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View Poll Results: Would you think it more likely that Raven is innocent if he had taken a polygraph?

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  • Yes.

    25 80.65%
  • No.

    6 19.35%

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  1. #1
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    Should Raven take a polygraph test?

    A lot of people are uncomfortable taking a polygraph even if they ARE innocent. I think that I'd be nervous about it myself. Is there a way that Raven could arrange to take one on his own at his lawyer's office or something? I remember that John Mason in the ridiculous run-away bride case, (ironically on the same night that Janet was murdered I think), was willing to do something like that - arrange for his own polygraph to include videotaping in his lawyer's office. LE wouldn't accept it but it seems that it would be better than nothing anyway - if for nothing else, to at least prove to his family and friends that he's not afraid to take it. Because it seems to me that no matter his family and friends say, they cannot possibly be 100% convinced of his innocence. The lie detector could change that for him.

    All things considered, I think that Raven should take a polygraph test.

    "Be the change you wish to see in the world."
    Mahatma Gandhi

  2. #2
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    Sorry, to clarify - the poll question is -

    Had Raven taken a polygraph test early on, would it have influenced your opinion on whether or not he was guilty?

    In the body of your posts, I'd be interested in what you all think about whether or not Raven should take a polygraph now.

    (I didn't make the poll "Should Raven take a polygraph test" only because I figured nearly everyone would answer yes and we wouldn't really learn anything from it.)

    "Be the change you wish to see in the world."
    Mahatma Gandhi

  3. #3
    Jenifred is offline I can feel it coming in the air tonight......
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    If he had taken the polygraph early on and passed, I'd be more way more inclined to believe that he was innocent.

    Should he take one now? Sure, why not? If he's innocent, he's got nothing to hide.
    2 Nephi 30:17 "There is nothing which is seceret save it shall be revealed; there is no work of darkness save it shall be made manifest in the light; and there is nothing which is sealed upon the earth save it shall be loosed."

  4. #4
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    COPYING FROM THE "DEAR RAVEN" THREAD TO HERE:




    Quote:
    Originally Posted by terminatrixator
    How about contacting Law Enforcement and making an appointment to take a Lie Detector test? Oh, I'm sorry, did your Attorney inform you not to do this? Does your attorney also believe you are a Stone Cold Murderer too? I bet he does and therefore would not want you take one.


    You know, this has always bothered me. Now, I know full well that more often than not, once someone hires an attorney, that the attorney will usually tell the person what to say, what not to say, what to do, what not to do, including a polygraph - but I swear, if it were me, and I KNEW I was innocent, I'd tell my attorney to shove that advice up his a**! I'd be BEGGING LE to give me a polygraph, to show I was NOT GUILTY, and then to allow LE to focus elsewhere.

    Now granted, in this situation, LE has never named Raven a POI. But, that said, I'm sure Raven knows by now that he walks around each and every day under a cloud of suspicion, and most likely from LE too, even if they've never said that publically. So if you're in fact 100% innocent, why the hell would you NOT come and offer to take a polygraph from LE? It makes no sense to me whatsoever. Sure, polygraphs might not be 100% accurate, sure, polygraphs may not be used in court, BUT, if nothing else, volunteering to take a polygraph from LE says that a person is willing to help, and is at least comfortable in coming in and saying, 'you know what, test me, I have nothing to hide!'
    "I'm for truth, no matter who tells it. I'm for justice, no matter who it's for or against."

    -Malcolm X

  5. #5
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    COPYING FROM THE "DEAR RAVEN" THREAD TO HERE:



    Quote:
    Originally Posted by JerseyGirl
    A lot of people are uncomfortable to take a polygraph even if they ARE innocent. I think that I'd be nervous about it myself. Is there a way that Raven could arrange to take one on his own at his lawyer's office or something. I remember that John Mason in the ridiculous run-away bride case, (ironically on the same night that Janet was murdered I think), was willing to do something like that - arrange for his own polygraph to include videotaping in his lawyer's office. LE wouldn't accept it but it seems that it would be better than nothing anyway.


