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  1. #1
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    Anyone see John Walsh on LKL June 27th?

    I must say, my jaw dropped when I heard John say how mishandled the case was. He said the PD dropped investigations that should have been done on suspects, to focus on the R's.

    I do recall waaaaay back when Walsh asked the R's to appear on his Most Wanted Show and they turned him down, Walsh had different thoughts about the R's then. AND maybe even the BPD back then.

    In my opinion IF IF the R's had but taken the lie detector test and been OPEN about doing it, they would never have had the umbrella hanging over them for nearly 10 years.

    I wish that Blue Crab would pick up the slack on this remembrance.

    I began some hard thinking last night about what John Walsh said. Most certainly the 'people' including friends of the family and those who had 'familiar contact with JonBenet in the family home should have been HIGH on the list.

    Blue Crabs thoughts about the college age -live in tutor of the Stine son - have great merit in my mind as being involved in this crime. The tutor Mr. I, has gone on to a high standard of respect in his life's pursuits.

    Mr. I, no doubt MAY have had friends in the suspect group that Blue Crab found, that may in fact have known the lay out of the R's home and known much personal information about the R's.

    Burke at the approximate age of 21, at this point WOULD KNOW who Mr. I, had brought into the home while Mr. I, was 'perhaps' babysitting all of the children while the R's and S's were out and about. WE donut know the who/what/where or when of any such involvement either - when an unknown member of 'that' group could have been taken through the home as a 'guest' and accepted friend of Mr. I.

    John Walsh comments last night sent me down a new train of thought.

    Blue Crab if you are reading, refresh my memory about what part of the world Mr. I was born in?

    Another fresh thought for me, could there have been a threat to the rest of the R family to keep quiet or they would get it too.

    This thought comes to mind, when my mom was secretary to a judge of the Kansas City Court of Appeals in early 1900's. a man appeared and went into the judges chambers, my mom heard a shot, and ran to see - as the man emerged and told her to go back in her office or she would get 'it' too.

    An unknown threat could explain the R's non typical behaviors.

    Did the BPD ever explore any country that might be upset over business dealings with Access Graphics? Nah, ya think?

    What we do know is that the p-ssing contest between Darnay Hoffman and Lin Wood's money pile from defending the R's was quite large.

    .
    Opinions expressed by me, are mine, based on life experience, and known facts of any given case.





    """I am just a pixel in the universal plan."""

  2. #2
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    Camper, I truly believe if half of what the BPD did to the Ramseys was made public information we could put their "lack of cooperation" to rest.

    I remember, however don't remember the names, a representative of LE, trying desperately to keep the Ramseys from interviewing , hoping that the appearance of " lack of cooperation" would force the hand of the DA into bringing about a Grand Jury. I remember, as well, the Ramseys being turned down at the very onset of a "new team", dashing their hopes again, of sharing any information that could possibly be sparked by another interview. The BPD shoved this "lie" of no cooperation into the media, and shared it among themselves giving it a "life" when it was a lie from the start. How bad was it, when HUNTER needed ,wanted, a suspect to be investigated and was TURNED down by the BPD, forcing him to hand it over to Armistead and the Ramseys. The Ramseys PAID for any investigation of an intruder. This is not justice at work. If Boulder paid multi-dollars and wants to pay no more, they should KNOW the money was spent trying to pin this murder on a Ramsey.

    Now we are going to have Linda Arndt and the remaining fragments of her exploding mind, hit the media...(my guess is a book..she needs the $$$) to add to the travesty of this whole affair.

    Those of us who believe in an intruder, kick around our suspects , placing them the best we can into a scenario, but NEVER, have I "heard" someone "damn and destroy " a suspect in the way those have attacked Patsy over the years. That's passion I don't understand, I always leave the doubt, not because of our system , whether it be helgoth, santa, I, or another , unless he's tried and found guilty I would think we should save judgement.

  3. #3
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    The problem with this line of thinking is what the boulder Police deparment did or did not do started way after the Ramseys questionable behavior. The Ramseys had a ransome in there head stating their daughter would be beheaded if they got police involvment or any involvment for that matter. They did everything but hire a skywirter to write above there house help our daughter has been kidnapped within an hour of finding that note. They tried to arrange toleave for Atlanta within an hour of Jonbenet's body being discovered. these are two examples of questionable behavior that happened long before the Boulder police can be fingerd for antiRhamsiism behaviors. This by no means excuses impreperities on the part of the police department. It just questions the merit of blaming the actions of the police deparment as causing as unjustified witch hunt for the Ramseys.

