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Thread: California v. John Mark Karr

  1. #26
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    False Confessions
    Why did John Mark Karr claim he killed JonBenet Ramsey? And why did prosecutors arrest him on such flimsy evidence?

    Newsweek
    Updated: 4:03 p.m. PT Aug 29, 2006
    Aug. 29, 2006 - Trip DeMuth was extremely concerned. When the former Boulder, Colo. prosecutor who investigated the 1996 JonBenet Ramsey murder case learned last week that suspect John Mark Karr had been arrested only five days after investigators learned his name, DeMuth was afraid the whole case was based on Karr’s own confession. But confessions aren’t very reliable unless they contain inside information only known to a killer, and DeMuth also knew that virtually all the evidence had leaked to the public—and to someone who falsely claimed to be the killer. “I concluded back then that there was no way to trust a confession,” DeMuth told NEWSWEEK last Friday.

    DeMuth was right: Karr’s own statements were all prosecutors had. On Monday afternoon, Boulder District attorney Mary Lacy announced that she wouldn’t file charges against Karr for the brutal December 1996 killing of 6-year-old JonBenet. After 12 days of a media circus that started with Karr’s arrest in Bangkok August 16 and finished with Karr a prisoner in a Boulder jail cell, Lacy conceded that she found no meaningful evidence linking Karr to the murder. “His DNA does not match that found in the victim’s blood in her underwear,” Lacy wrote in a motion to overturn Karr’s arrest. Prosecutors, she wrote, “would not be able to establish that Mr. Karr committed this crime despite his repeated insistence that he did.”


    Dennis Schroeder / AP-pool
    DA Lacy: ‘There was a real public safety concern here’
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Karr certainly looked like a promising suspect. In court filings released this week, Lacy confirmed that the hunt started in April with increasingly suspicious email exchanges between an anonymous man calling himself “Daxis” and University of Colorado journalism professor Michael Tracey, who has produced three television documentaries on the case. The emails led to 11 phone calls between Tracey and Karr, which were eventually traced to Bangkok. On August 3, investigators arranged with Tracey for him to ship a photo of JonBenet to a Mail Boxes Etc branch in Bangkok in order to learn his identity. Thai police traced him to an apartment building, and investigators finally learned the identity of Tracey’s correspondent on August 11. They arrested him five days later.

    Karr’s confessions ranged from the emails to police interviews whose contents remain unknown. But he famously implicated himself talking to reporters in Bangkok shortly after his arrest. He said then that he’d been with the Ramsey child when she died, that her death was an accident.


    http://msnbc.msn.com/id/14575118/site/newsweek/

  2. #27
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    Post Karr Ordered Back To Bay Area To Face Child Porn Charges

    POSTED: 6:00 pm PDT August 29, 2006
    UPDATED: 7:36 pm PDT August 29, 2006


    SANTA ROSA -- A Colorado judge on Tuesday ordered John Mark Karr sent to Sonoma County to face child pornography charges, while local authorities said they would re-examine his computer for more illicit images.

    The extradition order came a day after prosecutors in Colorado abruptly dropped their case against Karr in the slaying of JonBenet Ramsey, saying DNA tests failed to put him at the crime scene despite his insistence he sexually assaulted and strangled the 6-year-old beauty queen.Karr is being held in a Boulder jail until he can be sent back to Santa Rosa to face five misdemeanor child pornography charges.

    District Judge Roxanne Bailin in Boulder ordered Karr sent to California by Sept. 13, saying he had violated terms of his bond in that state by failing to show up for a hearing on the pornography charges.

    Meanwhile, at a Sonoma County court hearing, a prosecutor and a lawyer for the sheriff's department called the Karr investigation "ongoing," and said deputies have asked for a new warrant to search Karr's hard drive because technology has advanced in the five years since the original probe.If convicted, Karr could get a year in prison on each count.

    But authorities may want to push for more jail time if investigators turn up new evidence from Karr's computer.New information also came to light Tuesday about the sharing of information about Karr between California and Colorado.

