Camper
New Member
Lets all tune in tonight and see what Boulder and Company have done NOW!
Nancy will have call in's too.
Plus info on Karrs handwriting.
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Nancy will have call in's too.
Plus info on Karrs handwriting.
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Nancy Grace program tonight 8 PM EST- 6 PM Mountain time DNA has been contaminated
- Thread starter Camper
- Start date
Nedthan Johns
New Member
Good to see ya. Contaminated?
Is this in addition to it being degraded?
I give up. I throw in the towel. The world has gone mad. I need some meds.
Is this in addition to it being degraded?
I give up. I throw in the towel. The world has gone mad. I need some meds.
aspidistra
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No it cannot be contaminated and degraded. Maybe the fingernail dna, but not the speck from the underwear. That was ENHANCED and is in perfect condition.
Seeker
Former Member
Why can't a sample be both degraded and contaminated?
I won't be able to watch, but wonder if this is just the old info we already knew about...
I won't be able to watch, but wonder if this is just the old info we already knew about...
PalmettoSprings
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Nedthan Johns said:
I heard on Fox that it is contaminated due to the clippers that were used.
If I am not mistaken a differenct clipper is suppose to be used on each nail when nail samples are taken.
However, I tend to believe this has been known since day one.
WhiteWolf
New Member
Seeker said:
Hi seeker, I didn't get the big deal about the DNA unless what's left of the original DNA sample has been contaminated so any different tests couldn't be conducted on it.
Nancy will be on again on Courttv (repeat), CNN Headline News, and Catherine Crier.
Camper
New Member
Details, good point on the record.
I do believe the wild words came from the mouth of one of Nancy's guests who was stationed near the JAIL in Boulder.
Dang I cannot remember her name, I could draw a faily good picture of her, geeez, but her name has escaped me.
So tune in tonight and see where the curtain hangs. I cannot wait.
Maybe someone got into the 'war' room and cut up the record with a sharp instrument er somthin', Lacy has to come up with a position er, hmmm. Karr is a wild card.
Separate point, anyone remember or know what DAY it might have been that JonBenet told her little friend that she was going to have a 'secret visit from Santa AFTER Christmas?' I don't remember that we ever knew the date she might have told her little friend this.
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Edited to add: White Wolf, good point. I had tuned in late to hear this comment. It will be covered on Nancy Grace, Headline News at 6PM Mountain time.
I do believe the wild words came from the mouth of one of Nancy's guests who was stationed near the JAIL in Boulder.
Dang I cannot remember her name, I could draw a faily good picture of her, geeez, but her name has escaped me.
So tune in tonight and see where the curtain hangs. I cannot wait.
Maybe someone got into the 'war' room and cut up the record with a sharp instrument er somthin', Lacy has to come up with a position er, hmmm. Karr is a wild card.
Separate point, anyone remember or know what DAY it might have been that JonBenet told her little friend that she was going to have a 'secret visit from Santa AFTER Christmas?' I don't remember that we ever knew the date she might have told her little friend this.
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Edited to add: White Wolf, good point. I had tuned in late to hear this comment. It will be covered on Nancy Grace, Headline News at 6PM Mountain time.
Here's an article in the Daily Camera which covers the contamination:
http://www.dailycamera.com/bdc/county_news/article/0,1713,BDC_2423_4937937,00.html
DNA may lead to dead endBy Vanessa Miller, Camera Staff Writer
August 23, 2006
DNA swiped from John Mark Karr after his arrest last week in connection with the JonBenet Ramsey murder might be irrelevant, in part because "something got screwed up" when samples were taken from the crime scene in 1996, a former investigator on the case said. Bill Wise, former first assistant with the Boulder County District Attorney's Office, said that although DNA "absolutely could be one of the biggest things in the case," it could also be nothing.
Some of the DNA taken from the 6-year-old pageant queen's fingernails and underwear was "degraded," Wise said. He said the tool used to take samples wasn't clean.
"It had foreign DNA on it," he said.
The other "minuscule" sample, which is probably blood, was mixed with JonBenet's DNA, he said. That leaves investigators with the daunting task of trying to match a partial DNA strand with a sample from John Karr.
