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  1. #61
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    No chest hair, some hair on legs and arms. Sparse hair on his chin.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by docwho3
    I must have misread the posts when I thought a book had been found with him. . . ooops. But this does raise the question of why he was so familiar with the book that he could use not only a name of a character but also could use a publisher name from the book all from memory. I wonder if that book was required reading in high school or college classes somewhere back then?

    docwho3, it's my understanding the hotel/motel in Meridian, Idaho, is a real place. The help there didn't recognize Lyle, but he may or may not have stayed there. Maybe he stayed there at one one time and remembered the place, or maybe it's something as simple as him picking up a matchbook some place. (I haven't discounted the book, though!)

  3. #63
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    Jun 2006
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    Cool the address he gave

    the address he gave is a Best Western in Meridian. Was the hotel he commited suicide in a Best Western? He may have got the address out of a hotel listing

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaqinak
    the address he gave is a Best Western in Meridian. Was the hotel he commited suicide in a Best Western? He may have got the address out of a hotel listing
    Welcome, jaqinak, I see you've been here since June! What is your gut feeling about Lyle?

    That's a good idea about the Best Western motel chain.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaqinak
    the address he gave is a Best Western in Meridian. Was the hotel he commited suicide in a Best Western? He may have got the address out of a hotel listing
    The name of the hotel was never mentioned, 8/10 likely never mentioned to protect them

  6. #66
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    lots of possibilities

    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteWolf
    docwho3, it's my understanding the hotel/motel in Meridian, Idaho, is a real place. The help there didn't recognize Lyle, but he may or may not have stayed there. Maybe he stayed there at one one time and remembered the place, or maybe it's something as simple as him picking up a matchbook some place. (I haven't discounted the book, though!)
    Correct. I understood that there is a real address with a hotel or motel but I was exploring whether this was some coincidence or not and asking myself and the forum if perhaps the address was meant to be fake and if so was trying to figure out where he got it from. I sure wish a copy of that book had been found in the trash with the scrap of paper about suicide because that would have simplified things.

    Also I am alternatively wondering if he had left some sort of a security deposit box at hotel at the address that he gave, as per the partial quote I listed from the book. I understand that some hotels used to do that deposit box thing for their clients or maybe just a nearby bus locker of that number. I have an old map CD with that allows you to search for any address and I may run a search to see how many 1019 progress streets there are in the USA.

    By the way 1019 also seems to be a fairly standard term paper length for an approximate word count as a recent search of the authors name and that number showed me. . . Not sure what that means, if anything, but I include it just to be helpful.

    Also there is a library at 1019 tenth street in CO that had a discussion or readng or something like that about one of the authors works. I was using the search engine dogpile.com so the search results should be easy for others to duplicate.

    Right now I am sort of looking at many possibilities.

    (For General information:I only actually know a very little : I know there is a real address but don't know if that was by chance or design. I know that missing earlobes are often a genetic trait and so did not yet comment on them.)

    At first I thought the book was important as a piece of physical evidence. . . . as if he had perhaps read it on the way to the hotel where he died and as such it might have markings that might point to where he had been to buy it but now I consider the book to possibly be important for another reason, that he seemed to have remembered so well having read the book that, other than a small spelling error (or deliberate spelling change) he was able to use a character name, and possibly the publishers name in his fake name and address info. given that the books character that he used also did a suicide (if I understand the synopsis I read) the book seems to have had a special significance for our unidentified man. If it was known to others to have been a favorite book of his it might help jog someones memory about a missing loved one that we do not yet know about. And then I wonder why he chose that character when more than one person in the book attempted suicide. . . maybe his character was the only male in the book to do so. I have not read the book yet so I just do not know.

    The book seemed to possibly have quite a bit of significance to him so I am surprised that he did not bring a physical copy of it with him to his suicide.

    There have been many characters in literature that have suicided so what was it about this character and this book that appealed to our unidentified man? Was it a subject of a paper in college or was the sex taboo subject significant to him or some other quality?

    The book was perhaps not his guiding light since he did not bring it with him to his suicide but its details were fresh enough in his mind for him to quote parts of it to use in his fake sign-in info that he gave and that is why I wondered if he had recently been exposed to it as a college student perhaps or had been to a library discussion of the authors work.

    I don't have any magic answers but I am sort of fishing around to see what I can think of to run a web search on that might help in some small way.

  7. #67
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    I had wondered if he was a college/university student of if he ever took any other education.

    I found another possible reason for his weight loss- one of the symptoms for appendicitis is loss of appetite, which may have contributed to it, therefore perhaps putting his surgery not too long before his death

  8. #68
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    possibilities

    Quote Originally Posted by outofthedark
    I had wondered if he was a college/university student of if he ever took any other education.

    I found another possible reason for his weight loss- one of the symptoms for appendicitis is loss of appetite, which may have contributed to it, therefore perhaps putting his surgery not too long before his death
    I am not certain that he lost weight (but he could have lost weight for all I know but I am just not certain of it yet.) He might have gotten the pants from a thrift store or other free agency such as a church group and maybe they just were too big for him to start with.

    However, I would think a medical examiner could tell, at the time, from autopsy whether that was on old scar or a fairly new one. Were there any notes about the surgery scar and how old it was in the exam report?

