"We Didn't Mean for This to Happen"

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Eagle1

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PR is quoted, by her sister Pam as saying "Couldn't you fix this for me?" and SOMETHING LIKE...."We didn't mean for this to happen," when Pam had finally convinced her to lie down for a while. She would get up to greet each visitor arriving, people Pam didn't know. Pg. 53 of paperback PMPT.

Was PR ever asked what this sentence meant?

What do we think it could mean? (Obviously "we" could just mean John and I, or, any-number-of others and I didn't mean for this to happen.)
 
If these were normal folks I would think it would mean - we didnt mean to keep people away from their families on Christmas. Take up their time and bring such sadness to their holiday too.

Considering its the R's .... no telling .
 
"We didn't mean for this to happen.."

Could have been simply referring to the fact that they knew JonBenet had been promoted in the news and exposed to all kinds of weirdos that frequent the young pageant shows. Obviously Patsy knew the business and must have been aware of that risk. Obviously, that morning the police were discussing with them who might have done this. They must have speculated that "this" was the reason.

On the other hand....
 
Eagle1 said:
PR is quoted, by her sister Pam as saying "Couldn't you fix this for me?" and SOMETHING LIKE...."We didn't mean for this to happen," when Pam had finally convinced her to lie down for a while. She would get up to greet each visitor arriving, people Pam didn't know. Pg. 53 of paperback PMPT.

Was PR ever asked what this sentence meant?

What do we think it could mean? (Obviously "we" could just mean John and I, or, any-number-of others and I didn't mean for this to happen.)
Click to expand...

It sounds like Patsy was overwhelmed with people coming and maybe phone calls from people asking after her well being and so on . "Fix this for me" Make it go away fix it so it all stops. Patsy didn't have the strength to go through the formalities she thought was required of her. They didn't mean for the flood gate to open and people asking to much of her. Just acknowledging politely a person being there would seem stupid to her at a time like that.I know at a time like that anything would seem like to much. Even if "THEY" had anything to do with JBR'S death she would still be grieve stricken.

Susie
 
Eagle1 said:
PR is quoted, by her sister Pam as saying "Couldn't you fix this for me?" and SOMETHING LIKE...."We didn't mean for this to happen," when Pam had finally convinced her to lie down for a while. She would get up to greet each visitor arriving, people Pam didn't know. Pg. 53 of paperback PMPT.

Was PR ever asked what this sentence meant?

What do we think it could mean? (Obviously "we" could just mean John and I, or, any-number-of others and I didn't mean for this to happen.)
Click to expand...

It was not Pam Paugh....it was Pam Griffin, Patsy's friend.

With the crying and histrionics, Patsy jumped up to greet everyone who came a-knockin. Unfrigginbelievable.
 
'We didnt mean for this to happen 'is certainly a strange statement to make,considering the circumstances....but then again a lot of Patsys statements were strange
 
Eagle1 said:
PR is quoted, by her sister Pam as saying "Couldn't you fix this for me?" and SOMETHING LIKE...."We didn't mean for this to happen," when Pam had finally convinced her to lie down for a while. She would get up to greet each visitor arriving, people Pam didn't know. Pg. 53 of paperback PMPT.

Was PR ever asked what this sentence meant?

What do we think it could mean? (Obviously "we" could just mean John and I, or, any-number-of others and I didn't mean for this to happen.)
Click to expand...
Hi Eagle1, we were talking about this on another thread weren't we.

I was very surprised to read the differing responses to the meaning of "We didn't mean for this to happen". I just immediately assumed that the "this" referred to the death of JonBenet and that the "we" was a Freudian slip, in that she inadvertently admitted that she was involved with those whom she knew were responsible for the crime.
 
aussiesheila said:
Hi Eagle1,
...

I was very surprised to read the differing responses to the meaning of "We didn't mean for this to happen". ..... that the "we" was a Freudian slip, in that she inadvertently admitted that she was involved with those whom she knew were responsible for the crime...
Click to expand...

Yes, and earlier on that same pg 53, PR said to Pam (Griffin?) "You know, THEY'VE killed my baby. A little farther down the pg, Pam remembers having the feeling, couldn't say why, that Patsy KNEW who, but was AFRAID to say.

Anyone, who could THEY be? What kind of secret group would they let their baby visit, without them, who they're still not EXPOSING? Some have suggested a picture-taking pretext, which might sound harmless enough, even flattering, to the proud parents. There's gotta be something more. I think she may know what group, but not exactly which one, the way she talked in The Patricia Letters, which may be accessible from ACandyRose.

Some nut case kept phoning her during the Grand Jury proceedings, as if, imo, he may have been extremely nervous about that.
 
