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  1. #1
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    THE BLOW TO THE HEAD...an ACCIDENT...

    Dr. Henry Lee stated that the blow to the head was consistant with that of an accident. John Mark Karr said her death was an 'accident'. If an intruder caused this accidental blow to her head, how could it have happened? I found this post below on an old thread here titled "Head Blow".

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    -Quote earlier post Under Thread named Head Blow-

    "JonBenet was struck hard on the side of her head. Dr. Meyer stated during the autopsy that her head injuries were consistent with a "blow to the head".
    What position must JonBenet have been in to have recieved this blow to her head? To try and strike a blow on the side of the head to someone lying down would have been very awkward - like golfing. Not very likely at all. She must have been upright then.
    Which means she had to have been STRUCK first - and then strangled.
    Because she could not have been in an upright position to have that object swung to the side of her head - had she been strangled and unconscious/near death.
    It makes no sense that someone struck her head when she was lying down.
    And supposedly dead from being strangled."
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------

    ~~~~~Note that the Side of the Head was where the blow was. I remember carrying one of my sons sleeping from the car inside our home. He was about the same age as JBR was at the time of her death, he was so long that I had to turn my body sideways to get him through the doorjam safely. I was careless and did not turn enough to safely get him through the door jam. His head banged up against it. I was fearful that I had seriously injured him accidently. Luckily, he was not badly hurt and I was very very careful in the future.


    Assuming that an intruder did this to JonBenet, could he not have been carrying her quickly throught the maze of rooms through the house which he was not very familiar with and once in the basement, hit her head on the corner of a concrete wall or metal door jam with such force that it could have fractured her skull on the side of her head? It could have happened and remained unheard by family three floors up.

    Earlier this year, my husband's step-sister fell a few feet off a porch and hit her head on the paved driveway below. The family inside the house did not hear her fall, but found her several hours later. She died from the blow to her head.

    (This possibility, explaining the accidental blow to the head, just doesn't fit with a non-intruder theory, in my opinion, because I simply can't imagine why any parent would try to cover up such 'an innocent accident' by going to such horrific, documented, sexual assault extremes ('fragments of the paint brush ripping the vagina and leaving fragments consistant with the paint brush inside') and using a garrote on a child to cover up accidentally banging of their child's head when carrying them asleep, inside the home, to put them to bed... but it does play out with a sexual preditor.)


    Another less likely possibility, if an intruder was trying to stuff her out a window...above his head in the basement, JBR could conceiveably have fallen and hit her head causing a potentially fatal blow to her head.

    In either case the potentially fatal blow to the head would have been "accidental' as JMK claimed and the killer could have used the garrote which was already in place to finish the murder to 'put her out of her pain'. Or more callously, he could have realized she was going to die from the blow to the head and decided to kill her with the garrote.

    For tonight at least, I'm going to bed... having jumped down off the fence, believing that this theory could have happened.

    I have already posted explaining why I think the R's statements were filled with questionable comments. (Basically, Shock after the murder and their need to maintain the illusion of still having a "Norman Rockwell" imaginary life...as they had always portrayed themselves before the tragedy. Image seemed very important.)

    I imagine that by tomorrow noon I will find myself knocked back to "Fence Walker" status... I'm sure that many of you who have watched this case non-stop from the beginning can already see giant holes in my possibilities. (but for tonight I'm off the fence...)

  2. #2
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    Hey, i have been on and off the fence since Karr's arrest. today I think he did it but last night I thought Patsy did. I had just watched a crap movie called "perfect murder, perfect town' which made Patsy look like a lunatic, tranquilizer addict. i still think the blow to the head may have been an accident also.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by angelwngs
    Dr. Henry Lee stated that the blow to the head was consistant with that of an accident. John Mark Karr said her death was an 'accident'. If an intruder caused this accidental blow to her head, how could it have happened? I found this post below on an old thread here titled "Head Blow".