    Sonoma County sheriff's officials have said they forwarded information about Karr to Boulder authorities back in 2001 because of his apparent fascination with the 1996 murder of JonBenet. While he stopped short of confessing, they said he made "uncertain allusions to placing himself in the killer's role," arousing their suspicions.

    However, Tom Bennett, chief investigator for the Boulder County district attorney's office disputed that Tuesday, saying he didn't learn of Karr's possible connection to JonBenet until earlier this month. more at link:http://www.ktvu.com/news/9759188/detail.html
    Please help locate Mark Dribin http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...ht=Mark+Dribin and Ilene Misheloff http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...lene+Misheloff and bring them home.



  3. #28
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    Is there any truth to another posters comments a out a child in Thailands death.anyone hear have any info?

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzzm1
    We CA folks are hoping that after Bubba, and his friends, give JMK a big sendoff in 3, or 4, years,, that he will decide that Alabama, or Georgia, are far safer places for him, to loiter.
    If he makes it out of jail....
    I bet alot of people are going to just love to see him....

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buzzm1
    SONOMA JUDGE WON'T UNSEAL KARR ARREST DOCUMENTS
    08/29/06 5:15 PDT
    SANTA ROSA (BCN)

    A Sonoma County Superior Court judge refused this afternoon to unseal documents regarding the 2001 arrest of John Mark Karr in Sonoma County on five misdemeanor charges of possession of child pornography.

    The documents were sealed earlier this month after Karr became a suspect in the murder of JonBenet Ramsey. He is no longer being prosecuted in Colorado for the 6-year-old beauty pageant contestant's murder in December 1996.

    Judge Cerena Wong denied a motion by Bay Area media outlets to unseal documents in support of a search warrant and Karr's arrest. Rachel Matteo-Boehm, attorney for the media, said unsealing the documents does not mean Karr can't get a fair trial and that the California standard for sealing the documents is "exceedingly high.''


    Matteo-Boehm said the public and the press have a First Amendment right to know what is in the documents that support Karr's arrest.

    The judge made her ruling after viewing the documents during a closed hearing with Sgt. Robert Giordano of the Sonoma County Sheriff's Department and Deputy County Counsel Anne Keck.

    It was disclosed during the court hearing that the Sheriff's Department has re-opened its investigation of Karr on the pornography charges. Giordano would not comment on the scope of the re-opened investigation.

    Chief Deputy District Attorney Joan Risse said new technology has allowed a more thorough examination of Karr's computer on which the pornography was allegedly found five years ago.

    Wong said the overriding considerations to support keeping the documents sealed include Karr's and the prosecution's right to a fair trial before an impartial jury and Karr's presumption of innocence. Wong also cited the ongoing investigation by the Sheriff's Department.

    Matteo-Boehm also argued that names of alleged underage victims and witnesses in the documents could be redacted to shield their identity before the documents were unsealed. Wong said her review of the documents showed that was not possible and the identities could still be discerned.


    http://cbs5.com/localwire/localfsnew...urces_bcn_html
    The final paragraph states that "Matteo-Boehm also argued that names of alleged underage victims and witnesses in the documents could be redacted to shield thier identity before the documents were unsealed. Wong said her review of the documents showed that was not possible and the identities could still be discerned.

    I was under the impression that the child pornography charges were in regards to photos found on Karr's computer. I wasn't aware that there were "underage victims and witnesses." Does anyone know what Karr allegedly did in Sonoma County that would include victims?
    My posts are my opinion..........



  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by kazzbar
    Is there any truth to another posters comments a out a child in Thailands death.anyone hear have any info?
    I think its a joke that he would even try fighting it-what a total loser-and some think he is simply a mental case-how can he just be a victim of his own life and then fight extradition for charges he knows he is guilty of or could have that proven - why would he want to stay in boulder but not return to his other charges..loser-loser-loser..they need to look at every possible loophole to charge him with to extend his time in jail.
    I am pretty sure he can get 6 years for his charges and at least one year for fleeing..even if u are found innocent u cannot flee in the first place and get no charges.
    They need to give him any jail time possible -he is such a loser.
    Last edited by newtv; 08-30-2006 at 10:17 AM.