So she says ---- lots of things have been said or stated without any other proof other than the words falling from her mouth . I dont take that as a credible source at all. I believe Patsy & John both knows exactly what who where and when about the crime, before the crime and everything after it up to the present day.
 
sharpar said:
So she says ---- lots of things have been said or stated without any other proof other than the words falling from her mouth . I dont take that as a credible source at all. I believe Patsy & John both knows exactly what who where and when about the crime, before the crime and everything after it up to the present day.
Click to expand...
Well said:clap:
 
Eagle1 said:
Yes, and earlier on that same pg 53, PR said to Pam (Griffin?) "You know, THEY'VE killed my baby. A little farther down the pg, Pam remembers having the feeling, couldn't say why, that Patsy KNEW who, but was AFRAID to say.

Anyone, who could THEY be? What kind of secret group would they let their baby visit, without them, who they're still not EXPOSING? Some have suggested a picture-taking pretext, which might sound harmless enough, even flattering, to the proud parents. There's gotta be something more. I think she may know what group, but not exactly which one, the way she talked in The Patricia Letters, which may be accessible from ACandyRose.

Some nut case kept phoning her during the Grand Jury proceedings, as if, imo, he may have been extremely nervous about that.
Click to expand...
I wonder if Pam regrets saying that as it makes Patsy look guilty or I wonder if she did it to be spiteful (even if it was true). I think I would have protected my sister and not have said that. What do you all think?
 
Eagle1 said:
Yes, and earlier on that same pg 53, PR said to Pam (Griffin?) "You know, THEY'VE killed my baby. A little farther down the pg, Pam remembers having the feeling, couldn't say why, that Patsy KNEW who, but was AFRAID to say.
Click to expand...
Eagle, I assume the 'she' you are referring to is Patsy.

If it is then I think she does know "who could THEY be" and she inadvertently let that slip when she said to Pam Griffin in her very distressed state "We didn't mean for this to happen." Then later when she had calmed down and created the story that she wants the world to believe is the truth in DOI, she feigns ignorance of knowing anything when she quotes PW as having said she knew something but that she, Patsy knew nothing ^^And I turned to her and I said, "Priscilla, how can you know so much?" And I said, "I am the mother of this child. And I know nothing."^^



Eagle1 said:
Anyone, who could THEY be? What kind of secret group would they let their baby visit, without them, who they're still not EXPOSING?
Click to expand...
Are you referring to Patsy AND John as having let their baby visit a secret group here Eagle? I don't think John was ever in on any of this, he IMO was an old-fashioned type businessman focussed very much on his business who left his wife to attend to all the family matters and child rearing. I don't think he had much idea of what went on when he was away on business and I don't think he had ANY idea about the sexual abuse of JohnBenet that went on, I think mainly when he was away.

I don't think Patsy let JonBenet visit any group, I think she let relatives and friends babysit JonBenet and I think she went to gatherings/parties at relatives and friends' homes where people, including children might segregate from the main group for a matter of minutes, even hours, where Patsy wouldn't really be certain what those who were out of sight were up to. And that she didn't make it her business to find out.

I think Patsy and possibly her sisters were sexually abused by their own father. Someone posted a very interesting reply to one of my posts, and I think it was Jayelles, and I can't find the post, where she said that she had seen a video of Patsy being interviewed and Patsy was asked whether anyone had inappropriately touched her as a child, or some such question, and Patsy instantaneously became all child-like and spoke in a completely different voice, which ?Jayelles found very strange. I was unable to view the video but it sounded very much to me like a response that might have come from an adult who had been sexually abused child. This kind of helped me confirm my idea that this might have been where Patsy was coming from, and that her issues had never been resolved for her, so that when the same thing began to happen to JonBenet she was not capable of protecting her daughter and preventing the same thing from happening to her daughter as had happened to her as a child.



Eagle1 said:
Some have suggested a picture-taking pretext, which might sound harmless enough, even flattering, to the proud parents.
Click to expand...
This is what I proposed that might have been told to Patsy as to the reason why some men, including Santa, wanted to come to the Ramsey house that Christmas night. That a well-known photographer wanted to take photos of JonBenet with Santa on Christmas night and that was the only time available to schedule the session. I don't think this was ever mentioned to John as he would have recognised it to be the BS it really was, but since he was going to be asleep at the time he was never going to know, was he?



Eagle1 said:
There's gotta be something more. I think she may know what group, but not exactly which one, the way she talked in The Patricia Letters, which may be accessible from ACandyRose.
Click to expand...
I don't think I have ever read these. Do you mean 'she' as in Patsy here too?



Eagle1 said:
Some nut case kept phoning her during the Grand Jury proceedings, as if, imo, he may have been extremely nervous about that.
Click to expand...
Do you mean some nut case phoning Patsy? If so, my guess it would have been one of the pedophiles involved in the coverup pressuring her not to say 'too much' when she was called to testify.
 
