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  1. #1
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    Questions you'd like answers to...

    there are some things about this case that will never be known, but they are details that drive you nutz - here's a few I have, what are yours?

    1. Why was it so important to the Ramseys' story that JonBenet was asleep when they got home and was taken directly to bed? Burke said she woke up and helped carry stuff into the house. We know she had pineapple, so why lie about her being asleep? It seems as though it would have been easier to say that she woke up when they pulled into the garage, they futzed around and had a snack and then went to bed - why was it important enough to lie about it? It's as if they were afraid to have anyone know the child was on the first floor that night between those hours - why? Did something happen in that part of the house?

    2. Why did Burke act so strangely that morning? Why did he pretend to be asleep, and why didn't his parents wake him up and ask him if he had seen or heard anything in the night? Why when his father came up to get him to take him to White's house, did he remain silent and not ask any questions? That's not the way nine year old boys act - they want to know everything that's going on and if a cop walks in the house, they're fascinated by him, and want to know why he's there. This kid did not ask ONE question or exhibit any fear or curiosity at all. (In my opinion, someone put the fear of God in this kid to keep him quiet. I can hear it now, "no matter what anyone asks you, you say you don't know, do you hear me?? Do you want Mom and Dad in jail?? Don't say anything!!!, I mean it, Burke!!!) And I don't care what anyone says about everyone being "different", nine year old boys don't act like that in that kind
    of situation - he didn't even ask, "is JonBenet going with us to the Whites?"

    3. How did that blood get in the underwear? She's been wiped clean, but there is blood on the crotch panel - so she had to have had them on, been injured, wiped clean, and then the underwear put back on with the longjohns with the urine stain in the front - otherwise, how could the blood have gotten there? Which means she had that pair of underwear on, she was injured, the underwear were pulled up, and then someone thought better of it, pulled them down, wiped her clean and then pulled the underwear back up. How else could the blood have gotten on that part of the underwear?

    4. Patsy Ramsey was so insistent on the ransom note being on the spiral staircase, saying, "and that's how I come down every morning." How would an intruder know that? Why not leave it in her bed, or on the kitchen counter or the windshield of the car, or the steps leading down from their bedroom, where the parents would be sure of seeing it. And why would she never admit to having read the damned thing? Or why wouldn't she read it in the first place? If it was my kid, I'd of have it memorized. She insinuated to LE that it was 'weird" that Fleet White knew it so well - well, anyone with a brain and a heart would be reading that note over and over wondering if there was anything about it that could tell them who killed that little girl. What's weird, is that Patsy Ramsey didn't do that.

    This baloney that the parents shouldn't be suspected because of their behavior, because everyone acts "differently" is just that - baloney. If everyone acted differently, we wouldn't have societal norms, we wouldn't have traditions, we wouldn't know how to act appropriately in situations. Not to get into anything too esoteric, but there is a biological mechanism in the brain called "theory of mind mechanism". It allows us to understand and act appropriately in society, because we observe appropriate behavior and store those reactions in the brain. These parents didn't act in the way innocent parents act - they go on tv, but can't talk to the police. They call a lawyer the very day it happened, and then refuse to be interviewed, they have investigators on Dec. 27th, taking statements from people who were there that day and don't even inform the police. They give physical evidence but won't talk to the cops or take polygraphs or do one thing to remove themselves as suspects in the case. Things have to make sense and this just does not make any sense at all.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bev
    This baloney that the parents shouldn't be suspected because of their behavior, because everyone acts "differently" is just that - baloney. If everyone acted differently, we wouldn't have societal norms, we wouldn't have traditions, we wouldn't know how to act appropriately in situations. Not to get into anything too esoteric, but there is a biological mechanism in the brain called "theory of mind mechanism". It allows us to understand and act appropriately in society, because we observe appropriate behavior and store those reactions in the brain. These parents didn't act in the way innocent parents act - they go on tv, but can't talk to the police. They call a lawyer the very day it happened, and then refuse to be interviewed, they have investigators on Dec. 27th, taking statements from people who were there that day and don't even inform the police. They give physical evidence but won't talk to the cops or take polygraphs or do one thing to remove themselves as suspects in the case. Things have to make sense and this just does not make any sense at all.
    Well, yes, there are norms and traditions and all that good stuff. However, they are guidelines, and to think that people who don't fit the mold are suspicious and therefore should be denied rights is delusional.

    Furthermore, it is very obvious the Ramseys had no regard for norms or appropriate behavior because they bleached the hair of a five year old and dressed her up like a hooker. How many parents do that? But that still does not make them murderers.