    mjak

  4. #4
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    What would you do? Your child is found murdered, would you want to arrange for her funeral, be with friends and family, or stay in a town where such evil has just destroyed your family. They NEEDED family, I can't imagine solving the case was foremost on their mind. That would have it's day, well one would hope, of course it didn't happen, the priority at the moment was to get home.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by sissi
    What would you do? Your child is found murdered, would you want to arrange for her funeral, be with friends and family, or stay in a town where such evil has just destroyed your family. They NEEDED family, I can't imagine solving the case was foremost on their mind. That would have it's day, well one would hope, of course it didn't happen, the priority at the moment was to get home.
    I would be doing whatever the police asked me to do. I would never think of leaving the area much less the state without the police okaying it. My family would be called and they would be comming to me. Not to mention I could never leave the state leaving my daughters body behind.

    mjak

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Camper
    I must say, my jaw dropped when I heard John say how mishandled the case was. He said the PD dropped investigations that should have been done on suspects, to focus on the R's.

    I do recall waaaaay back when Walsh asked the R's to appear on his Most Wanted Show and they turned him down, Walsh had different thoughts about the R's then. AND maybe even the BPD back then.

    In my opinion IF IF the R's had but taken the lie detector test and been OPEN about doing it, they would never have had the umbrella hanging over them for nearly 10 years.

    I wish that Blue Crab would pick up the slack on this remembrance.

    I began some hard thinking last night about what John Walsh said. Most certainly the 'people' including friends of the family and those who had 'familiar contact with JonBenet in the family home should have been HIGH on the list.

    Blue Crabs thoughts about the college age -live in tutor of the Stine son - have great merit in my mind as being involved in this crime. The tutor Mr. I, has gone on to a high standard of respect in his life's pursuits.

    Mr. I, no doubt MAY have had friends in the suspect group that Blue Crab found, that may in fact have known the lay out of the R's home and known much personal information about the R's.

    Burke at the approximate age of 21, at this point WOULD KNOW who Mr. I, had brought into the home while Mr. I, was 'perhaps' babysitting all of the children while the R's and S's were out and about. WE donut know the who/what/where or when of any such involvement either - when an unknown member of 'that' group could have been taken through the home as a 'guest' and accepted friend of Mr. I.

    John Walsh comments last night sent me down a new train of thought.

    Blue Crab if you are reading, refresh my memory about what part of the world Mr. I was born in?

    Another fresh thought for me, could there have been a threat to the rest of the R family to keep quiet or they would get it too.

    This thought comes to mind, when my mom was secretary to a judge of the Kansas City Court of Appeals in early 1900's. a man appeared and went into the judges chambers, my mom heard a shot, and ran to see - as the man emerged and told her to go back in her office or she would get 'it' too.

    An unknown threat could explain the R's non typical behaviors.

    Did the BPD ever explore any country that might be upset over business dealings with Access Graphics? Nah, ya think?

    What we do know is that the p-ssing contest between Darnay Hoffman and Lin Wood's money pile from defending the R's was quite large.

    .
    For the record, I disagree with John Walsh, these detectives were stopped at every point by the DA. Granted Det. Ardnt messed up royally when she let John walk through the house and find JB. She ruined crucial evidence, the duct tape. That alone could have gotten Patsy, if it is her. I get hot flashes just thinking about it.

    They also let victims advocates go around cleaning after the fingerprinters did their job. How she got to be a detective, is beyond me. So that was a botched scene. And the Ramseys were allowed to move trunkfuls of clothes, etc. That was absurd. HOWEVER, the DA refused to press the Ramseys on anything, gave them evidence, let them run the interviews pretty much, let them give writing samples at the home of the DA. So Mr. Walsh, as good a man as he is, and he is, is not considering all the factors. He is simply not.

  7. #7
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    Camper,

    There is no forensic evidence that demonstrates an intruder entered the Ramsey household the night JonBenet was killed.

    I beleive the person you suspect has an alibi for that night that is similar to JAR's e.g. it includes geographic distance, as well as witness coroboration.

    John Walsh is simply parroting what should be standard lea investigative practice e.g. start from the family, and increase the suspect pool, as they are eliminated.

    .

  8. #8
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    Hmmm

    OOOHHHHH hecky darn, sissi was the only one who got 'it' - my message.




    ---->>>To UK, you did not read my post 'carefully', OR you would not have posted this - Quote "I beleive the person you suspect has an alibi for that night that is similar to JAR's e.g. it includes geographic distance, as well as witness
    coroboration."

    UK, I donut believe the BPD ever investigated any member of the 'ethnic' group that QUICKLY disbanded AFTER JonBenet's murder, that I and his 'friends' belonged to. Could you PM me a name????? of anyone in that group ? I will give you a peacock feather IF IF you can. I will give you two feathers IF you can tell me what EACH member of THAT group is doing today. Three feathers IF you can tell me what all the ex members of that group have been doing for the past 10 years, and where each member was on Christmas night 1996.

