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  1. #31
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
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    39
    Quote Originally Posted by pattysleuth View Post
    Just a thought, did Jenna play the lottery? The lottery was $541 million that was drawn on August 19th, the 3rd largest in US history. Could she have gone to several gas stations and buy a few tickets from each? They say in theory if you buy from several places maybe your better off. I wish we had details of the purchases from each station, from the debit card. Jenna was short on money and may have done this. But i would not have gone to sketchy areas to buy them without a friend in the car as a woman, my guess is someone was with her.
    I live in the area and I would go to those gas stations by myself. I don't think they are considered sketchy areas--I think someone mentioned something about the eastern most gas stations giving them pause, but I'd like to know more about that!


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  2. #32
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
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    39
    Quote Originally Posted by codesleuth View Post
    Regarding the lotto ticket theory...you typically can't play the lotto with a debit or credit card, it has to be cash.

    Regarding multiple stops, I will leave a gas station if they don't have the 16 oz tall boy cokes. I will also stop and by 1-2 of these 2-3 times a day. I have a long commute.
    The laws vary by state about using cards to purchase lotto tickets. You can't use a credit card in GA to purchase lotto -- I couldn't find anything about using a debit card, though. Any locals know?


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  3. #33
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Metro Atlanta
    Posts
    157
    Quote Originally Posted by lollygag View Post
    The laws vary by state about using cards to purchase lotto tickets. You can't use a credit card in GA to purchase lotto -- I couldn't find anything about using a debit card, though. Any locals know?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    This story says people can use a special debit card to buy tickets.

    http://onlineathens.com/local-news/2...e-ticket-sales

    Other than that it has to be cash if buying in the store. Just guessing but this could be due to the transaction fees charged when using a debit card. It's not a product the retailer is selling so they can't make up the cost of those fees by adjusting prices.

    Here is the last graf:
    Georgia lottery officials also approved a new debit card Thursday that can be used for both lottery and retail transactions. It’s called the “iHOPE” card. It will allow customers to preload funds, buy tickets and have their winnings automatically downloaded into the card’s account. It can be used anywhere that accepts debit cards, and stores that sell lottery tickets won’t face debit card transaction fees for lottery sales made with the card.


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  4. #34
    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Posts
    111
    Quote Originally Posted by pattysleuth View Post
    Just a thought, did Jenna play the lottery? The lottery was $541 million that was drawn on August 19th, the 3rd largest in US history. Could she have gone to several gas stations and buy a few tickets from each? They say in theory if you buy from several places maybe your better off. I wish we had details of the purchases from each station, from the debit card. Jenna was short on money and may have done this. But i would not have gone to sketchy areas to buy them without a friend in the car as a woman, my guess is someone was with her.
    Not sure about GA but in SC you can only buy lottery tickets with cash no debit.

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Metro Atlanta
    Posts
    157


    Here is a map. Subie said it was OK to post. If I need to change anything, let me know. I'm not the greatest map maker but needed a visual. Hope it helps for anyone else who needs an overall picture.

    Green - Gas stations known from debit card purchases. We don't know the order.
    Red - Location of house, apartment and car.
    Purple - Stops in an area, not sure of exact spot. General area based off of Google timeline, if I recall.
    Blue - Food stop known by debit card and straw wrapper in her mom's car.


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  6. #36
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    1,244
    Quote Originally Posted by noseynellie View Post


    Here is a map. Subie said it was OK to post. If I need to change anything, let me know. I'm not the greatest map maker but needed a visual. Hope it helps for anyone else who needs an overall picture.

    Green - Gas stations known from debit card purchases. We don't know the order.
    Red - Location of house, apartment and car.
    Purple - Stops in an area, not sure of exact spot. General area based off of Google timeline, if I recall.
    Blue - Food stop known by debit card and straw wrapper in her mom's car.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Thank you very much. Considering the gas station stops now being confirmed. Do we know where ex-boyfriend was living? Do you know where College park is NoseyNellie? I see the Lindbergh area....sorry....
    Last edited by Bit of hope; 10-01-2017 at 10:58 AM.
    Still believe in the human race.....

