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  1. #31
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
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    I've read and heard on the news that these attacks were made within the homeless people themselves. They cleared out some of them.

    http://www.kctv5.com/story/33707137/...an-creek-trail



    Quote Originally Posted by margarita25 View Post
    Woah:

    From November 2016:

    Targeted attacks with unknown motives along Indian Creek Trail leave victims battered and*bruised
    http://fox4kc.com/2016/11/03/targete...d-and-bruised/

    "KANSAS CITY, Mo. -- A popular bike and hike trail in South Kansas City is seeing a spike in crime, with at least four attacks reported since mid-October. At least three people have been stabbed, and one person was hit in the head with a rock along the Indian Creek Trail.

    The trail spans 17 miles and runs through parts of Overland Park and Leawood. Its a popular spot with bikers, joggers and walkers.

    But one section of the trail near S. Wornall Road and I-435 to W. 103rd Street, has seen four attacks reported in just as many weeks."

  2. #32
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    It appears these deaths are the work of a serial murderer -- well, to me anyway; and if that's the case, this person has joined ranks with names like Bob Berdella, Terry Blair, John E. Robinson Jr., and Lorenzo Gilyard -- infamous names in Kansas City history.

  3. #33
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    Austin, Texas
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    Ugh, how terrifying! This is the school district I grew up in - my old stomping grounds... just drove through all those areas last november with my dad. Don't think the trail was official back then but I spent lots of time adventuring in the woods and creeks to the Blue River as a kid.

    I hope they catch this sick f$!@ soon.

    Stay safe, locals. <3

  4. #34
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    When claiming something as a “fact,” you must prove it. Be able to provide links to information from approved third party sources; for instance, mainstream media (MSM), law enforcement (LE), and admin-verified case insiders.
    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/misc.php?do=showrules

    mod note: If you can't link it, you can't post it.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by wfgodot View Post
    It appears these deaths are the work of a serial murderer -- well, to me anyway; and if that's the case, this person has joined ranks with names like Bob Berdella, Terry Blair, John E. Robinson Jr., and Lorenzo Gilyard -- infamous names in Kansas City history.
    Should have provided some links (all Wiki here) for educational purposes:

    Bob Berdella

    Terry Blair

    John E. Robinson Jr.

    Lorenzo Gilyard

    These are all within recent memory. Yo, Kansas Citians -- who am I leaving out?

  6. #36
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    Aug 2004
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    Yeah, some local people are saying "homeless camp" but I would separate the stabbings and hittings-with-rock from these four attacks on men out walking their dogs. Even though homeless people of course deserve just as much community concern as community leaders out walking their dogs, at least the motive for such a stabbing or hitting-with-rock is more apparent. Again, David Lenox had just stepped out of his door, as was his routine, walking his dogs and I am not sure if it was a gated community, but I can't see robbery or an angry encounter being the motive especially in that case. And again, supposedly there were surveillance cameras all over Willow Creek, which caught nothing. And again, one report of the Darby slaying said there was no sign of a struggle. I'll go looking for that again--I remember reading it somewhere. To sum up...I would understand stabbings and hittings-with-rocks at or near a homeless camp. I would put these four random killings in a different category because (so far) no evidence the victims had any interaction with homeless people or any sign of a struggle that I'm aware of.
    Edited to add: Here is article claiming no evidence of struggle in Darby case. http://www.kansascity.com/news/local...151613637.html
    Last edited by darkstar105; 05-22-2017 at 11:35 AM.

  7. #37
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    OK this article, linked earlier by Margarita25, says the Willow Creek complex where Lenox was shot was gated. http://www.kansascity.com/news/local...137145698.html

    More reason why I am not viewing these killings, especially Lenox's, as altercations with homeless people.

  8. #38
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    From the article linked in post#41- "The killing seems to lack any apparent motive."

    I've been paying attention to this & have not heard and MSM article mention theft or robbery .. or anything missing .. or any motive. I'm curious if anyone here has read/heard about the victims being robbed at all.

  9. #39
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    Is this behind a paywall for non-KC-Star subcribers? If so, what's the protocol?

    http://www.kansascity.com/news/local...151953327.html

    Summary: Maj. Donna Greenwell, commander of the Kansas City Police Department’s violent crimes unit, says they are not ready to use the term "serial killer" yet, would not say how three of the victims were killed, "Darby was walking his two dogs on the trail early Thursday, which was part of a daily routine," and Darby was found "sprawled on the trail about 6:30 a.m. Thursday near a medical office in the 300 block of West 101 Street Terrace"

    Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/news/local/crime/article151953327.html#storylink=cpy"


    Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/news/local...#storylink=cpy


    Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/news/local...#storylink=cpy

  10. #40
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    I live in Willow Creek and it is gated but not all night.
    Usually the guard leaves around 11ish and gate is left open all night.

    Yes a lot of the locals here do think homeless might be involved, but I don't recall anyone here saying that.
    My post referring to the homeless was in response to margarita25's (#26) to the post about the targeted attacks, leaving victims being stabbed, bruised, battered to include hitting on head with rock.
    Those particular incidents were done within the homeless community. (Article below). Not intended to be related to the horrible killings.

    http://fox4kc.com/2016/11/03/targete...d-and-bruised/




    Quote Originally Posted by darkstar105 View Post
    OK this article, linked earlier by Margarita25, says the Willow Creek complex where Lenox was shot was gated. http://www.kansascity.com/news/local...137145698.html

    More reason why I am not viewing these killings, especially Lenox's, as altercations with homeless people.