    I don't believe John Walsh parrots anything. HE gets to the root of things. Which is what I think he has done since his first distrust of the R's - when they declined to participate on his 'Wanted' program. PLUS I do think his flag went up when they did not take the Enquirer offer of ONE MILLION dollars IF they would take a lie detector test. HE and Reva stepped up to the plate and took theirs when they knew the PD had them in the spotlight.

    I am taking a brand NEW path here after trudging around for nearly 10 Years on a well worn path.

    The only real and viable excuse for JonBenet having 'dust' on her feet, is to have willingly gone to the basement with someone she trusted, AFTER - AFTER she went to bed at 10 PM ish WHEN they returned from the Whites and the Christmas package delivery.

    ---->>>To solace, you just kept walking around on the OLDE path of thought in your response to my thread. WE have all been walking there for 10 years, THIS is a NEW train of thought here.

    SO my NEW thoughts concern WHO would JonBenet have gone willingly with - to where there was dust - dust on her feet as the autopsy states.

    We have all hammered the garland in her hair as having been done by the perp carrying her down the stairs, BUT IF as JR said, he carried her upstairs the garland could have snagged in to her hair at that time.

    The burglar alarm was not set, WHY, WHO may have expected a later evening arrival? WHO normally would have set the alarm? Why was the yard light NOT on as was the usual custom OR was it just a preset light to turn on at a specific time, OR did sometwist the bulb so it would not go on. I donut think WE ever had an answer to that one, did we?


    As for Linda A. She had a gun didn't she ?, she could have put someone from the victims advocate office in charge and gone to the BASEMENT herself. Maybe she had not recently practiced at the rifle range, and could not hit the broad side of a large barn, hmmm.

    NEW THOUGHT stuff here, participate in this exercise er start yer own thread.

    .
    Opinions expressed by me, are mine, based on life experience, and known facts of any given case.





    """I am just a pixel in the universal plan."""

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Camper
    OOOHHHHH hecky darn, sissi was the only one who got 'it' - my message.




    ---->>>To UK, you did not read my post 'carefully', OR you would not have posted this - Quote "I beleive the person you suspect has an alibi for that night that is similar to JAR's e.g. it includes geographic distance, as well as witness
    coroboration."

    UK, I donut believe the BPD ever investigated any member of the 'ethnic' group that QUICKLY disbanded AFTER JonBenet's murder, that I and his 'friends' belonged to. Could you PM me a name????? of anyone in that group ? I will give you a peacock feather IF IF you can. I will give you two feathers IF you can tell me what EACH member of THAT group is doing today. Three feathers IF you can tell me what all the ex members of that group have been doing for the past 10 years, and where each member was on Christmas night 1996.
    .
    Camper,

    I've already researched this area, I can supply you with more than one member name, even those members with links to irish nationalist organisations in and outside of Boulder Colorado, including people linked to the CU Ass who have been arrested or have prior convictions!

    I could also supply you with a tabloid style resume of your principal suspects preference for caucasian females, extended love life, clips from the suspects wedding, and/or a current photograph.

    But there is not much point since your suspect has an alibi for the night of JonBenet's death.

    .

  10. #10
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    Hmmm

    Thank you but I would more interested in any name that Burke could supply about friends of Mr. I that had visited the home with him, and had become acquainted with JonBenet.

    How does the information you have acquired equate with what and exactly who the BPD investigated?

    Do you have a web site that was heavily promoted on WS a number of years ago, about 3.2 years ago IF my memory serves me, to be more specific?

    Have you spoken to Burke OR the Stine boy?

    .
    Opinions expressed by me, are mine, based on life experience, and known facts of any given case.





    """I am just a pixel in the universal plan."""


  11. #11
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    Wow! Thanks for this info Camper. I had to go read the transcripts to get a better idea of all that he said. Very interesting comments although he's made mistakes before. I think he get's too much info about too many cases and get's them muddled up sometimes.

    http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP...27/lkl.01.html

    WALSH: Well, I have my own opinion of this story, Larry, and I think my opinion that the police work was terrible in this case that they cast the shadow of suspicion on the Ramseys from the beginning and didn't do any outside investigation was backed up by a jury in Colorado several years ago that cost taxpayers of Colorado millions of dollars.

    And they came up with a conclusion that they thought the Ramseys had nothing to do with it that many, many clues were overlooked and that it was a very nightmare investigation from day one.

    And I think it's horrible that Patsy Ramsey had to go to her grave not knowing what happened to her daughter but worst of all for the Ramsey family to have in her obituary saying that the Ramseys were suspects in their own daughter's murder. I think it's really a terribly sad case.

    Video clip, then:

    KING: John Walsh, was she or he or both logical suspects?

    WALSH: Well certainly in any disappearance of a child the parents are investigated. They're looked at very closely. Reve and I were polygraphed for hours when Adam went missing but the police didn't look at anybody from the outside. I think it was really shoddy police work.