    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    -Quote earlier post Under Thread named Head Blow-

    "JonBenet was struck hard on the side of her head. Dr. Meyer stated during the autopsy that her head injuries were consistent with a "blow to the head".
    What position must JonBenet have been in to have recieved this blow to her head? To try and strike a blow on the side of the head to someone lying down would have been very awkward - like golfing. Not very likely at all. She must have been upright then.
    Which means she had to have been STRUCK first - and then strangled.
    Because she could not have been in an upright position to have that object swung to the side of her head - had she been strangled and unconscious/near death.
    It makes no sense that someone struck her head when she was lying down.
    And supposedly dead from being strangled."
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------

    ~~~~~Note that the Side of the Head was where the blow was. I remember carrying one of my sons sleeping from the car inside our home. He was about the same age as JBR was at the time of her death, he was so long that I had to turn my body sideways to get him through the doorjam safely. I was careless and did not turn enough to safely get him through the door jam. His head banged up against it. I was fearful that I had seriously injured him accidently. Luckily, he was not badly hurt and I was very very careful in the future.


    Assuming that an intruder did this to JonBenet, could he not have been carrying her quickly throught the maze of rooms through the house which he was not very familiar with and once in the basement, hit her head on the corner of a concrete wall or metal door jam with such force that it could have fractured her skull on the side of her head? It could have happened and remained unheard by family three floors up.

    Earlier this year, my husband's step-sister fell a few feet off a porch and hit her head on the paved driveway below. The family inside the house did not hear her fall, but found her several hours later. She died from the blow to her head.

    (This possibility, explaining the accidental blow to the head, just doesn't fit with a non-intruder theory, in my opinion, because I simply can't imagine why any parent would try to cover up such 'an innocent accident' by going to such horrific, documented, sexual assault extremes ('fragments of the paint brush ripping the vagina and leaving fragments consistant with the paint brush inside') and using a garrote on a child to cover up accidentally banging of their child's head when carrying them asleep, inside the home, to put them to bed... but it does play out with a sexual preditor.)


    Another less likely possibility, if an intruder was trying to stuff her out a window...above his head in the basement, JBR could conceiveably have fallen and hit her head causing a potentially fatal blow to her head.

    In either case the potentially fatal blow to the head would have been "accidental' as JMK claimed and the killer could have used the garrote which was already in place to finish the murder to 'put her out of her pain'. Or more callously, he could have realized she was going to die from the blow to the head and decided to kill her with the garrote.

    For tonight at least, I'm going to bed... having jumped down off the fence, believing that this theory could have happened.

    I have already posted explaining why I think the R's statements were filled with questionable comments. (Basically, Shock after the murder and their need to maintain the illusion of still having a "Norman Rockwell" imaginary life...as they had always portrayed themselves before the tragedy. Image seemed very important.)

    I imagine that by tomorrow noon I will find myself knocked back to "Fence Walker" status... I'm sure that many of you who have watched this case non-stop from the beginning can already see giant holes in my possibilities. (but for tonight I'm off the fence...)
    I used to think that she fell too, or otherwise accidentally struck her head during whatever was happening, but the pathologists interviewed mostly agree that the blow to the head came after her death or there would be more bleeding - that the cause of death was strangulation. Therefore she was already dead when her head was bashed or she fell, and it was still not an accident.

  4. #4
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    Kaz.......... I feel your pain......... One minute I lean one way and the next I've read something that causes me to lean in the opposite direction........

    But tonight I wrapped myself around the possibility that I posted earlier... That an Intruder DID do it...Now I need to try to make the events of JBR's last night try to fit together...

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


    (Warning, After writing this I made myself sick to my stomach. Following the thoughts and steps of a sicko...pervert...was nasty and awful... Trying to make an this scenero fit...and putting the words to paper was LOUSY! Don't read it if you don't want to feel the same way...please...)

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    A possible intruder theory....or not???