    I still don't get it I guess - and maybe you have to be in that situation to really make that choice...but at this point, to me anyway, I just feel like I'd be doing ANYTHING possible to clear my name, and to make sure LE was looking in other directions. And I guess I don't really see the point in taking a polygraph independently of LE? If you're willing to TAKE a test, why would you not take it with LE? It seems to me that taking one "on your own" just implies that you're afraid to face LE, for some reason or another?
    "I'm for truth, no matter who tells it. I'm for justice, no matter who it's for or against."

    -Malcolm X

  6. #6
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    Polygraphs to prove innocence?

    This is just a message board but what this person says makes a lot of sense:

    "Tennessee law currently prohibits the admissibility of polygraph tests as evidence in court. The reason is that the test cannot conclusively determine if someone is lying ... but only analyzes stress responses to questions and answers and compares to a baseline stress response a person exhibits answering normal questions truthfully. The idea is that when people are lying, they exhibit more stress symptoms than they do when normally telling the truth.

    The test is not 100% reliable because people can learn to manipulate their own stress responses to defeat the test ... and ... people who are lying but who are skilled enough actors to place themselves in a physiological state of self-belief (kind of like you do when trying to realistically portray a character role on stage) can defeat the test (as well as sociopaths who feel no guilt whatsoever about lying and can lie just as easy as they can tell the truth)."

    So what the heck Raven, why don't you take the test? You've got nothing to lose. They're not admissable in court and you might just come out believable. It's worth a shot. And then maybe LE can move on in the investigation and get closer to finding your wife and baby's killer.

    "Be the change you wish to see in the world."
    Mahatma Gandhi

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenifred
    If he had taken the polygraph early on and passed, I'd be more way more inclined to believe that he was innocent.

    Should he take one now? Sure, why not? If he's innocent, he's got nothing to hide.
    I agree - if Raven had taken a polygraph and PASSED it, soon after Janet's murder, I would have been much more inclined to believe in his innocence too. Now? It surely can't hurt anything.
    "I'm for truth, no matter who tells it. I'm for justice, no matter who it's for or against."

    -Malcolm X

  8. #8
    terminatrixator's Avatar
    terminatrixator is offline All Posts JMO - May Godspeed Justice for Janet and her unborn child!
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    Well, if he had taken a polygraph immediately after the Murder, I would be inclined to agree and Raven's guilt or innocence would not have been in question here.

    If The Raven goes to the Durham Police Department and takes it, and passes, then it would mean something to me.

    If Raven decided to go to an Independent Testing Agency, I would not put much faith in it. If the Raven took it independently, there are too many variables involved whether he passed or failed in my opinion.

    Without the tester having the correct knowledge on how to administer the testing, whether or not Raven purchased books and practiced taking a test in the past, would be in question.

    Whether or not he used mental breathing techniques to pass, or even tranquilizers to slow the pulse rate would be questions that would lead me to not trust the validity of the test. If he was not also subjected to a blood test to test for drugs in his system that can help in his responses, and slow his breathing down, this test would mean nothing to me.

    There is much controvery on testing sociopaths and psychopaths, such as Raven. Sociopaths and psychopaths, have been lying for a long time, and start believing their lies, and there is some data that shows it is easier for sociopaths to pass a lie detector test than non-sociopaths.

    There is other data showing, that even sociopaths or psychopaths that believe their lies, still failed.

    There is data to indicate that going to independent agency, and not having the correct questions asked can create a false pretense of passing and unless there is a blood test showing no use of tranquilizers in the system, then the test to me would not be valid.

    I offered before, I would go to Durham Police Department and sit in the room with Raven and his attorney and take a Polygraph first, and then let LE do their thing with the Raven.

    It's not going to happen though, Raven would NEVER voluntarily go to Durham LE and take a Polygraph Test. Hell, he won't even call them to check on the investigation of Janet's murder.
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." ~ Edmund Burke

    "Safety never takes a holiday" ~Britney Romito

    "It's easier to KEEP Raven happy, than it is to MAKE Raven happy." ~Janet Christiansen (Abaroa)

    "Right now you have the capabilities of being a God" ~Karen Abaroa Bolton

  9. #9
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    To qote Dr. Phil: The way you can tell if Raven is lying is if his lips are moving...