    I will, however, agree with you that there is plenty about the Ramseys which doesn't make sense. But it was there before JonBenet died, as well. These were not normal people.

  3. #3
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    One question that comes to my mind is, I want to know who it was that screamed in the middle of the night? Was it JBR or PR? If I recall no one really knew who it was...


    ETA: wouldn't one think to call the police if they heard a scream in the middle of the night?


    This post is my opinion only, and is subject to making me look totally confused

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bev

    This baloney that the parents shouldn't be suspected because of their behavior, because everyone acts "differently" is just that - baloney. If everyone acted differently, we wouldn't have societal norms, we wouldn't have traditions, we wouldn't know how to act appropriately in situations. Not to get into anything too esoteric, but there is a biological mechanism in the brain called "theory of mind mechanism". It allows us to understand and act appropriately in society, because we observe appropriate behavior and store those reactions in the brain. These parents didn't act in the way innocent parents act - they go on tv, but can't talk to the police. They call a lawyer the very day it happened, and then refuse to be interviewed, they have investigators on Dec. 27th, taking statements from people who were there that day and don't even inform the police. They give physical evidence but won't talk to the cops or take polygraphs or do one thing to remove themselves as suspects in the case. Things have to make sense and this just does not make any sense at all.
    Thank you.That's something that needed to be said for a long time.
    Lack of a script on how most people would act in that situation doesn't mean their behavior is "normal" or unsuspicious.The fact of the matter is,the Ramseys behavior was so very uncharacteristic for that situation that it raised many red flags right from the beginning.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bev
    there are some things about this case that will never be known, but they are details that drive you nutz - here's a few I have, what are yours?

    1. Why was it so important to the Ramseys' story that JonBenet was asleep when they got home and was taken directly to bed? Burke said she woke up and helped carry stuff into the house. We know she had pineapple, so why lie about her being asleep? It seems as though it would have been easier to say that she woke up when they pulled into the garage, they futzed around and had a snack and then went to bed - why was it important enough to lie about it? It's as if they were afraid to have anyone know the child was on the first floor that night between those hours - why? Did something happen in that part of the house?
    I suspect because they said that in the beginning and just had to stick with it. I suppose they said that in the beginning (and continued to say so despite the evidence to the contrary) because her being awake had something to do with what happened to her. They probably deny she was awake because admitting she was might make them appear more suspect then they already looked. They didn't want to answer any questions about what went on while she was awake, so they just deny she was at all. Opening that door just makes it possible that they might be guilty of something... no way they'd go there, so they slammed that door by claiming she was asleep from the moment she left the car.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bev
    2. Why did Burke act so strangely that morning? Why did he pretend to be asleep, and why didn't his parents wake him up and ask him if he had seen or heard anything in the night? Why when his father came up to get him to take him to White's house, did he remain silent and not ask any questions? That's not the way nine year old boys act - they want to know everything that's going on and if a cop walks in the house, they're fascinated by him, and want to know why he's there. This kid did not ask ONE question or exhibit any fear or curiosity at all. (In my opinion, someone put the fear of God in this kid to keep him quiet. I can hear it now, "no matter what anyone asks you, you say you don't know, do you hear me?? Do you want Mom and Dad in jail?? Don't say anything!!!, I mean it, Burke!!!) And I don't care what anyone says about everyone being "different", nine year old boys don't act like that in that kind
    of situation - he didn't even ask, "is JonBenet going with us to the Whites?"
    According to the Ramseys, Burke was woken up once the house was full of people, JR told him that JBR was missing and he had to go to the White's for his own safety. I don't buy it. I think Burke knew something happened, his voice was heard by many on the 911 tape, and therefore had no need to ask questions. However, Burke was also known to be rather detached as part of his general personality anyway. I think you are correct, though, in believing he was admonished by his parents to keep his yap shut and quickly spirited away.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bev
    3. How did that blood get in the underwear? She's been wiped clean, but there is blood on the crotch panel - so she had to have had them on, been injured, wiped clean, and then the underwear put back on with the longjohns with the urine stain in the front - otherwise, how could the blood have gotten there? Which means she had that pair of underwear on, she was injured, the underwear were pulled up, and then someone thought better of it, pulled them down, wiped her clean and then pulled the underwear back up. How else could the blood have gotten on that part of the underwear?
    My guess is that it pooled inside her and when she was moved into a vertical position when JR picked her up some of it dripped out to stain the panties. Not to be icky, but us ladies know how that can happen.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bev
    4. Patsy Ramsey was so insistent on the ransom note being on the spiral staircase, saying, "and that's how I come down every morning." How would an intruder know that? Why not leave it in her bed, or on the kitchen counter or the windshield of the car, or the steps leading down from their bedroom, where the parents would be sure of seeing it. And why would she never admit to having read the damned thing? Or why wouldn't she read it in the first place? If it was my kid, I'd of have it memorized. She insinuated to LE that it was 'weird" that Fleet White knew it so well - well, anyone with a brain and a heart would be reading that note over and over wondering if there was anything about it that could tell them who killed that little girl. What's weird, is that Patsy Ramsey didn't do that.
    JAR even said that those stairs were a nutty place for the note to be left and was part of why he believed that whoever left it knew the family very intimately and would have known Patsy or someone else would have gone down those steps first thing in the morning. Patsy knew every word of that note because she wrote it. Pretending to not have it memorized is just more protective distancing just like claiming JBR was asleep from the moment she left the car. She claims when she called 911 she had only read the first few lines, but when asked by the dispatcher who had signed the note she told them how it was signed. She then changed her story saying that she was looking at it spread out on the floor in the hallway by the kitchen where JR was reading it and that she read it over his shoulder.