    An intruder enters the house through an open door before the Ramsey's leave for the party. He hides and waits for them to leave. All he has brought with him is a tiny square, flat flashlight which he will attached to his shirt. (***I'm not even sure they made these flashlights in 1996...***)They leave and he begins to plunder around the house. He finds everything he needs to make this fantasy of his..... a reality.... He hides everything in their proper places until he needs to use them. He also finds the check stub listing JR's bonus at 118,000+ some change...He locates JBR's room. He explores the house. He has plenty of time so he writes a ransom note in case he needs more time to get JBR out of the house and far, far away. He never intends to contact the family for the money. The family returns earlier than he thought they would. His note is all wrong...He needs to start over...After giving them time to go to sleep, he attaches the flashlight, turns it on and he sneaks toward JBR's room. In the the empty bedroom next to JBR's, he grabs the blanket off the top of the bed, in the process mussing the dust ruffle with his feet. He doesn't notice it. He sneaks into JBR's room. She is sound asleep. He puts the blanket over her to help hold her in place. He suddenly tapes her mouth as he straddles her legs, sitting on top of her. The blanket covering her arms and legs and the pressure of his body on hers prevents her from escaping. He reaches into his pocket for teh garrote and realizes that he forgot to put it together. He tries to tye the garrote for control. She is struggling and getting her hair all twisted into the cord of the garrote. She gets her hands free and scratches at her throat. He grabs her hands, shoves them under the blanket and puts his weight down on the blanket. He fumbles with the knots on the garrote again...He should have remembered to construct it before they all came home...but that note took longer than he had expected...At last, it is done and he is able to control her with the garrote. She is now almost unconcious, he decides it is safe now to cart her off down the stairs. In her bed she has kicked and thrashed about...and has accidently wet herself. Now he realizes it. He knows he must clean her and change her clothes. He grabs the first clothing he can lay his hands on and plans to change her in the basement where he is less likely to be discovered and where the water can't be heard running in the downstairs laundry room. He wraps the extra clothes inside the blanket and pulls it around her tight enough to bind her as well as he can. He pulls the garrote tighter for the trip down the staris. He can't risk her making a sound or a movement. He sneaks down the 1st set of stairs, lays her on the floor and retreaves the ransom note from where he has hidden it and places it, spread apart, on the stairs. He is in a huge hurry now and he is more careless. He picks her up again and rushes down the next flight of stairs and turns the corner too quickly. With JBR starting to awaken she begins to struggle violently, he loses his balance and trips on the tail of the blanket and accidently slams her head into the metal door frame (or concrete corner wall in the basement.) (or he loses his balance on the basement stairs tripping on the blanket tail and totally drops her. Her head crashes loudly on the basement floor.) She is seriously injured...Blood begins to trickle from her nose but he doesn't notice it as he picks her up. Her face is pressed against his jacket. His plan is falling apart at the seams. He takes her into the laundry room to examine her injury and to wash and to change her... She is in very bad shape. He is overwhelmed with emotion. He begins to wash her with water from the sink (if no sink he opens the lid to the washing machine and turns the dial to the rinse cycle.) He uses his hands to wash her. He ...tells her it was an accident... that he didn't mean to hurt her and he tries to make it better...He keeps telling her she will be ok...But she won't be ok and he finally realizes this. He decides to use the garrote to 'put her out of her pain'. He is overwhelmed with emotion and sickness... She is still in a state of undressed. His sickness takes over. He physically abuses her with the unused broken end of the paint brush which he removes from his pocket. When he finishes he puts the painbrush end back into his pocket. Now, he must wash her again. He takes off his jacket and overshirt. He will use his tee shirt to thoroughly clean her and dry the water. As he finishes redressing her, he realizes he has grabbed a 'too large' pair of 'bloomies', but they will have to do. He can't risk another mistake now. He stuffs his dirty tee shirt into the inside pocket of his jacket. He puts back on his overshirt and then his jacket. He has totally ruined his dream of capturing his angel. He carefully wraps her back into the blanket and puts her in the room which he thinks would be searched last, to give him the most time to escape. He sneaks up the stairs and lets himself out the same door which he had entered earlier in the day. He locks it from the inside before he exits. He pulls the door shut.(***This only works if all the locks were not deadbolted when the Ramsey's awakened, but at least one was only loked using the door knob lock. I don't know what types of locks were used.***) He quickly walks to the bus station to take the next bus to Denver so he can catch a plane home... It will be an unpleasantly long trip..........
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    After writing this, besides feeling totally sick... and wondering how I could possibly have put such words to paper... I realized that I am way too normal...to even believe my own theory. I don't see how anyone could be this sick... I take back what I said...earlier...I won't even make it through one night of being "off the fence" and believing an intruder did it...I want to be a permanent fence sitter. I don't want to believe any human could have been this vile... I just want to bury my head in the sand and not have any idea who this monster could have been. I need to try to sleep and forget I even went here........ I seriously doubt that will happen....tonight or that I can forget that I put these words to paper.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by aspidistra
    I used to think that she fell too, or otherwise accidentally struck her head during whatever was happening, but the pathologists interviewed mostly agree that the blow to the head came after her death or there would be more bleeding - that the cause of death was strangulation. Therefore she was already dead when her head was bashed or she fell, and it was still not an accident.
    ~~~~
    Good... I sincerely thank you for taking the time to post your opinion. After putting my thoughts to paper and trying to follow the intruder's steps... I decided I did not want to be right! I do not want to be able to think like this sicko.......... The garrote being made on her body sounded so stupid too.... Why would any intruder wait to make the garrote on her body?...But I read that was the only way that the hairs could have gotten inside of the knots as they were found...