    He probably believes his own lies and could do very well on polygraph. However, if he had done it early on it would have given me the impression that--at the very least--he was cooperating and wanted the murder solved.
    Men should take care not to make women weep, for God counts their tears. -- President Thomas S. Monson

  10. #10
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    I will only trust a polygraph that is conducted by LE - not someone Raven selects.


  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by juliagoulia
    To qote Dr. Phil: The way you can tell if Raven is lying is if his lips are moving...

    He probably believes his own lies and could do very well on polygraph. However, if he had done it early on it would have given me the impression that--at the very least--he was cooperating and wanted the murder solved.
    That's the key here Julia, cooperation! If he was cooperating (even if he didn't take a lie detector test), it could change my opinion.
    He's NOT speaking out for Janet, He's NOT offering a reward, He's NOT contacting LE, He's NOT memorizing her on the web (like he did himself before she was murdered), He's NOT trying to find out who murdered his wife. He IS moving away from the crime scene quickly, He IS moving on, He IS going on trips, He IS dating others, He IS financially benefitting from the crime.

    It's was raven is and isn't doing that makes him look like such a and guilty. So, raven, if you don't want to take a lie detector test (for whatever reason), at least contact LE and talk to them. Find out where they are in the case and what YOU can do to help this investigation.
    Justice For Janet Christiansen Abaroa!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by JerseyGirl
    Sorry, to clarify - the poll question is -

    Had Raven taken a polygraph test early on, would it have influenced your opinion on whether or not he was guilty?

    In the body of your posts, I'd be interested in what you all think about whether or not Raven should take a polygraph now.

    (I didn't make the poll "Should Raven take a polygraph test" only because I figured nearly everyone would answer yes and we wouldn't really learn anything from it.)
    It is almost pointless now. If Raven had taken a polygraph right away when he was initially asked to by LE and had passed, I and many other people would have looked for the killer elsewhere. The way I understand the events to have gone down were that Raven agreed to take the polygraph when he was first asked (the night of the murder) and then when he was due back the next day to take it, LE found out he had gotten a lawyer and would not be taking the polygraph. So now after all this time taking a "private" lie detector test??? No this would not fly with me!!!

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by SouthEastSleuth
    COPYING FROM THE "DEAR RAVEN" THREAD TO HERE:




    Quote:
    Originally Posted by terminatrixator
    How about contacting Law Enforcement and making an appointment to take a Lie Detector test? Oh, I'm sorry, did your Attorney inform you not to do this? Does your attorney also believe you are a Stone Cold Murderer too? I bet he does and therefore would not want you take one.


    You know, this has always bothered me. Now, I know full well that more often than not, once someone hires an attorney, that the attorney will usually tell the person what to say, what not to say, what to do, what not to do, including a polygraph - but I swear, if it were me, and I KNEW I was innocent, I'd tell my attorney to shove that advice up his a**! I'd be BEGGING LE to give me a polygraph, to show I was NOT GUILTY, and then to allow LE to focus elsewhere.

    Now granted, in this situation, LE has never named Raven a POI. But, that said, I'm sure Raven knows by now that he walks around each and every day under a cloud of suspicion, and most likely from LE too, even if they've never said that publically. So if you're in fact 100% innocent, why the hell would you NOT come and offer to take a polygraph from LE? It makes no sense to me whatsoever. Sure, polygraphs might not be 100% accurate, sure, polygraphs may not be used in court, BUT, if nothing else, volunteering to take a polygraph from LE says that a person is willing to help, and is at least comfortable in coming in and saying, 'you know what, test me, I have nothing to hide!'
    EXACTLY! Test me. I will take the test any time. I know I would pass!

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by BirdHunter
    The way I understand the events to have gone down were that Raven agreed to take the polygraph when he was first asked (the night of the murder) and then when he was due back the next day to take it, LE found out he had gotten a lawyer and would not be taking the polygraph.
    The NEXT day??? So in the period of the one day between being asked to take the test and actually taking it, Raven retained an attorney? Oh my ...

    "Be the change you wish to see in the world."
    Mahatma Gandhi

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by JerseyGirl
    The NEXT day??? So in the period of the one day between being asked to take the test and actually taking it, Raven retained an attorney? Oh my ...
    Baby, it was more like HOURS!

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