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  1. #1
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    2017.05.17 - Trump and DeVos plan to reshape higher education finance.*

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...-mean-for-you/

    "Budget documents obtained by The Washington Post show President Trump’s administration is proposing a raft of changes that could have significant impact on college students and graduates."

    "One of the most striking higher education proposals calls for replacing the five income-driven student loan repayment plans with a single plan to the benefit of undergraduate borrowers.*"

    "Another*change in the spending plan calls for the elimination of Public Service Loan Forgiveness,
    a program that wipes away federal student debt for people in the public sector after they have made 120 qualifying monthly payments, or 10 years’ worth of payments."



    Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk

  2. #2
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    Can you believe these jokers.

  3. #3
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    Two of the dumbest, least educated people on the planet in charge of making decisions about education
    INSANE

  4. #4
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    Higher education finance is in serious need of reform, so I'm very glad this is a priority of the new administration.

    The Pell grant program, in particular, is in desperate need of reform. The graduation rates for students who receive Pell grants is abysmal—meaning, the recipients graduate at alarmingly low rates, and do not end up with certified skills for employment. As Pell grants don’t have to be repaid, this is a program that is experiencing a downward spiral that needs to be addressed.

    Billions in Pell Grants go to students who never graduate

    And while some schools with large numbers of Pell recipients have strong graduation rates for those students, the ones receiving the biggest share of the money often do not.

    The government itself does not collect this data, meaning that, since 2000, taxpayers have spent $300 billion on Pell grants — the nation’s single most expensive education program, awarded based on family earnings to help low-income students get access to higher educations — with no way of knowing how many of the recipients ever actually earned degrees.

    In a quirk of federal policy, individual institutions do have to disclose the graduation rates of their students who receive Pell grants, when asked. And while some resisted doing so, or released them only in response to public-record requests, the Hechinger analysis of 32 of the largest private and 50 of the largest public universities — and tens of thousands of Pell grant students — shows that more than a third of Pell recipients at those schools hadn’t earned degrees even after six years.

    In January 2014, Congress gave the Department of Education 120 days to produce, for the first time, Pell grant graduation rates for every university and college in the country. The department finally released the months-overdue report in November, but did not break down the information by institution, citing problems with the data, and was only able to analyze 70 percent of Pell recipients. Only 39 percent of the 1.7 million students in its sample earned a bachelor’s degree in six years.
    http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/...ever-graduate/

    What Happens to Pell Grant Recipients After They Enroll?
    Federal aid may help students get to college, but a study shows they graduate at lower rates than peers.
    https://www.theatlantic.com/educatio...enroll/407311/

    An unprecedented look at Pell Grant graduation rates from 1,149 schools

    http://hechingerreport.org/an-unprec...-1149-schools/

    Lots of experts have opined about how to tie performance (both student performance, and academic institution performance) to continued funding—rather than simply means based needs tests. The GOAL of Pell grants is to help needy students go to school AND actually graduate with a certified skill set they can use to contribute to the employment and tax base.

    Some of the reform ideas are :

    Require students to be enrolled at least half-time to qualify for the Pell Grant. Students who enroll part-time and work full-time are less likely to graduate than students who enroll full-time and work part-time. This would target the money where it is most likely to lead to completion.

    Establish restrictions on the types of colleges that are eligible for the Pell Grant. Currently the main restriction on eligibility for the Pell Grant is the cohort default rate, as part of the general restrictions on institutional eligibility for federal student aid. But about 250 colleges have opted out of the student loan program in order to preserve eligibility for the Pell Grant. More are thinking about doing this because of the pending switch to 3-year cohort default rates. Somehow it doesn't seem right for colleges that would have had high default rates to remain eligible for the Pell Grant. Eliminating such colleges from eligibility is one possibility. (However, part of the reason why these colleges had high default rates is their low costs. Low institutional charges makes a college prone to a form of abuse where students enroll in the lowest cost college to maximize the refund they get after deducting institutional charges from the student financial aid.)