    The only other way I see for the blow to the head to have come after death by an intruder is if he fell carrying her to the basement after he choked her to death upstairs and what sicko would molest her in her own bedroom, kill her and wash and redress her with her parents asleep nearby...

    The only other possibility I can possibly see is if he killed her and was stupid enough to try to stuff her out of a basement window which was over his head... and dropped her... That makes no sense either...

    I am quickly running out of intruder theories....

  6. #6
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    Don't worry Angel Wngs I posted my theory days ago and it was similar but a little different.i think he 'got' in when the Rams left. I fence sit and then say, i don't know, then I am back to the rams again. But I am finding John Karr is taking up most of my thoughts( this disturbs me). Nothing i read about him surprises me but I do wonder how much of it is true.One thing that has me wondering is 'why' there was no Semen found at the crimescene I find it hard to believe he did all of this and did not( you know) at some stage. Maybe it is me but I think he would have been extremely sexually aroused .ERRRhh I am freaking myself out thinking about it .

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by kazzbar
    Don't worry Angel Wngs I posted my theory days ago and it was similar but a little different.i think he 'got' in when the Rams left. I fence sit and then say, i don't know, then I am back to the rams again. But I am finding John Karr is taking up most of my thoughts( this disturbs me). Nothing i read about him surprises me but I do wonder how much of it is true.One thing that has me wondering is 'why' there was no Semen found at the crimescene I find it hard to believe he did all of this and did not( you know) at some stage. Maybe it is me but I think he would have been extremely sexually aroused .ERRRhh I am freaking myself out thinking about it .
    Kazz... I was there a couple of days ago... The warrant posted online stated that the blacklight findings were consistant with that of semen but then in the next paragraph it said that the swab test showed no evidence of semen. I know that blood and other things show up on black light but wouldn't they appear different enough to make a scientific suggestion that the blacklight showed one or the other??? I wanted so to believe that he just washed it too well when cleaning her body and degraded it to the point that the semen could not be proven by the swab but was proven by the blacklight and this was the secret bullet that JMK knew that was not posted by the media... but this idea got totally shot down here ....

    Lord in Heaven... It is 5:00 AM here... I have been here all day long and now all night too!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by angelwngs
    Kazz... I was there a couple of days ago... The warrant posted online stated that the blacklight findings were consistant with that of semen but then in the next paragraph it said that the swab test showed no evidence of semen. I know that blood and other things show up on black light but wouldn't they appear different enough to make a scientific suggestion that the blacklight showed one or the other??? I wanted so to believe that he just washed it too well when cleaning her body and degraded it to the point that the semen could not be proven by the swab but was proven by the blacklight and this was the secret bullet that JMK knew that was not posted by the media... but this idea got totally shot down here ....

    Lord in Heaven... It is 5:00 AM here... I have been here all day long and now all night too!
    Just because it got shot down does'nt make it impossible. I just cannot believe any intruder did not get their sexual jolly's off. i just do not know enough about the Mo,s of people who do this type of thing. Sexual gratification "must' be part of it, perhaps it occurs later when the crime is recalled.
    Go to Bed. You will be absolutely wrung out if you dont. I still have another 5 hrs before bed time.Tomorrow I am getting away from this computer!!!...

  9. #9
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    "What position must JonBenet have been in to have recieved this blow to her head? To try and strike a blow on the side of the head to someone lying down would have been very awkward - like golfing. Not very likely at all. She must have been upright then.
    Which means she had to have been STRUCK first - and then strangled."