    Like you, I don't believe she would not have memorized that note if she had actually seen it for the first time that morning, and it was written by someone else. I find it highly strange that both JR and PR didn't memorize everything about that note but neither one could verify much of what it said in their interviews. Everyone in the house was scouring that note but the Ramseys.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bev
    This baloney that the parents shouldn't be suspected because of their behavior, because everyone acts "differently" is just that - baloney. If everyone acted differently, we wouldn't have societal norms, we wouldn't have traditions, we wouldn't know how to act appropriately in situations. Not to get into anything too esoteric, but there is a biological mechanism in the brain called "theory of mind mechanism". It allows us to understand and act appropriately in society, because we observe appropriate behavior and store those reactions in the brain. These parents didn't act in the way innocent parents act - they go on tv, but can't talk to the police. They call a lawyer the very day it happened, and then refuse to be interviewed, they have investigators on Dec. 27th, taking statements from people who were there that day and don't even inform the police. They give physical evidence but won't talk to the cops or take polygraphs or do one thing to remove themselves as suspects in the case. Things have to make sense and this just does not make any sense at all.
    I absolutely agree.

  6. #6
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    A big question of mine is whether there really were two other voices on the original enhanced 911 tape. I'd like to hear it for myself...but oddly enough, that seems like the only piece of evidence in the case that hasn't been released in some manner (so far).
    Whether there really were other voices would be a big kicker...instantly exposing Ramsey lies. Next up would be whether the 3rd voice is reall Burke, or an unknown person.

    I do think Burke contradicting his parents' story about how Jonbenet was when they all got home was a slip in his coaching. When asked about whether he'd eaten any pineapple that night, Burke gave the "I don't remember". Did he really not remember...or did he know not to answer that question?

  7. #7
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    I have a question! Anyone besides me not able to sleep at night from rereading the books written about this case, the transcripts, reading here, and at FFJ?

    I go to bed at night and lay there, thinking and thinking about JonBenet and all we know, think we know, and especially thinking about what we don't know. The frustration is taking it's toll on me. Sleep? what is that? I can't sleep!

    Will there ever be JUSTICE for JonBenet?

  8. #8
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    LaMer, I can totally relate--and I'm new to this board, but can't tell you the number of times I forced myself to go to bed at 1:00 am or later after reading the Laci board, before she was found. I remember I'd lie awake, crying, trying to figure out where she could be...

    Last night, I was so engrossed in reading the Ramsey interviews that I lost track of time, and suddenly I had a panic attack--I knew I was alone in the room and I'd been reading for hours, but where were my kids??? Had they gotten off the schoolbus??? If they were home, why couldn't I hear them???? I stared at the clock on my monitor and it said 11:00 and for a split second I was relieved because I knew they hadn't left for school yet, because they leave at noon...THEN I realized it was 11:00 *PM* and everyone was in bed....It was the weirdest feeling....
    He's guilty. Get over it.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Betsy
    LaMer, I can totally relate--and I'm new to this board, but can't tell you the number of times I forced myself to go to bed at 1:00 am or later after reading the Laci board, before she was found. I remember I'd lie awake, crying, trying to figure out where she could be...

    Last night, I was so engrossed in reading the Ramsey interviews that I lost track of time, and suddenly I had a panic attack--I knew I was alone in the room and I'd been reading for hours, but where were my kids??? Had they gotten off the schoolbus??? If they were home, why couldn't I hear them???? I stared at the clock on my monitor and it said 11:00 and for a split second I was relieved because I knew they hadn't left for school yet, because they leave at noon...THEN I realized it was 11:00 *PM* and everyone was in bed....It was the weirdest feeling....
    Oh Betsy,
    I understand and I can relate I'm so relieved to know, I'm not alone! It is driving me nuts, cause when I feel that I am finally drifting off to sleep--finally you know---the words-sentences are still scrolling past my eyes!