"The amount of DNA is small enough that it could exclude someone. But it could not go so far for the inclusion," Wise said.
Partial strands might narrow possible matches down to one person in every 100,000, he said.
http://www.dailycamera.com/bdc/county_news/article/0,1713,BDC_2423_4937937,00.html
DNA may lead to dead endBy Vanessa Miller, Camera Staff Writer
August 23, 2006
DNA swiped from John Mark Karr after his arrest last week in connection with the JonBenet Ramsey murder might be irrelevant, in part because "something got screwed up" when samples were taken from the crime scene in 1996, a former investigator on the case said. Bill Wise, former first assistant with the Boulder County District Attorney's Office, said that although DNA "absolutely could be one of the biggest things in the case," it could also be nothing.
Some of the DNA taken from the 6-year-old pageant queen's fingernails and underwear was "degraded," Wise said. He said the tool used to take samples wasn't clean.
"It had foreign DNA on it," he said.
The other "minuscule" sample, which is probably blood, was mixed with JonBenet's DNA, he said. That leaves investigators with the daunting task of trying to match a partial DNA strand with a sample from John Karr.
"The amount of DNA is small enough that it could exclude someone. But it could not go so far for the inclusion," Wise said.
Partial strands might narrow possible matches down to one person in every 100,000, he said.
aspidistra
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Yes of course the fingernail evidence was contaminated by the dirty clippers. They botched that. BUT the underwear dna is in perfect, enhanced condition. It was discovered long after the initial autopsy and taking the clippings in a sloppy way. So making a news story about OLD NEWS is just pretty lame. It irritates me to go on about the fingernails and try to brush the other dna under the rug, even though it is the other dna that is key. But Nancy Grace is just irritating in the way she puts out her stories anyway. Although she does have some interesting guests.PalmettoSprings said:
Seeker
Former Member
In Boulder it's one fresh set of clippers for each hand, not each nail.PalmettoSprings said:
Thanks WW, I still won't be able to watch, but maybe I can read a transcript tomorrow.WhiteWolf said:
WhiteWolf
New Member
PalmettoSprings said:
This has been known for a long time (fingernail DNA contaminated).
Camper
New Member
Sloppiness in reporting has been major.
WE all knew about the fingernail deal witht he clippers, but I got the impression from hearing this today that it was something NEW and different.
I think White Wolf has a good attitude about the panty blood, and it already being intact from previous pristine documentation and new methods of testing, in 2003.
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WE all knew about the fingernail deal witht he clippers, but I got the impression from hearing this today that it was something NEW and different.
I think White Wolf has a good attitude about the panty blood, and it already being intact from previous pristine documentation and new methods of testing, in 2003.
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Nedthan Johns
New Member
actually it CAN be degraded and contaiminated. We all know it was degraded but the contaimination is NEW. Doesn't mean it was recently contaiminated, but could have been prior to the testing.
It looks like the DNA on JonBenet's underwear was a trace amount which was contaminated by miss JB's own DNA. Investigator's would have to seperate out the strands which do not match JB's, but they could never get a complete DNA profile from the sample.aspidistra said:
It doesn't sound like prosecutors could ever win this case on DNA alone.
Nuisanceposter
Remembering Little Miss Christmas
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Barbara Kostanick said it was the day before Christmas. I assume she means December 24th.Camper said:
Camper
New Member
Nuisanceposter said:
Thank you. Could someone start a new thread with the guest list from the party of the 23rd, er, seems like I remember there was a guest list posted once?
I have more questions, when was the last day of school before Christmas? Will save this Q for the guest list thread IF someone starts one.
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A judge was interviewed on Fox. He said the DNA was contaminated in both samples. the fingernails were exposed to air and the undergarments were also questionable. He said the BPD went and bought the exact same undergarments from the same store and the same kind of foreign DNA was present, probably from factory workers who handled the garments.
He said there could be enough points that match or dont match, but that it may also be inconclusive. And that %99 of murder cases are convicted without DNA.
(i don't know if this is old news or not)
He said there could be enough points that match or dont match, but that it may also be inconclusive. And that %99 of murder cases are convicted without DNA.
(i don't know if this is old news or not)