    Establish minimum graduation rates for Pell Grant recipients for a college to retain eligibility. This would ensure that Pell Grant funding is targeted at colleges where the students have a greater chance of graduating. Several years ago Bob Shireman proposed establishing a bounty on college completion for Pell Grant recipients, where colleges would get a bonus when a Pell Grant recipient graduated. A more recent manifestation of this idea was incorporated in the Perkins loan reengineering, which didn't pass Congress. That proposal was designed to be a carrot, as opposed to a stick, where colleges would gain more Perkins loan funds for meeting completion targets. But one could just as easily design a program where colleges lost funds for - 3 - failing to satisfy minimum completion targets. This is mainly a matter of perspective, as to whether the glass is half full or half empty. But given the low completion rates at many colleges, perhaps it is time to establish minimum completion rates for aid eligibility? The main risk, of course, would be grade inflation. 8. Make the Pell Grant performance based. Currently the Satisfactory Academic Program (SAP) rules check for eligibility at the end of the second year. MDRC has demonstrated that a tighter feedback loop leads to improved retention and improved academic performance. Perhaps part of the Pell Grant should be pegged more closely to academic performance

    Make the Pell Grant performance based. Currently the Satisfactory Academic Program (SAP) rules check for eligibility at the end of the second year. MDRC has demonstrated that a tighter feedback loop leads to improved retention and improved academic performance. Perhaps part of the Pell Grant should be pegged more closely to academic performance, where it is paid at the end of each semester based on the student's GPA for the semester (e.g., students get nothing for a D, half for a C, three quarters for a B and the full amount for an A). Or perhaps the standard for continued Pell Grant eligibility should be raised from a 2.0 GPA to a higher threshold. Or perhaps provide Pell Grant recipients with a bonus for graduating within the normal timeframe (e.g., 4 years for a Bachelor’s degree and 2 years for an Associate’s degree).

    Limit the Pell Grant to specific fields of study, such as science, technology, engineering, mathematics and nursing. The National SMART Grant tried this but only with an add-on incentive to study STEM. The National SMART Grant does not appear to have shift many students into STEM fields. Instead, it gave extra money to students who were going to major in those fields regardless and may have improved their graduation rates. Students in non-STEM fields were fine just keeping their original grants. But if the only way to retain a Pell Grant (or a full Pell Grant) were to major in STEM fields, we might see more of a migration.

    http://www.fastweb.com/nfs/fastweb/s...nt_3.29.11.pdf

  5. #5
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    There are students who get all kinds of funding/loans/grants + their books paid for & never show up to class. Then they sell their books on the open market for money.

    I've seen it firsthand.

    I really relied upon academic scholarships. I never missed a class...and relished everything my (very liberal) professors in the northeast taught me.

    Yes....there needs to be some reform, imo.
    Last edited by ATasteOfHoney; 05-19-2017 at 07:14 PM.
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    "Look, if any of us wanted to mind our own business, we wouldn't be here" (carbuff 8/11/13)

    This post reflects my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy it anywhere else outside of the WebSleuth forum

  6. #6
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    Another example of a problem affected by Pell grant funding-- sketchy "for profit" colleges with questionable "degrees" leading to really terrible graduation rates. Some of these end up closing their doors, such as Globe University in MN, sued for fraudulent degrees. So now those students have even more obstacles to graduating with any kind of a usable credential to get a job-- and more federal $$ WASTED that gets exactly no return on investment.
    In September, a Hennepin County District judge found Globe University and the Minnesota School of Business committed fraud by leading students to believe that completing the schools’ criminal justice program would help them become police and probation officers. The ruling was the result of a 2014 lawsuit filed against the schools by Minnesota Attorney General Lori Swanson, after hundreds of students complained to her office.

    The fraud ruling set off a series of consequences that, unless they are overturned, make it nearly impossible for the institutions to continue to operate.
    http://www.twincities.com/2016/12/21...sing-campuses/

    http://www.startribune.com/globe-uni...ary/407775176/

  7. #7
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    Sketchy accreditations abound
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    "Look, if any of us wanted to mind our own business, we wouldn't be here" (carbuff 8/11/13)

    This post reflects my constitutionally-protected opinion. Please do not copy it anywhere else outside of the WebSleuth forum

  8. #8
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    Note that the above reforms were proposed during the Obama administration, and PBS is a pretty "liberal" newssource. This is an example of an issue that both conservatives and liberals should be able to agree on.