  9. #69
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    His appendix scar was old. The motel isn't part of the Best Western chain. I agree he was educated. I'm not aware of Joyce Carrol Oates being required reading in High School. I believe he read it (possibly in college) and associated himself with Lyles character. In the book Lyle Stevik owned a furniture and the father of a family. He was depressed, and talked about going down into his basement, throwing a rope over a beam and hanging himself. However, he does not commit suicide. I feel our Lyle saw himself in the character. Keep it up!

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaqinak
    the address he gave is a Best Western in Meridian. Was the hotel he commited suicide in a Best Western? He may have got the address out of a hotel listing
    Great tie in there with the Best Western Hotel idea Jaqinak. I'm wondering if he could have worked for a Best Western. He was quite organized and a creature of habit, and putting the pen in his pocket made me wonder this. Also throwing the waste paper in the wastecan - not all motel guests are that curtious!

    I noticed the unibrow too and for some reason thought men from the Middle East had brows like this. They were really thick brows. And since he never had earlobes, it was a hereditary trait with him. Thinking outloud,

    I'm thinking he is like a Chicano or Malatto - whatever it would be called to be Native American and white. I just wonder what an anthropologist would say about Lyle by just looking at his photo. Did you ever talk to someone in that or a related field Coldcaseman?

    Good to see you here too Whitewolf. ;}


    Scandi

    ETA: Doc, you simply amaze me, and I think you have very good ideas. I'd like to read that book too, as if like Coldcaseman says that our Lyle associates himself with the character, we might learn more about him and his life before he took the bus to Quinalt Lake.


  11. #71
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    Something keeps running around in my mind about the ME who performed the autopsy. Why would he mention Hispanic on the report as possible race?

    I'm also wondering if Lyle's heart was broken from a love affair that broke off or if she died? He was most thoughtful in not eating before he did this so he would still be clean when they found him. That is if his stomach was empty.

    Oh, so many thoughts.


    Scandi

  12. #72
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    thinking out loud some more

    Quote Originally Posted by coldcaseman
    His appendix scar was old. . .
    Thanks for the info.

    Thinking out loud:
    There are several possible reasons for the larger pants but the real question is did he really lose weight? If he did it might have shown in his skin being loose on his body as that is a lot of weight to lose. He might have fallen on hard times and not been eating regularly and might have been having to walk quite a bit to get places. That can cause a big weight loss which I have seen happen to someone before.

    But if he didnt lose weight then he might have worn large pants for any number of reasons: He might have gotten them from some group or person that just gave them away to needy people. I want to say this next possibility as delicately as possible . . . but he might have gotten the larger pants from a male "friend". In fact as well planned as his suicide seems to have been it is possible that the pants were in some way an important reminder to him of something or someone and so were one of the few things brought with him to his suicide. But I am just thinking out loud.

    Quote Originally Posted by coldcaseman
    . . .I believe he read it (possibly in college) and associated himself with Lyles character. In the book Lyle Stevik owned a furniture and the father of a family. He was depressed, and talked about going down into his basement, throwing a rope over a beam and hanging himself. However, he does not commit suicide. . .
    Sorry for saying he did commit suicide, I thought I read it in some synopsis and I also read it in a new article:
    . . .Youmans says Lyle Stevick is the name of a character in “You Must Remember This,” a book by Joyce Carol Oates. In the book, the character by the same name spelled differently takes his own life. . .
    http://www.thedailyworld.com/article...ews/01news.txt

    Just goes to show how wrong news reports can be at times, I suppose.


    Quote Originally Posted by coldcaseman
    . . .I feel our Lyle saw himself in the character. . .
    I feel that way too too but I am not yet sure what his reasons were. The taboo breaking sexual themes of the book and the larger pants he wore to suicide in have me wondering but that isn't proving anything.

    I wonder how many college essays were written that year on that book and that author. I still feel he must have done homework on that book and author. If it was still the year 2001, although it could be a daunting task, it would seem just barely possible to track down all the people who turned in papers on that book that year and then see who can't be found on that list. . . as it might point to the mans identity but so much time has passed now that I am not thinking records of papers written have survived that long.

    Maybe entering his pic on college reunion sites would help someone recognize him.

  13. #73
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    I'm also wondering if Lyle's heart was broken from a love affair that broke off or if she died?
    I always wondered if that was one of the cases. I thought Burn-Out was also a possible motive for suicide even though they say few Burn-Out victims actually carry out suicide

  14. #74
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    Determining ethnic background by facial features can be unreliable. The pathologist suggested Native American or hispanic due to facial features as well as skin tone, but it's not an exacy science. Concerning the pants, I considered that Lyle just liked to wear larger sizes, but the belt tells a different story. All of the notches were stretched and worn, with the smallest size appearing to fit his waist. As he lost weight, he tightened his belt. My belts look similar, but it's because I'm expanding. I asked my wife to read the book and give me a synopsis. She informed me that Lyle considers and contemplates suicide, but doesn't go through with it. I miscommunicated that to the reporter. Now that I'm retired, I have the time to read the bok myself.

  15. #75
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    I should add that Lyle was very thin. If he lost weight, it was over a period of time. The skin was not loose or sagging. It's possible he lost the weight due to depression. The pathologist found nothing medically wrong with him.

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