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  1. #46
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  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by MIKAYOYO View Post
    They didn't even participate in the national anthem until like 2009.
    SBM: this. and there is no rule or provision in NFL contracts that explicitly addresses this.
    Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.
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  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by bwt42 View Post
    I don't think the players protests will have any positive effect on racial problems. Most white people see it as just giving them the finger. jmo. BTW Now, if they want to boycott & forego a paycheck, that would show they really had commitment.
    I know that's your opinion but I really don't think that's the case. That may have been the case before Trump opened his mouth but since then, many white folks seem to view this as an assault on the first amendment by the president himself. Posted yesterday about the dozens and dozens of veterans and military widows/widowers posting as much on twitter yesterday, in their newfound support of taking a knee. Not to make assumptions, but many of those profile pictures featured white people.

    JMO

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by bwt42 View Post
    I don't think the players protests will have any positive effect on racial problems. Most white people see it as just giving them the finger. jmo. BTW Now, if they want to boycott & forego a paycheck, that would show they really had commitment.
    Are you aware of what any of them do with their time and money away from the field?

  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by BritsKate View Post
    I know that's your opinion but I really don't think that's the case. That may have been the case before Trump opened his mouth but since then, many white folks seem to view this as an assault on the first amendment by the president himself. Posted yesterday about the dozens and dozens of veterans and military widows/widowers posting as much on twitter yesterday, in their newfound support of taking a knee. Not to make assumptions, but many of those profile pictures featured white people.

    JMO
    So, is it about the first amendment or social justice.
    I understood every word you said. It was the order that you said them that has me confused.

  6. #51
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    I wonder (and this is random, honestly not directed at anyone, although the thought started with bwt42's post) if players did boycott the league and forego a paycheck(s) (even though they seem to have support from the league and unions, etc.) would that be enough to...

    make a point
    start a dialogue
    change the world...

    what will it take and then what do we (protestors, players, supporters, advocates) want? Sure, it is easy to answer with some form of the concepts of fairness, equality, empathy, acknowledgment, etc. But how do we get there? What does it look like? Is there any hope?
    Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.
    Margaret Mead

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by bwt42 View Post
    So, is it about the first amendment or social justice.
    yes.
    yes.
    yes.
    Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.
    Margaret Mead

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by bwt42 View Post
    So, is it about the first amendment or social justice.
    I think for some people it's now about Trump's attack on the League and the 1st Amendment. The athletes were protesting against injustice and racism and maybe some of the people who now support the players don't agree with them, but they support the athletes' right to express themselves. But the protest itself is and always has been about racial inequality and police brutality.

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by bwt42 View Post
    So, is it about the first amendment or social justice.
    I don't believe they're mutually exclusive but in reality, it really doesn't matter if they're protesting the Purple People Eater by taking a knee - they have the absolute right to do so. That right is essentially being undermined by the strongest office holder in the US government, the defender of the Constitution. So of course people are going to object when they feel rights are endangered.

    JMO

  10. #55
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    Opposition to Take a Knee and the Yearning to Go Back to Slavery

    Let’s not mistake what we are really seeing here. We are getting a good look at how many everyday Americans are okay with slavery. Not only do they want to silence the freedom of speech for Black Americans and other people of color, they want to FORCE them to behave in a certain manner or be punished.

    Yes, that is slavery; that is what you are doing when you believe that anyone living in this country should venerate her regardless of how this country has treated them or people like them
    But we are watching the real America at work. The required, unquestioned, loyalty of marginalized people to honor a country that continues to kill people of marginalized communities. What part of that is considered freedom?


  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzPistonsGirl View Post
    I wonder (and this is random, honestly not directed at anyone, although the thought started with bwt42's post) if players did boycott the league and forego a paycheck(s) (even though they seem to have support from the league and unions, etc.) would that be enough to...

    make a point
    start a dialogue
    change the world...

    what will it take and then what do we (protestors, players, supporters, advocates) want? Sure, it is easy to answer with some form of the concepts of fairness, equality, empathy, acknowledgment, etc. But how do we get there? What does it look like? Is there any hope?
    I don't know enough about union and labor laws to hazard much of a guess but contractually they may well be barred from actions like these.

    JMO

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by BritsKate View Post
    I don't know enough about union and labor laws to hazard much of a guess but contractually they may well be barred from actions like these.

    JMO
    I think I meant in the bigger sense... what does justice in this instance look like? What do we want from these protests? I mean, we want action, but what does THAT look like?

    I don't want this fade away. People who may not have been too invested in politics ( I know there are some) might be more so now. This might help to wake up some folks who've been sleeping since last November.
    Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it's the only thing that ever has.
    Margaret Mead

  13. #58
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    Bob Costas on conflating the flag with the 'military only'


  14. #59
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    Both my brothers are veterans. Neither feel "disrespected" by the protests (although one says "Don't get mad. Vote.").

    Serving our country means defending the constitution. 99% of the people screaming about how this disrespects our flag and country never served a day in their lives.
    For Elizabeth, a minor child, a victim. Thank God she is home!

    *Gitana (means "Gypsy girl"). Pronounced "hee tah nah."

  15. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by bwt42 View Post
    So, is it about the first amendment or social justice.

    What's the difference?
    "Sell your cleverness and buy bewilderment" - Rumi

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