    But sadly, there is so much hatred and animosity toward Trump and DeVos that it will be next to impossible to make productive and effective changes. The problems are more important, and more pervasive, than the tenure of the people in office, IMO.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Momma2cam View Post
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...-mean-for-you/

    "Budget documents obtained by The Washington Post show President Trump’s administration is proposing a raft of changes that could have significant impact on college students and graduates."

    "One of the most striking higher education proposals calls for replacing the five income-driven student loan repayment plans with a single plan to the benefit of undergraduate borrowers.*"

    "Another*change in the spending plan calls for the elimination of Public Service Loan Forgiveness,
    a program that wipes away federal student debt for people in the public sector after they have made 120 qualifying monthly payments, or 10 years’ worth of payments."



    Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk
    So removing public service debt is a bad thing?

  10. #10
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    The fake colleges should be shut down A good example was Trump university


  11. #11
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    The problem is that the laws and guidelines made in education are not made by people who are educators or have any understanding of child development.

    I AM an educator and have also attended, along with other educators, state sessions devoted to education. We have addressed concerns about the required methods of teaching as well as licensing mandates and standardization. And we are not heard. Because politicians appoint their buddies to oversee an area that should be overseen by people who have a dadgum CLUE about education.

    IMO, a cabinet member ought to have education and experience in that particular area. It is frightening that cronyism supersedes expertise.

    Which is why we have a generation of children who learn just enough to pass a test, but never acheive critical thinking skills.

    Sorry. Subject very dear to my heart.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by EllieBee View Post
    The problem is that the laws and guidelines made in education are not made by people who are educators or have any understanding of child development.

    I AM an educator and have also attended, along with other educators, state sessions devoted to education. We have addressed concerns about the required methods of teaching as well as licensing mandates and standardization. And we are not heard. Because politicians appoint their buddies to oversee an area that should be overseen by people who have a dadgum CLUE about education.

    IMO, a cabinet member ought to have education and experience in that particular area. It is frightening that cronyism supersedes expertise.

    Which is why we have a generation of children who learn just enough to pass a test, but never acheive critical thinking skills.

    Sorry. Subject very dear to my heart.
    Don't be sorry! Your opinions on the subject are valuable. Thank you for sharing.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by K_Z View Post
    Another example of a problem affected by Pell grant funding-- sketchy "for profit" colleges with questionable "degrees" leading to really terrible graduation rates. Some of these end up closing their doors, such as Globe University in MN, sued for fraudulent degrees. So now those students have even more obstacles to graduating with any kind of a usable credential to get a job-- and more federal $$ WASTED that gets exactly no return on investment.


    http://www.twincities.com/2016/12/21...sing-campuses/

    http://www.startribune.com/globe-uni...ary/407775176/

    This point is absolutely true. And for-profit colleges often prey upon the most vulnerable of college students. Not only is it federal funds wasted but many of the students at these places are 1st gen college-going who wind up with debt, no job and little ability to get funds at accredited schools.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by EllieBee View Post
    The problem is that the laws and guidelines made in education are not made by people who are educators or have any understanding of child development.

    I AM an educator and have also attended, along with other educators, state sessions devoted to education. We have addressed concerns about the required methods of teaching as well as licensing mandates and standardization. And we are not heard. Because politicians appoint their buddies to oversee an area that should be overseen by people who have a dadgum CLUE about education.

    IMO, a cabinet member ought to have education and experience in that particular area. It is frightening that cronyism supersedes expertise.

    Which is why we have a generation of children who learn just enough to pass a test, but never acheive critical thinking skills.

    Sorry. Subject very dear to my heart.
    I agree. The issues in higher education need to be vetted and addressed by those who truly know, understand, and can participate in making it better.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by K_Z View Post
    Note that the above reforms were proposed during the Obama administration, and PBS is a pretty "liberal" newssource. This is an example of an issue that both conservatives and liberals should be able to agree on.

    But sadly, there is so much hatred and animosity toward Trump and DeVos that it will be next to impossible to make productive and effective changes. The problems are more important, and more pervasive, than the tenure of the people in office, IMO.
    They are, in concert, the antithesis of educational understanding.

    Despicable. But screw the children, right? It's all about the braggadocio of our infantile president.

    ETA: by "they" , I meant Trump and De Vos.

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