  11. #41
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    I DO wonder about David Lenox's case though.....where he was found, I'm pretty sure there's a direct line (without bldgs in the way) to the trails. I tried to look but leaves on bushes and trees are present now but weren't in February.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by VictoriaH View Post
    I DO wonder about David Lenox's case though.....where he was found, I'm pretty sure there's a direct line (without bldgs in the way) to the trails. I tried to look but leaves on bushes and trees are present now but weren't in February.
    So Willow Creek Apartments is gated, but it looks open to the south toward the trail. Victoria, can you confirm whether my restricted google maps view is correct?

    I wonder if the homeless stabbings last fall were part of the killer's "prep" for further killings. John Palmer was murdered last August in a very remote area (based on what I see on the maps). Perhaps the killer had a reason (however flimsy it might have been) to kill him and then liked the thrill so much he got ready to "continue". Do we know if John Palmer was shot or stabbed?

    Or perhaps the homeless stabbings from last fall were not related. It just seems like such a coincidence since they were in the immediate area of 2 of the "white-male-with-dogs" victims.

    I would still really like to know which one of the 4 victims wasn't walking a dog. Were all of the dog walkers shot? I can't imagine stabbing someone to death while they walked their dogs. The dogs would go absolutely ballistic.
    Any man's death diminishes me,
    Because I am involved in mankind,
    Therefore, send not to know, for whom the bell tolls;
    It tolls for thee.
    ~John Dunne


    #TeamCivilization

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snoopster View Post
    So Willow Creek Apartments is gated, but it looks open to the south toward the trail. Victoria, can you confirm whether my restricted google maps view is correct?

    I wonder if the homeless stabbings last fall were part of the killer's "prep" for further killings. John Palmer was murdered last August in a very remote area (based on what I see on the maps). Perhaps the killer had a reason (however flimsy it might have been) to kill him and then liked the thrill so much he got ready to "continue". Do we know if John Palmer was shot or stabbed?

    Or perhaps the homeless stabbings from last fall were not related. It just seems like such a coincidence since they were in the immediate area of 2 of the "white-male-with-dogs" victims.

    I would still really like to know which one of the 4 victims wasn't walking a dog. Were all of the dog walkers shot? I can't imagine stabbing someone to death while they walked their dogs. The dogs would go absolutely ballistic.
    Its so hard to speculate about the killers' intent on "prep" because what I read is they thought that the attacks (no killing ones on the homeless) were to "run them out". There doesn't seem to be ANY apparent motive whatsoever! So frustrating!

    I don't know who the third person is and I didn't see it anywhere. I'm still searching.
    I too wondered about the dogs but I'm guessing if they were shot without a warning the dogs wouldn't know what happened.
    Your map is pretty accurate, just off a little bit on exact locations.
    It's time for bed and I can help pinpoint them tomorrow if you want. 😊

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snoopster View Post
    So Willow Creek Apartments is gated, but it looks open to the south toward the trail. Victoria, can you confirm whether my restricted google maps view is correct?

    I wonder if the homeless stabbings last fall were part of the killer's "prep" for further killings. John Palmer was murdered last August in a very remote area (based on what I see on the maps). Perhaps the killer had a reason (however flimsy it might have been) to kill him and then liked the thrill so much he got ready to "continue". Do we know if John Palmer was shot or stabbed?

    Or perhaps the homeless stabbings from last fall were not related. It just seems like such a coincidence since they were in the immediate area of 2 of the "white-male-with-dogs" victims.

    I would still really like to know which one of the 4 victims wasn't walking a dog. Were all of the dog walkers shot? I can't imagine stabbing someone to death while they walked their dogs. The dogs would go absolutely ballistic.
    Also.....I don't know how much truth there is to any of them getting stabbed or cut up.
    And I'm pretty positive there isn't any openings of the gates around the complex.
    But I'll look tomorrow.

  15. #45
    Nick_1 is offline Verified Former Law Enforcement Data Analyst
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    Just saw this story on the local news at 10 PM. I live geographically in fairly close proximity to the KC metropolitan area. I used to read and post years ago on this site. I got a new account in the fall as my last posts were in excess of 5 years old. I would consider myself a serial crimes researcher. Formerly, I was employed by a LE agency (Not KS or MO), but in a nearby state. I will have a long post up here in an hour or two as I get up to date. Initial thoughts from comments on this thread:

    1) Vagrant individuals are exceedingly unlikely to perpetrate violent crimes outside the homeless community. When they do, primarily, robbery is the motive. It's not my place to release case specific information as doing so may hinder an ongoing investigation. However, I would refer the reader to media reports regarding the motive.

    2) Transient populations don't work well in serial crimes; inherently, they're transient. Four crimes in six months is an awfully large amount of time to have elapsed and have the same group still together. Moreover, these weren't joy or opportunity kills, I would initially opine. The secluded, consistent areas of these crimes suggest some sort of premeditation.

    3) Examining the case information at first glance, victims here are problematic. White males, older and walking dogs it appears almost always, with the exception of one case. Walking dogs suggests a preoccupied victim, perhaps. Older white males, many times, are a father or grandfather. Could the perpetrator be acting after he experiences or views a trigger? For example, he sees a happy father at the park with his son, is the suspect angry he or she never had or has that experience? Something isn't right on this case. A younger perpetrator typically can't let long periods of time elapse before he or she partakes in violent crimes. Vagrant individuals are the same way, striking when they need money to fund a habit or feed a child. This one is interesting and complex.

    Upon initial examination of the geographic area, victim age sex and race, and the elapsed time in between each case; undoubtedly in my mind, these cases are connected.

    More in a bit. -Nick
    Last edited by Nick_1; 05-23-2017 at 12:07 AM. Reason: Include last line

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