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Posts
    13

    GA - Jenna Van Gelderen, 25, Atlanta, 18 August 2017 #3

    The more I read the more I am convinced Jenna is the victim of human trafficking. Although I try to keep an open mind, everything not adding up only adds up to the same thing, in my honest opinion. Trafficking is a multi-million dollar business, with Atlanta being the hub for the entire country. The people behind it are masterminds and the authorities cannot keep up with them because so much is done out of sight (there are even internet sites that are so advanced that everyday common surfers cannot see).

    Something tells me Jenna was questioning her situation, not realizing the full picture, which is completely understandable due to her Autism. While groomed, victims are coerced and brainwashed - by the time they realize the reality of it, it is too late. For Jenna, my guess is she had ZERO idea of what was going on, truly believing the groomer was indeed her boyfriend. This was probably a unique situation for the “boyfriend” as well. My belief is that she was living with a groomer in that apartment, and actually being on the lease was a great coverup. How in the world would she be able to get a lease otherwise, with no income and a record for stealing money from her employer? I’m hoping LE is looking into connections of the other person on the lease (or who actually owns the unit or possibly even the building) because it wouldn’t surprise me if it is part of a much bigger operation. A fabricated landlord that allows an apartment lease to those without income for a kickback? The true landlord is being paid, in my opinion, mainly to keep their mouth shut.

    I feel Jenna was an enigma to the trafficking business, not straying too far, but not staying exceptionally close, either. If she was still being groomed, she was being shown that all her financial needs could be met by her groomer (no need for her to seek reportable income and it explains why she hasn’t had a deposit in quite some time). Everything was being financially controlled for her, and the rest of the control was in the process. My guess is that her leaving for the weekend for the cat (or even just going to visit the house frequently if she didn’t actually stay there) was completely off the charts and created havoc. My gut tells me that either the groomer (or his superior) sent her away to another part of the country within his circle to get her completely away from her family (makes sense with the abandoned car/belongings), or she was feeling uneasy with her current situation and somehow befriended another groomer/pimp who promised to take care of her. Unaware of the true reality of it all, being friendly with two different trafficking circles could have really caused problems.

    A few random thoughts...
    - Studio Execs possibly taping over the video surveillance footage (somewhere in thread #2 mentioned by Subie) was alarming to me
    - GBI involved from the beginning leads me to believe they are onto trafficking and because of the depth of trafficking organizations, it is a very slow process to unweave the intricacies of their webs
    - strip clubs are oftentimes completely against trafficking because one is legal and one is not. There have been many instances where the nightclubs have helped LE with trafficking (this is something Jenna could have been unaware of and if she tried to go to a strip club, that could have been an issue with her groomer/pimp for several reasons).
    - gas stations and convenience stores are common pickup places for trafficking. There is trafficking language/code. Until there is surveillance footage, or at least amounts and times of purchases, I do not think I can place much more thought because it might not have even been Jenna there or making the purchases (still trying to focus on FINDING HER).
    - the tapestry is a mystery and I originally thought it could be related to a community worshipping the Egyptian Sun God, Ra (my husband told me he heard references back in his rap music days to Ra), which led me to want to believe there was a connection to the Opera House concert the night of her disappearance (if I remember the band/place correctly) or to Studio Execs, but there are SO MANY MISSING PIECES! This tapestry is frustrating, to say the least, but like the gas stations, until there is come concrete evidence, I can come up with 1000 theories, but I feel, for me, it is futile without more info.
    - I, like many others on here, think all these “friends” of Jenna’s are somehow connected. The South Carolina one still has me confused because I want to believe she is legit and unrelated to the happenings in Atlanta, but I want her to tell more (and maybe she is, we just don’t know). My gut tells me most of Jenna’s “friends” aren’t talking because they are somehow involved with illegal activities themselves, therefore the cry for help in order to find her is not coming from her “friends.” So sad.
    - the scariest part to me is that Jenna, although 25, is vulnerable and could be looked at as a VERY potential profitable resource in the trafficking industry. She could be advertised for being much younger due to her social vulnerability and her small stature (which is nauseating that there is an overwhelming desire for underage sex), but the reality is that she is actually of legal age, so it is a win-win for pimps (the difference in charges between trafficking children and adults is huge - I think trafficking adults is only a misdemeanor which means they get arrested, pay their bail, and are back at it the next day. Trafficking children will land you in jail for a LONG time).