    There's lots of great detectives out there and good cops but I think that that grand jury in Colorado came up with a conclusion that there were footprints by her window, that there were all kinds of clues that were missed and my heart goes out to the Ramseys.

    Me: Now just HOW would JW know what was discussed in the GJ since it was all soooo secretive? Someone must have told him for him to know this right? And what's this about footprints by her window? Does he even know her window was on the 2nd floor?

    John Ramsey actually lost a daughter in his first marriage to a drunk driver. You can imagine the nightmare that this man is going through right now with the loss of his wife and the murder of his beautiful daughter going unsolved probably to his grave. You know what you see on TV that everybody gets justice and the bad guy is caught is not usually the case. And my heart goes out to this family tonight.

    KING: We have an e-mail for you on our website. The tenth anniversary of JonBenet's killing will be in December. Mary Lingnau of Whitby, Ontario asks: "Do you think the case will ever be solved?"

    WALSH: I don't think the case will ever be solved because of the poor police work in the beginning. Vital clues were lost. Time was lost. I don't think that all the sex offenders in the area were investigated. Back then lots of sex offenders didn't have to register, so I think that so many crucial mistakes were made in this case.

    Unless there was an incredible clue or somebody came forward, had the guts to come forward and say somebody has talked about this case to me, I don't think this case will be ever solved. I don't think this little girl will ever get justice and that's a sad thing in so many of these cases.

    Me: He's right about sex offenders not having to register back in 1996, but even today they give bogus addy's and move whereever they want and even change/use fake names! Besides, if JB were the target of a sex predator she would have been raped in the traditional sense and there would be no fake ransom note.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seeker
    Wow! Thanks for this info Camper. I had to go read the transcripts to get a better idea of all that he said. Very interesting comments although he's made mistakes before. I think he get's too much info about too many cases and get's them muddled up sometimes.

    http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP...27/lkl.01.html

    WALSH:
    There's lots of great detectives out there and good cops but I think that that grand jury in Colorado came up with a conclusion that there were footprints by her window, that there were all kinds of clues that were missed and my heart goes out to the Ramseys.

    Me: Now just HOW would JW know what was discussed in the GJ since it was all soooo secretive? Someone must have told him for him to know this right? And what's this about footprints by her window? Does he even know her window was on the 2nd floor?
    Seeker,

    Spin, media spin thats all this is. Walsh has a profile to project, so like Lou Smit he makes it up on the hoof!

    .

  13. #13
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    Just a quick heads up for JBR sleuthers ...



    "JonBenet - Anatomy of a Cold Case"

    Court TV - Thursday June 29th - 10 PM EDT


    The TV promo infers that they may have the evidence to solve this case.

    I did watch LKL last night - interesting comments by John Walsh ...


    13th Juror

  14. #14
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    Hmmm

    Yep, I have been by the house many many times. JonBenet had a large open balcony, with wrought iron trim and support.

    Its possible coulda been footie prints on the flat balcony, BUT no forced entry into the door there. Plus 'our' perp would have to have climbed up a slim wrought iron support.

    So 'our' perp would have had to be young and perhaps a gymnast with rust on the front of his clothing. Hmmm.

    Yes I concur about John W. and his mixing up of stuff, just like Paula Woodward and her one and half page ransom note, when it was two and a half pages. The devil is in the details, PLUS actual FACTS certainly help us all.

    Wonderful coverage on Molly Bish too last night. That suspect sketch looks like Xavier sp? Cugat. You have to be olde to remember Xavier C. Horrible ending for Molly. Her killer is still on the loose.

    Wonder what Steve Thomas take on (possible?)footprints on JonBenets balcony would be? The balcony probably would never have been swept off, since there were zero steps to get up to the balcony.

    .
    Opinions expressed by me, are mine, based on life experience, and known facts of any given case.





    """I am just a pixel in the universal plan."""

  15. #15
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    Although the case was mishandled, I will always be a PDI. Even if she had taken and passed a lie detector test, I would have always believed that she was involved in some way.

    Along with everything else, that ransom note screamed "Patsy". She may as well have signed it with her name.

    As for the R's alleged "cooperation", even when they DID "cooperate", they were never really properly questioned. Their legal team insisting on a list of the questions prior to the questioning, etc. made the whole thing a farce.

    I'm also surprised that more people couldn't see through Lou Smit's apologetics. His carefully worded "documentary" that puts more weight on a wrinkled dust ruffle than it does all of the bigger evidence that points AWAY FROM an intruder is laughable.


    A poster above said something about how, when a family member dies, the family wants to be with the rest of their family.

    That is certainly true, but I have never, ever in my life heard of the immediate family traveling TO the extended family. They stay with the body of their loved one and the family comes to THEM.

    The R's were headed out of town to get AWAY from what they'd done.

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