LouSmit.com

Jay78 · Oct 9, 2006

for anyone who cares to read smit's intruder theory, its all here, as well as he resignation letter. A couple of interesting things:

1) there was a packing peanut near JB's body that were also found in window well.
2) there is a dark "smear" type mark going down the wall under the window in the train room

JMO8778 · Oct 10, 2006

narlacat said:
I've already read it, once was enough.
Smit more than earned his nickname.

Smit/schmuck,yes, sounds about one in the same to me.

JMO8778 · Oct 10, 2006

Nuisanceposter said:
Steve Thomas said the "smear" was a water mark.

I don't give too much thought to the packing peanut, either - not only was it Christmastime and those things in abundance when shipping packages, but they have an extraordinary amount of static cling. The packing peanuts could have come from inside the house and ended up in the window well and in the cellar room by any number of ways. I don't see them as clear proof that an intruder killed JonBenet and used that tiny window as an entry/exit.

Mainly because of the spider web and lack of evidence on the window and sill. It was 10 degrees at 6 am, as noted by Sergeant Reichenbach as he passed the mall on the way to respond to the call for help at the Ramsey house. There's no way that spider came out and repaired the web, and with it spanning the grate, there's no way anyone went in or out that window - especially not without leaving any forensic evidence of having gone through it. That video of Smit coming in it proves it's a tight fit, and that there would have been much more debris and disturbance than what was seen. It should also be noted that some of the photos Smit uses to back up his theory were taken much later than the 26th.

I still want to know - where the heck was Smit when Karr was caught, and all the IDIs (including Boulder officials) rallied round to slap each other on the back? he should have been right there, showing us how he was right, and the intruder went in through the window and got JonBenet up for a pineapple snack before stun gunning her...oh, that's right, that wasn't part of Karr's bogus confession.

There's a lot about Smit's intruder theory that falls apart when scrutinized...such as a complete lack of any forensic evidence that anyone other than a Ramsey was in that house that night. I think he should continue being as silent and as absent as he was during the Karr disaster. Any cop who decides to believe a parent couldn't have killed their child because they swore to God they didn't and then prayed with him needs to spend more time studying crime and the way people involved in crime, even people who have never been involved in crime before, might behave.

It's weird that he was so silent in the Karr fiasco,indeed.
It speaks volumes I think.
He certainly did behave very unprofessinally and unobjectivly.I don't think LE will suffer without him.Good thing he resigned IMO.I hope he finds something,if anything, he's much more capable of.

narlacat · Oct 10, 2006

Jay78 said:
for anyone who cares to read smit's intruder theory, its all here, as well as he resignation letter. A couple of interesting things:

1) there was a packing peanut near JB's body that were also found in window well.
2) there is a dark "smear" type mark going down the wall under the window in the train room

I've already read it, once was enough.
Smit more than earned his nickname.

Nuisanceposter · Oct 10, 2006

Steve Thomas said the "smear" was a water mark.

I don't give too much thought to the packing peanut, either - not only was it Christmastime and those things in abundance when shipping packages, but they have an extraordinary amount of static cling. The packing peanuts could have come from inside the house and ended up in the window well and in the cellar room by any number of ways. I don't see them as clear proof that an intruder killed JonBenet and used that tiny window as an entry/exit.

Mainly because of the spider web and lack of evidence on the window and sill. It was 10 degrees at 6 am, as noted by Sergeant Reichenbach as he passed the mall on the way to respond to the call for help at the Ramsey house. There's no way that spider came out and repaired the web, and with it spanning the grate, there's no way anyone went in or out that window - especially not without leaving any forensic evidence of having gone through it. That video of Smit coming in it proves it's a tight fit, and that there would have been much more debris and disturbance than what was seen. It should also be noted that some of the photos Smit uses to back up his theory were taken much later than the 26th.

I still want to know - where the heck was Smit when Karr was caught, and all the IDIs (including Boulder officials) rallied round to slap each other on the back? he should have been right there, showing us how he was right, and the intruder went in through the window and got JonBenet up for a pineapple snack before stun gunning her...oh, that's right, that wasn't part of Karr's bogus confession.