    I want with all my heart to be wrong, but I strongly believe, although it is only my opinion, this possibility cannot be denied.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    7,762
    Hi ya'll,
    I had several requests to pop in on Jenna's case and just now have gotten the chance to invest some time. I apologize in advance if I ask any questions that have already been answered while I get myself up to speed on the SAR situation.
    Has the Underwood Hills area been flooded with Missing posters? If so, at what point in time did they go up and what details were included on them?
    TIA

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Metro Atlanta
    Posts
    157
    Quote Originally Posted by WorkerBee View Post
    The more I read the more I am convinced Jenna is the victim of human trafficking. Although I try to keep an open mind, everything not adding up only adds up to the same thing, in my honest opinion. Trafficking is a multi-million dollar business, with Atlanta being the hub for the entire country. The people behind it are masterminds and the authorities cannot keep up with them because so much is done out of sight (there are even internet sites that are so advanced that everyday common surfers cannot see).

    Something tells me Jenna was questioning her situation, not realizing the full picture, which is completely understandable due to her Autism. While groomed, victims are coerced and brainwashed - by the time they realize the reality of it, it is too late. For Jenna, my guess is she had ZERO idea of what was going on, truly believing the groomer was indeed her boyfriend. This was probably a unique situation for the “boyfriend” as well. My belief is that she was living with a groomer in that apartment, and actually being on the lease was a great coverup. How in the world would she be able to get a lease otherwise, with no income and a record for stealing money from her employer? I’m hoping LE is looking into connections of the other person on the lease (or who actually owns the unit or possibly even the building) because it wouldn’t surprise me if it is part of a much bigger operation. A fabricated landlord that allows an apartment lease to those without income for a kickback? The true landlord is being paid, in my opinion, mainly to keep their mouth shut.

    I feel Jenna was an enigma to the trafficking business, not straying too far, but not staying exceptionally close, either. If she was still being groomed, she was being shown that all her financial needs could be met by her groomer (no need for her to seek reportable income and it explains why she hasn’t had a deposit in quite some time). Everything was being financially controlled for her, and the rest of the control was in the process. My guess is that her leaving for the weekend for the cat (or even just going to visit the house frequently if she didn’t actually stay there) was completely off the charts and created havoc. My gut tells me that either the groomer (or his superior) sent her away to another part of the country within his circle to get her completely away from her family (makes sense with the abandoned car/belongings), or she was feeling uneasy with her current situation and somehow befriended another groomer/pimp who promised to take care of her. Unaware of the true reality of it all, being friendly with two different trafficking circles could have really caused problems.

    A few random thoughts...
    - Studio Execs possibly taping over the video surveillance footage (somewhere in thread #2 mentioned by Subie) was alarming to me
    - GBI involved from the beginning leads me to believe they are onto trafficking and because of the depth of trafficking organizations, it is a very slow process to unweave the intricacies of their webs
    - strip clubs are oftentimes completely against trafficking because one is legal and one is not. There have been many instances where the nightclubs have helped LE with trafficking (this is something Jenna could have been unaware of and if she tried to go to a strip club, that could have been an issue with her groomer/pimp for several reasons).
    - gas stations and convenience stores are common pickup places for trafficking. There is trafficking language/code. Until there is surveillance footage, or at least amounts and times of purchases, I do not think I can place much more thought because it might not have even been Jenna there or making the purchases (still trying to focus on FINDING HER).
    - the tapestry is a mystery and I originally thought it could be related to a community worshipping the Egyptian Sun God, Ra (my husband told me he heard references back in his rap music days to Ra), which led me to want to believe there was a connection to the Opera House concert the night of her disappearance (if I remember the band/place correctly) or to Studio Execs, but there are SO MANY MISSING PIECES! This tapestry is frustrating, to say the least, but like the gas stations, until there is come concrete evidence, I can come up with 1000 theories, but I feel, for me, it is futile without more info.
    - I, like many others on here, think all these “friends” of Jenna’s are somehow connected. The South Carolina one still has me confused because I want to believe she is legit and unrelated to the happenings in Atlanta, but I want her to tell more (and maybe she is, we just don’t know). My gut tells me most of Jenna’s “friends” aren’t talking because they are somehow involved with illegal activities themselves, therefore the cry for help in order to find her is not coming from her “friends.” So sad.
    - the scariest part to me is that Jenna, although 25, is vulnerable and could be looked at as a VERY potential profitable resource in the trafficking industry. She could be advertised for being much younger due to her social vulnerability and her small stature (which is nauseating that there is an overwhelming desire for underage sex), but the reality is that she is actually of legal age, so it is a win-win for pimps (the difference in charges between trafficking children and adults is huge - I think trafficking adults is only a misdemeanor which means they get arrested, pay their bail, and are back at it the next day. Trafficking children will land you in jail for a LONG time).

