TX - Paddling students approved in Texas school district

The Three Rivers School District will now let a principal or behavior coordinator paddle a misbehaving student with a parent’s permission.

A student could now receive a paddling for minor incidents, like breaking classroom rules.

The new paddling policy reverses a previous code that prohibited corporal punishment.

Three Rivers isn’t the only school district in Texas that allows corporal punishment. There are 26 independent districts that also allow it.

Corporal punishment in schools is still legal in 19 states, mostly in the Midwest, South and Southwest.

http://www.fox13memphis.com/news/tr...exas-school-district-under-new-rule/566471977

I had no idea, I thought it was completely abolished in all states.
I bet the children are much better behaved.

This topic could get a bit heated. I think I will stay away from it.

Hitting children teaches them fear and that might means right, any appearance of "good behavior" is an a fear-based appearance, not true reflection of understanding of why one must behave well.

ETA: so if the goal is creating fear and not thinking then I guess it is great

flourish said:

Hitting children teaches them fear and that might means right, any appearance of "good behavior" is an a fear-based appearance, not true reflection of understanding of why one must behave well.

ETA: so if the goal is creating fear and not thinking then I guess it is great

Click to expand...

Be afraid, be obedient, don't question, don't think.

I heard horror stories about teachers "exercising too much discipline" from my father, who went to school in central California in the 60s. There was no paddling that I know of. However, he told me a story of a classmate who was CHOKED by his teacher, right in the middle of the classroom, in junior high. The teacher grabbed the kid by his neck, choked him, and threw him halfway across the room. Never forgot that story.

Springrain said:

I heard horror stories about teachers "exercising too much discipline" from my father, who went to school in central California in the 60s. There was no paddling that I know of. However, he told me a story of a classmate who was CHOKED by his teacher, right in the middle of the classroom, in junior high. The teacher grabbed the kid by his neck, choked him, and threw him halfway across the room. Never forgot that story.

Click to expand...

I went to school in the fifties and it was fine for teachers to force a five year old to put her hand out and be caned across the palm six times for talking or fidgeting. A tiny little five year old's hand. With all the might of an adult.

flourish said:

Hitting children teaches them fear and that might means right, any appearance of "good behavior" is an a fear-based appearance, not true reflection of understanding of why one must behave well.

ETA: so if the goal is creating fear and not thinking then I guess it is great

Click to expand...

This is manipulation. They are manipulating kids into "behaving properly" with fear.

There are two ways to influence human behaviour:

You can manipulate

Or

You can inspire

Which method you choose tells me everything I need to know about you.

Jennifer17 said:

I went to school in the fifties and it was fine for teachers to force a five year old to put her hand out and be caned across the palm six times for talking or fidgeting. A tiny little five year old's hand. With all the might of an adult.

Click to expand...

I can attest that the hand beating is painful.

The Farm said:

I had no idea, I thought it was completely abolished in all states.
I bet the children are much better behaved.

Click to expand...

Years and years of scientific studies have all reached the same conclusion, corporal punishment doesn't result in better behaved children, to the contrary, it often results in child abuse and injury and trains young humans to grow up and use violence to force the reaction they want from people.
Often adults misread their own power and unintentionally injure children when they hit to discipline. Too often.
There is not a credible peer reviewed scientific study supporting spanking, the results are all the same. Every western psychology and pediatric association agrees.

If hitting children is okay, I suggest rather than risking injury by hitting too hard, just spit on your child.
It is the same thing but much safer. You still get all the humiliation to the child that you get from hitting them and the dominance factor but you don't risk physical damage.
Spitting on your kids is a much safer substitute for hitting.
If you are repulsed at the idea of spitting on a child, how is it okay to hit them?

As new parents learn alternatives ways to discipline, like logic and reason, less of them will end up on websleuths after losing control on their kid.

"The American Academy of Pediatrics and the American Psychoanalytic Association are among many national and international organizations which have comprehensive position statements calling for a ban on physical punishment and describing effective alternatives. The American Academy of Pediatrics concludes: "Corporal punishment is of limited effectiveness and has potentially deleterious side effects. The American Academy of Pediatrics recommends that parents be encouraged and assisted in the development of methods other than spanking for managing undesired behavior.”

From a public health perspective, three issues are crucial to decreasing physical punishment: education (about infant and child development); legislation (to aid parents who are at risk and to protect the children); and continued research (especially on the alternatives).

If we truly want a less violent society, not hitting our children is a good place to start.

Why Physical Punishment Does Not Work
Psychology Today
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo.../201404/why-physical-punishment-does-not-work


"The meta-analysis also demonstrates that the frequency and severity of the corporal punishment matters. The more often or more harshly a child was hit, the more likely they are to be aggressive or to have mental health problems."