There's a lot about Smit's intruder theory that falls apart when scrutinized...such as a complete lack of any forensic evidence that anyone other than a Ramsey was in that house that night. I think he should continue being as silent and as absent as he was during the Karr disaster. Any cop who decides to believe a parent couldn't have killed their child because they swore to God they didn't and then prayed with him needs to spend more time studying crime and the way people involved in crime, even people who have never been involved in crime before, might behave.

Holdontoyourhat · Oct 10, 2006

Nuisanceposter said:
...such as a complete lack of any forensic evidence that anyone other than a Ramsey was in that house that night.

I wouldn't call unidentified male DNA found in a conspicuous place a 'complete lack of any forensic evidence.' We're also looking for the rolls the tape and cord came from. And someone with an actual motive.

BBB167893 · Oct 10, 2006

There's a lot about Smit's intruder theory that falls apart when scrutinized...such as a complete lack of any forensic evidence that anyone other than a Ramsey was in that house that night.

It's worse than you know!

This is from 1972:

Colo. Springs Burglar Shot Accidentally

COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. AP) The death of a 26-year-old Colorado Springs man early Sunday apparently was the result of an accidental shooting in a struggle with a police officer, the El Paso County District Attorney's office said Monday.

Officials report James LaBare died from a gunshot wound after allegedly burglarizing the violations bureau at City Hall, less than 100 feet from the police station.

Dist. Atty. Bob Russel said Officer Andrew Smit and another officer answered a burglary alarm about 3 a.m. Sunday and a suspect ran from the scene, repeatedly ignoring orders to halt. Smit caught up with LaBare and in a struggle the officer's gun discharged, Russel said. LaBare died several hours later.

The evidence will be turned over to the El Paso County grand jury Tuesday night, Russel said, but he added that the shooting apparently was within the law.

No wonder he doesn't believe this was an accidental killing! That would hit too close to home for him!

JMO8778 · Oct 11, 2006

Holdontoyourhat said:
I wouldn't call unidentified male DNA found in a conspicuous place a 'complete lack of any forensic evidence.'

I'm confused about where DNA would have come from on an intruder.And such a small amount as well.It seems he would have had to wear gloves.
If it had come from contact from his skin,wouldn't there be more of it,and wouldnt it be in better condition,not degraded?

Nuisanceposter · Oct 11, 2006

Absolutely, JMO8778. If the foreign male DNA had been deposited in JonBenet's underwear at the same time as JonBenet's DNA had been, both samples would have been fresh and complete. Only JB's was fresh and complete - the other DNA was fragmented and degraded. So much so that they were unable to identify what kind of cell the DNA came from (JB's from blood.)

On top of that, when Dr. Henry Lee obtained identical packages of underwear to the ones JonBenet had been found in, (brand new unwashed brand name Bloomie's underwear), he discovered that those pairs of underwear also had DNA on them.

In my opinion, that proves that the possibility that the foreign DNA on JB's undies came from the factory where they were manufactured is undeniable and very likely - much more so than the possibility that the DNA came from an intruder that didn't leave any other DNA (or any other forensic evidence) in the Ramsey house.

Boulder DA Mary Lacy also said on national television that the DNA is antiquated and may have nothing whatsoever to do with this case.

Holdontoyourhat · Oct 11, 2006

Also, 2 1/2 pages of handwriting isn't a 'complete lack of forensic evidence of an intruder' either.

The idea that PR wrote the note, and the DNA came from a factory worker, are only just 'interpretations' of the forensic evidence. IMO they are both the wrong interpretations.

Nuisanceposter · Oct 11, 2006

That RN is a lack of forensic evidence of an intruder when the mother (whose jacket fibers were found on the body and in the crime scene) cannot be excluded as the author of the ransom note, even by experts hired by the Rs themselves.