    I want with all my heart to be wrong, but I strongly believe, although it is only my opinion, this possibility cannot be denied.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    The location of the car ... parking on a street, in front of a building with a visible camera. You can see the camera right by the door. Also, it's not just any camera. It's a camera that recorded a shooting and it was publicized in the news.

    Either the person who left it was dumb or they felt police would not be getting any helpful info on it, IMO. There's plenty of other places in this city - even around there - to leave a car and be more discreet. This is not a street where people park cars so it would stand out. The tank was not empty to the point it couldn't be driven somewhere else.

    Is there such a thing as a turf war relating to drug sales/trafficking or something of the sort? Does that really happen or have I watched too many movies?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Europe
    Posts
    1,244
    Quote Originally Posted by Oriah View Post
    Hi ya'll,
    I had several requests to pop in on Jenna's case and just now have gotten the chance to invest some time. I apologize in advance if I ask any questions that have already been answered while I get myself up to speed on the SAR situation.
    Has the Underwood Hills area been flooded with Missing posters? If so, at what point in time did they go up and what details were included on them?
    TIA
    Hi Oriah...welcome. Good to have you "aboard". I'm sorry can't answer your questions.
    Still believe in the human race.....


  11. #41
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Posts
    13
    Quote Originally Posted by WorkerBee View Post
    The more I read the more I am convinced Jenna is the victim of human trafficking. Although I try to keep an open mind, everything not adding up only adds up to the same thing, in my honest opinion. Trafficking is a multi-million dollar business, with Atlanta being the hub for the entire country. The people behind it are masterminds and the authorities cannot keep up with them because so much is done out of sight (there are even internet sites that are so advanced that everyday common surfers cannot see).

    Something tells me Jenna was questioning her situation, not realizing the full picture, which is completely understandable due to her Autism. While groomed, victims are coerced and brainwashed - by the time they realize the reality of it, it is too late. For Jenna, my guess is she had ZERO idea of what was going on, truly believing the groomer was indeed her boyfriend. This was probably a unique situation for the “boyfriend” as well. My belief is that she was living with a groomer in that apartment, and actually being on the lease was a great coverup. How in the world would she be able to get a lease otherwise, with no income and a record for stealing money from her employer? I’m hoping LE is looking into connections of the other person on the lease (or who actually owns the unit or possibly even the building) because it wouldn’t surprise me if it is part of a much bigger operation. A fabricated landlord that allows an apartment lease to those without income for a kickback? The true landlord is being paid, in my opinion, mainly to keep their mouth shut.

    I feel Jenna was an enigma to the trafficking business, not straying too far, but not staying exceptionally close, either. If she was still being groomed, she was being shown that all her financial needs could be met by her groomer (no need for her to seek reportable income and it explains why she hasn’t had a deposit in quite some time). Everything was being financially controlled for her, and the rest of the control was in the process. My guess is that her leaving for the weekend for the cat (or even just going to visit the house frequently if she didn’t actually stay there) was completely off the charts and created havoc. My gut tells me that either the groomer (or his superior) sent her away to another part of the country within his circle to get her completely away from her family (makes sense with the abandoned car/belongings), or she was feeling uneasy with her current situation and somehow befriended another groomer/pimp who promised to take care of her. Unaware of the true reality of it all, being friendly with two different trafficking circles could have really caused problems.