Is Corporal Punishment an Effective Means of Discipline?
http://www.apa.org/news/press/releases/2002/06/spanking.aspx

"By 2000, research was proliferating, and the convention had been ratified by 191 of the world’s 196 countries, 11 of which had prohibited all physical punishment. Today, research showing the risks associated with physical punishment is robust, the convention has been integrated into the legal and policy frameworks of many nations, and 31 countries have enacted prohibitions against the physical punishment of children. These three forces — research, the convention and law reform — have altered the landscape of physical punishment."

Physical punishment of children: lessons from 20 years of research
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3447048/

"In the meta-analysis, researchers Elizabeth Gershoff and Andrew Grogan-Kaylor from the University of Texas at Austin and the University of Michigan, respectively, evaluated 75 published studies on the relationship between spanking by parents and various behavioral, emotional, cognitive and physical outcomes among their kids. They found that spanking was associated with 13 out of a total of 17 negative outcomes they assessed, including increased aggression and behavioral and mental health problems as well as reduced cognitive ability and self-esteem."

"Studies continue to find that spanking predicts negative behavior changes—there are no studies showing that kids improve.."

What Science Says—and Doesn't—about Spanking
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-science-says-and-doesn-t-about-spanking/

everybodhi said:

Years and years of scientific studies have all reached the same conclusion, corporal punishment doesn't result in better behaved children, to the contrary, it often results in child abuse and injury and trains young humans to grow up and use violence to force the reaction they want from people.
Often adults misread their own power and unintentionally injure children when they hit to discipline. Too often.
There is not a credible peer reviewed scientific study supporting spanking, the results are all the same. Every western psychology and pediatric association agrees.

If hitting children is okay, I suggest rather than risking injury by hitting too hard, just spit on your child.
It is the same thing but much safer. You still get all the humiliation to the child that you get from hitting them and the dominance factor but you don't risk physical damage.
Spitting on your kids is a much safer substitute for hitting.
If you are repulsed at the idea of spitting on a child, how is it okay to hit them?

As new parents learn alternatives ways to discipline, like logic and reason, less of them will end up on websleuths after losing control on their kid.

"The American Academy of Pediatrics and the American Psychoanalytic Association are among many national and international organizations which have comprehensive position statements calling for a ban on physical punishment and describing effective alternatives. The American Academy of Pediatrics concludes: "Corporal punishment is of limited effectiveness and has potentially deleterious side effects. The American Academy of Pediatrics recommends that parents be encouraged and assisted in the development of methods other than spanking for managing undesired behavior.”

From a public health perspective, three issues are crucial to decreasing physical punishment: education (about infant and child development); legislation (to aid parents who are at risk and to protect the children); and continued research (especially on the alternatives).

If we truly want a less violent society, not hitting our children is a good place to start.

Why Physical Punishment Does Not Work
Psychology Today
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blo.../201404/why-physical-punishment-does-not-work


"The meta-analysis also demonstrates that the frequency and severity of the corporal punishment matters. The more often or more harshly a child was hit, the more likely they are to be aggressive or to have mental health problems."

Is Corporal Punishment an Effective Means of Discipline?
http://www.apa.org/news/press/releases/2002/06/spanking.aspx

"By 2000, research was proliferating, and the convention had been ratified by 191 of the world’s 196 countries, 11 of which had prohibited all physical punishment. Today, research showing the risks associated with physical punishment is robust, the convention has been integrated into the legal and policy frameworks of many nations, and 31 countries have enacted prohibitions against the physical punishment of children. These three forces — research, the convention and law reform — have altered the landscape of physical punishment."

Physical punishment of children: lessons from 20 years of research
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3447048/

"In the meta-analysis, researchers Elizabeth Gershoff and Andrew Grogan-Kaylor from the University of Texas at Austin and the University of Michigan, respectively, evaluated 75 published studies on the relationship between spanking by parents and various behavioral, emotional, cognitive and physical outcomes among their kids. They found that spanking was associated with 13 out of a total of 17 negative outcomes they assessed, including increased aggression and behavioral and mental health problems as well as reduced cognitive ability and self-esteem."

"Studies continue to find that spanking predicts negative behavior changes—there are no studies showing that kids improve.."

What Science Says—and Doesn't—about Spanking
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/what-science-says-and-doesn-t-about-spanking/

Click to expand...