  7. #32
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    >>>>"I was under the impression that the child pornography charges were in regards to photos found on Karr's computer. I wasn't aware that there were "underage victims and witnesses." Does anyone know what Karr allegedly did in Sonoma County that would include victims?"<<<<

    The children depicted in the child porn photos ARE victims.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leila
    The final paragraph states that "Matteo-Boehm also argued that names of alleged underage victims and witnesses in the documents could be redacted to shield thier identity before the documents were unsealed. Wong said her review of the documents showed that was not possible and the identities could still be discerned.

    I was under the impression that the child pornography charges were in regards to photos found on Karr's computer. I wasn't aware that there were "underage victims and witnesses." Does anyone know what Karr allegedly did in Sonoma County that would include victims?
    yes, I would like to know also.Were they pictures of students he had taken or poor day care victims he looked after.This is all murky.II also heard the victims were clothed. heard the pictures were deleted and on the hard drive of his laptop.
    What about witnessess.I figured they were just nasty photos of anonomous victims off the Netbut this is not correct.
    Did he take these ugly pictures?

  9. #34
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    I wonder if Karr's mental state will have an impact on sentencing charges in CA. (The charges are also only misdemeanors.) A good attorney could certainly use his fixation with JB to prove he wasn't competent.

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Can we fly parents in from Bangkok of children he raped and murdered?

    Doesn't the more serious charges come first in the International court of law?



    There are no charges waiting for him over there. He just has to serve his time in Calif and he is back on the streets again. At least if he returns to Bangkok the schools are all aware that he is a pervert and why he has lost every job in every school that he has ever taught in.

  11. #36
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    Jeffrey Dahmer's End

    Isn't anyone thinking what I'm thinking, that inmates may kill Karr, unless he's protected in solitary or something? He probably knows that. Otherwise he'd have free room and board for a while, to write his book.

  12. #37
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    the lawyer could argue that it was for a book that still isnt written-i think a jury would believe he intended to use it for depraved fantasies.

  13. #38
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    Good Morning,

    Listening to MSNBC this morning, I have heard that Ca is looking into anything possible to keep Karr off the streets as long as possible. Undoubtedly they do not want to be the state that releases him when he is such a danger to society, even though he would be under close supervision. That doesn't always work as we have seen. This is not official news, but rather the opinion of the comentators on MSNBC from what they have learned.

    But what is really interesting comes from yesterday's court hearing and possible evidence in Karr's lap-top computer. It was said that he suddenly looked green and quite unwell {my poetic license, but the same meaning ;} when it was said Ca is going to go through everything he has in that computer! There is a feeling there might be much, much more disturbing info there on which possible other crimes, and even federal charges might be in the making!

    The hostess of the show said you could liken it to telling someone, hey I have your password now and am going to see exactly what you have been up to! LOL LOL

    The one problem with that I see as possibly defendable is just because the computer technology is so much better now than in 2001, how can one go back and amend or increase charges based on new info come to light. Yes, it still is an ongoing case, but I would think they would have to have brand new charges for this world trolliping tushie wanna-be!

    Scandi

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by scandi
    Good Morning,

    Listening to MSNBC this morning, I have heard that Ca is looking into anything possible to keep Karr off the streets as long as possible. Undoubtedly they do not want to be the state that releases him when he is such a danger to society, even though he would be under close supervision. That doesn't always work as we have seen. This is not official news, but rather the opinion of the comentators on MSNBC from what they have learned.

    But what is really interesting comes from yesterday's court hearing and possible evidence in Karr's lap-top computer. It was said that he suddenly looked green and quite unwell {my poetic license, but the same meaning ;} when it was said Ca is going to go through everything he has in that computer! There is a feeling there might be much, much more disturbing info there on which possible other crimes, and even federal charges might be in the making!

    The hostess of the show said you could liken it to telling someone, hey I have your password now and am going to see exactly what you have been up to! LOL LOL

    The one problem with that I see as possibly defendable is just because the computer technology is so much better now than in 2001, how can one go back and amend or increase charges based on new info come to light. Yes, it still is an ongoing case, but I would think they would have to have brand new charges for this world trolliping tushie wanna-be!

