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Thread: CA - Alfred Grimes 14, & Sammy Jackson 14, Monterey, 14 December 1968

  1. #1
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    Exclamation CA - Alfred Grimes 14, & Sammy Jackson 14, Monterey, 14 December 1968

    http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/576dmca.html

    and

    http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/894dmca.html


    Alfred James Grimes
    Missing since December 14, 1968 from Monterey, Monterey County, California.
    Classification: Endangered Missing







    Vital Statistics
    • Date Of Birth: April 9, 1954
    • Age at Time of Disappearance: 14 years old
    • Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: 5'4"; 110 lbs.
    • Distinguishing Characteristics: White male. Brown hair; brown eyes.
    • Dentals: Not available


    Circumstances of Disappearance
    Grimes was last seen fishing with his friend, Sammy Jackson, on December 14, 1968, in Monterey, California.



    Sammy Lloyd Jackson
    Missing since December 14, 1968 from Monterey, Monterey County, California.
    Classification: Endangered Missing







    Vital Statistics
    • Date Of Birth: July 8, 1955
    • Age at Time of Disappearance: 13 years old
    • Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: 4'8"; 75 lbs.
    • Distinguishing Characteristics: White male. Brown hair; brown eyes.
    • Dentals: Not available


    Circumstances of Disappearance
    Jackson was last seen fishing with Alfred Grimes on December 14, 1968 in Monterey, California.
    Last edited by Cubby; 01-09-2011 at 11:52 AM.

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  3. #2
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    Zodiac victims?

    These two boys disappeared only six days before one of Zodiac's first well documented murders. On 20 December 1968, he shot a young couple in Vallejo. CA. Could there be a connection?

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  5. #3
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    Here is a possible match for Alfred Grimes. Presuming he didn't drown of course, he could have been a runaway.

    They appear to have the same shaped nose and features. The hair appears abit darker but that might just be the tone of the reconstruction.

    Here is the link. http://doenetwork.org/cases/865umca.html


    The Doe Network:
    Case File 865UMCA

    Reconstruction of Victim by NCMEC

    Unidentified White Male


    •The victim was discovered on November 5, 1972 in Hacienda Heights, Los Angeles County, California

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Vital Statistics

    •Estimated age: 18-25 years old
    •Approximate Height and Weight: 6'0" (183 cm); 175 lbs (79 kg)
    •Distinguishing Characteristics: Brown, shoulder-length hair; blue eyes. A 3 inch surgical scar on his right knee, and a 4-1/2 inch scar on his spine, near the tail bone. A pair of yellow metal framed eyeglasses was found near the scene and may also have belonged to the decedent.
    •Clothing: He was wearing a blue denim Levi jean jacket with a zipper-down front, a pink t-shirt; blue bell bottom, Oshkosh brand jeans, with “PEACE” embroidered on the bottom left leg, and “LOVE” embroidered on the bottom right leg, blue flowered boxer shorts and brown leather boots. He was also wearing a small yellow metal earring containing a Peace symbol, and a white metal chain with black Rosary beads around his neck.
    •DNA: Available


    Clothing


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Case History
    On November 5, 1972, a resident discovered the body of a young man lying in a ravine in the 2900 block of Athel Drive of Hacienda Heights at 09:53 a.m.

    A neighbor heard gunshots and screams nearly eight hours earlier. The body was reported lying about 20 feet down the roadway. There was also blood on the street.
    The man died of multiple gunshot wounds. Pronounced dead at scene.


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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  7. #4
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    Or this one. He looks a little dark to me to be Alfred but the face shape and eyes are the same. http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1567ummd.html


    Unidentified White Male


    •The victim was discovered on December 6, 1973 in Upper Marlboro, Prince George's County, Maryland

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Vital Statistics

    •Estimated age: 15-20 years old
    •Approximate Height and Weight: 5'0"; 105 lbs.
    •Distinguishing Characteristics: Brown hair; brown eyes. Faint mustache.
    •Clothing: Blue/gray cotton jacket collar bears initials "ELT"; green sweatshirt; white undershorts; gray and white corduroy trousers; brown belt. Crudely written on left leg of trousers "Shalom" and multi other crude writings on trousers.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Case History
    The victim was located in a wooded area on Old Crain Highway near Pennsylvania Avenue in Upper Marlboro, Maryland on December 6, 1973.

    He may have been hospitalized in recent days.


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Investigators
    If you have any information about this case please contact:
    Maryland State Police/MD Center for Missing
    410-290-1620, extension 380
    You may remain anonymous when submitting information.

    Agency Case Number:
    93611/A73-2136

    Source Information:
    NamUs


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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  9. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by rcoope23 View Post
    Here is a possible match for Alfred Grimes. Presuming he didn't drown of course, he could have been a runaway.

    They appear to have the same shaped nose and features. The hair appears abit darker but that might just be the tone of the reconstruction.

    Here is the link. http://doenetwork.org/cases/865umca.html
    This one doesn't appear to fit, IMO. Alfred is 5'4", the UID is 6'0". Alfred is 110 lbs, the UID is 175 lbs. Alfred has brown eyes, the UID has blue eyes.


    Quote Originally Posted by rcoope23 View Post
    Or this one. He looks a little dark to me to be Alfred but the face shape and eyes are the same. http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/1567ummd.html
    This one is a lot closer, but the height is still off a little. Possible though.
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    STILL DOING IT FOR DYLAN GROENE. REST IN PEACE.

