lightning, driving to work in the morning, airplane crash, a brain aneurysm, you name it. That is based in statistics and facts, not feeling.

    I do understand the fear, though, and when we operate on fear, we are in survival mode and not using the cognitive part of our brain. I get it. And, as I said, I understand the argument that we just shouldn't let in any more refugees because we cannot possibly vet them well enough since the current standard is not enough (risk 1 in 3 billion). If that's your argument, claim it!

    The argument for more extreme vetting, at least as far as refugees go, though is just not informed.

    Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk
    I don't base my opinion on immigration or refugee's on the odds's that I'll personally be harmed by some miscreant.

    I care about the safety of my fellow citizens.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Momma2cam View Post
    I don't feel there is no threat- I know the threat is dismal and I'm more likely to die by getting struck by lightning, driving to work in the morning, airplane crash, a brain aneurysm, you name it. That is based in statistics and facts, not feeling.

    I do understand the fear, though, and when we operate on fear, we are in survival mode and not using the cognitive part of our brain. I get it. And, as I said, I understand the argument that we just shouldn't let in any more refugees because we cannot possibly vet them well enough since the current standard is not enough (risk 1 in 3 billion). If that's your argument, claim it!

    The argument for more extreme vetting, at least as far as refugees go, though is just not informed.

    Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk
    Momma.....I hope you don't mind me saying but your argument doesn't hold water because you keep comparing accidental risks with a highly preventable risk.
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    "Look, if any of us wanted to mind our own business, we wouldn't be here" (carbuff 8/11/13)

    This post reflects my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy it anywhere else outside of the WebSleuth forum

  7. #37
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    BBM IMO this is not extreme vetting.

    Investigators were continuing to untangle Mr. Artan’s background on Wednesday. He was admitted to the United States in 2014 as the child of a refugee after living for several years in Pakistan. Some records listed his age as 18, but others suggested he was older. He had earned enough academic credits to have senior class standing at Ohio State.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/30/u...ali-artan.html

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Momma2cam View Post
    That statistic is for the US. You are correct, other countries do not have the same "extreme vetting" and thus, terrorists are more drawn to those countries. You have made exactly the point I've been trying to make.

    Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk
    However, there is a difference between the vetting of refugees and the proposed immigration of thousands of middle eastern immigrants who were refugees in european or other countries. And that is what many people, myself included, are worried about.

    One current example---Obama made a deal with Australia---to take in 1,250 refugees, living in detainment camps offshore. Australia won't take them because they refugees broke Australian laws by arriving by boat illegally. So they want us to take them now.

    See the irony? Australia stands by their ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION laws, while we ignore ours and make excuses for those who break them.

    https://www.theguardian.com/australi...-angered-trump
    The deal relates to 1,250 refugees held in Australia’s offshore detention camps on Nauru and Manus Island, including many from Sri Lanka, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Iran and Iraq. The refugees, some of whom are stateless, have spent years languishing in the offshore detention camps, which the United Nations has repeatedly criticised as cruel and illegal. The refugees are unable to go home, but cannot come to Australia – even when their right to protection as refugees is confirmed – because they travelled to Australia by boat.
    Last edited by katydid23; 05-07-2017 at 10:34 PM.
    “Every day that they don’t find something is good for me.“ Billie Dunn

  9. #39
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  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by katydid23 View Post
    So it does worry me when people shrug and say 'what's the problem...the refugees are all vetted.' Because vetting is not the only problem.

    There is a huge disconnect culturally with many refugees---who have no desire to assimilate and live peacefully within our cultural norms. We can see that very clearly in Brussels, Malmo, and the suburbs of Paris.
    Rsbm. What is your stance then on the refugee and immigration process? Do you believe we should pull out as an approved country for refugees and asylees? Close the borders for legal and illegal immigrants? Or, do you have suggestions for how we discern who we should and should not let in- by country? Only if they agree to totally assimilate and to no longer use their own language, etc? Only if they have enough money or can create jobs? Or?


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  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Momma2cam View Post
    That is what has been happening. If there is any question about refugees' backgrounds or not being able to verify things, they are not let in.

    The individuals that cross the border illegally of course can't be vetted. What are your ideas for border security? Extreme vetting has no impact on that.

    Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk
    “A large portion of the MS-13 gang members are here illegally,” DeMarco added. “And they arrive in the country through the Unaccompanied Minor Program, which was really loosened up and formed under President Obama.”

    http://nypost.com/2017/05/07/sheriff...gang-violence/

    It's simply not true that only the occasional "refugee" criminal slips through the cracks. Obama was fast-tracking unaccompanied minor "refugees" with his programs.
    Last edited by Imp; 05-07-2017 at 10:40 PM.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tillicum View Post
    BBM IMO this is not extreme vetting.

    Investigators were continuing to untangle Mr. Artan’s background on Wednesday. He was admitted to the United States in 2014 as the child of a refugee after living for several years in Pakistan. Some records listed his age as 18, but others suggested he was older. He had earned enough academic credits to have senior class standing at Ohio State.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/30/u...ali-artan.html
    Right? How extreme has the vetting been when we can't even nail down the ages of some of these people?

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Momma2cam View Post
    Rsbm. What is your stance then on the refugee and immigration process? Do you believe we should pull out as an approved country for refugees and asylees? Close the borders for legal and illegal immigrants? Or, do you have suggestions for how we discern who we should and should not let in- by country? Only if they agree to totally assimilate and to no longer use their own language, etc? Only if they have enough money or can create jobs? Or?


    Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk
    My grandparents left Canada after World War II and immigrated to the US. They had to have American sponsors, jobs lined up and a certain amount of cash before they could come in.

    It worked for my family then and it can work for today's immigrants.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by ATasteOfHoney View Post
    Momma.....I hope you don't mind me saying but your argument doesn't hold water because you keep comparing accidental risks with a highly preventable risk.
    We could prevent many of those accidents- I could, theoretically, never leave my home. I could of course then hit my head on the wall and drown in the shower. My point is the risks we take every day just by breathing and moving around on our feet pose more threat than allowing refugees in who are fleeing war and terrorism themselves.

    So, again, I ask- is your stance to pull out as a country willing to accept refugees and asylees? If so, then we don't really have much more to discuss. I was addressing the extreme nature of the vetting process.

    If your belief is that regardless of the risk, we should prevent it, then you're arguing to completely close the borders. I can't argue with that because that is rooted in very different philosophical views. I believe in working hard to aid as many humans as we possibly can, regardless of their accidental birth place. I recognize the luck and privilege to have been accidentally born in the US but I don't believe my life is more worthy because of it.

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  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by RANCH View Post
    My grandparents left Canada after World War II and immigrated to the US. They had to have American sponsors, jobs lined up and a certain amount of cash before they could come in.

    It worked for my family then and it can work today's immigrants.
    Got it. I can respect that opinion in regards to the immigration process and I don't completely disagree. I see the value in that as it minimizes the potential strain on resources once immigrants are in the US. Where my opinion differs is that I don't think wealth should be the primary deciding factor in allowing all immigrants in. My family immigrated from Ireland legally as well and luckily they had the means.

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