The mother, who was in the house at the time of the murder, who tells police that the paper the RN was written on looks like paper from their house (ST said police hadn't noticed that yet when she said that on the morning of the 26th.) The pad of paper the RN came from was a pad of paper that Patsy herself regularly used. Patsy also told Thomas that the RN could have been written by a woman, and mentioned on the CNN interview that they didn't know if the killer was male or female. Suspicious, to say the least, especially when the writing on the RN looks and sounds just like her own (even her family members said so.)

Sorry, HOTYH, but the discovery of other pairs of the exact same brand of underwear having DNA on them as well really blows a hole in the theory that the DNA on JB's undies had to have been from the killer - especially since it was old and fragmented and degraded, and JB's DNA was fresh and complete.

Holdontoyourhat · Oct 11, 2006

Nuisanceposter said:
Sorry, HOTYH, but the discovery of other pairs of the exact same brand of underwear having DNA on them as well really blows a hole in the theory that the DNA on JB's undies had to have been from the killer - especially since it was old and fragmented and degraded, and JB's DNA was fresh and complete.

CBS news sure tells a different story than you, by stating that the DNA was MIXED IN with JBR's blood. That sortof blows a hole in the factory worker t-h-e-o-r-y, doesn't it?

Nuisanceposter · Oct 11, 2006

No. Isn't it possible that the DNA was already there and mixed with JB's when her drops of blood fell on top of it?

What other explanation is there for the foreign DNA being fragmented and degraded, research unable to even identify which kind of cell it came from, while JonBenet's DNA is fresh and complete? JonBenet's DNA has all the markers, the foreign DNA doesn't.

How can one sample of DNA be so much different than the other in terms of freshness and completeness if both were deposited at the same time?

And how could this intruder have left only DNA on the undies, and no other forensic evidence of his presence anywhere in the house, considering he had to have been there for quite some time?

BBB167893 · Oct 11, 2006

Absolutely, JMO8778. If the foreign male DNA had been deposited in JonBenet's underwear at the same time as JonBenet's DNA had been, both samples would have been fresh and complete. Only JB's was fresh and complete - the other DNA was fragmented and degraded. So much so that they were unable to identify what kind of cell the DNA came from (JB's from blood.)

It makes no sense that bacteria would eat one and not the other.

On top of that, when Dr. Henry Lee obtained identical packages of underwear to the ones JonBenet had been found in, (brand new unwashed brand name Bloomie's underwear), he discovered that those pairs of underwear also had DNA on them.

Take it up with him.

In my opinion, that proves that the possibility that the foreign DNA on JB's undies came from the factory where they were manufactured is undeniable and very likely - much more so than the possibility that the DNA came from an intruder that didn't leave any other DNA (or any other forensic evidence) in the Ramsey house.

The DNA is worthless.

Boulder DA Mary Lacy also said on national television that the DNA is antiquated and may have nothing whatsoever to do with this case.

And she's a Team Ramsey member.

That RN is a lack of forensic evidence of an intruder when the mother (whose jacket fibers were found on the body and in the crime scene) cannot be excluded as the author of the ransom note, even by experts hired by the Rs themselves.

Her own mother said it was her writing!

CBS news sure tells a different story than you, by stating that the DNA was MIXED IN with JBR's blood. That sortof blows a hole in the factory worker t-h-e-o-r-y, doesn't it?

It would, if they hadn't gotten that story from Ramsey hired-gun PIs, who, by John's own admission, were hired to keep his sorry butt out of jail.

No. Isn't it possible that the DNA was already there and mixed with JB's when her drops of blood fell on top of it?

That accounts for everything.

rashomon · Oct 11, 2006

[Nuisanceposter]Isn't it possible that the DNA was already there and mixed with JB's when her drops of blood fell on top of it?

SuperDave said:
That accounts for everything.

That is indeed the most logical explanation.