    Very good! Never considered that.

    "I had just watched a crap movie called "perfect murder, perfect town' which made Patsy look like a lunatic, tranquilizer addict."

    She didn't need the movie to make her look like that.

    "but the pathologists interviewed mostly agree that the blow to the head came after her death or there would be more bleeding"

    Not so. Werner Spitz has always said the head blow came first.

  10. #10
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    Does anyone know WHICH side of the head was hit? Was it the left side?


  11. #11
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    Days ago I wrote in another thread about the head blow and the possibility that the blow came from above as opposed to the blow coming down hard on the head.

    Having 5 kids, it was always a challenge to get several sleeping kids out of a car, late at night after visiting relatives.

    I can remember several times that either myself or Mr. Am had a kiddo slung over our shoulder, kiddow wakes up, lifts head, and Pow, kiddow bangs head on top of front or bedroom door frame.
    Lifting another kiddo out of the car, I was in a hurry and kiddow's head hit the car's door trim/frame as I got him out. (Yes, I felt like the worst mom in the world at the time)

    Could JBR's head injury have happened from above? Such as a pipe in the basement?
    Maybe someone carrying her up on their shoulder, JBR flung back, either waking up or while still asleep and when doing so slammed her head against a pipe that ran along the ceiling?

    ETA: Or maybe JBR was flailing and flinging her arms, legs and head trying to get away from her abductor while he/she was carrying her and her head hit something hard, above her? I added this because I just remembered my own son's temper tantrums where he would flail arms, legs and head and there were a few occasions where he slammed his head, Hard! while in one of his tantrums.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    GenaBena, my only sibling,
    In the time line of life, it wasn't supposed to happen this way.
    We were supposed to grow old together.
    Sleep Peacefully, Li'l Sis
    October 16, 2011


    ~~~~~~~~~~

    Amity

    Consciousness:
    That annoying time between naps.

  12. #12
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    Right side.

  13. #13
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    Thanks for the info SuperDave. The fact that it was the right side would be in keeping with Steve Thomas's theory, I think, assuming he felt that this took place in JonBenet's bathroom of which I saw a picture in the last few days (forget what site maybe someone else knows). It looked like the outer part of the bathtub was in ceramic tiles with a sharp edge and assuming that the picture as is does not display an inverted image, the scene about toilet issues would probably place the child between the mother and the toilet with her right side to the tub. Also, if a right-handed person struck a child facing them on the left side of the head with a lot of force, they could have sent the child's head directly to the edge of the tub.

    I know that there are a lot of "ifs" here so let me know if any of them are incorrect.

    When he was a toddler who had just learned to walk my son once came running to me in the bathroom, as I was in front of the sink washing my hands. He lost his balance, tripped and his forehead went down on the side of the toilet bowl. It caused no break to the skin but bled beneath the skin, although it caused no bone damage. The memory of the sound of that blow still makes me cringe to this day. I can't imagine what that would have created had the force of an adult blow come swinging down sending a child's head to such a surface, but I can imagine that the adult would probably assume death.

    I believe that Patsy was right-handed. Were all three Ramseys in the house right-handed?

    JMO

  14. #14
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    I don't have any medical knowledge to speak of, so I might be wrong, but I don't see the kind of skull fracture JBR suffered coming from a door jamb or a short fall.

  15. #15
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    Chrishope wrote: I don't have any medical knowledge to speak of, so I might be wrong, but I don't see the kind of skull fracture JBR suffered coming from a door jamb or a short fall.

    True, Chrishope.
    I am just trying to come up with something, anything. And from all I've read and heard, most TH's talk about the flashlight, the bathroom ceramics, the floor, the baseball bat as being the probable cause of the head fracture, I was just trying to interject ideas from my own life experiences. All I've read talks about things below, I was trying to think of things "up"...pipes in basement, door frames etc.
    Anything to stop my head from spinning over this case.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    GenaBena, my only sibling,
    In the time line of life, it wasn't supposed to happen this way.
    We were supposed to grow old together.
    Sleep Peacefully, Li'l Sis
    October 16, 2011


    ~~~~~~~~~~

    Amity

    Consciousness:
    That annoying time between naps.

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