Ellen13, PR's sister Polly was there at the Fernies' I think, not her sister Pam. We are referring to Pam Griffin.

aussiesheila said:
.........
I don't think Patsy let JonBenet visit any group, I think she let relatives and friends babysit JonBenet and I think she went to gatherings/parties at relatives and friends' homes where people, including children might segregate from the main group for a matter of minutes, even hours, where Patsy wouldn't really be certain what those who were out of sight were up to. And that she didn't make it her business to find out.

I think Patsy and possibly her sisters were sexually abused by their own father. Someone posted a very interesting reply to one of my posts, and I think it was Jayelles, and I can't find the post, where she said that she had seen a video of Patsy being interviewed and Patsy was asked whether anyone had inappropriately touched her as a child, or some such question, and Patsy instantaneously became all child-like and spoke in a completely different voice, which ?Jayelles found very strange. I was unable to view the video but it sounded very much to me like a response that might have come from an adult who had been sexually abused child. This kind of helped me confirm my idea that this might have been where Patsy was coming from, and that her issues had never been resolved for her, so that when the same thing began to happen to JonBenet she was not capable of protecting her daughter and preventing the same thing from happening to her daughter as had happened to her as a child. .........
This is what I proposed that might have been told to Patsy as to the reason why some men, including Santa, wanted to come to the Ramsey house that Christmas night. That a well-known photographer wanted to take photos of JonBenet with Santa on Christmas night and that was the only time available to schedule the session. I don't think this was ever mentioned to John as he would have recognised it to be the BS it really was, but since he was going to be asleep at the time he was never going to know, was he?.......
Do you mean some nut case phoning Patsy? If so, my guess it would have been one of the pedophiles involved in the coverup pressuring her not to say 'too much' when she was called to testify.
Click to expand...

Yes, the Patricia Letters are about some guy phoning Patsy during the Grand Jury, and you could be right that it was to (distract) pressure her not to say too much when called to testify, which I'm not sure she ever was. You gotta take a look at them, you're so interested in the case. I may have a link in my shortcuts list, will try to remember to get it for you, can't promise I'll remember, and maybe someone else will think to post it before I do. Sounds like you and I think alike about a lot of things, including workaholic businessmen.

I remember the post you mention about PR being asked if she was ever abused, and that Nedra allegedly said JonBenet was only A LITTLE molested. Sick Paugh family?

Yes, could be that the R's l know the what,when,who,where, and why. But this was an outsider, Pam Griffin, who had the impression that valium-doped PR was afraid of this THEY. I think it was an unbiased opinion.

Assuming at least momentarily for the sake of argument, just to stretch our minds a bit, that there's a THEY, outside the family, who the heck could they be? I too have heard the photographer theory, which may be the plausible one,and I think PR would have been flattered that they wanted to photograph JonBenet, and wouldn't necessarily have bothered to tell JR, who'd know it was a ruse that stunk to high heaven, but also someone here just may be able to imagine some other theories and I'd like to know those too, no matter how far-out, short of martians, of course.
 
I highly doubt Patsy met anyone for a late-night photo session on Christmas night. Common sense alone can rule this out.

First off, they'd be tired from spending their day on Christmas itself, and visiting people, dropping off gifts, attending parties, etc. Who'd want to stay up late on Christmas night for photos, especially of the child after everyone is sleeping, including the child?

Second, they were planning on getting up early to fly to Michigan and meet up with the rest of the kids and spend Christmas with them. Who'd want to stay up late for photos, keeping the child up as well, when they have to get up early and will be busy all day as soon as they do?

Third, why would Patsy be so desperate for this photo session that she's keeping herself and her young daughter up late for it, and keeps it a secret from her husband? Patsy didn't need to meet anyone else's deadlines, and I cannot see her going out of her way to accommodate some photographer like this when she already had portfolios of pictures of JonBenet and all the time in the world to go to any photographer she wanted when they returned home. And if she wanted to keep it secret from her husband, she'd do it during the week and just wouldn't tell him - she wouldn't arrange for a secret late-night session while her husband sleeps upstairs.

The idea of them meeting some photographer for a late-night camera session on Christmas night with a trip planned early the next day doesn't make any sense to me. I can't see that as being what happened here. I can't buy into the idea that PR was allowing her daughter to be used as a sex toy for pedophiles, either. There would be no gain in it for her, and Patsy wouldn't put herself or her daughter out for anything that didn't benefit them somehow.
 
Eagle1 said:
Ellen13, PR's sister Polly was there at the Fernies' I think, not her sister Pam. We are referring to Pam Griffin.