    Scandi
    Good morning Scandi! I am sure I am not the only one here who gets a kick out of your "poetic license". You are too funny and your posts are great. Thanks for a big smile this morning.

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    I wouldn't be suprised if something happened to him during his trip back to CA.

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seeker
    I wouldn't be suprised if something happened to him during his trip back to CA.
    You mean like a "trip" down a flight of stairs or an "accidental" shank in the throat?

  17. #42
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    Thanks Anita,

    It was from Rita Cosby that I got the feeling for that poetic description! LOL Something like when that was stated in court he shifted in his chair and was obviously suddenly overwhelmed by the thought of it as his face demeanor took on a changed look. And it was noticed by many that were present to the point of discussion between themselves!

    Oh boy, it makes you wonder what the rest of the story could be, in fact I will bet the lap top will be our newest thread coming up! YaYa

    I also caught it when a poster mentioned a murder victim of his in Thailand, and think that was somewhat misconstrued, which could be easy to happen.

    What was said by Mary was there was a young girl he had taken to on the same degree as JonBenet, and this was a student in the school where he had just started teaching that Tuesday I believe. They didn't want anything to happen to her.

    Scandi

  18. #43
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    Wink

    We can only guess what's on that pc.
    However I bet there's ALOT to put him away for a long time, well hope so...

  19. #44
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    Well if the crux of the case against him in CA is Wendy Hutchens and her infamous recordings and email (probably photo) trading, how does her getting paid for interviews, playing recordings during those interviews, and selling her "journal" on Ebay going to affect the case?

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anita Richman
    Good morning Scandi! I am sure I am not the only one here who gets a kick out of your "poetic license". You are too funny and your posts are great. Thanks for a big smile this morning.
    i think because he bolted before a trial-they can do anything they want-its karr who caused the delay..he has lost alot of rights from bolting..and they are allowed to scrutinize his every move before and during that bolt.

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by lighthouselover
    Well if the crux of the case against him in CA is Wendy Hutchens and her infamous recordings and email (probably photo) trading, how does her getting paid for interviews, playing recordings during those interviews, and selling her "journal" on Ebay going to affect the case?
    because the police themselves asked her to make the tapes-they are authentic-i dont think what she does with them matters - she had them before and thats what matters-its not like she came forward for the first time to the public-that would be different-she made these tapes under police supervision and it is real

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by newtv
    because the police themselves asked her to make the tapes-they are authentic-i dont think what she does with them matters - she had them before and thats what matters-its not like she came forward for the first time to the public-that would be different-she made these tapes under police supervision and it is real
    She may have done it at the request of the police, however, had he remained in CA and fought the charges, he stood a chance of arguing entrapment. But the question still remains, if she taped at the request of the police, why was she still in possession of the tapes?

    According to Beth Karas, prior to JMK fleeing, he had won a motion which in effect, threw out the photos. The DA appealed and another judge ruled them back in. That tells me that the photos are all their evidence. It remains to be seen how he acquired the photos, but I have my own opinions about that. Remember, he was only charged with possession - a misdemeanor. Had he been downloading, producing, or sending the photos to anyone - it would have been a felony.

    The problem with Wendy Hutchens is that unless this case had been dismissed, she is still more than likely going to be called as a witness. By going on shows like LKL and Nancy Grace, she has in effect "sold" her testimony (i.e. how she met him, how she came to tape him, and so on). Also, if you ever visited the wendyhutchens site, she posted her record of correspondence (phone and email) with JMK. In that record, she clearly lists sending photos to JMK. There were 5 photos sent.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not a JMK apologist, but there may not be a conviction in the misdemeanor child porn because any defense lawyer worth their salt is going to present the above issues.

