Wine Cellar Top Door Latch

calicocat

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Did I read correctly that Fleet White looked in the wine cellar and did not notice JonBenet, then a police officer looked in and didn't see her either, yet John later went to open the door and it resisted because the top latch was secured? How could that be? Who would have put the latch on the door later that morning?

IMO, it had to have been John. He went to get the family mail and was gone an hour and twenty minutes. When he returned, he sat at the kitchen table and read it. Where did he have to go to get the mail?
 
calicocat said:
Did I read correctly that Fleet White looked in the wine cellar and did not notice JonBenet, then a police officer looked in and didn't see her either, yet John later went to open the door and it resisted because the top latch was secured? How could that be? Who would have put the latch on the door later that morning?

IMO, it had to have been John. He went to get the family mail and was gone an hour and twenty minutes. When he returned, he sat at the kitchen table and read it. Where did he have to go to get the mail?

calicocat,

Fleet looked in the wine room and did not see JonBenet's body. The police officer never looked in the wine room.There was a latch on the wine room door,I don't recall John having a problem with it.John did not leave the house to get the mail,there was a slot in the door,which deposited the mail on the floor,although he did go through his mail,claiming he thought there may be something from the kidnapper.
 
Here's the information I read about the mail:

Soon the only police official remaining was Detective Arndt, along with John and Patsy and the family friends. T hen even John left to pick up the family's mail, and was gone approximately an hour and 20 minutes. When John returned Detective Arndt noted that he sat in the kitchen and opened the mail. John still remained in a room by himself not making contact with Patsy or any of the friends who stayed to console the family.

http://www.crimeandjustice.us/forums/lofiversion/index.php?t1588.html

and the information about Fleet White:

Fleet went town to the basement. He noticed that the lights were on. He found a small piece of glass from a broken window in a room used for model trains. In checking the latch for the window he discovered that it was unlocked, but closed. Fleet also noticed a blue suitcase was sitting underneath the window. He continued with his search by opening every cupboard and door. He opened the door to the wine cellar, reached inside, but could not find the light switch and could not see inside the room. The wind cellar is completely formed by cement and has no windows. Finding no evidence of anyone entering or leaving from the basement area and no trace of JonBenet, Fleet went back upstairs.

(Same website)

and about the policeman, I'll post that information as soon as I find it.
 
calicocat said:
Here's the information I read about the mail:

Soon the only police official remaining was Detective Arndt, along with John and Patsy and the family friends. T hen even John left to pick up the family's mail, and was gone approximately an hour and 20 minutes. When John returned Detective Arndt noted that he sat in the kitchen and opened the mail. John still remained in a room by himself not making contact with Patsy or any of the friends who stayed to console the family.

http://www.crimeandjustice.us/forums/lofiversion/index.php?t1588.html

and the information about Fleet White:

Fleet went town to the basement. He noticed that the lights were on. He found a small piece of glass from a broken window in a room used for model trains. In checking the latch for the window he discovered that it was unlocked, but closed. Fleet also noticed a blue suitcase was sitting underneath the window. He continued with his search by opening every cupboard and door. He opened the door to the wine cellar, reached inside, but could not find the light switch and could not see inside the room. The wind cellar is completely formed by cement and has no windows. Finding no evidence of anyone entering or leaving from the basement area and no trace of JonBenet, Fleet went back upstairs.

(Same website)

and about the policeman, I'll post that information as soon as I find it.

Calicocat,

I'm not sure why your responding with links.You're the one who asked the questions,and I answered.

All the questions you asked are common knowledge:

Fleet did not see JonBenet's body in the wine cellar.

The police never looked in the wine room.

John never left the house to collect the mail.

I guess I'm confused as to why you are supplying me with links ... when you were the one to ask the questions?
 
Noone put a latch on the door that morning.
Yes Fleet looked in the wine cellar and didn't see JBR's body.

French, the Police Officer didn't open the wine cellar door.

JR didn't leave the house to get the mail, like Capps has said.
 
Hi Capps,

I was asking how the door became latched after others had previously looked inside the room. Because your information did not agree with mine, I was showing you where I got my information from. And, where did you learn about the mail slot in the door? Are you saying that John never left the house for the hour and twenty minutes?
 
Calicocat,

Fair enough ...

You stated in your first post that John tried opening the wine cellar door,but the door resisted because of the door latch.I stated that I didn't recall hearing about that,so I don't have anything to add to that.

The mail was delivered into the door slot.There was a strange character by the name of Colfax,who some how got imbedded into the Ramsey saga ... for reasons,only known to him,he forced a burning piece of paper into the Ramsey's house,through the mail slot in the door while it was unoccupied,and started a small fire in the entrance hall. That is when it was realized,that that was how the mail was delivered.