Thanks Eagle. I later read that I got that fact wrong and realized my mistake. Thanks for correcting me. Want to compliment you for not pouncing all over me about it. Over at another board I frequent, if you get any little fact wrong, they jump your s&%t! So, we should all be thankful on this board that we can talk to eachother so nicely. We all have the same common goal and I appreciate that. We need to remember that! Thanks again Eagle.
Ellen13
Click to expand...
 
We're well-trained here not to nitpick and to stick to what's most important or risk getting BANNED! It's like "Stayin' Alive". I know, at some forums anything goes and you get nowhere about the case, Michigan neighbor. I was getting the two Pam's mixed up too, was used to hearing more about PR's sister Pam than her sister Polly, until someone here noticed it was Pam Griffin.

NP, you're right that the photographer theory doesn't make too much sense, but the one thing most everyone's been saying consistently is that a lot of what this fam does really doesn't seem to make sense, so I'm keeping an open, air-conditioned mind while looking for some other idea to replace that one.
 
Eagle1 said:
I remember the post you mention about PR being asked if she was ever abused, and that Nedra allegedly said JonBenet was only A LITTLE molested. Sick Paugh family?
Click to expand...


I keep reading about Nedra saying this. Does anyone have a direct quote or a link?? I am not doubting, but the quote is so 'out there' I would love to see it.

TIA. :D
 
Eagle1 said:
Yes, the Patricia Letters are about some guy phoning Patsy during the Grand Jury, and you could be right that it was to (distract) pressure her not to say too much when called to testify, which I'm not sure she ever was. You gotta take a look at them, you're so interested in the case. I may have a link in my shortcuts list, will try to remember to get it for you, can't promise I'll remember, and maybe someone else will think to post it before I do. Sounds like you and I think alike about a lot of things, including workaholic businessmen.
Click to expand...
I don't think I have ever heard of the Patricia letters, Eagle except in your posts. I'll have to go hunting.


Eagle1 said:
I remember the post you mention about PR being asked if she was ever abused, and that Nedra allegedly said JonBenet was only A LITTLE molested. Sick Paugh family?
Click to expand...
Yes, that's what I'm thinking and I'm wondering about a few other things as well. Did the Ramseys move to Boulder, and then DP moved there too for occasional periods of time? Did NP stay behind in Atlanta? Didn't FW and PW once rent a house close by to the Ramseys? Who moved to that street first - the Ws or the Rs? Who referred Patsy to Dr Beuf?

Eagle1 said:
Yes, could be that the R's l know the what,when,who,where, and why.
Click to expand...
Eagle, I wish you would stop saying the R's - Patsy AND John I mean. I am quite, quite certain that John knew absolutely NOTHING. But equally, I think Patsy knew a LOT.

Eagle1 said:
But this was an outsider, Pam Griffin, who had the impression that valium-doped PR was afraid of this THEY. I think it was an unbiased opinion.
Click to expand...
To be kind to Patsy, I think she maybe thought it was only her father and their former very best friend who were getting inappropriately 'close' to JonBenet.

Eagle1 said:
Assuming at least momentarily for the sake of argument, just to stretch our minds a bit, that there's a THEY, outside the family, who the heck could they be? I too have heard the photographer theory, which may be the plausible one,and I think PR would have been flattered that they wanted to photograph JonBenet, and wouldn't necessarily have bothered to tell JR, who'd know it was a ruse that stunk to high heaven, but also someone here just may be able to imagine some other theories and I'd like to know those too, no matter how far-out, short of martians, of course.
Click to expand...
I don't know which photographer theory you mean, there was one where they suggested JonBenet was taken out of the house to a studio somewhere and returned dead. I don't think this was what happened. In my photographer theory which I don't think ANYONE else but me believes, the 'photographer' was purely fictional; Patsy had been told that one was going to come to the basement that night to photograph JonBenet with Santa, but that was just a cover for who was really coming to the basement.
 
Here are a couple of links to the Patricia Letters, at least parts of them. I haven't used the links in years, can't remember. But first, quoting one paragraph from your above post, "Eagle, I wish you would stop saying the R's - Patsy AND John I mean. I am quite, quite certain that John knew absolutely NOTHING. But equally, I think Patsy knew a LOT."

No offense taken but as we've said before,very recently when you felt Narlacat was getting too rough, lets never forget our very strict rules here! And other people also say Patsy and John, just to be on the safe side, including Dingo. IMO we can't be at all certain P didn't tell J things, were only theorizing when we said she PROBABLY didn't tell him IF there was a photographer appointment. Which wouldn't have made sense, with all they had planned, as someone above has said, but we just can't know for sure. Now the links, and you'll no doubt find others from there if interested. Have a great day.

http://jbr-subculture.tripod.com/cheesyApril1999.htm

http://www.acandyrose.com/patricia1999phenomenon.htm
 
I don't know anything about whether the Whites owned or rented the house two doors away from the Ramseys that you asked about, AussieShiela.
 
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