    A few random thoughts...
    - Studio Execs possibly taping over the video surveillance footage (somewhere in thread #2 mentioned by Subie) was alarming to me
    - GBI involved from the beginning leads me to believe they are onto trafficking and because of the depth of trafficking organizations, it is a very slow process to unweave the intricacies of their webs
    - strip clubs are oftentimes completely against trafficking because one is legal and one is not. There have been many instances where the nightclubs have helped LE with trafficking (this is something Jenna could have been unaware of and if she tried to go to a strip club, that could have been an issue with her groomer/pimp for several reasons).
    - gas stations and convenience stores are common pickup places for trafficking. There is trafficking language/code. Until there is surveillance footage, or at least amounts and times of purchases, I do not think I can place much more thought because it might not have even been Jenna there or making the purchases (still trying to focus on FINDING HER).
    - the tapestry is a mystery and I originally thought it could be related to a community worshipping the Egyptian Sun God, Ra (my husband told me he heard references back in his rap music days to Ra), which led me to want to believe there was a connection to the Opera House concert the night of her disappearance (if I remember the band/place correctly) or to Studio Execs, but there are SO MANY MISSING PIECES! This tapestry is frustrating, to say the least, but like the gas stations, until there is come concrete evidence, I can come up with 1000 theories, but I feel, for me, it is futile without more info.
    - I, like many others on here, think all these “friends” of Jenna’s are somehow connected. The South Carolina one still has me confused because I want to believe she is legit and unrelated to the happenings in Atlanta, but I want her to tell more (and maybe she is, we just don’t know). My gut tells me most of Jenna’s “friends” aren’t talking because they are somehow involved with illegal activities themselves, therefore the cry for help in order to find her is not coming from her “friends.” So sad.
    - the scariest part to me is that Jenna, although 25, is vulnerable and could be looked at as a VERY potential profitable resource in the trafficking industry. She could be advertised for being much younger due to her social vulnerability and her small stature (which is nauseating that there is an overwhelming desire for underage sex), but the reality is that she is actually of legal age, so it is a win-win for pimps (the difference in charges between trafficking children and adults is huge - I think trafficking adults is only a misdemeanor which means they get arrested, pay their bail, and are back at it the next day. Trafficking children will land you in jail for a LONG time).

    I want with all my heart to be wrong, but I strongly believe, although it is only my opinion, this possibility cannot be denied.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

    Only the last paragraph of my post appears on the app (which makes it look really strange and cryptic). There is a way to see it, but I know I wouldn’t look unless prompted. I must have too many words... sorry!

  12. #42
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Posts
    13
    Quote Originally Posted by noseynellie View Post
    The location of the car ... parking on a street, in front of a building with a visible camera. You can see the camera right by the door. Also, it's not just any camera. It's a camera that recorded a shooting and it was publicized in the news.

    Either the person who left it was dumb or they felt police would not be getting any helpful info on it, IMO. There's plenty of other places in this city - even around there - to leave a car and be more discreet. This is not a street where people park cars so it would stand out. The tank was not empty to the point it couldn't be driven somewhere else.

    Is there such a thing as a turf war relating to drug sales/trafficking or something of the sort? Does that really happen or have I watched too many movies?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Are you talking about the camera at the recording studio?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  13. #43
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Posts
    336
    Quote Originally Posted by WorkerBee View Post
    Only the last paragraph of my post appears on the app (which makes it look really strange and cryptic). There is a way to see it, but I know I wouldn’t look unless prompted. I must have too many words... sorry!
    I can see your post in its entirety in the original post & the quoted post!

    Very good points you bring up!

  14. #44
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Metro Atlanta
    Posts
    157
    Quote Originally Posted by WorkerBee View Post
    Are you talking about the camera at the recording studio?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Yes


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  15. #45
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    7,762
    I find the location of the recovered vehicle very interesting as well. I wonder how many times it had been moved prior to discovery.
    Also, anyone know when Jenna was first issued her license?

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