We all have a right to our own opinions. When i was in school in the 60's I remember what was called the rattan which was basically a bamboo whip across the hand.
And children were respectful and behaved. Today what we have is a bunch of out of control children killing each other, killing their parents, commiting suicide at 7 years old etc. No rules, no morals, no values. They rule the schools and they rule the teachers. THEY have control.
I no longer rely on statistics or studies on most things. Usually they end up years later saying ohhhh that's wrong.
And to the above poster that said this could get heated yes I thought the same thing so this will be my last post on this thread....lol

Facts are facts. Opinions aren't facts. Of course you've chosen to discount research so that's just... Swell


And OMG the psychological effects of that period continue to linger... Again if the appearance of good behavior is all that's important then I suppose it seems fine but there are ramifications for creating a generation of scared robots who behave not because they have developed social skills but from fear

The Farm said:

We all have a right to our own opinions. When i was in school in the 60's I remember what was called the rattan which was basically a bamboo whip across the hand.
And children were respectful and behaved. Today what we have is a bunch of out of control children killing each other, killing their parents, commiting suicide at 7 years old etc. No rules, no morals, no values. They rule the schools and they rule the teachers. THEY have control.
I no longer rely on statistics or studies on most things. Usually they end up years later saying ohhhh that's wrong.
And to the above poster that said this could get heated yes I thought the same thing so this will be my last post on this thread....lol

Click to expand...

It's your last post.... interesting because you just made a bunch of statements that need to be backed up or verified, but if you're not here to do it I guess we'll just assume they are opinions based on personal experience, not based facts (like those listed in the post you replied to).

I'm curious to know if ANY research supports paddling in schools as an effective means of anything positive. Who would go up against the APA, NIH, and Scientific American?

flourish said:

Facts are facts. Opinions aren't facts. Of course you've chosen to discount research so that's just... Swell


And OMG the psychological effects of that period continue to linger... Again if the appearance of good behavior is all that's important then I suppose it seems fine but there are ramifications for creating a generation of scared robots who behave not because they have developed social skills but from fear

Click to expand...

The biggest argument I hear is "I was spanked and I turned out okay!" and my question is - do you really think you turned out okay if you think it's acceptable to hit a child?

bluesneakers said:

The biggest argument I hear is "I was spanked and I turned out okay!" and my question is - do you really think you turned out okay if you think it's acceptable to hit a child?

Click to expand...

Yes this! Also there seems to frequently be some kind of "revenge" component... Like, "it happened to me so I refuse to spare you" and like it's some kind of basic unspoken requirement to not do better. My grandpa beat the crap out of my dad growing up, but thank goodness my dad recognized that wasn't the best way... Not that there wasn't ever physical punishment, but not nearly like the ones to which he was subjected.

The Farm said:

We all have a right to our own opinions. When i was in school in the 60's I remember what was called the rattan which was basically a bamboo whip across the hand.
And children were respectful and behaved. Today what we have is a bunch of out of control children killing each other, killing their parents, commiting suicide at 7 years old etc. No rules, no morals, no values. They rule the schools and they rule the teachers. THEY have control.
I no longer rely on statistics or studies on most things. Usually they end up years later saying ohhhh that's wrong.
And to the above poster that said this could get heated yes I thought the same thing so this will be my last post on this thread....lol

Click to expand...

Indeed, these "out of control" children are the ones who were raised by the "respectful and behaved" children who were beaten at home and in school.

Just some food for thought.

CoolJ said:

Indeed, these "out of control" children are the ones who were raised by the "respectful and behaved" children who were beaten at home and in school.

Just some food for thought.

Click to expand...

Almost as though they never actually learned social skills and therefore can't teach social skills to their own.

flourish said:

Yes this! Also there seems to frequently be some kind of "revenge" component... Like, "it happened to me so I refuse to spare you" and like it's some kind of basic unspoken requirement to not do better. My grandpa beat the crap out of my dad growing up, but thank goodness my dad recognized that wasn't the best way... Not that there wasn't ever physical punishment, but not nearly like the ones to which he was subjected.

Click to expand...

My daughter's father got the crap beaten out of him too, and his dad stopped once he started hitting back. So all of a sudden hitting was wrong! He spent years teaching him it's okay to hit when you don't get your way, what do you expect? My ex went through years of therapy and learned some self-awareness and he never hit any of his own children, but I think trying to fight with his own dad was when the sky opened and he saw how stupid it all was.

We don't hit because hitting is wrong, but it's okay to hit someone for hitting.

Kind of like killing is wrong unless we're killing someone who killed someone else.

flourish said:

Facts are facts. Opinions aren't facts. Of course you've chosen to discount research so that's just... Swell


And OMG the psychological effects of that period continue to linger... Again if the appearance of good behavior is all that's important then I suppose it seems fine but there are ramifications for creating a generation of scared robots who behave not because they have developed social skills but from fear

Click to expand...

Personally, I like it when my neighbors, for instance, hit me if I do something wrong in their eyes, And of course, having my husband correct my behavior by hitting is the right thing to do.

Oh, wait a minute. Those are crimes. Assault is a crime,

But a person hitting someone who is not even half the size is ok, Hm. Gotta meditate on that.,Won't ask anyone though, Don't want to be considered cheeky and get a swat

The Farm said:

I had no idea, I thought it was completely abolished in all states.

Click to expand...

I thought so too and had to look it up.



Blue = Corporal punishment in schools prohibited
Red = Corporal punishment not prohibited

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_corporal_punishment_in_the_United_States