Keith X · Oct 11, 2006

Nuisanceposter said:
I still want to know - where the heck was Smit when Karr was caught, and all the IDIs (including Boulder officials) rallied round to slap each other on the back? he should have been right there, showing us how he was right, and the intruder went in through the window and got JonBenet up for a pineapple snack before stun gunning her...oh, that's right, that wasn't part of Karr's bogus confession.

If you read the pile of emails that the DA made available after Karr was shipped back to CA, you'll see that Michael Tracey cc'd many of them to Smit and often discussed them with him. You'll also see that Karr was pretty much an obsessive with no "inside info" or evidence to back up his claim that he killed JBR. Therefore by the time the Karr arrest hit the press, Smit had probably figured out that Karr was not the killer.

So far as I can figure it, Karr was arrested not because anyone really believed he killed JBR but because he posed a clear and present danger to his pupils. Then it seems he blabbed to the Thai police, who made the mistake of exposing him to the media, and from there it was a circus.

Holdontoyourhat · Oct 11, 2006

:laugh:

rashomon said:
That is indeed the most logical explanation.

U gotta b kiddn me! Ur telling me that JBR's blood falls on a pre-existing degraded factory-worker stain, on her underwear, and that this is 'the most logical'?!?

Is this how RDI accounts for the presence of foreign DNA?

Excuse me, but are there any other pieces of clothing with 'degraded' DNA on them besides her underwear? Hello?

JMO8778 · Oct 12, 2006

Holdontoyourhat said:
:laugh: U gotta b kiddn me! Ur telling me that JBR's blood falls on a pre-existing degraded factory-worker stain, on her underwear, and that this is 'the most logical'?!?

Is this how RDI accounts for the presence of foreign DNA?

Excuse me, but are there any other pieces of clothing with 'degraded' DNA on them besides her underwear? Hello?

...If said perp wore gloves, as there were no fingerprints found,then where did the dna come from?why would he all of a sudden remove the gloves and leave dna in the most damning place possible?
Do some IDI's think said perp maybe had a vas?I know there was no semen found but,is it possible to leave dna without it?I'm not of the IDI theory,I'm just trying to figure out the basis of where on the body of an intruder dna might come from.

rashomon · Oct 12, 2006

Holdontoyourhat said:
:laugh: U gotta b kiddn me! Ur telling me that JBR's blood falls on a pre-existing degraded factory-worker stain, on her underwear, and that this is 'the most logical'?!?

Is this how RDI accounts for the presence of foreign DNA?

Excuse me, but are there any other pieces of clothing with 'degraded' DNA on them besides her underwear? Hello?

I'm not kiddin' anybody HOTH. Of course it is the most logical explanation. For that foreign DNA could have been on more locations in the underwear, maybe even spread over the garment (suppose a factory worker had sneezed into it).
And when JB's blood spots in the garment were tested, they found the degraded DNA too. What's so hard to understand about that?
Up to eight people usually handle underwear in the manufaturing process before it is finally packaged.
Dr. Lee bought packaged underwear of the same type and found human DNA on it too.

BBB167893 · Oct 12, 2006

U gotta b kiddn me!

I don't have time to kid.

Ur telling me that JBR's blood falls on a pre-existing degraded factory-worker stain, on her underwear, and that this is 'the most logical'?!?

Yes! How else does one sample have abundant material and the other one worn beyond recognition?

Even the Team Ramsey DA says it's likely useless.

Is this how RDI accounts for the presence of foreign DNA?

Far as I know. If the IDIs would recognize this DNA is worthless, they might FIND an intruder. I've said that for a long time.

Excuse me, but are there any other pieces of clothing with 'degraded' DNA on them besides her underwear? Hello?

Yes, there were.

To wit:

Dr. Lee bought packaged underwear of the same type and found human DNA on it too.

For that foreign DNA could have been on more locations in the underwear, maybe even spread over the garment (suppose a factory worker had sneezed into it).
And when JB's blood spots in the garment were tested, they found the degraded DNA too. What's so hard to understand about that?

To be blunt, who would say that, if they weren't positive?

What most people forget is the world is bristling with human DNA. It's everywhere and on everything.

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