  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by newtv
    I think its a joke that he would even try fighting it-what a total loser-and some think he is simply a mental case-how can he just be a victim of his own life and then fight extradition for charges he knows he is guilty of or could have that proven - why would he want to stay in boulder but not return to his other charges..loser-loser-loser..they need to look at every possible loophole to charge him with to extend his time in jail.
    I am pretty sure he can get 6 years for his charges and at least one year for fleeing..even if u are found innocent u cannot flee in the first place and get no charges.
    They need to give him any jail time possible -he is such a loser.
    Funny how he views being labeled as Child Pornographer as more offensive than Child Killer, and Child Killer as more offensive than Child Molester. He wants to be remembered as JB's Lover, as if she told him to do disgusting things to her!!!
    Please help locate Mark Dribin http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...ht=Mark+Dribin and Ilene Misheloff http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...lene+Misheloff and bring them home.



  24. #49
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    Hiya LinasK,

    Great, interesting thoughts! He didn't fight extradition to CO, BUT he is fighting it to CA. Now why...??

    My guess is that:

    1. even though JMK is, "sadly tetched" (in my opinion). that he was not so tetched as to NOT know that he was playing a big game with adults in CO and that it was highly entertaining to him for some reason (pulling the wool over other eyes, getting lots of attention, maybe setting the stage for some type of grandstanding he might be able to do at some point, living his fantasy etc.), BUT

    2. that he also "knows" (or suspects) that the State of CA has him on the midsdemeanors (and/or maybe more, once they re-search his hard drive), OR at least, DEFINITELY, the Fugitive from Justice thing.

    In other words, perhaps the "pedophile-with-a-cause," Peter Pan kinda fantasy was great for him, giving him much "mind candy" to chew on, but going to CA is going to slip him back into "big boy panties" and the adult world again.

    Didn't JMK say that he couldn't relate to adults? Unfortunately, returning to jail in CA may put him back into a cell "with an adult" who has little respect for his past and/or his cause.

    At one point, I thought that, perhaps, JMK was railroaded with the 5 misdemeanor counts - i.e. maybe it was a setup so that they could investigate him further per his blab pertaining to JBR. I have no clue on that now, BUT JMK surely does (plus what might be found in his deletions on the hard drive.) He also knows that the FFJ charge remains, without a doubt, AND that he will have to walk through the "unglorious" weeks and months of incarceration while evidence is gathered and judgements are made, then whatever term he may be given.

    Per the FFJ charge:
    http://www.courttv.com/news/ramsey/d...complaint.html

    AND BTW, did anyone read this recently:
    30 men seized in Petaluma sex sting

    Let's hope that JMK doesn't room in with a pedophile buddy during his incarceration (too much fun), but rather with a very straight fellow.

    Interestingly, I think that the bail for those arrested in the pedophile sting was only set at $30K - yet JMK's was set at $100K in 2001. I'm sure there is a good reason for this, I'd like to hear it.

    And away we go with "my" tax dollars working to deal with JMK. I hope that someone is a good investor with these, investing little and gaining much. I am sick at heart and sad inside about JMK, and hope for a healing for him someday (although I don't know whether healing can be had), but I really do not want him to be out scaring, endangering, injuring or slaughtering any of our little lambs along a route to possible healing. I would rather there was a way to contain him such that nothing OTHER than healing could occur.

    Wouldn't it be cool if this whole fiasco would set off a thinker who could propose a "real way" to prevent "tainted people" from hurting children? Had that been done some 50 years ago, I could have been spared many years of pain, as could my elder brother who is now "working on behalf of children" in the geographical area where JMK will now be thrust.

    W

  25. #50
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    But what is really interesting comes from yesterday's court hearing and possible evidence in Karr's lap-top computer. It was said that he suddenly looked green and quite unwell {my poetic license, but the same meaning ;} when it was said Ca is going to go through everything he has in that computer! There is a feeling there might be much, much more disturbing info there on which possible other crimes, and even federal charges might be in the making!
    Yes yes yes, he was described as being very very very upset when he realized, his 'stuff' as in computer from Thailand, was not being returned to him.

    I'll betcha Mr, Highpants, is messin those pants today!

    OMG what secrets are in there? One thing, he must be sane enough to be skeeeerred being green and all .

    Just in: According to CTTV, he is calm and just sitting there and not talking to anyone!

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