  10. #10
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    My guess is that it pooled inside her and when she was moved into a vertical position when JR picked her up some of it dripped out to stain the panties. Not to be icky, but us ladies know how that can happen.
    IMO That's not icky at all! It's gravity and mother nature. This board discusses JonBenet's vaginal injuries, why would you acknowledge you were being icky be discussing blood flow? Don't be silly. IMO

    I believe the blood spot shows JonBenet stared menstruating at an early age IMO. Patsy knew this and started seeing JonBenet as an adult; an adult who would compete with her for male attention IMO. John Ramsey saw his six-year old daughter in Vegas showgirl costumes and other sexy outfits and became attracted to her IMO. Maybe it was how she looked at him when she was on stage, maybe it was the inviting gestures she made during her performances. IMO Whatever it was, John started paying more attention to his daughter than he did to Patsy IMO. Patsy found father and daughter together and went to strike John because she wanted him dead when she saw first-hand what he was doing, but instead she accidentally hit JonBenet IMO. Instead of calling the paramedics when Patsy can tell them it was an accident and explain the whole story of abuse (remember, there was evidence of chronic abuse which would've substaniated Patsy's story to any doctor), she writes a three-page ransom note and stages it to look like a strangulation IMO. After all, she was willing to hit and possibly kill her husband for abusing their daughter but when she accidentally killed or knocked her daughter unconcious, she had to stage it to make it look like her daughter was murdered. It makes sense to me IMO.

    What do you guys think?


  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoneDuck
    IMO That's not icky at all! It's gravity and mother nature. This board discusses JonBenet's vaginal injuries, why would you acknowledge you were being icky be discussing blood flow? Don't be silly. IMO

    I believe the blood spot shows JonBenet stared menstruating at an early age IMO. Patsy knew this and started seeing JonBenet as an adult; an adult who would compete with her for male attention IMO. John Ramsey saw his six-year old daughter in Vegas showgirl costumes and other sexy outfits and became attracted to her IMO. Maybe it was how she looked at him when she was on stage, maybe it was the inviting gestures she made during her performances. IMO Whatever it was, John started paying more attention to his daughter than he did to Patsy IMO. Patsy found father and daughter together and went to strike John because she wanted him dead when she saw first-hand what he was doing, but instead she accidentally hit JonBenet IMO. Instead of calling the paramedics when Patsy can tell them it was an accident and explain the whole story of abuse (remember, there was evidence of chronic abuse which would've substaniated Patsy's story to any doctor), she writes a three-page ransom note and stages it to look like a strangulation IMO. After all, she was willing to hit and possibly kill her husband for abusing their daughter but when she accidentally killed or knocked her daughter unconcious, she had to stage it to make it look like her daughter was murdered. It makes sense to me IMO.

    What do you guys think?
    Well, I know most guys freak out when mentioning menstruation... their eyes roll up in their head, they clamp their hands over their ears and start babbling "I can't hear you! I can't here you! neener neener neener!".

    No, the blood was from having that paintbrush stuffed up there. There's no possible way that JBR started menstruating at the age of six... that would be a world record. Other body changes begin before mentruation starts, and JBR had none of them. If she was discovered to have fully developed functioning ovaries and uterus during her autopsy that would have been a hell of an incredible find and would have been noted on the autopsy report. It wasn't. Both her uterus and ovaries were reported to be normal for a child her age, meaning under-developed and non-functional re: menstruation. The autopsy report said her uterus and ovaries were "prepubescent and unremarkable"...
    http://www.acandyrose.com/12271996jonbenet06.gif

  12. #12
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    My question may seem odd to others, but why such a major holiday as "Christmas", especially with young children, would ya just umm.. say "forget" to charge batteries for your video camera? Johns' answer basically just doesn't cut it with me, because he contradicts his own self. This information is from his and Patsy's own book. So for him to say they didn't make home video's since Beth's death is a flat lie because they did. I don't believe anything this man says. I just wonder why they for some reason or another didn't want videos done on this Chrismas morning? Does anyone know if they had videos made Christmas of 1995? I don't have this book and can't find info anywhere except that they had Christmas '95 in Boulder.