    HELP FIND MISSING 7-YEAR-OLD PATRICK ALFORD.

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    Thanks Shewhomustnotbenamed for the feedback I submitted the first one, giving allowances for growth and muscle gain as he grew older but perhaps your right, the differences might be a little to extreme.

    Do you know if there were any newspaper articles on the case?
    Any theories about what might have happened to them?

    They might have both drowned but surely the river was dredged to search for bodies? Also did they have any reason that you know of to be runaways?
    Would love more information on this case but there dosn't seem to be much online.

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  13. #7
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    I did an archive search in Google, but couldn't find any articles.

    Sorry, I don't really know anything about the case. Charley Project says they are believed to have drown (http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/...es_alfred.html), and the California Attorney General's page just says "Unknown Circumstances" (http://dojapp.doj.ca.gov/missing/det...=3508700531384).

    You're right. There's not much about them out there.
    FOR THE MISSING: PACIFIC NORTHWEST - Highlighting missing persons in the Pacific Northwest - www.facebook.com/missingnorthwest / www.twitter.com/MissingNW
    STILL DOING IT FOR DYLAN GROENE. REST IN PEACE.

    HELP FIND MISSING 7-YEAR-OLD PATRICK ALFORD.

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  15. #8
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    Well I have contacted Montery Library and the California Department of Justice, just in case there is other information out there, just not online yet. The more information had the better

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  17. #9
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    I was able to get two articles about the boys disappearence from the Monery library. It is important to get these details out there. It is so sad, the parents of Grimes are still actively looking for their boy in 1968. It's also sad that Jacksons father seems to have given up on him.
    Attached Files Attached Files

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  19. #10
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    rcoope thank you very much for the articles. Good info there.

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  21. #11
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    Hello,

    I just wanted to reply to your message regarding circumstances around the disappearance. I am his niece. My grandparents are since deceased and I try to get as much information as I can because I am determined to get answers in my lifetime. There was no reason to believe they would have run away and they never have shown up years later. My mom has told me that he knew how to swim and our family never would believe that he drowned. My family received calls from an unknown person for years following the disappearance taunting my grandparents. I would love to read any articles that you all were able to obtain. I welcome any help with this that I can possibly get!!! Thank you!

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  23. #12
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    I just wanted to thank you for getting those articles. I am his niece and I have never seen these articles before. Thank you!!!

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  25. #13
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    Andreai775, can you give us more information on the taunting ? Did the police take it seriously or did they put it down to the local nut job. I'm not trying to connect it in any way to the Zodiac but IIRC there were calls in one particular case there where it's thought the Zodiac did phone the victim's family.

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  27. #14
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    Charles Ray Hatcher a suspect?

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    These two boys disappeared only six days before one of Zodiac's first well documented murders. On 20 December 1968, he shot a young couple in Vallejo. CA. Could there be a connection?
    He was in San Francisco in 1969. [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Ray_Hatcher"]Charles Ray Hatcher - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame] There's another case he's a suspect in murder at the morticians convention.The killer carved a piece of soap and scrawled a message on the mirror and obliterated the rest of the message leaving the word 'This'.I always wonderd if the rest of the message said "This is the Zodiac Speaking". http://www.iowaunsolvedmurders.com/b...roger-atkison/ This case could also be connected http://iowacoldcases.org/case-summaries/anna-miller/

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    A picture of fishermans warf. Where the boys went to fish.


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    Does anyone know if there are strong currents at this wharf? Could one of them fallen in and then the other went to help and they both drowned? Cant remember but what time did they go fishing in the morning? Seems strange.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HarleyQuinn View Post
    Does anyone know if there are strong currents at this wharf? Could one of them fallen in and then the other went to help and they both drowned? Cant remember but what time did they go fishing in the morning? Seems strange.
    A sherrifs deputy saw the boys at a bus stop in Marina at 4:30 am and spoke with Alfred.

    The bus driver remembers letting them off near fishermans warf.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HarleyQuinn View Post
    Does anyone know if there are strong currents at this wharf? Could one of them fallen in and then the other went to help and they both drowned? Cant remember but what time did they go fishing in the morning? Seems strange.
    They must of been abducted there bodies would of washed ashore.
    Last edited by killer Chaser; 07-04-2013 at 10:59 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Justiceforever View Post
    A sherrifs deputy saw the boys at a bus stop in Marina at 4:30 am and spoke with Alfred.

    The bus driver remembers letting them off near fishermans warf.
    4.30am wow seems awfully early for kids to be out but it was a different did they regularly go at this time every weekend etc? Because then some one might have known their habits

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  38. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by killer Chaser View Post
    They must of been abducted there bodies would of washed ashore.
    Sometimes yes depending on currents

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  40. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by HarleyQuinn View Post
    4.30am wow seems awfully early for kids to be out but it was a different did they regularly go at this time every weekend etc? Because then some one might have known their habits
    The fish bite better early in the morning. Alot of people fish at that time. The article uptread says that they regularily went fishing every Sat. morning.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justiceforever View Post
    The fish bite better early in the morning. Alot of people fish at that time. The article uptread says that they regularily went fishing every Sat. morning.
    Sad really someone might have known their habit of this and took it to their advantage. Did anyone see them during the morning at the wharf?

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