As far a John being unaccounted for,for an hour and twenty minutes,that was the story that got out in the media ... but I included this snippet from Det. Linda Arndt's deposition (courtesy of FFJ):

"24 Q. And didn't you indicate that it was
25 sometime between 10:40 and 12:00 noon that John Ramsey
Page 129
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 left to pick up his mail or that you lost track of him
2 but later saw him reading the mail and assumed he had
3 left to pick up the mail during that period you had
4 lost track of him?
5 A. It has been widely reported that -
6 Q. I'm not talking about widely reported. I'm
7 talking about what you know.
8 A. What I know? Okay. Ask me again then.
9 Q. I'll ask you again. Isn't it your
10 recollection that it was between 10:40 and 12:00 noon
11 that you lost track of John Ramsey, and when you later
12 saw him opening mail you assumed he had gone out to get
13 the mail during that period you had lost track of him?
14 A. As I told you when you asked before, I
15 didn't personally watch him every minute from about
16 10:40 until noon.
17 Q. Would you read back the question?
18 (Record read by reporter as requested.)
19 THE DEPONENT: I'm sorry. What did I not
20 answer?
21 Q. (BY MR. HALABY) Are you stating that you
22 never lost track of him during that period?
23 A. I think I just told you that I personally
24 couldn't account for every minute.
25 Does that mean that you lost track of him
Page 130
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 then?
2 A. You could interpret it that way.
3 Q. All right. And during that period that you
4 lost track of him, did you later conclude what he had
5 done during that period in terms of going to pick up
6 the mail?
7 A. When I didn't personally monitor him the
8 whole time, what was the other half?
9 Q. Did you conclude that during that period
10 you'd lost track of him that he had gone out to pick up
11 the mail?
12 A. When I didn't personally monitor him, I
13 didn't know how he had gotten his mail.
14 Q. And did you then put two and two together
15 and believe that he had gone out to get the mail?
16 A. I thought he had gotten mail by stepping
17 outside.
18 Q. You didn't believe somebody else had picked
19 up the mail and delivered it to him inside the house?
20 A. I didn't know.
21 Q. But what you had concluded was that he had
22 gone out to get the mail, correct?
23 A. I thought he had got - yes."


Seems Like Det. Arndt tried to dance around that whole situation. From what I'm reading,it seems that Arndt wasn't paying much attention to John,and probably didn't know how long he was gone,and just assumed he was gone for awhile,because she saw him reading his mail. If she wasn't monitoring him every minute,then there is a possibility,he may have been gone for 15 min.,30 min.or an hour and twenty minutes ... she can't be sure. I think that's why she danced around it a bit,because it sure makes her look pretty bad,that she wasn't closely monitoring some one she should have been.IMO.
 
It's too much to read in one sitting, but has some additional information, such as the fact of more fibers than we thought, some under her arms.

Why would there be fibers under her arms?
 
capps said:
Seems Like Det. Arndt tried to dance around that whole situation. From what I'm reading,it seems that Arndt wasn't paying much attention to John,and probably didn't know how long he was gone,and just assumed he was gone for awhile,because she saw him reading his mail. If she wasn't monitoring him every minute,then there is a possibility,he may have been gone for 15 min.,30 min.or an hour and twenty minutes ... she can't be sure. I think that's why she danced around it a bit,because it sure makes her look pretty bad,that she wasn't closely monitoring some one she should have been.IMO.
What on earth was LA thinking?I would have immediately q'd why the family wasn't going nuts that the supposed 'kidnappers' didn't call by 10am like they said they would.I think I would have been on the Rams like stink on **** about it.I would have followed JR around on his heels and never let him out of my sight,much less check the house alone.
While I believe she assumed correctly that the R's were involved once JB's body was found,I don't think she has to have kids of her own to notice before that something was amiss.
I'm also perplexed as to why she (later on)got away with making threats twds herself and others,in regards to saying she would 'take everyone out' if she got pulled off the investigation.The last time someone threatened me,it landed the person a week in the mental part of the local hospital.Even if it wasn't thought that she was really a threat,she shouldnt have been allowed to get away with the threats.
Sry, but it just makes me angry when I see an investigation that involves a child become so completely botched,altho that is to say it involved a lot of ppl in Boulder,not just LA.
 
Linda Arndt is or was, to say the very least, bizarre.

When you are being questioned by a detective about a very serious nature, in response to a direct question, who answers "Well, it has been widely reported that...." ????

That is so strange to me. Especially since she's a detective herself!!!
 
julianne said:
Linda Arndt is or was, to say the very least, bizarre.

When you are being questioned by a detective about a very serious nature, in response to a direct question, who answers "Well, it has been widely reported that...." ????

That is so strange to me. Especially since she's a detective herself!!!

Julianne,

If you haven't already,please read the whole deposition,it's a very frustrating read at times,with the way Arndt answers the questions.There is another interview with Arndt,although I couldn't tell you at this moment where you can find it,where she is talking about being stalked by one of the Ramsey friends,again she was dancing all over the place,when the interviewer was just trying to understand in what way she was being stalked ... another frustrating interview.

With that being said ... I do feel bad for Arndt being left alone to handle all that was going on the day JonBenet was found....but she does come across kind of strange.
 

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