    Home movies were 'not' filmed Christmas morning in Boulder (DOI pg 4)
    John Ramsey forgot to charge movie camera batteries (DOI pg 4)
    John Ramsey didn't want home movies after Beth died in 1992 (DOI pg 4)

    Soon JonBenét slipped under the tree and removed a brightly wrapped gift from its hiding place near the back. She had found exactly the right present for me at FAO Schwarz during a trip to New York City with her mom in November. Patsy later told me that when JonBenét had seen the shiny red gumball machine that dispensed jellybeans, she insisted I had to have it because I love jellybeans. She marched across the room and proudly presented the gift to me, with a big hug and kiss.
    "Betcha can't guess what this is!" she teased.
    "Give me a little hint," I pried. The suspense was too much for her, so she quickly helped me unwrap the package.
    "Oh, wow. Would you look at that!" I exclaimed.
    "Do you really like it, Daddy?"
    "I sure do, Honey. I love it and I love you!" I gave her a big hug.
    A moment later she looked up at me. "Daddy, what about . . .?" She did the standard charade symbol for a movie camera with one hand to her face and the other cranking the film reel. She was excited and wanted me to take home videos.
    "Well . . ." I said rubbing my chin. "I forgot to charge the batteries of the video camera last night. They're all run down. But here is our regular camera. I can take a few pictures. You get over there next to Mommy."
    Since the death of my oldest daughter, Beth, I hadn't wanted to take away from the moment at hand by stepping out of the scene to videotape or photograph it. I felt that life was too precious and went past too quickly to interrupt it by fussing with a camera. Now I wanted to live in the moment, rather than preserving it for later enjoyment. We had learned the hard way that sometimes later can be too sad. I still was not up to looking at the home videos we had made of all those earlier Christmases when Beth was still with us. I thought about just how special this Christmas morning was as I snapped a few pictures of the children with their opened gifts lying around the room. I had no way of knowing these would be the last photographs I would take of my youngest and most defenseless daughter.



    Beth Ramsey killed in automobile accident Chicago Illinios (DOI pg13) 1992- 01-08
    Home movies were filmed Christmas morning in Boulder (DOI pg89) 1993-12-25
    Home movies were filmed Christmas morning in Boulder (DOI pg92) 1994-12-25

    Ramseys spent Christmas in Boulder, Colorado (DOI pg1) 1995-12-25
    Bill McReynolds played Santa at Ramseys Christmas party (DOI pg98) 1995-12-25
    Ramseys had Christmas dinner at Fleet/Priscilla White's house (DOI pg8) 1995-12-25

  13. #13
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    Patsy found father and daughter together and went to strike John because she wanted him dead when she saw first-hand what he was doing, but instead she accidentally hit JonBenet IMO. Instead of calling the paramedics when Patsy can tell them it was an accident and explain the whole story of abuse (remember, there was evidence of chronic abuse which would've substaniated Patsy's story to any doctor), she writes a three-page ransom note and stages it to look like a strangulation IMO. After all, she was willing to hit and possibly kill her husband for abusing their daughter but when she accidentally killed or knocked her daughter unconcious, she had to stage it to make it look like her daughter was murdered. It makes sense to me IMO.
    This could have happened. Tho, JR seems to get a pass here from many many people, in this regard.

    Question is WHY?

    Remember: the comments to have been made by PR and JR at the Fernies.

    -we didn't mean for this to happen-PR

    -I'm sorry, I'm so sorry-JR

    What happened and why was JR so sorry?

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by PagingDrDetect
    Well, I know most guys freak out when mentioning menstruation... their eyes roll up in their head, they clamp their hands over their ears and start babbling "I can't hear you! I can't here you! neener neener neener!".

    No, the blood was from having that paintbrush stuffed up there. There's no possible way that JBR started menstruating at the age of six... that would be a world record. Other body changes begin before mentruation starts, and JBR had none of them. If she was discovered to have fully developed functioning ovaries and uterus during her autopsy that would have been a hell of an incredible find and would have been noted on the autopsy report. It wasn't. Both her uterus and ovaries were reported to be normal for a child her age, meaning under-developed and non-functional re: menstruation. The autopsy report said her uterus and ovaries were "prepubescent and unremarkable"...
    http://www.acandyrose.com/12271996jonbenet06.gif
    I totally agree, Dr. No way she was already menstrating.

  15. #15
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    I'm sorry to get so graphic, so please don't read my question if you are sensitive. My question is why would the sexual pervert, whether John or another male use the paint brush for vaginal penetration rather than a more intimate way such as a finger? Sorry! This has been bugging me for ages, and why I believe it was Patsy rather than John or an intruder. They would want it more "personal" interaction, wouldn't you think?

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